Predestination is misunderstood...
- Thread starter Genez
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Yeah I'm aware of the loaded questions 😊
I often do answer a question with a question, in this place, to find out there motives.
But not always. 😊
So the seed that enters the heart and is removed, is that the seed that saves also.
Well I believe it is. It is word, a light, a seed, if it stays it sows if it leaves, it knows.
Does it return, or mark the place as void.
For the darkness has never understood the light.
I often do answer a question with a question, in this place, to find out there motives.
But not always. 😊
So the seed that enters the heart and is removed, is that the seed that saves also.
Well I believe it is. It is word, a light, a seed, if it stays it sows if it leaves, it knows.
Does it return, or mark the place as void.
For the darkness has never understood the light.
Right here-Molinism is a Catholic theological system that attempts to reconcile human free will with God's grace, providence, foreknowledge, and predestination. It's named after Luis de Molina, a 16th-century Spanish Jesuit priest and Roman Catholic theologian-guess you will agree with this in your worldview-Subjunctive Clauses-pre-determinism-determinism-counter factuals.
With my favorite William Craig and WiseDisciple.
-
1
- Show all
I don't support molinism on the second part 😋
Molinism has got some good points tho.
Such as God knows what the outcome will be of a person, who does not make the right choice
But I believe God wills a person to make the right choice, especially those who are saved.
Where molinism says God will leave a person to make his own choice always.
Calvinism says differently,.it says God wills a saved person to make the right choice.
I believe calvinism is correct on that part.
So it looks like those who says calvinism believes God wills evil are wrong.
Molinism has got some good points tho.
Such as God knows what the outcome will be of a person, who does not make the right choice
But I believe God wills a person to make the right choice, especially those who are saved.
Where molinism says God will leave a person to make his own choice always.
Calvinism says differently,.it says God wills a saved person to make the right choice.
I believe calvinism is correct on that part.
So it looks like those who says calvinism believes God wills evil are wrong.
Ruff ruff woof woof.
Making a choice has nothing to do with free will.
I can will you to make A choice but will you make it ?
Your will is your drive, its your mojo its your rational desire to influence your choice
Your will is your enthusiasm, it's all theese things and its your inner you
A free will is also your will because only your will is your will and nobody else's., if your desire rules your choice, then your not in control friend.
Your will can be influenced,
Like your will to live or die.
You can lose the will to live because of a bad choice or because of bereavement
Your suppose to be intelligent,
And you need an idiot like me to tell you this.
Can I make the same choices and have the same will as the father.
No I can not.
So I need the will of God's word and the choice of God's word to help me choose and keep my will strong but also in check,
But Will you listen
Will you or won't you, I doubt it
Making a choice has nothing to do with free will.
I can will you to make A choice but will you make it ?
Your will is your drive, its your mojo its your rational desire to influence your choice
Your will is your enthusiasm, it's all theese things and its your inner you
A free will is also your will because only your will is your will and nobody else's., if your desire rules your choice, then your not in control friend.
Your will can be influenced,
Like your will to live or die.
You can lose the will to live because of a bad choice or because of bereavement
Your suppose to be intelligent,
And you need an idiot like me to tell you this.
Can I make the same choices and have the same will as the father.
No I can not.
So I need the will of God's word and the choice of God's word to help me choose and keep my will strong but also in check,
But Will you listen
Will you or won't you, I doubt it
Proving once again that you're totally clueless as to what free will means. You believe that you're just like God who can by the omnipotent power of his will bring things into existence or call them out of existence, or can will for things to happen or not happen, as he pleases? Really? You really believe you have the power to will anyone here to make certain choices?
It's good to know, though, just how seriously deluded you are, thinking you can do only what God can. I have to think the seriousness of your condition will likely elicit a lot of prayers to the Lord on your behalf. May He have mercy on you and hear us all, as we pray for your deliverance.
Get a grip on reality! You are NOT deity. You are not divine. You are not God. You're a mere mortal like the rest of us and if you want to be taken seriously on a public forum, you need to address honest questions that people ask you, otherwise, you will wind up with zero credibility. You will simply be perceived as a perennial echo chamber dweller who posts here because you love to hear the feedback of your own voice.
------------For the General Audience. We have so much error rampant through this forum. Hopefully every believer listens.------------
Believers have a responsibility to point out error and guide others towards truth as part of their commitment to love, truth, and the spiritual well-being of the community. This responsibility is rooted in the broader biblical commands to love one's neighbor, to pursue righteousness, and to be agents of reconciliation and truth in the world. Several passages throughout the New Testament underscore this aspect of Christian duty: (We are called to love one another even when we disagree. Perhaps we can take a step back and approach ALL conversation with a spirit of humility and respect. While we may have different interpretations (The Word of God is the only true Interpretation), it's important to remember that God calls us to unity and love. Let's focus on those shared values in ALL discussions.)
Galatians 6:1 (NKJV): "Brethren, if a man is overtaken in any trespass, you who are spiritual restore such a one in a spirit of gentleness, considering yourself lest you also be tempted." This verse emphasizes the responsibility of believers to help restore those who have fallen into sin. The approach should be characterized by gentleness and self-awareness, highlighting the importance of humility and care in correcting others.
Matthew 18:15-17 (NKJV): "Moreover if your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he hears you, you have gained your brother. But if he will not hear, take with you one or two more, that ‘by the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.’ And if he refuses to hear them, tell it to the church. But if he refuses even to hear the church, let him be to you like a heathen and a tax collector." Here, Jesus provides a process for addressing sin within the community, emphasizing the importance of private correction and the goal of reconciliation. It shows a structured approach to pointing out error, with the ultimate aim of restoration.
2 Timothy 4:2 (NKJV): "Preach the word! Be ready in season and out of season. Convince, rebuke, exhort, with all longsuffering and teaching." Paul instructs Timothy—and by extension, all believers—to be diligent in teaching the truth of God's Word, which includes correcting errors and encouraging right living. This exhortation underscores the role of Scripture in guiding the process of correction and the need for patience and dedication in this task.
James 5:19-20 (NKJV): "Brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth, and someone turns him back, let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul from death and cover a multitude of sins." James highlights the life-saving impact of correcting error and guiding someone back to the truth. It presents the act of pointing out error as an expression of care and concern for the spiritual state of others.
with meekness and fear: The manner in which believers are to defend their faith is critically important. "Meekness" suggests gentleness and humility, indicating that our defense should not be aggressive or confrontational but characterized by the humility that comes from understanding that our faith is a gift from God. "Fear" in this context refers to a deep respect or reverence for God, reminding believers that their ultimate accountability is to Him. This respectful approach ensures that the conversation about faith honors God and respects the dignity of the person asking.
These passages collectively illustrate that believers are indeed called to lovingly and carefully address error within the community, always aiming for the restoration and spiritual health of the individual. This responsibility is carried out within the context of a commitment to truth, love, humility, and the ultimate goal of salvation. It's important that such correction is done in a spirit of gentleness, respect, and love, reflecting the character of Christ.
Believers have a responsibility to point out error and guide others towards truth as part of their commitment to love, truth, and the spiritual well-being of the community. This responsibility is rooted in the broader biblical commands to love one's neighbor, to pursue righteousness, and to be agents of reconciliation and truth in the world. Several passages throughout the New Testament underscore this aspect of Christian duty: (We are called to love one another even when we disagree. Perhaps we can take a step back and approach ALL conversation with a spirit of humility and respect. While we may have different interpretations (The Word of God is the only true Interpretation), it's important to remember that God calls us to unity and love. Let's focus on those shared values in ALL discussions.)
Galatians 6:1 (NKJV): "Brethren, if a man is overtaken in any trespass, you who are spiritual restore such a one in a spirit of gentleness, considering yourself lest you also be tempted." This verse emphasizes the responsibility of believers to help restore those who have fallen into sin. The approach should be characterized by gentleness and self-awareness, highlighting the importance of humility and care in correcting others.
Matthew 18:15-17 (NKJV): "Moreover if your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he hears you, you have gained your brother. But if he will not hear, take with you one or two more, that ‘by the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.’ And if he refuses to hear them, tell it to the church. But if he refuses even to hear the church, let him be to you like a heathen and a tax collector." Here, Jesus provides a process for addressing sin within the community, emphasizing the importance of private correction and the goal of reconciliation. It shows a structured approach to pointing out error, with the ultimate aim of restoration.
2 Timothy 4:2 (NKJV): "Preach the word! Be ready in season and out of season. Convince, rebuke, exhort, with all longsuffering and teaching." Paul instructs Timothy—and by extension, all believers—to be diligent in teaching the truth of God's Word, which includes correcting errors and encouraging right living. This exhortation underscores the role of Scripture in guiding the process of correction and the need for patience and dedication in this task.
James 5:19-20 (NKJV): "Brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth, and someone turns him back, let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul from death and cover a multitude of sins." James highlights the life-saving impact of correcting error and guiding someone back to the truth. It presents the act of pointing out error as an expression of care and concern for the spiritual state of others.
with meekness and fear: The manner in which believers are to defend their faith is critically important. "Meekness" suggests gentleness and humility, indicating that our defense should not be aggressive or confrontational but characterized by the humility that comes from understanding that our faith is a gift from God. "Fear" in this context refers to a deep respect or reverence for God, reminding believers that their ultimate accountability is to Him. This respectful approach ensures that the conversation about faith honors God and respects the dignity of the person asking.
These passages collectively illustrate that believers are indeed called to lovingly and carefully address error within the community, always aiming for the restoration and spiritual health of the individual. This responsibility is carried out within the context of a commitment to truth, love, humility, and the ultimate goal of salvation. It's important that such correction is done in a spirit of gentleness, respect, and love, reflecting the character of Christ.