Pope tells gay man ‘God made you like this and loves you like this’

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NHR

New member
Jun 11, 2018
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#41
What you have all not taken into consideration is that maybe the pope never said this. It wouldn't be the first time the media has lied about the pope for example here in Australia channel 9 news reported that the pope said in an interview that pope Francis wanted to integrate gay marriage into the church. So I look up the interview and it turns out the pope said no such thing. Remember the bible says it is a sin to falsely accuse someone.
Also the bible says you have to follow the pope. Jesus said this position is protected, from that point of view the devil will do everything he can to undermine the words of Christ.
Jesus gave Peter the key of David and promised this church the gates of hell will not prevail against (Mat 16:18-19). Then Jesus goes on to say if you do not follow this church He just set up you will go to hell (Mat 18:17).
John the apostle tells us we have to follow the man with the key of David (Rev 3:7-10). The man with the key of David is the appointed prime minster he stands in place of the Davidic king with the king's authority symbolised as keys and this position is passed down (Is 22:22). So according tot he bible the true church of Christ has to still exist today headed by the man with the key of David in an unbroken apostolic line back to Peter. This can only be the Catholic Church.
 

Miri

The Thingy Member
Jul 22, 2012
8,307
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#42
I don’t know which is the saddest.

That the pope allegedly thinks God made gay people.
That the man referred to was sexually abused by catholic priests.
Or that possibly the abuse he suffered at the hands of the Catholic Church,
might have influenced his sexual preferences.

In this case, three wrongs don’t make a right. What a mess all round.
 

NHR

New member
Jun 11, 2018
29
5
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#43
I don’t know which is the saddest.

That the pope allegedly thinks God made gay people.
That the man referred to was sexually abused by catholic priests.
Or that possibly the abuse he suffered at the hands of the Catholic Church,
might have influenced his sexual preferences.

In this case, three wrongs don’t make a right. What a mess all round.
What evidence do you have to claim the pope said it is ok to be gay?

Further, can you please show where the Catholic church teaches that it is ok to abuse children? If you cannot then you cannot claim the Catholic church abused anybody but evil men who are in the church. If it is the entire church's fault for the actions of a few then you have to also accuse Jesus of theft because He personally chose Judas to be one of the 12. Judas was a thief according to the gospel.

When you take into consideration the independent investigations that have been conducted into the sex abuse crisis from around the world such as John Jay or the Murphy report, you find similar figure globally. Most abuse cases from religious groups including non-Catholic Christianity sits between 2-8% of cases. But the Catholic Church has less than 0.1%, with most cases of abuse against children coming from parents at around 70%. The anti-Christian never reports this for some reason?
 

SaintMichaels

Active member
Jun 6, 2018
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#44

NHR

New member
Jun 11, 2018
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#45
What was not reported, or this Pope failed to detail, is that while that may be true according to RCC teaching, their Catechism as pertains to homosexuals states that such persons must as Roman Catholics be celibate.
What you are saying here is true. Another example would be a married man who is attracted to a woman who is not his wife. The attraction is not a sin. But if he acts on that attraction by any thought, word or deed then he commits a sin. The same with homosexuality.

But it must be remembered we don't know if the pope really made this claim about God making this man gay.
 

Miri

The Thingy Member
Jul 22, 2012
8,307
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113
UK age 50
#46
What evidence do you have to claim the pope said it is ok to be gay?

Further, can you please show where the Catholic church teaches that it is ok to abuse children? If you cannot then you cannot claim the Catholic church abused anybody but evil men who are in the church. If it is the entire church's fault for the actions of a few then you have to also accuse Jesus of theft because He personally chose Judas to be one of the 12. Judas was a thief according to the gospel.

When you take into consideration the independent investigations that have been conducted into the sex abuse crisis from around the world such as John Jay or the Murphy report, you find similar figure globally. Most abuse cases from religious groups including non-Catholic Christianity sits between 2-8% of cases. But the Catholic Church has less than 0.1%, with most cases of abuse against children coming from parents at around 70%. The anti-Christian never reports this for some reason?

If you read the actually article you will see that the pope was
allegedly speaking to the person who had been sexually abused by catholic
priests. And the pope allegedly told them it was ok to be gay.
 

Miri

The Thingy Member
Jul 22, 2012
8,307
1,187
113
UK age 50
#47
What was not reported, or this Pope failed to detail, is that while that may be true according to RCC teaching, their Catechism as pertains to homosexuals states that such persons must as Roman Catholics be celibate.

That’s false teaching, Jesus never called any of his followers to be celebate.
Peter who was supposedly the first Pope (according to the Catholic Church, I don’t
believe he was), had a mother in law, as Jesus healed her!

Maybe if Catholic priests were allowed to have wives and it wasn’t such a
“Boys club”. We would see less cases of molestation. Even God told Adam it
was not good to be alone.

The bible also has things to say about this too, but the Catholic Church thinks
it knows better than God.


Matthew 8:14-15 NKJV
[14] Now when Jesus had come into Peter's house, He saw his wife's mother
lying sick with a fever. [15] So He touched her hand, and the fever left her.
And she arose and served them.



1 Corinthians 7:1-5 NKJV
[1] Now concerning the things of which you wrote to me: It is good
for a man not to touch a woman. [2] Nevertheless, because of sexual
immorality, let each man have his own wife, and let each woman have
her own husband. [3] Let the husband render to his wife the affection
due her, and likewise also the wife to her husband.

[4] The wife does not have authority over her own body, but the husband
does. And likewise the husband does not have authority over his own
body, but the wife does. [5] Do not deprive one another except with
consent for a time, that you may give yourselves to fasting and prayer;
and come together again so that Satan does not tempt you because
of your lack of self-control.
 

NHR

New member
Jun 11, 2018
29
5
3
#48
If you read the actually article you will see that the pope was
allegedly speaking to the person who had been sexually abused by catholic
priests. And the pope allegedly told them it was ok to be gay.
Ok, so there is no actual evidence that the pope told this man that God made him gay. The media who has lied about the pope on gay issues before could be twisting what was actually said or even the man might not be telling the truth or misunderstood what the pope said. We cannot make a real judgment until we hear the pope say God makes people gay. You cannot destroy a man's reputation based on hearsay.
 

Adstar

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2016
3,568
698
113
#49
The amazing thing is catholics will still sick to the dogma that the pope is the infallible representative of God on earth and all things he declares are now equal to scripture and to be believed and followed...

But if we understand that God gives those who rebel against His will over to delusions and deception it is easy to understand why people follow false leaders into the eternal lake of fire..
 

NHR

New member
Jun 11, 2018
29
5
3
#50
That’s false teaching, Jesus never called any of his followers to be celebate.
Peter who was supposedly the first Pope (according to the Catholic Church, I don’t
believe he was), had a mother in law, as Jesus healed her!

Maybe if Catholic priests were allowed to have wives and it wasn’t such a
“Boys club”. We would see less cases of molestation. Even God told Adam it
was not good to be alone.

The bible also has things to say about this too, but the Catholic Church thinks
it knows better than God.


Matthew 8:14-15 NKJV
[14] Now when Jesus had come into Peter's house, He saw his wife's mother
lying sick with a fever. [15] So He touched her hand, and the fever left her.
And she arose and served them.



1 Corinthians 7:1-5 NKJV
[1] Now concerning the things of which you wrote to me: It is good
for a man not to touch a woman. [2] Nevertheless, because of sexual
immorality, let each man have his own wife, and let each woman have
her own husband. [3] Let the husband render to his wife the affection
due her, and likewise also the wife to her husband.

[4] The wife does not have authority over her own body, but the husband
does. And likewise the husband does not have authority over his own
body, but the wife does. [5] Do not deprive one another except with
consent for a time, that you may give yourselves to fasting and prayer;
and come together again so that Satan does not tempt you because
of your lack of self-control.
Jesus did teach celibacy, "For there are eunuchs, who were born so from their mother's womb: and there are eunuchs, who were made so by men: and there are eunuchs, who have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven. He that can take, let him take it" (Mat 19:12). .
 

NHR

New member
Jun 11, 2018
29
5
3
#51
The amazing thing is catholics will still sick to the dogma that the pope is the infallible representative of God on earth and all things he declares are now equal to scripture and to be believed and followed...

But if we understand that God gives those who rebel against His will over to delusions and deception it is easy to understand why people follow false leaders into the eternal lake of fire..
The problem with what you are claiming is that the bible never gives you a list of what books belong in scripture. You got that from the pope in the 4th-century. As even the father of protestant Christianity admits, “We concede — as we must — that so much of what they say is true: that the papacy has God’s word and the office of the apostles, and that we have received Holy Scriptures, Baptism, the Sacrament, and the pulpit from them. What would we know of these if it were not for them?” (Martin Luther, Sermon on the Gospel of St. John, 1537).

Also the bible says you have to follow the pope (Rev 3:7-10).
 

Miri

The Thingy Member
Jul 22, 2012
8,307
1,187
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UK age 50
#52
Ok, so there is no actual evidence that the pope told this man that God made him gay. The media who has lied about the pope on gay issues before could be twisting what was actually said or even the man might not be telling the truth or misunderstood what the pope said. We cannot make a real judgment until we hear the pope say God makes people gay. You cannot destroy a man's reputation based on hearsay.

Have a look at this if you want independent news. They are saying
the Vatican hasn’t confirmed or denied it. Surely if it was false they would
have issued a statement by now. Why would someone with such “influence”
not deny it if it wasn’t true.

Notice there is also no denial about the abuse either.


But anyway watch this space, there may be an update at some point.


https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/...be-happy-being-gay-god-made-me-this-way-84469
 

James777

Junior Member
Mar 13, 2013
1
0
1
#53
Why can I not get into Chat ? ? ? Cant use any Password. What is going on ? ? ?
 

Adstar

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2016
3,568
698
113
#54
The problem with what you are claiming is that the bible never gives you a list of what books belong in scripture. You got that from the pope in the 4th-century. As even the father of protestant Christianity admits, “We concede — as we must — that so much of what they say is true: that the papacy has God’s word and the office of the apostles, and that we have received Holy Scriptures, Baptism, the Sacrament, and the pulpit from them. What would we know of these if it were not for them?” (Martin Luther, Sermon on the Gospel of St. John, 1537).

Also the bible says you have to follow the pope (Rev 3:7-10).
No you are wrong there.. The first council that collected and compiled the Holy Bible had no pope... It was done by different churches comming together and putting forward the scriptures they had and then deciding on what should be included and what should be excluded.. The collection of the scriptures was not one mans decision.. If it was then there would probably be only one Gospel account instead of 4..

The evil papacy is just harlotry to the roman empire.. I will never follow such a evil unchristian insitiution..

And Rev 3: 7-10 does not call upon me to follow a degenerate abomination called the pope..
 

Miri

The Thingy Member
Jul 22, 2012
8,307
1,187
113
UK age 50
#55
Jesus did teach celibacy, "For there are eunuchs, who were born so from their mother's womb: and there are eunuchs, who were made so by men: and there are eunuchs, who have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven. He that can take, let him take it" (Mat 19:12). .

Eunuchs had no choice, they were abused. Jesus wasn’t say people should become
a Eunuch he was just setting out what happens if you are one.
Traditionally they were “well you know” before puberty so they never
developed properly. Children don’t get a choice. Eunuchs were also traditionally
not allowed into the temple as they were incomplete. So for anyone who was
mutilated in this way, they would have been considers outcasts as far as religion
went. Jesus was saying I accept you as you are to them. Just as he accepted
others considered outcasts of society.

They suffered horribly as they could not go to the bathroom normally etc and
the lack of testies meant they never developed properly.

By the way other translations have

Matthew 19:11-12 NLT
[11] "Not everyone can accept this statement," Jesus said. "Only those
whom God helps. [12] Some are born as eunuchs, some have been
made eunuchs by others, and some choose not to marry for the sake
of the Kingdom of Heaven. Let anyone accept this who can."


It also has to be read in conjunction with the 1 cor verses I posted earlier.
Again Jesus never command his disciples or church leaders not to marry, yet
the Catholic Church puts that burden on its priests.
 

NHR

New member
Jun 11, 2018
29
5
3
#56
Eunuchs had no choice, they were abused. Jesus wasn’t say people should become
a Eunuch he was just setting out what happens if you are one.
Traditionally they were “well you know” before puberty so they never
developed properly. Children don’t get a choice. Eunuchs were also traditionally
not allowed into the temple as they were incomplete. So for anyone who was
mutilated in this way, they would have been considers outcasts as far as religion
went. Jesus was saying I accept you as you are to them. Just as he accepted
others considered outcasts of society.

They suffered horribly as they could not go to the bathroom normally etc and
the lack of testies meant they never developed properly.

By the way other translations have

Matthew 19:11-12 NLT
[11] "Not everyone can accept this statement," Jesus said. "Only those
whom God helps. [12] Some are born as eunuchs, some have been
made eunuchs by others, and some choose not to marry for the sake
of the Kingdom of Heaven. Let anyone accept this who can."


It also has to be read in conjunction with the 1 cor verses I posted earlier.
Again Jesus never command his disciples or church leaders not to marry, yet
the Catholic Church puts that burden on its priests.
Ok, if the media says the Vatican has not confirmed or denied, this still means there is no evidence that the pope made this claim. The fact remains that we don't know if the pope even knows anything about the matter. This is still just a rumor.

Jesus says that some are eunuchs at birth and some are made so. But then Jesus clearly says, "and there are eunuchs, who have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven." This is His kingdom and then encourages it for anyone who can take it (Mat 19:12).

Now this fits in with the Catholic Church teachings which does not prevent anyone from getting married but allows the choice to get married or have a religious life of celibacy for the kingdom of God.
 

NHR

New member
Jun 11, 2018
29
5
3
#57
No you are wrong there.. The first council that collected and compiled the Holy Bible had no pope... It was done by different churches comming together and putting forward the scriptures they had and then deciding on what should be included and what should be excluded.. The collection of the scriptures was not one mans decision.. If it was then there would probably be only one Gospel account instead of 4..

The evil papacy is just harlotry to the roman empire.. I will never follow such a evil unchristian insitiution..

And Rev 3: 7-10 does not call upon me to follow a degenerate abomination called the pope..
Ok, if you think you are right can you please name this council that put the bible together without the pope?

The book of Rev 3:7-10 says you have to follow the man with the key of David. The man with the key of David is a prime minister who stands in place of the Davidic king with the king's authority symbolised as keys and this position is passed down (Is 22:22). Jesus is the eternal Davidic king (Luke 1:32). Jesus gave His keys of authority to Peter and promised this church the gates of hell will not prevail against it (Mat 16:18-19). Jesus then says if you do not follow this authority you will go to hell (Mat 18:19). So the true church of Christ has to still exist today headed by the man with the key of David in an unbroken apostolic line back to Peter. This is only the Catholic Church. Name one other that fits this biblical description?

If not the Catholic Church then the bible is wrong.
 

Miri

The Thingy Member
Jul 22, 2012
8,307
1,187
113
UK age 50
#58
Ok, if the media says the Vatican has not confirmed or denied, this still means there is no evidence that the pope made this claim. The fact remains that we don't know if the pope even knows anything about the matter. This is still just a rumor.

Jesus says that some are eunuchs at birth and some are made so. But then Jesus clearly says, "and there are eunuchs, who have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven." This is His kingdom and then encourages it for anyone who can take it (Mat 19:12).

Now this fits in with the Catholic Church teachings which does not prevent anyone from getting married but allows the choice to get married or have a religious life of celibacy for the kingdom of God.

Not really, it’s entirely possible to be a church minister and be married, have a
family etc. In fact in many churches, the ministers wife is often just as involved
with the church as their husbands and helps with vital ministry.

Only in the Catholic Church are man made rules given out the priests cannot marry.
Maybe that’s why it attracts so many “men” who have no interest in marrying
women. I’m not being facetious saying that, there does seem to be rather a
lot of gay priests in the Catholic Church.

But by all means if any of them want yo use this scripture to justify that piece of
doctrine, then maybe they might want to consider becoming Eunichs as well!

Funny that isn’t it how they use it to justify why they don’t marry but they don’t
go all the way with it.
 

NHR

New member
Jun 11, 2018
29
5
3
#59
Not really, it’s entirely possible to be a church minister and be married, have a
family etc. In fact in many churches, the ministers wife is often just as involved
with the church as their husbands and helps with vital ministry.

Only in the Catholic Church are man made rules given out the priests cannot marry.
Maybe that’s why it attracts so many “men” who have no interest in marrying
women. I’m not being facetious saying that, there does seem to be rather a
lot of gay priests in the Catholic Church.

But by all means if any of them want yo use this scripture to justify that piece of
doctrine, then maybe they might want to consider becoming Eunichs as well!

Funny that isn’t it how they use it to justify why they don’t marry but they don’t
go all the way with it.
Yes, the church can change the rule bec it is a disciple. Jesus gave to the pope the power to loose and bind so it is not sufficient to claim this as a man made rule that doesn't have to be followed (Mat 16:18). However it does not go against the bible to practice celibacy is my point and Jesus Himself said it is good for people who can take it. In the church no one is forced to become a priest. No one is prevented from getting married.

Now some priest can become priest for the wrong reason but this goes back tot he Judas thing. Jesus personally chose Judas as one of the 12. Yet he sinned and is probably in hell based on the words of Christ and even modern day exorcist priest who are claiming his spirit is a demonic one. He was one of the spirits in Emily Rose. But this does not nullify the church Jesus started. All these people chose to do the wrong thing with the free will they were given.

Jesus is clearly referring to Eunuchs as in celibacy. But Eunuchs in Jewish tradition did not cut anything off. This would be self mutilation. What you are referring to is a pagan practice. But as I quoted Jesus even said celibacy for the kingdom of God is ok.
 

Born_Again

Senior Member
Nov 15, 2014
1,560
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#60
This is why you follow Christ and His word... not a man and his word.