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E
Belief is an mental agreement.
I can agree, yet not trust (faith)
Faitj is a trust, and assurance, that what you believe will actually happen.
I heard a good example a few weeks. ago.
A high wire walker spent the day walking across a high wire, eventually, he putt a wheel barrow on the line, and filled it with enough weight to resemble a human body. And he walked across quite a few times. A crowed gathered, After about an hour, he turned to the crowd, and asked a question.
Do you believe I can take a person across in this wheelbarrow. Not one person said no. They all BELIEVED HE COULD DO IT.
so he then asked. WHo wants to go. Not one person said yes. why? NO ONE TRUSTED HIM, they did not have an ASSURANCE he would make it.
they believed he could do it. But they had no faith he could do it, proven by the fact they did not work ( say yes, I will do it)
this is about as simple as you can get to point out how one can believe in something, having a mental agreement (Demons believe yet tremble) yet have no faith at all in the same thing, because they have no assurance of what they believe will really happen (lack of trust) thats why they will claim they believe, but have no work to show it, because their belief is in agreement only. Not in assurance (faith)
I can agree, yet not trust (faith)
Faitj is a trust, and assurance, that what you believe will actually happen.
I heard a good example a few weeks. ago.
A high wire walker spent the day walking across a high wire, eventually, he putt a wheel barrow on the line, and filled it with enough weight to resemble a human body. And he walked across quite a few times. A crowed gathered, After about an hour, he turned to the crowd, and asked a question.
Do you believe I can take a person across in this wheelbarrow. Not one person said no. They all BELIEVED HE COULD DO IT.
so he then asked. WHo wants to go. Not one person said yes. why? NO ONE TRUSTED HIM, they did not have an ASSURANCE he would make it.
they believed he could do it. But they had no faith he could do it, proven by the fact they did not work ( say yes, I will do it)
this is about as simple as you can get to point out how one can believe in something, having a mental agreement (Demons believe yet tremble) yet have no faith at all in the same thing, because they have no assurance of what they believe will really happen (lack of trust) thats why they will claim they believe, but have no work to show it, because their belief is in agreement only. Not in assurance (faith)
E
A pseudo salvation is a salvation that is not real. Not SECURE. Not real.
If I was drowning, And someone came to rescue me, And he through me a rope, and claimed I was saved, then dropped the rope and let me die because I did not do what he said (I sinned against him). I was never saved in the first place.
Thats what you teach.
If I was drowning, And someone came to rescue me, And he through me a rope, and claimed I was saved, then dropped the rope and let me die because I did not do what he said (I sinned against him). I was never saved in the first place.
Thats what you teach.
no that is not what I teach....to use your analogy....If I was drowning and someone came to rescue me, and threw me a rope and told me hold on to this rope don't let go until you are in my arms. I hold on to the rope but then I decide to let go of the rope to go get my hat which blew off and drowned in the process. I was saved but I did not follow the instructions to the end. Whose fault is it?
Luke 9:62
And Jesus said unto him, No man, having put his hand to the plough, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God.
Luke 9:62
And Jesus said unto him, No man, having put his hand to the plough, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God.
WHAT?????? where does it say that?
Nothing can change the fact that we are God's kids once we are born again of the Spirit - we are partakers of the divine nature - the Spirit of God in Christ is in us via the gift of holy spirit. God does not remove that 'spirit' each time we mess up, his seed remains. If we walk in darkness we are out of fellowship, out of alignment, so to speak, with our Father and Jesus Christ - we ask forgiveness and return to walking in the light then our fellowship is restored. 1 John 1 is not that hard to understand. I take it you do not have children? or else you would understand what I had said earlier better.
Nothing can change the fact that we are God's kids once we are born again of the Spirit - we are partakers of the divine nature - the Spirit of God in Christ is in us via the gift of holy spirit. God does not remove that 'spirit' each time we mess up, his seed remains. If we walk in darkness we are out of fellowship, out of alignment, so to speak, with our Father and Jesus Christ - we ask forgiveness and return to walking in the light then our fellowship is restored. 1 John 1 is not that hard to understand. I take it you do not have children? or else you would understand what I had said earlier better.
K
This what I mean by real life, I met a man at Walmart, he asked me for a dollar. I knew he was drunk, I said can I tell you about Jesus. He quickly told me that he was baptized and that he was okay with God. He could not wait to die so that he would be in heaven. But stuck out that hand for my dollar so he could get another half pint.
This lie has to be stopped.
This lie has to be stopped.
E
Its your fault. Because you used your own power.
God said he comes and saves us, He does not give us a rope. He grabs our hand and lifts us out of the water.
You still do not get it..
You were not saved when the guy gave you the rope. you still had to depend on your own power. Your could ot be saved til you pulled yourself out of the water.
No wonder you have no security, you faith is in yourself
and thanks for proving I was right, Yuo teach a pseudo-salvation Not a salvation done by the power of God.
K
Look, go to the nearsest bar and talk about Jesus, 80 % will tell you that they go to church and have been baptised and the preacher told them that once saved always saved and they can do whatever they want to do. 40% are divorced and the other 60% at the bar are cheating on their wives our husbands and 30% are killing their babies. The OSAS has to be stopped it is lie. I am down in the trenches at rehabs and jails, The are deceived by this lie and live terrible lives because some preacher prayed with them and said no matter what you do you are saved.
E
and ths proves something?
what makes them any different than the catholics, or other legalistic churches who go out and get drunk every weekend, living with their girlfriends, And say its ok. All I have to do is go to my priest. or I am not as bad as the child molester. God will forgive me..
there are bad in every belief out there. But both can not be right.
stop looking at the negative, and look at the positive.
I know of NO pastor who teaches eternal security or person who believes in it that would nto go confront a person living in sin..
I have been given that excuse a few times, I challenged them on it. People will be people. Not everyone who claims to be saved is saved.
what makes them any different than the catholics, or other legalistic churches who go out and get drunk every weekend, living with their girlfriends, And say its ok. All I have to do is go to my priest. or I am not as bad as the child molester. God will forgive me..
there are bad in every belief out there. But both can not be right.
stop looking at the negative, and look at the positive.
I know of NO pastor who teaches eternal security or person who believes in it that would nto go confront a person living in sin..
I have been given that excuse a few times, I challenged them on it. People will be people. Not everyone who claims to be saved is saved.
You made this post about fellowship: (green)
This section of scripture is regarding fellowship with the Father and the Son - fellowship is not salvation. It is the relationship between two parties.
That which we have seen and heard declare we unto you that you also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father and his Son Jesus Christ. . . . If we say we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth: But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin. 1 John 1:3,6,7
If we walk in darkness [sin]- it breaks our fellowship with the Father and the Son. Notice also it breaks fellowship with other believers. When we return to the light - our fellowship with the Father and the Son is restored. This also happens in earthly families when our children 'walk in darkness' - they get grounded, they do not get to hang with the family - when they apologize [walk in the light], they are restored and again get to hang out with the family.[/quote]
So after posting about fellowship you posted:
Nothing here about salvation.
How can fellowship have nothing to do about salvation? A Christian that falls out of fellowship with God and his brethren is lost. One is either in fellowship with God or with Satan, one serves God or mammon, one serves sin unto death or obedience unto righteousness.
One on hand you say: Nothing can change the fact that we are God's kids once we are born again of the Spirit.
But then you say: If we walk in darkness we are out of fellowship, out of alignment, so to speak, with our Father and Jesus Christ - we ask forgiveness and return to walking in the light then our fellowship is restored.
Not walking in the light but in darkness is being LOST. Not in fellowship with God/Christ is LOST. 1 Jn 1:7 says a Christian's sins are all cleansed away by the blood of Christ only when the Christian is walking in the light. Walking in darkness sins are NOT cleansed away by the blood of Christ. You're trying to argue that the Christian's sins are cleansed away if he walks in the light or not, it doesn't really matter.
The Israelites were the children of God, His elect but God disinherited them and cast them off and they were then lost, Rom 10 and 11.
This section of scripture is regarding fellowship with the Father and the Son - fellowship is not salvation. It is the relationship between two parties.
That which we have seen and heard declare we unto you that you also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father and his Son Jesus Christ. . . . If we say we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth: But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin. 1 John 1:3,6,7
If we walk in darkness [sin]- it breaks our fellowship with the Father and the Son. Notice also it breaks fellowship with other believers. When we return to the light - our fellowship with the Father and the Son is restored. This also happens in earthly families when our children 'walk in darkness' - they get grounded, they do not get to hang with the family - when they apologize [walk in the light], they are restored and again get to hang out with the family.[/quote]
So after posting about fellowship you posted:
Nothing here about salvation.
How can fellowship have nothing to do about salvation? A Christian that falls out of fellowship with God and his brethren is lost. One is either in fellowship with God or with Satan, one serves God or mammon, one serves sin unto death or obedience unto righteousness.
One on hand you say: Nothing can change the fact that we are God's kids once we are born again of the Spirit.
But then you say: If we walk in darkness we are out of fellowship, out of alignment, so to speak, with our Father and Jesus Christ - we ask forgiveness and return to walking in the light then our fellowship is restored.
Not walking in the light but in darkness is being LOST. Not in fellowship with God/Christ is LOST. 1 Jn 1:7 says a Christian's sins are all cleansed away by the blood of Christ only when the Christian is walking in the light. Walking in darkness sins are NOT cleansed away by the blood of Christ. You're trying to argue that the Christian's sins are cleansed away if he walks in the light or not, it doesn't really matter.
The Israelites were the children of God, His elect but God disinherited them and cast them off and they were then lost, Rom 10 and 11.
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