Psalm 27

[evyaniy]

Where else in all of Scripture are the relationship between Father, Son and Holy Spirit revealed besides the Psalms? What can that teach us? Their very voices speaking to and about Each Other are revealed in the Psalms, as the writer of Hebrews clearly shows us. Just as he showed us so much about Father and Son in Hebrews, using the Psalms as His primary source and attributing quotes to Father and Son explicitly, how can we then ignore that?

It is not like the writer of Hebrews covered everything the Father and Son said in the Psalms in his letter. He was showing us that the Father and Son are speaking in the Psalms and he used certain quotes to show us that and explain the Gospel. But He only used a few quotes to show us what is available and revealed in the Psalms so we would understand there is more and then search for it.

 

[evyaniy]

I've always seen the Holy Spirit in Proverbs 8...

In Proverbs when it says "My son".... I can hear the Father's Voice.

In the Song of Solomon when it says "My Beloved"... I can hear Jesus' Voice to me.

Yes, They are revealed throughout Scripture.

 

[evyaniy]

I've always seen the Holy Spirit in Proverbs 8...

In Proverbs when it says "My son".... I can hear the Father's Voice.

In the Song of Solomon when it says "My Beloved"... I can hear Jesus' Voice to me.

Thank you very much for this pleasant discussion and the points you raised. Will have to think and ponder for some time to see where it leads. Blessings to you

 

[Lafftur]

Where else in all of Scripture are the relationship between Father, Son and Holy Spirit revealed besides the Psalms? What can that teach us? Their very voices speaking to and about Each Other are revealed in the Psalms, as the writer of Hebrews clearly shows us. Just as he showed us so much about Father and Son in Hebrews, using the Psalms as His primary source and attributing quotes to Father and Son explicitly, how can we then ignore that?

It is not like the writer of Hebrews covered everything the Father and Son said in the Psalms in his letter. He was showing us that the Father and Son are speaking in the Psalms and he used certain quotes to show us that and explain the Gospel. But He only used a few quotes to show us what is available and revealed in the Psalms so we would understand there is more and then search for it.

Thank you for sharing with me your passion for the Psalms. I think it's wonderful and delightful! God is there in the Psalms, enjoy!

 

[evyaniy]

The Path of Life is choosing The Father's Will and denying ourselves. The Father made known to Jesus Christ all of His (The Father's) Will so Jesus Christ knew what to think, say and do at all times. Jesus Christ knew to only say and do what He heard the Father say and saw the Father do.

Psalm 16 causes me to ponder and ask the Holy Spirit questions about the "Soul" of Jesus Christ the Son of God and Son of Man...

I know the Soul is the Mind, Will and Emotions... the scriptures speak of the "Mind of Christ" and we know He had His own Will that He set aside and instead would choose the Will of His Father.... like Jesus Christ prayed in the Garden..."Nevertheless, not My Will, but Yours be done." And, the Emotions of Christ...

Thinking more about your comments on the Son's Path of Life is choosing the Father's will is true. That would certainly include obeying the Law and commandments. As He told us, the greatest commandments are to "‘Love the Adonai your Elohim with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind" and "‘Love your neighbor as yourself." These are the commandments He was obeying when facing death to save us. As you point out, in His prayer in the garden He prayed "not My Will, but Yours be done."

Since offering His Life as a Sacrifice to save us, was not His will, (if there was any other way), He was obedient to the law and commandments and the will of His Father and trusting His Father's judgement and purpose with the outcome. So the Law and the will of the Father and obedience of the Son as well as Justice and Righteousness all met on the cross which allowed for mercy and the Love of the Father and Son to be accomplished.

We are not in disagreement. We are looking at different aspects of many things that came together to accomplish Salvation. His path to Life was the Law which required Him to choose to do His Father's will to save us.

 

[Lafftur]

Thinking more about your comments on the Son's Path of Life is choosing the Father's will is true. That would certainly include obeying the Law and commandments. As He told us, the greatest commandments are to "‘Love the Adonai your Elohim with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind" and "‘Love your neighbor as yourself." These are the commandments He was obeying when facing death to save us. As you point out, in His prayer in the garden He prayed "not My Will, but Yours be done."

Since offering His Life as a Sacrifice to save us, was not His will, (if there was any other way), He was obedient to the law and commandments and the will of His Father and trusting His Father's judgement and purpose with the outcome. So the Law and the will of the Father and obedience of the Son as well as Justice and Righteousness all met on the cross which allowed for mercy and the Love of the Father and Son to be accomplished.

We are not in disagreement. We are looking at different aspects of many things that came together to accomplish Salvation. His path to Life was the Law which required Him to choose to do His Father's will to save us.

Only Jesus Christ was given all power and authority in Heaven and Earth from His Father which included the power and authority to choose to lay His Life down and the power and authority to raise Himself up again whenever He chose to do so.

However, Jesus Christ chose to only lay His Life down when His Father said it was TIME to do so. Likewise, Jesus Christ did not choose to rise from the dead until His Father said it was TIME to do so which was the 3rd day.

Jesus Christ was never praying and trusting the Father to raise Him from the dead because the Father had already given Jesus Christ the power and authority to raise Himself from the dead.

What was so significant about the 3rd day….

 

[evyaniy]

Only Jesus Christ was given all power and authority in Heaven and Earth from His Father which included the power and authority to choose to lay His Life down and the power and authority to raise Himself up again whenever He chose to do so.

However, Jesus Christ chose to only lay His Life down when His Father said it was TIME to do so. Likewise, Jesus Christ did not choose to rise from the dead until His Father said it was TIME to do so which was the 3rd day.

Jesus Christ was never praying and trusting the Father to raise Him from the dead because the Father had already given Jesus Christ the power and authority to raise Himself from the dead.

What was so significant about the 3rd day….

Well, we are in disagreement about that. Can you please answer the question you posed about the 3rd day. Thanks

 

[Lafftur]

In the wilderness, God told Moses to tell the Israelites to purge and clean themselves and be prepared to encounter the Presence of God on the 3rd day.

We know the Father put His Hand on Jesus Christ as The Lamb of God and transferred ALL the sins of humanity onto the Lamb.

Perhaps it took 3 days for Jesus Christ to be cleansed and be in His Father’s Presence again…

We know Jesus Christ did not let Mary touch Him because He had not yet ascended to see His Father.

 

[evyaniy]

Also, do you have any verses to substantiate what you just said about Him never praying and trusting the Father to raise Him and that He had given Him that authority already? He did not say all power and authority was given to Him till after He was raised. If you have verses that prove otherwise, that would be helpful. Thank you

There are many verses in the Psalms where He asks the Father to raise Him or give Him Life. But of course if you do not think that is Him speaking then you could discount those. That does not make it correct though.

 

[evyaniy]

Well, we are in disagreement about that. Can you please answer the question you posed about the 3rd day. Thanks

that is great. we agree that we disagree. perf

 

[Lafftur]

Well, we are in disagreement about that. Can you please answer the question you posed about the 3rd day. Thanks

I agree that we disagree…lol!

No worries, we are still both in Christ and walk in His Love in our hearts toward each other!

 

[evyaniy]

It goes back to the post from a couple days ago that people do not agree that His prayers are revealed in the Psalms. That is the whole purpose of this saga is to show that His prayers are in the Psalms. Well, this is disheartening since there is so much revealed by knowing it is Him speaking in the Psalms which is what this has all been about.

Thank you for your time and forthrightness. Nothing can ever change the fact that Psalm 119 is His prayer for life in my mind. The more people challenged that the more it proved true while studying their objections. The intent was always to share what was received.

 

[Blain]

Psalm 27
By David.

(Son about Father)

27:1 YHVH is My Light and My Salvation.
whom shall I fear?
YHVH is the Strength of My life.
Of whom shall I be afraid?

(Son about evildoers)

27:2 When evildoers came at Me to eat up My flesh,
even My adversaries and My foes,
they stumbled and fell.
27:3 Though an army should encamp against Me,
My heart shall not fear.
Though war should rise against Me,
even then I will be confident.

(Son about Father)

27:4 One thing I have asked of YHVH,
that I will seek after,
that I may dwell in the house of YHVH
all the days of My life, to see YHVH's beauty,
and to inquire in His temple.
27:5 For in the day of trouble
He will keep Me secretly in His pavilion.
In the covert of His tabernacle He will hide Me.
He will lift Me up on a rock.
27:6 Now My head will be lifted up
above My enemies around Me.
I will offer sacrifices of joy in His tent.
I will sing, yes, I will sing praises to YHVH.

(Son to Father)

27:7 Hear, YHVH, when I cry with My voice.
Have mercy also on Me, and answer Me.

(Son quotes Father and then quotes His Own answer)

27:8 When You said, “Seek My face,”
My heart said to You, “I will seek Your face, YHVH.”

(Son to Father)

27:9 Don’t hide Your face from Me.
Don’t put Your Servant away in anger.
You have been My Help.
Don’t abandon Me,
neither forsake Me, 'Elohiym of My salvation.
27:10 Even if My father and My mother forsake Me,
then YHVH will take Me up.
27:11 Teach Me Your way, YHVH.
Lead Me in a straight path, because of My enemies.
27:12 Don’t deliver Me over to
the desire of My adversaries,
for false witnesses have risen up against Me,
such as breathe out cruelty.
27:13 I am still confident of this:
I will see the goodness of YHVH
in the land of the living.

(Son to believers or Spirit to Son)

27:14 Wait for YHVH.
Be strong, and let Your heart take courage.
Yes, wait for YHVH.

No David is one who lives in worship with God even in his distress at his lowest points he still gives God credit and speaks of hos gooness and faithfulness much like how one writes a poem from deep in their hearts to speak to and with God this is how David operated. Why would the father or the son or the spirit tell themselves to wait for themselves?

This is not rightly dividing this is trying to make it seem like something it is not. Look at the entire psalm what is the main focus and theme? What was the purpose of the psalm and who was it spoken to? David was perhaps the most loyal and closest person to his heart his songs and worship came from within and were always pointed to God never was there any instance where you read God speaking to God in them when you overcomplicate things you add to it.

This is a pure psalm from the heartwhere aside from your personal addition does this psalm say it is anything other than a song to God from the heart of David?

 

[Lafftur]

No David is one who lives in worship with God even in his distress at his lowest points he still gives God credit and speaks of hos gooness and faithfulness much like how one writes a poem from deep in their hearts to speak to and with God this is how David operated. Why would the father or the son or the spirit tell themselves to wait for themselves?

This is not rightly dividing this is trying to make it seem like something it is not. Look at the entire psalm what is the main focus and theme? What was the purpose of the psalm and who was it spoken to? David was perhaps the most loyal and closest person to his heart his songs and worship came from within and were always pointed to God never was there any instance where you read God speaking to God in them when you overcomplicate things you add to it.

This is a pure psalm from the heartwhere aside from your personal addition does this psalm say it is anything other than a song to God from the heart of David?

Hold on @Blain -

@evyaniy is our brother/sister in Christ. evyaniy is seeking Truth and sharing with all of us. evyaniy's heart is genuine. Be kind.

 

[evyaniy]

It comes down to people do not believe that Psalm 119 is the Son's prayer, which is fine. He was praying to His Father throughout the Psalm to be quickened or revived or live or raised from the dead to life again because of His obedience. No one else could pray that. We are saved by grace through faith. He was saved from death by His Father because of His obedience.

This whole thing was about sharing one of the most important revelations in Scripture with believers to bless their faith in the hopes that others would come to understand that the Son's prayers are revealed in the Psalms. This is not about debating with people. There are multiple threads and hundreds of posts trying to answer questions to help others to see it. Feel free to read some of the old posts if you like.

Since it is pretty much unanimous against what has been shared, the effort again appears fruitless. If you disagree please ignore the posts. The challenges have become tedious now and perhaps enough has been done. Thank you.

Looks like we are here again. No worries. The posts and sharing since then has been excellent and well worth the effort. It is also why the question is asked to posters about their understanding of Psalm 119 and Whose prayer it is. There is not much point in going round and round concerning a premise they do not agree with. There will always be other disagreements about Scripture when they do not agree that Psalm 119 is the Son's prayer. It is inevitable since Psalm 119 is central to understanding Scripture, in my view.

 

[evyaniy]

blessings to all, and to all a goodnight.

 

[Lafftur]

Also, do you have any verses to substantiate what you just said about Him never praying and trusting the Father to raise Him and that He had given Him that authority already? He did not say all power and authority was given to Him till after He was raised. If you have verses that prove otherwise, that would be helpful. Thank you

There are many verses in the Psalms where He asks the Father to raise Him or give Him Life. But of course if you do not think that is Him speaking then you could discount those. That does not make it correct though.

Notice in John 2:19 - Jesus Christ referring to His Body as the Temple of God, says that He (Jesus Christ) will raise it up again. He does NOT say He will pray and His Father will raise Him up again.


John 2:18-22

King James Version

18 Then answered the Jews and said unto him, What sign shewest thou unto us, seeing that thou doest these things?

19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.

20 Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?

21 But he spake of the temple of his body.

22 When therefore he was risen from the dead, his disciples remembered that he had said this unto them; and they believed the scripture, and the word which Jesus had said.

In Psalm 16:9-10, Jesus Christ is stating what He knows is True, what He knows is His Father's Will... that Jesus Christ will rise from the dead on the 3rd day... His Soul will not remain in Hell nor His Body in the Tomb.

He is not praying and asking His Father to deliver Him from Hell and the Grave, He knows He will rise on the 3rd day. It has already been given to Him to do so. Jesus Christ just has to choose to WAIT until the 3rd day. He is not waiting on His Father, He is waiting for the 3rd day.


Psalm 16:9-10

King James Version


9 Therefore my heart is glad, and my glory rejoiceth: my flesh also shall rest in hope.
10 For thou wilt not leave my soul in hell; neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.

Dear @evyaniy - I respect you and find you delightful! Please know, it's okay to not agree on everything. It's easy to see that you love Jesus Christ and He is your Lord and Savior! On that we BOTH AGREE!

 

[Blain]

Hold on @Blain -

@evyaniy is our brother/sister in Christ. evyaniy is seeking Truth and sharing with all of us. evyaniy's heart is genuine. Be kind.

Yes I suppose your right I have always felt a kindred spirit with David and became irritated. This psalm in particular means a lot to me and I didn't like Davids heartfelt words being taken away and from it's purpose. You know how psalms are with me and I suppose I felt a personal offense

 

[Blain]

Looks like we are here again. No worries. The posts and sharing since then has been excellent and well worth the effort. It is also why the question is asked to posters about their understanding of Psalm 119 and Whose prayer it is. There is not much point in going round and round concerning a premise they do not agree with. There will always be other disagreements about Scripture when they do not agree that Psalm 119 is the Son's prayer. It is inevitable since Psalm 119 is central to understanding Scripture, in my view.

I apologize for over reacting the book of psalms is very dear to my heart as is David and changing the Psalm and the heart that was speaking it was like a stab to my own. there is different understanding and I even have a feeling that psalm 23 is actually deeper than at first glance.

But it was my fault not yours.

 

[Lafftur]

@Blain -

For the record, I also find you absolutely delightful and I enjoy reading your Thread of Blain's Psalms!

I'm sleepy now and heading to sleep.... look forward to chatting more tomorrow! Goodnight everyone.... zzz