Not By Works

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jackrosie

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
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And to teach the cross was only for the elect ... another sickening view not in the scripture

"Behold the LAMB OF GOD, which TAKETH AWAY THE SIN OF THE WORLD." (John 1:29)

Somehow world becomes only believers?

It is scriptural that he knew us before he formed us in the womb.
 

EleventhHour

Well-known member
Nov 11, 2019
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WOW , that is shocking , how did he come to that conclusion...
...xox...
John Flavel (Calvinist)
The word ‘World’ is put to signify the elect, because they are scattered through all parts, and are among all ranks of men in the world; these are the objects of this love …


A. W. Pink (Calvinist)
“The ‘world’ in John 3:16 must, in the final analysis, refer to the world of God’s people.
 

EleventhHour

Well-known member
Nov 11, 2019
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Yes, as we saw in the “not of works..false” Thread. That god does not love everyone only the elect
Or in the "God Loves Everyone - False" thread where it was argued that only the human side of Jesus loved man, the divine side hated man.

I never heard such nonsense in my life.

Do you see how far they have to go to make their philosophy work.. that is just wrong.

For God so loved the world....does not mean just the elect.
 

EleventhHour

Well-known member
Nov 11, 2019
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Let us do a substitution exercise .... with world meaning elect


Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.
1 John 2:15

“Love not the elect, neither the things that are in the elect. If any man love the elect, the love of the Father is not in him.”


Or how about this one ..................

For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.
1 John 2:15

“For all that is in the elect, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the elect.


Houston we have a problem!!! o_O:eek:
 
Oct 25, 2018
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Serious question , looking to learn :)...
Is God`s calling not irresistible , I mean , when Jesus called Matthew , Peter , Andrew etc , did they not just drop their nets and follow , and Matthew left his stall and followed...
I see this calling irresistible , but like I said , I am still learning...
Is the elect different from the calling of God to others?...
...xox...
Irresistible grace doesn’t teach that ppl can‘t resist His grace, but that they don’t resist it all the way to hell. We’ve all resisted His grace before we were saved. But there was a time when He drew me and that drawing was effectual, irresistible. Irresistible grace is also called effectual calling.
 

jackrosie

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
2,098
966
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Or in the "God Loves Everyone - False" thread where it was argued that only the human side of
Or in the "God Loves Everyone - False" thread where it was argued that only the human side of Jesus loved man, the divine side hated man.

I never heard such nonsense in my life.

Do you see how far they have to go to make their philosophy work.. that is just wrong.

For God so loved the world....does not mean just the elect.

For God so loved the world....that Jesus died for all mankind......so not sure where they got that stupid idea .from
 

EleventhHour

Well-known member
Nov 11, 2019
8,389
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Irresistible grace doesn’t teach that ppl can‘t resist His grace, but that they don’t resist it all the way to hell. We’ve all resisted His grace before we were saved. But there was a time when He drew me and that drawing was effectual, irresistible. Irresistible grace is also called effectual calling.
Let us be clear...

Effectual calling is the work of God’s almighty power and grace, whereby (out of his free and special love to his elect, and from nothing

in them moving him thereunto) he doth, in his accepted time, invite and draw them to Jesus Christ, by his word and Spirit; savingly

enlightening their minds, renewing and powerfully determining their wills, so as they (although in themselves dead in sin) are hereby

made willing and able freely to answer his call, and to accept and embrace the grace offered and conveyed therein.

Link
Westminter Larger Catechism

Sounds quite contradictory to me.

Of course in this schema ... God has to Regenerate first before then can even respond to the message because it goes beyond Total Depravity to Total and Complete Inability.
 

EleventhHour

Well-known member
Nov 11, 2019
8,389
8,876
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Irresistible grace doesn’t teach that ppl can‘t resist His grace, but that they don’t resist it all the way to hell. We’ve all resisted His grace before we were saved. But there was a time when He drew me and that drawing was effectual, irresistible. Irresistible grace is also called effectual calling.
So, yes grace can be resisted, but no grace cannot be resisted because yes eventually grace will not be resisted? :unsure:
 
Oct 25, 2018
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It is scriptural that he knew us before he formed us in the womb.
And this knowing is not just His omniscience but Him knowing us intimately. Just as Adam knew Eve and she conceived Cain. Him knowing her was an intimate encounter, not just knowing Eve as a person.
 
Oct 25, 2018
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So, yes grace can be resisted, but no grace cannot be resisted because yes eventually grace will not be resisted? :unsure:
You have to remember, John Calvin did not refer to his beliefs as TULIP. Neither was it from the Synod of Dordt. It was first found in 1913, and the author said they heard it eight years earlier. So TULIP wasn’t around until around the turn of the 20th century or so.
 
May 23, 2020
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ok, Dot. I see where you are. It’s not obeying His teachings per se, but following the leading of Holy Spirit.

I know you don’t care much for the Jews, but you actually are thinking like them. Doing the commandments. By hook or by crook by golly.
Stone, you really don’t know me at all but feel very free to call be a bigot. Please stop falsely accusing me of many things including being a racist. It’s untrue. You should have much confidence at w in your own understanding as you are very wrong.
The new and living way. This is abundant life.

Am not saying be lawless either. We have a love for His Word....who is the person, our Lord Jesus Christ.
If you lived his word you wouldn’t have said I don’t care much for Jews. You would love truth not lies. You told a whopper.
 
Mar 14, 2011
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Gods grace is unending and everlasting. It is effectual to all mankind

However not all mankind has any desire for it.

We still Must chose

To say because a man said no Does not gods grace is ineffective, and to say it is is again to mock Gods character
 
May 23, 2020
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The BIBLE WAS NOT WRITTEN IN ENGLISH, it was translated to English, some English Bible still use, YHWH or Yahweh.

QUOTE:
Yahweh
(יהוה) (ya•'we) is the primary Hebrew name of God in the Bible. Jews normally do not pronounce this name, considering it too holy to verbalize. Instead, whenever they encounter this unpronounceable string of consonants, (YHWH) they speak the name Adonai. Orthodox Jews strenuously avoid mentioning or even writing the divine name, preferring such circumlocutions as "the Holy One," "the Name," or the defective writing "G-d."

In Christian Bibles, Yahweh is usually translated as "the LORD," a rough equivalent to the Hebrew "Adonai." The Hebrew Bible indicates this reading by inserting the vowel pointing from the word Adonai on the consonants YHWH, rather than use the actual vowels. Based on a literal reading of this pointing (יְהוָֹה), many modern Protestant Christians read God's name as Jehovah.

Elohim is the generic term for God in the Hebrew Bible, translated "God." From the New World Encyclopedia. END QUOTE.


Isaiah 43:10-11 (HCSB)
10 “You are My witnesses”— ⌊this is⌋ the LORD’s declaration— “and My servant whom I have chosen, so that you may know and believe Me and understand that I am He. No god was formed before Me, and there will be none after Me.
11 I, I am Yahweh, and there is no other Savior but Me.

Isaiah 43:10-11 (NJB)
10 You yourselves are my witnesses, declares Yahweh, and the servant whom I have chosen, so that you may know and believe me and understand that it is I. No god was formed before me, nor will be after me.
11 I, I am Yahweh, and there is no other Saviour but me.

Isaiah 43:11 (YLT) chose to us Jehovah in their Translation, so did (ASV)
11 I--I am Jehovah, And besides Me there is no saviour.


IF YOU ARE MORE COMFORTABLE TO USE YHWH or Yahweh, instead of LORD, that would be appropriate.
He has other “proper names” in other languages which bear no resemblance to YHWH. He doesn’t have a proper name, he has many.

No one in the NT times used it. That is a fact. One can follow the teaching of Jesus or stay with Moses. I choose Jesus.
 
May 23, 2020
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Now see, there you go again with the word VICTIM......and you're flinging out judgment, accusations and condemnation all over the place on this thread.....you're NOT seeking TRUTH, you're seeking some kind of screaming revenge..........something terrible MUST have happened to you by someone claiming to be a Christian........and the thought of that person being forgiven and still going to heaven absolutely infuriates you............:unsure:

DM - If this is true, I'm so sorry for whatever was done to you and hope you can forgive them, even if just for your sake. You're not going to ever be happy or whole again UNLESS you forgive them for the evil that they did to you. It's the only rope of hope that can pull you out of the anger and bitterness pit you seem to be in.

Dear Heavenly Father,

Something is terribly wrong with DorothyMae, I do ask You to heal her broken heart, mind, thought patterns and emotions....it sounds like her heart is in pieces with so many sharp edges.....she needs You Father....there's nothing any of us can do for her. We just keep retaliating......Help, Father......we forgive her meanness.....and ask You to intervene and fix her, in the Name of Jesus Christ, we pray, amen. :love:(y)
This time I’m asking you to specify WHO I judged of what? Who did I accuse of what and who did I condemn? Otherwise please stop.

Now, read the words of Jesus and all the prophets and you’ll find sharp edges. Jesus called some men “snakes” so did you pray for him to forgive them whatever they had done so he could release the bitterness???

What you don’t understand is what it means when a person loves truth. This is so foreign that you cannot imagine me telling it unless there’s some personal wound there. But that’s the reason. I love truth.