Predestination is misunderstood...

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

maxamir

Active member
Mar 8, 2024
696
86
28
And your inability to hear with understanding prevents you from comprehending that man's volition does not save him. God's determination to save believers is what saves men.

Have a nice day.
If you finally submit to salvation belonging to God and not the choice of men then I thank God for answered prayer!
 

maxamir

Active member
Mar 8, 2024
696
86
28
Why Did Jesus say this if no one is worthy of his grace
Luke 13:1-9

New King James Version





Repent or Perish
13 There were present at that season some who told Him about the Galileans whose blood Pilate had [a]mingled with their sacrifices. 2 And Jesus answered and said to them, “Do you suppose that these Galileans were worse sinners than all other Galileans, because they suffered such things? 3 I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish. 4 Or those eighteen on whom the tower in Siloam fell and killed them, do you think that they were worse sinners than all other men who dwelt in Jerusalem? 5 I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish.”
God shows His providential goodness in warning men of their terrible state before Him and the pending judgement they are under which man's conscience is a witness to but grace is only found in those He actually saves from His wrath and not those who simply hear the warning.
 

maxamir

Active member
Mar 8, 2024
696
86
28
Matthew 11:29

New International Version

Jesus said

29 Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls.
then only people who enter into Christ's yoke are those who have been humbled to see their desperate need of His grace but there is no peace for the wicked.
 

Genez

Junior Member
Oct 12, 2017
2,776
407
83
Very interesting!

Exactly, in my first language so many things get lost in the translation to English, it is very difficult to convey that nuance. I feel like it is different than an acquired language because as much as you study and learn the language the nuance is really only understood within that culture, just my sense of it.

I will need to look up "isagogics" :)
:unsure: ...Curiosity alert!


What is your first language?
 

Genez

Junior Member
Oct 12, 2017
2,776
407
83
Keep reading and you will learn that none can come to Him unless God draws him and it has been granted to him do so.

Joh 6:44 No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up at the last day.

Joh 6:65 And He said, "Therefore I have said to you that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted to him by My Father."
Why was Jesus saying that?

Because all those religious Jews were seeking what works they could do to gain God's approbation!

Jesus set them on their workaholic fannies and told them that God must do a work before they could get saved.
Then He slammed them with a work to do to get them where their evil hearts wanted to be.

"You want to do a work to gain eternal life? Then eat my flesh and drink my blood to be saved!"

They being dull minded presumed the literal meaning and took off.
Jesus did that on purpose because he knew they were being dead weight.

grace and peace .....................
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
25,369
13,730
113
I'm actually a really nice guy, I'm even willing to help old ladies cross the street. I have given money to homeless people and handed out gospel tracts, so yeah. Nobody can say that they are "holier than thou"
"Nice" is not a fruit of the Spirit. It doesn't matter what good you do, for as you judge others, so shall you be judged.
 

maxamir

Active member
Mar 8, 2024
696
86
28
Why was Jesus saying that?

Because all those religious Jews were seeking what works they could do to gain God's approbation!

Jesus set them on their workaholic fannies and told them that God must do a work before they could get saved.
Then He slammed them with a work to do to get them where their evil hearts wanted to be.

"You want to do a work to gain eternal life? Then eat my flesh and drink my blood to be saved!"

They being dull minded presumed the literal meaning and took off.
Jesus did that on purpose because he knew they were being dead weight.

grace and peace .....................
the issue at hand is who is the cause of salvation, God or man?

I'll let Scripture answer that question.

Psa 65:4 Blessed is the man You choose, And cause to approach You, That he may dwell in Your courts. We shall be satisfied with the goodness of Your house, Of Your holy temple.

Psa 119:49 Remember the word to Your servant, Upon which You have caused me to hope.
 
Dec 18, 2023
6,402
406
83
you do realise by resorting to ad hominem attacks and slander you only prove that you have no valid arguments to make?
. I dont argue with evil

Repent or Perish
13 There were present at that season some who told Him about the Galileans whose blood Pilate had [a]mingled with their sacrifices. 2 And Jesus answered and said to them, “Do you suppose that these Galileans were worse sinners than all other Galileans, because they suffered such things? 3 I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish. 4 Or those eighteen on whom the tower in Siloam fell and killed them, do you think that they were worse sinners than all other men who dwelt in Jerusalem? 5 I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish.”
 
Dec 18, 2023
6,402
406
83
God is only limited by His perfect nature eg, He can not lie.
You still need to repent.


Repent or Perish
13 There were present at that season some who told Him about the Galileans whose blood Pilate had [a]mingled with their sacrifices. 2 And Jesus answered and said to them, “Do you suppose that these Galileans were worse sinners than all other Galileans, because they suffered such things? 3 I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish. 4 Or those eighteen on whom the tower in Siloam fell and killed them, do you think that they were worse sinners than all other men who dwelt in Jerusalem? 5 I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish.”
 
Dec 18, 2023
6,402
406
83
God shows His providential goodness in warning men of their terrible state before Him and the pending judgement they are under which man's conscience is a witness to but grace is only found in those He actually saves from His wrath and not those who simply hear the warning.
well do you also go with the Calvinism idea that Jesus has not spoken to anyone for 2000 years and God has not saved anyone for 6000 years.

Because that's what your twisted Calvinist friend said to me.

Well can you at least be a man and answer this question directly.

I bet you can't.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
59,828
29,201
113
The text says that Eve was tempted and ate before Adam and that she went to him after, so I do not think it was at the exact same time.
Genesis 3:6 When the woman saw that the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eyes, and that it was desirable
for obtaining wisdom, she took the fruit and ate it. She also gave some to her husband who was with her, and he ate it.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
59,828
29,201
113
No, it isn't. Prayer solves nothing when you are not thinking.
The Spirit helps us in our weakness. We do not know what we ought to pray for, but the Spirit himself
intercedes for us through wordless groans. And he who searches our hearts knows the mind of the Spirit,
because the Spirit intercedes for God’s people in accordance with the will of God. From Romans 8:26-27.