Research: Majority of Americans Believe Works Are the Key to Salvation

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

FreeGrace2

Well-known member
Jan 31, 2021
7,978
970
113
Luke 8:6 say it is possible the faith growth, ever believe than no longer believe or die
unless you not agree with Jesus
Sorry, but I don't have any idea what you are trying to say. Please slow down and rephrase this.

And while you are at it, find verses that clearly show that any of the 8 things in my list can be negated.

I dare you.
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,743
1,360
113
Sorry, but I don't have any idea what you are trying to say. Please slow down and rephrase this.

And while you are at it, find verses that clearly show that any of the 8 things in my list can be negated.

I dare you.
I give the clear verse Luke 8:6
it say faith may die like a plan growth for some time than die because not enough water
and all the verses in the Bible relate each other.
conclusion must involve all premises not only 8 verses

matt 24:13 must include in the premises
 

FreeGrace2

Well-known member
Jan 31, 2021
7,978
970
113
I give the clear verse Luke 8:6
You don't know what is clear.

But I have figured out why you stubbornly refuse to accept clear verses on eternal security. You have brought your opinionated emotions into it. You have showed it by the type of questions you ask. It is clear that certain behaviors are very offensive to you, and in your opinionated emotional state, you transfer that to God, and conclude that since YOU are that offended, then so must He be.

All you've done is LOWER God to YOUR level. That's never a good thing. You have humanized God.

God is so far above man it is incalculable.

it say faith may die like a plan growth for some time than die because not enough water
and all the verses in the Bible relate each other.
conclusion must involve all premises not only 8 verses
The 8 verses PROVE the changes that accompany salvation. If any of the 8 can be lost, along with salvation, there would be a verse saying so.

matt 24:13 must include in the premises
This verse has nothing to do with soul salvation and avoiding the LOF.

You will never understand Scripture so long as you keep lowering God to YOUR standards.
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,743
1,360
113
All your verses is faith require, when faith die like plan die, than no salvation
you lower God standard

ever have faith mean only a second than atheist for the rest of one live is save
it is not bible say
endure to the end

prove to me Matt 24:13 not about salvation

whosoever believe save

you change into who ever believe even only a second and turn to atheist will be save
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
14,244
2,927
113
All your verses is faith require, when faith die like plan die, than no salvation
you lower God standard

ever have faith mean only a second than atheist for the rest of one live is save
it is not bible say
endure to the end

prove to me Matt 24:13 not about salvation

whosoever believe save

you change into who ever believe even only a second and turn to atheist will be save
It's about survival, not the eternal salvation of the soul. If those days were not shortened, no one would survive, not even the elect. On must endure to the end.

22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.
 

FreeGrace2

Well-known member
Jan 31, 2021
7,978
970
113
All your verses is faith require, when faith die like plan die, than no salvation
you lower God standard
That's what you do.

ever have faith mean only a second than atheist for the rest of one live is save
Yes, your poor old emotions keep getting in the way of truth. Jesus said those who get eternal life shall never perish, and YET, you STILL reject what Jesus said.

it is not bible say
endure to the end
You don't understand what the Bible says.

prove to me Matt 24:13 not about salvation
I have. Several ways. Why haven't you been paying attention?

I showed what Jesus said about recipients of eternal life. They shall never perish. John 10:28
I showed what Jesus said about WHEN a person possesses eternal life. WHEN they become a believer. John 5:24

I showed that "having believed", the believer is sealed with the Holy Spirit, a deposit GUARANTEEING the believer's inheritance.

I showed from the context that Matt 24:13 is the 7 year tribulation.

whosoever believe save
Don't stop there. Those who believe POSSESS ETERNAL LIFE.
those who believe shall never perish.
Those who believe are sealed with the Holy Spirit, who GURANTEES their inheritance for the redemption.

you change into who ever believe even only a second and turn to atheist will be save
Your hypothetical is stupid. No one does that. You're just desperate to hold on to your false doctrine.
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,743
1,360
113
That's what you do.


Yes, your poor old emotions keep getting in the way of truth. Jesus said those who get eternal life shall never perish, and YET, you STILL reject what Jesus said.


You don't understand what the Bible says.


I have. Several ways. Why haven't you been paying attention?

I showed what Jesus said about recipients of eternal life. They shall never perish. John 10:28
I showed what Jesus said about WHEN a person possesses eternal life. WHEN they become a believer. John 5:24

I showed that "having believed", the believer is sealed with the Holy Spirit, a deposit GUARANTEEING the believer's inheritance.

I showed from the context that Matt 24:13 is the 7 year tribulation.


Don't stop there. Those who believe POSSESS ETERNAL LIFE.
those who believe shall never perish.
Those who believe are sealed with the Holy Spirit, who GURANTEES their inheritance for the redemption.


Your hypothetical is stupid. No one does that. You're just desperate to hold on to your false doctrine.
So you believe only being believer a second and that person still have 20 year before he die as atheist and save

i don’t understand why Stephen not deny any way his denial not make him unsave
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,743
1,360
113
Oyou believe physical save?

for 2000 years no elect survive
if so Paul still alive today, Peter etc

did you ever hear Paul still alive today
 

FreeGrace2

Well-known member
Jan 31, 2021
7,978
970
113
So you believe only being believer a second and that person still have 20 year before he die as atheist and save
So I believe that Jesus said when a person believes, they possess eternal life, AND recipients of eternal life shall never perish.

Why don't you believe what Jesus said?

And why do you continue to give such stupid hypotheticals, that NO ONE does.

No one believes something for "a second".

i don’t understand why Stephen not deny any way his denial not make him unsave
Seems you don't understand a lot of things.
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,743
1,360
113
So I believe that Jesus said when a person believes, they possess eternal life, AND recipients of eternal life shall never perish.

Why don't you believe what Jesus said?

And why do you continue to give such stupid hypotheticals, that NO ONE does.

No one believes something for "a second".


Seems you don't understand a lot of things.
your understanding are wrong

it doesn’t matter if any one believe a second or not but your definition if one ever believe, no limit time can be an hour or a second than being atheist for the rest of his live still save

must endure to the end of the live

if so why Jesus say if you deny Me I will deny you in front of the Father

if Jesus deny you, say I dont know him can you save?
 

FreeGrace2

Well-known member
Jan 31, 2021
7,978
970
113
your understanding are wrong
It is EASY to understand what Jesus said.

In John 5:24 He said that believers POSSESS (have) eternal life. No brainer
In John 10:28 He said that recipients of eternal life shall never perish. No brainer.

Since it is YOU who doesn't believe what Jesus said in these 2 verses, it is YOU who doesn't understand.

it doesn’t matter if any one believe a second or not but your definition if one ever believe, no limit time can be an hour or a second than being atheist for the rest of his live still save
You still don't understand or believe what Jesus said. That is where your hang-up is.

must endure to the end of the live
This is an addition to Scripture. The context is the 7 year tribulation, and Jesus NEVER said "end of life", as you wrongly do.

if so why Jesus say if you deny Me I will deny you in front of the Father
He was referring to an acknowledgement in front of His Father. While the believer will be in front of His Father, Jesus won't acknowledge him to His Father. This isn't difficult to grasp.

if Jesus deny you, say I dont know him can you save?
Since you don't undestand what it means by "denying you", it doesn't matter the answer because you don't even understand the premise.

You won't begin with the clear words of Jesus about eternal security. Instead, you mangle another verse, think that verse is about salvation, which it isn't, and then apply that false notion to the rest of Scripture.

You are therefore unteachable. There is no use or point in answering your questions because of this.
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,743
1,360
113
You don't know what is clear.

But I have figured out why you stubbornly refuse to accept clear verses on eternal security. You have brought your opinionated emotions into it. You have showed it by the type of questions you ask. It is clear that certain behaviors are very offensive to you, and in your opinionated emotional state, you transfer that to God, and conclude that since YOU are that offended, then so must He be.

All you've done is LOWER God to YOUR level. That's never a good thing. You have humanized God.

God is so far above man it is incalculable.


The 8 verses PROVE the changes that accompany salvation. If any of the 8 can be lost, along with salvation, there would be a verse saying so.


This verse has nothing to do with soul salvation and avoiding the LOF.

You will never understand Scripture so long as you keep lowering God to YOUR standards.
deny Jesus nothing to do with salvation?

if repent before die yes

not repent mean Jesus will say in front of His Father

” Father I don’t know him”

that person will go to hell
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,743
1,360
113
I am not perfect but I not use my emotion when read the bible
i try use all premise in the Bible before make conclusion

for example
for salvation need faith

for salvation need endurance

than it mean

for salvation need faith and endure in the faith to the end of your live

if you have vested interest to make it for sinner like me go to heaven than I will ignore or twist Matt 24:13
endure mean stay physically life to the second coming

in this definition no apostle endure
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,743
1,360
113
Yes, but only for those who NEVER believed in the first place.
did Janus say “ for those who never believe deny me wii make you lose you salvation but not for those who ever believe”

how people who never believe lose they salvation, they never have salvation

losing something only if one ever have something

you add the word
 
Jun 28, 2022
1,259
378
83
basically you fail to understand my answer
i keep answer and your Say I am not address those verse
all those promise are conditional if you obey

that show in verse 8

not know and not obey will punish

ex obey is no obey

say you always drive 55 but today you speeding to 85

the aw say you are speeding and violate the law

than police pull you than you say I am ex obey

police say not now this type ticket see you in court
I agree with FreeGrace2. Your grammar and poor grasp of English make your posts difficult to follow.

I browsed a forum not long ago where a member with the same issue would post a Bible question with, ''can you say me it?''

Was that you?
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,743
1,360
113
I agree with FreeGrace2. Your grammar and poor grasp of English make your posts difficult to follow.

I browsed a forum not long ago where a member with the same issue would post a Bible question with, ''can you say me it?''

Was that you?
I apologize for your inconvenient, if you tell me what part you don’t understand let me know