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oldhermit

Senior Member
Jul 28, 2012
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#41
Okay... so others in this thread [and your other thread] did not receive your same "thumbs up"... are we to assume you've simply not yet read their posts, but when you do you'll acknowledge by providing a "thumbs up" to their posts as well (whether you agree with them, or not)?? :unsure: [hmm... sounds reasonable :D ]
Lol. Not at all.
 

TheDivineWatermark

Well-known member
Aug 3, 2018
5,779
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#42
[P.S. the "PERFECT tense" goes like this: "ACTION COMPLETED at a SPECIFIC POINT of TIME in PAST (●) with results CONTINUING into the PRESENT (▬►). In certain contexts the results are PERMANENT." ... that is, until or unless something comes along to CHANGE that status... ; However, as we've seen, BOTH Rev2:8 and 20:4b use the "aorist indicative" (re: the SAME word "LIVED")... Therefore I disagree with your disagreement of my pointing out of that particular point :D (I think I know why you want to "disagree" on this point ;) )]
 

oldhermit

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Jul 28, 2012
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#43
Yea, I understand the various tenses and their uses.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
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#44
Can you show me where scripture ever makes this connection? The little horn, the man of sin and the son of perdition are never referred to by scripture as the antichrist. This is a manufactured eschatology that has absolutely no biblical support.
Your claim of a manufactured eschatology is (False)

Can you show me where the word (Trinity) is used in the holy bible, but we know well it is a manufactured (Phrase) representing the Father, Son, Holy Spirit, as being one

As I clearly showed, (The Antichrist) is a manufactured phrase, to represent a common (Future) human man.

The word (The Antichrist) is a catch all phrase, for the future human man that is identified several different places in the bible, just as the word (Trinity) is a catch all phrase for the Father, Son, Holy Spirit, being one.

Your use of 1 & 2 John is a "distraction", to the catch all phrase (The Antichrist), that you are well acquainted with, and know well it represents Daniel, Paul, And John in their human man described, as you desperately try to breathe life into your (Preterist) claims in (Historicism), that this figure has come and gone.

Examples: (The Antichrist) Same Future Human Man Below

(Future) Daniel's (Little Horn) Daniel 7:8-11

(Future) Paul's (Man Of Sin, Son Of Perdition) 2 Thessalonians 2:3

(Future) John's (The Beast) Revelation 13:4
 

TheDivineWatermark

Well-known member
Aug 3, 2018
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#45
[as to the point of "tenses"]


Ezekiel 37:10 - "and they lived"

Septuagint

( https://www.blueletterbible.org/search/search.cfm?Criteria=and+they+lived&t=KJV#s=s_primary_0_1 - <--NOTE: this phrase is found ONLY 2x in Scripture; here and Rev20:4b; Here in Ezek37:10, this is LIKENING this UNTO "a resurrection" as I'm always pointing out the parallel passages re: SAME, in Dan12:1-4; in Rom11:15[25]; in Isa26:15-21; here in Ezek37:10,12-14,21-23; in Hos5:14-6:3; etc etc... LIKENING this UNTO "a resurrection" but concerning ISRAEL's "future" [their coming up out of the graveyard of nations, WHERE SCATTERED (/'sow... unto the earth' / 'dust of the earth'), as opposed to a LITERAL / BODILY / PHYSICAL resurrection from being previously BODILY / PHYSICALLY "DEAD"--again, here in *this* text LIKENING this UNTO "a resurrection"--same language here! SEE bold below... ] )

Inflected, Root & Transliterated Strong's, Parsing

καὶ
καί
kai
g2532
Pronounce Greek root for G2532 καί


ἐπροφήτευσα
προφητεύω
prophēteuō
g4395
Pronounce Greek root for G4395 προφητεύω


καθότι
καθότι
kathoti
g2530
Pronounce Greek root for G2530 καθότι


ἐνετείλατό
ἐντέλλω
entellō
g1781
Pronounce Greek root for G1781 ἐντέλλω


μοι
ἐγώ
egō
g1473
Pronounce Greek root for G1473 ἐγώ


καὶ
καί
kai
g2532
Pronounce Greek root for G2532 καί


εἰσῆλθεν
εἰσέρχομαι
eiserchomai
g1525
Pronounce Greek root for G1525 εἰσέρχομαι


εἰς
εἰς
eis
g1519
Pronounce Greek root for G1519 εἰς


αὐτοὺς
αὐτός
autos
g846
Pronounce Greek root for G846 αὐτός


τὸ

ho
g3588
Pronounce Greek root for G3588 ὁ


πνεῦμα
πνεῦμα
pneuma
g4151
Pronounce Greek root for G4151 πνεῦμα


καὶ
καί
kai
g2532
Pronounce Greek root for G2532 καί


ἔζησαν
ζάω
zaō
g2198
Pronounce Greek root for G2198 ζάω
["and they lived [ ἔζησαν / ezēsan]" - V-AAI-3P - Verb - Aorist Active Indicative - 3rd Person Plural[/I] (just like in Rev20:4b
[/U]) - https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?page=3&strongs=G2198&t=KJV#lexResults ]


καὶ
καί
kai
g2532
Pronounce Greek root for G2532 καί


ἔστησαν
ἵστημι
histēmi
g2476
Pronounce Greek root for G2476 ἵστημι


ἐπὶ
ἐπί
epi
g1909
Pronounce Greek root for G1909 ἐπί


τῶν

ho
g3588
Pronounce Greek root for G3588 ὁ


ποδῶν
πούς
pous
g4228
Pronounce Greek root for G4228 πούς


αὐτῶν
αὐτός
autos
g846
Pronounce Greek root for G846 αὐτός


συναγωγὴ
συναγωγή
synagōgē
g4864
Pronounce Greek root for G4864 συναγωγή


πολλὴ
πολύς
polys
g4183
Pronounce Greek root for G4183 πολύς


σφόδρα
σφόδρα
sphodra
g4970
Pronounce Greek root for G4970 σφόδρα

[Ezek] 37:10 [Grk] καὶ ἐπροφήτευσα καθότι ἐνετείλατό μοι καὶ εἰσῆλθεν εἰς αὐτοὺς τὸ πνεῦμα καὶ ἔζησαν καὶ ἔστησαν ἐπὶ τῶν ποδῶν αὐτῶν συναγωγὴ πολλὴ σφόδρα


[note: not saying this necessarily has to be speaking of the same ppl etc... but that the grammar is consistent with what I've been pointing out; apologies for the length of this post... wish it would transfer the same way it looks at BLB, LOL]


--in each case, it is re: ppl who have previously been "dead" (or "dead" in a manner of speaking, when it comes to the Ezek passage), but who now / after that / after having DIED, "LIVED";)(do you not believe the wording of Rev2:8 points toward Jesus' RESURRECTION FROM THE DEAD? [i.e. BODILY])
 

oldhermit

Senior Member
Jul 28, 2012
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#46
Your claim of a manufactured eschatology is (False)

Can you show me where the word (Trinity) is used in the holy bible, but we know well it is a manufactured (Phrase) representing the Father, Son, Holy Spirit, as being one

As I clearly showed, (The Antichrist) is a manufactured phrase, to represent a common (Future) human man.

The word (The Antichrist) is a catch all phrase, for the future human man that is identified several different places in the bible, just as the word (Trinity) is a catch all phrase for the Father, Son, Holy Spirit, being one.

Your use of 1 & 2 John is a "distraction", to the catch all phrase (The Antichrist), that you are well acquainted with, and know well it represents Daniel, Paul, And John in their human man described, as you desperately try to breathe life into your (Preterist) claims in (Historicism), that this figure has come and gone.

Examples: (The Antichrist) Same Future Human Man Below

(Future) Daniel's (Little Horn) Daniel 7:8-11

(Future) Paul's (Man Of Sin, Son Of Perdition) 2 Thessalonians 2:3

(Future) John's (The Beast) Revelation 13:4
Yes, the word trinity nowhere appears in scripture but the word antichrist does and John sets the parameters for its use and application. We are not permitted to go beyond the biblical use of the word.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
6,245
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#47
Yes, the word trinity nowhere appears in scripture but the word antichrist does and John sets the parameters for its use and application. We are not permitted to go beyond the biblical use of the word.
Daniel, Paul, And John in their human man described below, as you desperately try to breathe life into your (Preterist) claims in (Historicism), that this figure has come and gone.

Same (Future) Human Man Below

(Future) Daniel's (Little Horn) Daniel 7:8-11

(Future) Paul's (Man Of Sin, Son Of Perdition) 2 Thessalonians 2:3

(Future) John's (The Beast) Revelation 13:4
 

oldhermit

Senior Member
Jul 28, 2012
9,000
506
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#48
Daniel, Paul, And John in their human man described below, as you desperately try to breathe life into your (Preterist) claims in (Historicism), that this figure has come and gone.

Same (Future) Human Man Below

(Future) Daniel's (Little Horn) Daniel 7:8-11

(Future) Paul's (Man Of Sin, Son Of Perdition) 2 Thessalonians 2:3

(Future) John's (The Beast) Revelation 13:4
You still have not demonstrated how or where scripture calls any of these the antichrist. You are calling them that, but scripture is not.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
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#49
You still have not demonstrated how or where scripture calls any of these the antichrist. You are calling them that, but scripture is not.
In love Glenn, nothing personal, not a matter of salvation.

We have removed the the manufactured phrase (The Antichrist) now deal with the facts below (y)

Daniel, Paul, And John in their human man described below, as you desperately try to breathe life into your (Preterist) claims in (Historicism), that this figure has come and gone.

Same (Future) Human Man Below

(Future) Daniel's (Little Horn) Daniel 7:8-11

(Future) Paul's (Man Of Sin, Son Of Perdition) 2 Thessalonians 2:3

(Future) John's (The Beast) Revelation 13:4

With all respect, you presented your views on the book of Daniel, I oppsed your teachings in at least 3-4 of your claims, you continue on as if my questions in opposition didn't exist.

Your platform is invalid, in the fact it appears you believe your (Historicist) teaching is truthful, and the final authority, its not, and you haven't answered those who bring correction to this error.

One Example: Antiochus Epiphanes didnt fulfill Daniel 11:37 as you have claimed, as he was a married man that fathered many children, and his fathers didnt worship the true Hebrew (God Of His Fathers) but were polytheistic in their beliefs.

Its for these reason I consider your platform, and teachings invalid, in love.

Daniel 11:37KJV
37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.

Another Example: You have claimed Emperor Domitius 81-96AD fulfilled Daniel 7:8-11 the (Little Horn) below?

Scripture below clearly teaches that this figure will be present on earth to witness the second coming and final judgment, and be cast into the lake of fire, in perfect agreement with John's (The Beast) seen in Rev 19:20 below (Future)

Daniel 7:8-11KJV
8 I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things.
9 I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire.
10 A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him: thousand thousands ministered unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened.
11 I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the horn spake: I beheld even till the beast was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the burning flame.


Revelation 19:20KJV
20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.
 

oldhermit

Senior Member
Jul 28, 2012
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#50
In love Glenn, nothing personal, not a matter of salvation.

We have removed the the manufactured phrase (The Antichrist) now deal with the facts below (y)

Daniel, Paul, And John in their human man described below, as you desperately try to breathe life into your (Preterist) claims in (Historicism), that this figure has come and gone.

Same (Future) Human Man Below

(Future) Daniel's (Little Horn) Daniel 7:8-11

(Future) Paul's (Man Of Sin, Son Of Perdition) 2 Thessalonians 2:3

(Future) John's (The Beast) Revelation 13:4

With all respect, you presented your views on the book of Daniel, I oppsed your teachings in at least 3-4 of your claims, you continue on as if my questions in opposition didn't exist.

Your platform is invalid, in the fact it appears you believe your (Historicist) teaching is truthful, and the final authority, its not, and you haven't answered those who bring correction to this error.

One Example: Antiochus Epiphanes didnt fulfill Daniel 11:37 as you have claimed, as he was a married man that fathered many children, and his fathers didnt worship the true Hebrew (God Of His Fathers) but were polytheistic in their beliefs.

Its for these reason I consider your platform, and teachings invalid, in love.

Daniel 11:37KJV
37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.

Another Example: You have claimed Emperor Domitius 81-96AD fulfilled Daniel 7:8-11 the (Little Horn) below?

Scripture below clearly teaches that this figure will be present on earth to witness the second coming and final judgment, and be cast into the lake of fire, in perfect agreement with John's (The Beast) seen in Rev 19:20 below (Future)

Daniel 7:8-11KJV
8 I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things.
9 I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire.
10 A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him: thousand thousands ministered unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened.
11 I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the horn spake: I beheld even till the beast was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the burning flame.


Revelation 19:20KJV
20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.
Inyeresting, it is as if you did not even bother to read anything I posted on Dan 11. It looks more like you just glanced at the main points and ignored everything else. You simply ignored every historical context I outlined. Perhaps it would be better if we simply move on.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
6,245
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#51
Inyeresting, it is as if you did not even bother to read anything I posted on Dan 11. It looks more like you just glanced at the main points and ignored everything else. You simply ignored every historical context I outlined. Perhaps it would be better if we simply move on.
(It Would Be Better If We Simply Move On)? :giggle:

As previously stated, a "Distraction" to avoid a direct answer to the facts presented below, only myself and Watermark are active in the thread, Glenn your running from the presented truth, "Why"?

In love Glenn, nothing personal, not a matter of salvation.

We have removed the manufactured phrase (The Antichrist) now deal with the facts below (y)

Daniel, Paul, And John in their human man described below, as you desperately try to breathe life into your (Preterist) claims in (Historicism), that this figure has come and gone.

Same (Future) Human Man Below

(Future) Daniel's (Little Horn) Daniel 7:8-11

(Future) Paul's (Man Of Sin, Son Of Perdition) 2 Thessalonians 2:3

(Future) John's (The Beast) Revelation 13:4

With all respect, you presented your views on the book of Daniel, I oppsed your teachings in at least 3-4 of your claims, you continue on as if my questions in opposition didn't exist.

Your platform is invalid, in the fact it appears you believe your (Historicist) teaching is truthful, and the final authority, its not, and you haven't answered those who bring correction to this error.

One Example: Antiochus Epiphanes didnt fulfill Daniel 11:37 as you have claimed, as he was a married man that fathered many children, and his fathers didnt worship the true Hebrew (God Of His Fathers) but were polytheistic in their beliefs.

Its for these reason I consider your platform, and teachings invalid, in love.

Daniel 11:37KJV
37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.

Another Example: You have claimed Emperor Domitius 81-96AD fulfilled Daniel 7:8-11 the (Little Horn) below?

Scripture below clearly teaches that this figure will be present on earth to witness the second coming and final judgment, and be cast into the lake of fire, in perfect agreement with John's (The Beast) seen in Rev 19:20 below (Future)

Daniel 7:8-11KJV
8 I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things.
9 I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire.
10 A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him: thousand thousands ministered unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened.
11 I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the horn spake: I beheld even till the beast was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the burning flame.


Revelation 19:20KJV
20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.
 

oldhermit

Senior Member
Jul 28, 2012
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#52
I explained all of that in detail in the Daniel study. If you are not willing to consider the things I said, why should I believe you would give serious consideration if I explained it again. Go back and read the notes on Dan 7 and consider the historical implication I outlined.
 

oldhermit

Senior Member
Jul 28, 2012
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#53
Chapter Two
The Letters to the Seven Churches

The purpose of these letters was not only to warn the seven churches of the impending critical circumstances that would directly affect them; it was also to chastise them for their failings, praise them for their strengths, and encourage them to hold on to their faith. I suppose it may seem rather disconcerting to realize that as the people of God, we are always being weighed in the balances. This should remind us just as it did those of the seven churches of John's day, that Jesus is not only watching us, but is evaluating our conduct. If our congregation was to receive a letter from the Almighty like these churches did, what do you imagine he would say to us?

AS ALWAYS, JUDGMENT BEGINS WITH THE HOUSE OF GOD

I. To the Church in Ephesus, 1-7

A. “From the One who hold the seven stars in his right hand and the One who walks among or between the seven golden lampstands,” 1.

1. The right hand – symbol of authority over the seven stars.
As head of the Church, Jesus occupies the position of supreme authority. Thus, whatever he has to say to these Churches is of supreme importance and not subject to appeal.

2. “Walks among (or between) the seven golden lampstands. As God hath said, ‘I will dwell in them and walk among them; and I will be their God and they shall be my people,’” 2 Corinthians 6:16.

“As God hath said,” – The words here quoted are taken substantially by combining three OT passages, Exodus 29:45; Leviticus 26:12; Ezekiel 37:27. They are not found in this exact word order in any one place in the Old Testament. Paul combines the substance of what occurs in these three Old Testament passages. This has covenant implications on two levels.

a. The repeat of the covenant itself – “I will be their God and they shall be my people.”

b. The symbolism of “walking among” recalls the act of covenant made between God and Abraham in Genesis 15:17-18 as God passed between the pieces of the sacrifices and made a covenant with Abraham.

Jesus presents himself to these seven churches as the God who has entered into covenant with them. He will be responding to each of these seven churches according to how they have kept or failed to keep covenant with God.

B. Praise from God to the Church of Ephesus, 2-3
“I know your deeds and your toil and perseverance, and that you cannot tolerate evil men, and you put to the test those who call themselves apostles, and they are not, and you found them to be false; and you have perseverance and have endured for My name's sake, and have not grown weary.”

1. Their status before the Lord is directly linked to their deeds and labor.

a. Ἔργα – deed, doing, labor, work. They were active, not lazy or lethargic. Their activity was such that it warranted praise from the Lord.

b. Κόπον – A stronger word than just works or deeds. This more aptly stresses labor that is characterized by troubles and weariness.

2. Intolerance for evil men – They were vigilant and watchful.
Intolerance is not generally regarded as a virtue. Yet, Jesus regards them highly for their virtue of intolerance. Intolerance requires:

a. Confrontation – We cannot afford to simply ignore it and hope it goes away or leave the problem for someone else to correct.

b. Disassociation – Do not allow yourself to be counted as their friend.

c. Resistance – Take action against them. Put them out of your midst.

d. Personal abstinence – Don't become a partaker of their evil deeds.

e. Acceptance of and adherence to a revealed standard of moral conduct.

f. The ability to know the difference between that which is good and that which is evil. This can only be derived from revealed knowledge.

3. Testing the false teachers
The rise and proliferation of false apostles in the first century was not only promised by Jesus in Matthew 24:5 and 23-24, it was also addressed in the epistles as a then present danger in the Church.

a. 2 Corinthians 11:13, “For such men are false apostles, deceitful workers, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ.”

b. 2 Peter 2:2-15, “But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves. Many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of the truth will be maligned; and in their greed they will exploit you with false words; their judgment from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep…. 12 But these, like unreasoning animals, born as creatures of instinct to be captured and killed, reviling where they have no knowledge, will in the destruction of those creatures also be destroyed, suffering wrong as the wages of doing wrong. They count it a pleasure to revel in the daytime. They are stains and blemishes, reveling in their deceptions, as they carouse with you, having eyes full of adultery that never cease from sin, enticing unstable souls, having a heart trained in greed, accursed children; forsaking the right way, they have gone astray, having followed the way of Balaam, the son of Beor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;”

c. 2 Timothy 3:8, “Just as Jannes and Jambres opposed Moses, so these men also oppose the truth, men of depraved mind, rejected in regard to the faith.”

d. 1 John 4:1, “Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.”

e. 2 John 7, “For many deceivers have gone out into the world, those who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh. This is the deceiver and the Antichrist.”

f. Titus 1:10, “For there are many unruly and vain talkers and deceivers, specially they of the circumcision:”

g. Jude 3-4, “...I felt the necessity to write to you appealing that you contend earnestly for the faith which was once for all handed down to the saints. For certain persons have crept in unnoticed, those who were long beforehand marked out for this condemnation, ungodly persons who turn the grace of our God into licentiousness and deny our only Master and Lord, Jesus Christ.”

The ability to recognize a false apostle comes out of being able to distinguish the fake from the genuine article. Such men were exposed and expelled. The Church at Ephesus was the operating base for Paul so, they were well acquainted with the teachings and the works of an apostle. It would not have been difficult for them to quickly expose a false teacher. Paul met with the elders of the Church at Ephesus in Acts 20:18-21 saying. “I know that after I leave, savage wolves will come in among you and will not spare the flock. Even from your own number men will arise and distort the truth in order to draw away disciples after them. So be on your guard! Remember that for three years I never stopped warning each of you night and day with tears.”

He also charged Timothy in 1 Timothy 1:3 while Timothy was working in Ephesus, to “instruct certain men not to teach strange doctrines.” Apparently, while Timothy was in Ephesus, this problem had already taken root and Paul was telling Timothy to confront this danger.

We have the same teaching of the apostles they had so, we should be equally able to distinguish between those who teach truth and those who teaches error, whether it be through simple well-intentioned misunderstanding on the part of the teacher, or out-and-out deception for some personal agenda.
 

oldhermit

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Jul 28, 2012
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#54
4. Praise for perseverance and endurance points to the their work or struggles even in hardship without having grown weary.

C. The area of failure at Ephesus and the warning, 4-5
“But I have this against you, that you have abandoned the love you had at first. Remember therefore from where you have fallen; repent, and do the works you did at first. If not, I will come to you and remove your lampstand from its place, unless you repent.”

Apparently, their zeal and determination were still intact so, just what was it that they had abandoned? From what had they fallen? What was their first love? Was it their love for one another, their love for the Lord? Whatever their first love was, was of such importance that they were warned that if this was not corrected, Jesus said he would remove their lampstand. Their lampstand would no longer occupy its place before the presence of Lord. In other words, Jesus would remove them as his Church.

Love was a vital element that affected the nature and character of the Church itself. The loss of their first love indicated a breach of covenant. Without love, they could no longer be recognized as God's covenant people. All their deeds, toil, perseverance, all of their intolerance of evil men, and endurance would mean nothing without love. Just as Paul warned the Church at Corinth in Corinthians 13, even the offering of one's self to the flames is meaningless without love.

Jesus' remedial recommendation for them was to remember, repent, and do the works they did at first. This would suggest then that the love they once had was characterized by their actions. The exhortation for them to “do the works they did at first” would seem to indicate there may have been something lost in their relationships to one another. Love for one another cannot be seen except through one's pragmatic demonstrations of kindness and charity to one other. Without this, their other efforts become meaningless.

D. Their hatred for the deeds of the Nicolaitans, 6

1. Who were the Nicolaitans?
Nicolaitans were one of the heretical sects that plagued the early Church. This heresy seems to have had considerable impact on the Church in both Ephesus and Pergamum. Irenaeus identified them as followers of Nicolas who was one of the seven chosen in Acts 6 to serve as deacons in the Church at Jerusalem, but there is no real evidence to prove that the Nicolas of Acts 6 is the same Nicolas from which this sect took its name.

2. The deeds of the Nicolaitans are said to have been licentiousness.
There seems to be no historical evidence of a Gnostic sect called Nicolaitans so, this does not appear to have been a part of that particular movement. It is generally accepted (although not necessarily provable), that like gnosticism, the Nicolaitans held to a form of antinomianism which taught that man could freely partake of sin because the Law of God is no longer binding. It taught that because Christians are reckoned as righteous, only an intellectual belief in Christ was sufficient for one's salvation and that the gospel of Christ has made God's law of no effect and that by “believing,” we are released from the necessity of being “doers” of the Word. This was the doctrine of the Nicolaitans, which Christ says, “I also hate.”

3. Hate, from μισέω, has two levels of meaning.

a. It can mean to hate, detest, or utterly despise. This represents an absence of love. It is so used in such passages as…

 Romans 7:15, “For what I am doing, I do not understand. For what I will to do, that I do not practice; but what I hate, that I do.”

 Luke 6:22, “Blessed are you when men hate you, and when they exclude you, and revile you, and cast out your name as evil, For the Son of Man’s sake.”

b. The second level of meaning is on a comparative level.
Helps Word Studies informs us that μισέω means “to love someone or something less than someone (something) else. In other words,[simply] to renounce one choice in favor of another.”

“In Luke 14:26: [Jesus says], 'If anyone comes to Me, and does not hate (μισέω, 'love less' than the Lord) his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be My disciple.' (NASV). Note the comparative meaning which centers [around] a moral choice, elevating one value over another.]” (See also Strongs NT 3404: μισέω).

So, this stresses the presence of love for both parties where one must be preferred above the other. It would seem the stronger meaning is to be preferred here. I think it unlikely that the implication is that Jesus loved the doctrine of the Nicolaitans less any more than when men “hate you, exclude you, revile you, and cast out your name as evil.” They certainly no not do this because they love you less. They do this because they HATE you.

E. Jesus promises reward for faithful endurance, 7

1. “He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.”
These admonitions are not intended to be exclusive to these seven churches. Whatever Jesus says to these seven churches is intended for the Church in all places and in all times, and it is the Spirit who is the source of the words, not John.

2. “To him who overcomes, I will grant to eat of the tree of life which is in the Paradise of God.”
This emphasizes the sure distribution of reward from the Lord and that reward is life. Accessibility to the tree of life has been restored in Christ. As we will see in 22:2 in the vision of the River of Life and the Tree of Life, what we find conspicuously absent in the description of the tree is the sword of Genesis 3:24. Accessibility to this tree requires of us patience in suffering and our perseverance to overcome.
 

oldhermit

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#55
II. To the Church at Smyrna, 8-11
The Church at Smyrna was one of the two churches in Asia who had kept their covenant with the Lord.

A. “These things say the First and the Last who was dead and is alive. I know your works and your tribulation.”

1. “Works” is synonymous with one's conduct of life. In other words, “I know how you are behaving.”

2. “Tribulation”
This was spoken to a church who was under persecution and having to confront desperate times. This was the home of Polycarp who was reportedly burned to death for the cause of Christ. Their tribulation does not go unnoticed by the Lord. He is watching with great interest. This tells them they were not alone in their suffering, or even in their death.

3. The Living one was also dead. Now he is alive.
This reminds them that death is not the end of the relationship. If He lives, I will live. Why do you suppose the persecution of Christians failed, and will always fail, as a means for destroying Christianity? How do you threaten someone who has no fear of death? With what do you threaten someone who seems willing to endure great suffering? When death becomes the coveted event of a Christian's life, everything else looses its importance. Everything else becomes less relevant, even death.

B. “I know your poverty (but you are rich). This is high praise from the Lord.

1. How is their poverty measured?
Their poverty was measured by the standards of society. They were poor because they had been dispossessed of material things, even of their freedom and their lives. These were those who, like those of Hebrews 11:36-40, lived in the catacombs among the dead because everything else had been taken from them. These were the dregs of the socially outcast. Yet, Jesus says “you are rich!”

2. How is their wealth measured?
It was measured by the consecration of their lives and the rewards that such consecration is given. This is determined by the Lord. This represents a complete reversal of the earthly value systems. God holds precious that which the world despises, and he places no value on the things which the world holds as precious. They displayed a standard of wealth that was not represented by any social metric. This represents an overturning of the earthly value systems.

C. “And the blasphemy by those who say they are Jews and are not, but are a synagogue of Satan.”
The word synagogue is the identifier. This “synagogue of Satan” was those Jews who stood against the gospel and persecuted of the Church at that time. The sons of the kingdom have become the servants of Satan. “I say to you that many will come from east and west, and recline at the table with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven; but the sons of the kingdom (the unbelieving Jew) will be cast out into the outer darkness; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth,” Matthew 8:11-12.

Unlike the other churches (with the exception of Philadelphia), the threat at Smyrna was not from those from within, but from those without. Their status before the Lord was directly linked to their deeds and labor.

D. “Do not fear what you are about to suffer. Behold, the devil is about to cast some of you into prison, so that you will be tested, and you will have tribulation for ten days.”

The number 10 is the number of completeness and this is obviously not talking about a literal 10 days so, to what do the 10 days relate?

1. One possibility offered is that the 10 days may signify the 10 different periods of persecution from Nero to Diocletian.
This is a problem because Nero is probably dead when John receives this revelation, and if not, there is still the matter of the future tense. Smyrna is told that this is something they are “about to” experience which tells us this was something that was to soon come upon them but had not come upon them as yet.

2. Another possibility offered is that the ten days represents the 10 years of persecution which was precisely the duration of the persecution under Diocletian, during which, all the Asiatic churches were grievously afflicted.

This theory does not fit the immediacy represented by the language of the text. By the time Diocletian rose to power, all of the Revelation generation is long dead. Diocletian reigned from AD 285 – 305.

3. This could also suggest that their time of persecution would be brief.
This would seem to be the best understanding of the ten days since it is directed to this specific group of Christians within a specific time in history. This is very limited in its address. “The devil is about to cast some of you into prison, so that you will be tested, and you will have tribulation for ten days.” The implication seems to be that that specific group of Christians were the ones who would experience the full time of the testing and tribulation regardless of the actual length of time involved. These 10 days of tribulation does not seem to be directed to the other seven churches nor to succeeding generations at Smyrna.

E. Rewards and expectations from the Lord.

1. “Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life. He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.”
Τῆς ζωῆς is the genitive of apposition demanding that the life is the crown. In other words, “If you will overcome, I will crown you with life.” This is one time when the NIV actually offers the best translation of a verse.

2. “He who overcomes will not be hurt by the second death.”

a. To “overcome” is the same admonition as to “be faithful.” One overcomes by being faithful, holding on to one's integrity before the Lord, even in the midst of dire or even life-threatening circumstances.
b. “Will not be hurt by the second death.”

The second death is the casting of one from the presence of the Lord. This is the absolute expression of one's separation from God. It is an inevitable reality for the majority of humanity. How does one avoid this dreaded separation; by being faithful even to point of death. Faithfulness is a pattern of life behavior that corresponds to a determined set of beliefs.
 

oldhermit

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#56
III. To the Church at Pergamos, 12-17

A. “The One who has the sharp two-edged sword.”
The sword is the instrument of war, and the sword he yields is the Word of God which is the standard by which all will be judged.

B. “I know where you dwell, where Satan's throne is; and you hold fast My name, and did not deny My faith even in the days of Antipas, My witness, My faithful one, who was killed among you, where Satan dwells.”

1. This is figurative language that stresses the level of opposition that the Church at Pergamos was facing. Satan is the great enemy of the Church, and for the Church to “dwell where Satan's throne is” represents the strongest and harshest threat of opposition to the Church. There was not only persecution from the Jewish community, but from the pagan society as well. They saw Christianity as a threat to their own religions as well as an economic threat to the idol industry.

2. Who was Antipas?
We know nothing factual about Antipas beyond what is presented to us in Revelations 2:13. A tradition of the Eastern Orthodox Christian church emerges in about AD 1000 that says Antipas was martyred by being roasted alive inside a hollow life-size bull which had a bonfire under its belly because he refused to renounce his faith in Christ. This account of his martyrdom may or may not be true. What we do know of the man is that the Lord regarded him as faithful. We also know that he was indeed martyred in some fashion, and that the Lord saw fit to give him recognition in God's hall of fame of the faithful.

C. The matter against Pergamos:

1. “You have there some who hold the teaching of Balaam. Who kept teaching Balak to put a stumbling block before the sons of Israel to eat things sacrificed to idols and to commit acts of immorality.”
How did Balaam teach Israel to sin?

a. He caused them to fall into lewdness and fornication with the women of Moab.

b. He led Israel into idolatry to worship the Baals.
So, there were those among the Church at Pergamos, who like Balaam, were leading Christians away from Christ and into lewdness and idolatry.

2. “So, you also have some who in the same way hold the teaching of the Nicolaitans.”
“In the same way” suggests the similarity between these two heresies. The teaching of the Nicolaitans was that of antinomianism. The Nicolaitans believed that the gospel of Christ has made God's law of no effect, and that by “believing,” we are released from the necessity of being doers of the Word. Therefore, behave as you will without fear of consequences.

D. Jesus' remedial ultimatum was “Repent; or else I am coming to you quickly, and I will make war against them with the sword of My mouth.” In effect, what Jesus told the Church at Pergamos was that this behavior was unacceptable, it would not be tolerated and that if they did not repent, the consequences would be disastrous.

The sword of My mouth represents the cursing element of the covenant of blessings and cursings. Because some of those in the Church at Pergamos had broken their covenant with the Lord, they were in danger of receiving the curse of the covenant if they did not repent. The sword of the mouth represents the spoken word. Jesus is threatening the implementation of that word against the dual threat within the Church at Pergamos – the doctrines of Balaam and the doctrines of the Nicolaitans.

The word Nicolaitan is the Greek equivalent to the name Balaam. Both mean “destroyer of the people, or victor over the people, or one that ruined a people.” This is why I do not personally believe that the term Nicolaitans has any connection to the Nicolas of Acts 6, and indeed may not even be associated with any particular person of that name. This is possibly a symbolic name that identifies a specific brand of heresy that is destructive to God's people.

E. Reward – “He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.”

1. “To him who overcomes, to him I will give some of the hidden manna.”

This is the true manna, as opposed the manna in the wilderness. This is the spiritual food, the food that nourishes not the body, but the soul. Although the body may be destroyed by persecution, the soul is nourished and sustained by the spiritual food of the grace of God. They were given the grace to endure.

2. “I will give him a white stone.”

a. There are a number of suggestions concerning the historical and cultural uses of the white stone. The designation of white possibly represents purity.

 One suggestion is that a small object called a “tessera,” made of wood, stone, clay or bone, conveyed special privileges to its owner. The ancient Romans used tesserae as tokens of admittance to events in the arena. However, tesserae did not have to be white, and the durability of the materials used is questionable.

 Another suggestion has to do with the building material used during the time John wrote Revelation. Important buildings were commonly made of white marble. In front of some of the pagan temples were white marble pillars engraved with the names of people who were supposedly healed by that particular deity. This is a very unlikely application.

 One of the better-accepted explanations of the white stone has to do with the high priest’s breastplate which contained twelve stones. Each of these stones had the name of one of the twelve tribes of Israel engraved on it, Exodus 28:21. As he ministered in the temple, the high priest bore the names of God’s people into God’s presence. In the same way, the “white stone” with the believer’s name written on it could be a reference to our standing in God’s presence. I think this is certainly a possible application.

 In ancient times, legal decisions were indicated by white and black stones. The judges did not give their verdict upon the prisoner by an oral decree of “guilty,” or “not guilty,” as in our country. Verdict was decreed by dropping a white stone into an urn to express their opinion that the prisoner was innocent, or a black stone to declare their judgment that the prisoner was guilty. Jesus says, “To him who overcomes I will give a white stone;” that is, I will give him a sentence of acquittal. As the judge, placed the white stone in the urn, he declared the prisoner’s innocence. This is certainly a possibility.

 Another widely held explanation suggests that the white stone may be a translucent precious stone such as a diamond. The word translated “white” is λευκήν and can mean “brilliant or bright.” This interpretation holds that the name of Christ was written on the stone, not the name of the believer. Revelation mentions that the name of Christ is written on the foreheads of the saints, Revelation 3:12; 14:1; and 14:20. This may be possible but, the language of the text tells us this name is a new name and one not known by others.

 Another possibility is the Roman use of the white stone as an honor to the victors of athletic games. If so, this would not be the first time such references are made in scripture. 1 Corinthians 9:24-27, 2 Timothy 2:5, and Hebrews 12:1 are all good examples of such references. The winner of a contest was awarded a white stone with his name inscribed on it. This served as his “ticket” to a special awards banquet.

 Since we are not given any explanation of the significance of the white stone in scripture, one can only speculate as to its significance. What we can ascertain about the stone from this text is that it is extended as a divine recognition of faithful service to those who bear up under the stress of persecution and evil and is therefore, to be regarded as a noble and coveted gesture from the Master.

b. The name written on it
Again, this can only be surmised because scripture does not provide us with any further information on what this name is or what it represents. The implication from the text is that this name is a matter of pride on the part of the reciever and demonstrates an intimate relationship between that individual and the Lord. It is conformation from the Master of a job well done.
 

oldhermit

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#57
IV. To the Church at Thyatyra, 18-29

A. “The Son of God, who has eyes like a flame of fire, and His feet are like burnished bronze.” (Not as in 1:13 where he is represented as the Son of Man possessing these same characteristics.)

B. Praise from the Lord to the Church at Thyatyra
“I know your deeds, and your love and faith and service and perseverance, and that your deeds of late are greater than at first.”

1. Love and faith are expressed in their deeds. The effects of these qualities are displayed pragmatically. One cannot see love; one can only see demonstrations of love. One cannot see faith; one can only see faithful conduct. Their love and faith were not just in word, but also in deed. In other words, their love and faith were not hypocritical, they were demonstrative.

2. Service and perseverance are expressed in the increase of their deeds. This is a display of growth, maturity, development, and resolve, even in the midst of struggle. Is this not what spiritual maturity is? Spiritual maturity is not just an exercise in one's understanding of doctrine, it is also behavioral development.

C. The matter against Thyatyra – “You tolerate the woman Jezebel, who calls herself a prophetess.”
Jezebel was the Queen of Ahab the godless king of Israel. Jezebel incited Ahab to abandon the worship of Jehovah and encouraged the worship of the Baals and the Asherah. (The Baals were any of a variety of gods of fertility and nature. The god Asherah was identified as the wife of the Sumerian god Anu. Asherah were often represented as sacred trees or poles or as some type of pillar figurines). Jezebel persecuted the prophets of God and had an innocent man killed just so Ahab could claim possession of his vineyards, 1 Kings 21.

The use of the name Jezebel is of course symbolic and is seemingly expressive of a particular female individual in the Church at Thyatyra. Apparently, this person was doing the same thing in Thyatyra as those who were teaching the doctrines of the false apostles, Balaam, and the Nicolaitans were doing at the Churches in Ephesus and Pergamos. The title of 'prophetess' is self-acclaimed. False teachers very often attach such titles to themselves as a means to present an air of credibility.

1. “She teaches and leads My bond-servants astray so that they commit acts of immorality and eat things sacrificed to idols.”
This was as act of seduction. She was seducing Christians to commit spiritual immorality through the exercise of idolatry. This is what happens when influential people are allowed to continue to infest others within the Body without being silenced and shut out. Such people, whether men or women, should never be allowed to stay in our midst. Such tolerance is inevitably destructive.

2. “I gave her time to repent, and she does not want to repent of her immorality.”
This certainly suggest that time was invested in an effort to correct her teaching and her behavior. When this proved unproductive, Jesus says enough is enough. There comes a time when we have to stop giving that which is holy to the dogs and get rid of the dog in the interest of the preservation of the Body. Jesus' condemnation of the Church at Thyatyra was that they had done nothing to purge her from them, in fact, they had even tolerated her so, he decides to take matters into his own hands against her and those who follow her example – “her children”.

He would set the micro-biological world against them. “I will kill her children with pestilence.” The slaying of “her children” also seems to be an allusion to the fate of the children of Jezebel in 2 Kings 10 who were killed by the armies of Jehu. In fact, Jehu had all seventy of the sons of Ahab killed and beheaded and their heads taken to Jezreel. God said he would slay her children so that the Church can see and know that this is the wrath of God being poured out against those who have apostatized themselves. Her punishment would not be done covertly, but visibly for the Church to see and acknowledge the hand of God in this.

“I will throw her on a bed of sickness, and those who commit adultery with her into great tribulation, unless they repent of her deeds. And I will kill her children with pestilence, and all the churches will know that I am He who searches the minds and hearts; I will give to each one of you according to your deeds.”

A lesson here for us is that if we do not deal with such matters within the body ourselves, God will, and the results will not be favorable.
 

oldhermit

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#58
D. Reward
“Butt I say to you, the rest who are in Thyatira, who do not hold this teaching, who have not known the deep things of Satan, as they call them—I place no other burden on you. Nevertheless, what you have, hold fast until I come.”

1. “Who do not hold this teaching.” Fidelity was still to be found in Thyatira.

2. βαθέα τοῦ Σατανᾶ – “The depths of Satan” not “deep things” stresses the depth of the heresies in their midst. These false teachers regarded their knowledge as that of deep and profound mysteries. Jesus says this knowledge is from Satan.

3. “I place no other burden on you.”
It would seem for a few of them, that the matter of dealing with this false teacher and those who chose to follow her, had been a difficult struggle which they had endured. Jesus deals gently with them knowing and understanding the limitations of our abilities to endure. He will not allow us to be burdened beyond that threshold. It is a comforting thing to hear from the Lord himself that he will not allow the matter to get any worse and that he will deal with the problem on your behalf.

4. “He who overcomes, and he who keeps My deeds until the end; To him, I will give authority over the nations;”

a. This is the fulfillment of divine intentions.

 This idea is presented in Jeremiah 1:10 as God told Israel, “See, I have appointed you this day over the nations and over the kingdoms to pluck up and to break down, to destroy and to overthrow, to build and to plant.”

 This power of judgment was to be realized in Christ,

• Psalms 2:9, “Ask of Me, and I will surely give the nations as Your inheritance, and the ends of the earth as Your possession. You shall break them with a rod of iron, you shall shatter them like earthenware.”

• Psalms 110:2, “The Lord will stretch forth Your strong scepter from Zion, saying, rule in the midst of Your enemies.”

 Paul confirms the reality of this relationship as it relates to the Church in 1 Corinthians 6:2, “Or do you not know that the saints will judge the world? If the world is judged by you, are you not competent to constitute the smallest law courts?”

b. What does he mean by “I will give you authority over the nations”?
The term nations is generally used to define the Gentile nations as opposed to the tribes which usually refers to the tribes of Israel. As it relates to the Church, the nations are all who reside outside the Body of Christ. This includes rebellious Israel.

c. What is this authority over the nations?
This is not talking about administrative power. This is the power to preach the gospel even in those nations where there is great opposition. This is authority to bring the power of God to bear on the world to move nations, open doors, and overturn opposition.

Revelation 5:6-10, “And I saw between the throne (with the four living creatures) and the elders a Lamb standing, as if slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God, sent out into all the earth. And He came and took the book out of the right hand of Him who sat on the throne. When He had taken the book, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, each one holding a harp and golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints. And they sang a new song, saying, Worthy are You to take the book and to break its seals; for You were slain, and purchased for God with Your blood men from every tribe and tongue and people and nation. You have made them to be a kingdom and priests to our God; and they will reign upon the earth.”

d. How is this power to be exercised? Through the preaching of the gospel and the petitions of prayer.

5. “And he shall rule them with a rod of iron, as the vessels of the potter are broken to pieces, as I also have received authority from My Father;”

This is the exercise of judgment. How is this judgment administered?

a. Through the preaching of the gospel.

b. Through their example.

The question then is how do we render judgment upon the world?

 Matthew 12:38-42, “The men of Nineveh will stand up with this generation at the judgment, and will condemn it because they repented at the preaching of Jonah; and behold, something greater than Jonah is here.”

“The Queen of the South will rise up with this generation at the judgm weent and will condemn it, because she came from the ends of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and behold, something greater than Solomon is here.”

 Hebrews 11:7, “By faith Noah, being warned by God about things not yet seen, in reverence prepared an ark for the salvation of his household, by which he condemned the world, and became an heir of the righteousness which is according to faith.”

 Matthew 19:27-30, “Then Peter said to Him, behold, we have left everything and followed You; what then will there be for us? And Jesus said to them, truly I say to you, that you who have followed Me, in the regeneration when the Son of Man will sit on His glorious throne, you also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. And everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or children or farms for My name’s sake, will receive many times as much, and will inherit eternal life.”

So, how do Nineveh, the Queen of the South, the apostles, and Noah render judgment and condemnation to those generations? It is their acts of faith that stand as a witness against those generations. In the same way, it is our faith and our preaching of the gospel that stands as a witness against the world.

6. “And I will give him the morning star.”
Although the planet Venus is both the evening and morning star, this is symbolic language. I really do not think he is talking about the planet Venus. The Morning Star is one of the titles applied to Christ in Revelation 22:16 as a symbol of his glory. This may suggest then that Christ will give them a fellowship with him in his glory. They will share in his glory.
 

Truth7t7

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#59
I explained all of that in detail in the Daniel study. If you are not willing to consider the things I said, why should I believe you would give serious consideration if I explained it again. Go back and read the notes on Dan 7 and consider the historical implication I outlined.
You made a claim, and I have given clear scriptural evidence to prove your claim to be (False), you haven't answered my provided scriptural argument below.

Emperor Domitian 81-96AD didnt fulfill Daniel 7:8-11, nor did Antiochus Epiphanies fulfill Daniel 11:37


Daniel, Paul, And John in their human man described below, as you desperately try to breathe life into your (Preterist) claims in (Historicism), that this figure has come and gone.

Same (Future) Human Man Below

(Future) Daniel's (Little Horn) Daniel 7:8-11

(Future) Paul's (Man Of Sin, Son Of Perdition) 2 Thessalonians 2:3

(Future) John's (The Beast) Revelation 13:4

With all respect, you presented your views on the book of Daniel, I oppsed your teachings in at least 3-4 of your claims, you continue on as if my questions in opposition didn't exist.

Your platform is invalid, in the fact it appears you believe your (Historicist) teaching is truthful, and the final authority, its not, and you haven't answered those who bring correction to this error.

One Example: Antiochus Epiphanes didnt fulfill Daniel 11:37 as you have claimed, as he was a married man that fathered many children, and his fathers didnt worship the true Hebrew (God Of His Fathers) but were polytheistic in their beliefs.

Its for these reason I consider your platform, and teachings invalid, in love.

Daniel 11:37KJV
37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.

Another Example: You have claimed Emperor Domitius 81-96AD fulfilled Daniel 7:8-11 the (Little Horn) below?

Scripture below clearly teaches that this figure will be present on earth to witness the second coming and final judgment, and be cast into the lake of fire, in perfect agreement with John's (The Beast) seen in Rev 19:20 below (Future)

Daniel 7:8-11KJV
8 I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things.
9 I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire.
10 A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him: thousand thousands ministered unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened.
11 I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the horn spake: I beheld even till the beast was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the burning flame.


Revelation 19:20KJV
20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.
 

oldhermit

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#60
Chapter Three

I. To the Church at Sardis, the Hypocritical Church, 1-6

A. To me, this is the most sobering address of all the seven Churches because although they had the appearance of being active, they were dead and did not even know it.

“To the angel of the church in Sardis write: He who has the seven Spirits of God and the seven stars, says this: I know your deeds, that you have a name that you are alive, but you are dead.”

1. The “name” represents their reputation before men or perhaps even among the other Churches. They had a reputation as being viable, active, and in good standing before God and man. This is what man saw. This was man's assessment of them. The Lord’s assessment of them was far less favorable. Like the Pharisees of Matthew 23:27, they looked good on the surface, but inside, there was nothing of value. “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you are like whitewashed tombs which on the outside appear beautiful, but inside they are full of dead men's bones and all uncleanness.”

Any time the almighty addresses you and says, “You are dead,” you can rest assured this is not a good thing. This Church had broken covenant with God and Jesus says, “You are dead.” This was God's assessment of them. They were not just merely unproductive; they had become separated from God. This represents a change of status.

2. The deeds of this Church are represented as worthless – “I know your deeds...but, you are dead.”
This is not a reflection on the type of deeds, but of the condition of the heart and uncompleted deeds. They looked good on the surface, their deeds had given an appearance of life, but there was actually very little sign of life left in the body. God sees beyond the surface reputation and assess the condition of the heart.

B. “Wake up, and strengthen the things that remain, which were about to die; for I have not found your deeds completed in the sight of My God.”

1. Γρηγορῶν – stay awake, be vigilant.
There was still some signs of life and they were charged to give attention to what good remained in them because even these things were about to die as well. This is more than just the idea of protecting what good remains, this is a matter of building them up and strengthening them, reinforcing them. This is a matter of resolving to hold fast to these things as a matter of life and death.

2. Uncompleted deeds are a sign of fragmented service and represents a lack of commitment and devotion. Good works had been started, but soon, the interest died out and the work went uncompleted and nothing was accomplished for the Lord. A legacy of uncompleted deeds is thus represented as a sign of a dead or dying Church.

The danger that the Church at Sardis faced was not from outside sources. They were not troubled with the pressures of persecution and suffering or even with false teachers within the body. The problem at Sardis was that they were their own worst enemy. They were destroying themselves perhaps through apathy and laziness. They had simply stopped being productive, and they died.

C. The warning

1. “So, remember what you have received and heard; and keep it, and repent.”
What they had received and heard was apostolic doctrine. This was the foundation of revealed knowledge upon which the Church at Sardis was built. This foundation had been rejected. They had departed form the word of God, and this was fatal. They were called upon by the Lord to repent and to return to that foundation of revealed knowledge.

2. “Therefore, if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what hour I will come to you.”
This is not apocalyptic. Jesus is not talking about the expectation of his second coming. This is a judgment figure that points to the urgency of the matter. They are urged to give immediate attention to correcting this problem because the Lord would not give them a time line of expectation for their judgment. He is talking about consequences in their near future if they did not repent. They could not afford a delay in their repentance nor in their return to the teachings they had received and heard. Nor could they afford not to give attention to the good things that remain. They were simply not allowed to remain in this condition without suffering divine retribution.

D. The remaining faithful among them – “But you have a few people in Sardis who have not soiled their garments; and they will walk with Me in white, for they are worthy.”

Worthiness is associated with behavior. Because these had not polluted their garments, they were considered worthy. They were the sign of life that still remained at Sardis. God would not fail to preserve his remnant. The few whom he says were still worthy of blessings were those who had kept their covenant with the Lord. They had not corrupted themselves or defiled themselves with the sins of Sardis. Their works still testified of their worthiness.

E. Blessings

1. “He who overcomes will thus be clothed in white garments;”
How does one overcome? His deeds must represent his assigned status. In Sardis, their deeds had been rendered useless by reason of negligence, but for these few, it would seem their deeds are still productive and their status remains holy before the Lord. “Clothed in white” represents purity and holiness.

2. “I will not erase his name from the book of life, and I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels. He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.” What are the consequences of not overcoming?

a. He will NOT be clothed in white garments. No acknowledgment of purity or holiness.

b. “I WILL erase his name from the book of life.” (which means at present, his name was in the book of life. If it was to remain there, his faith must be strong enough to overcome.)

c. “I will NOT confess his name before My Father and before His angels.”
Confessing our names before the Father and before the angels by Jesus is an acknowledgement of ownership, fellowship, and acceptance. This is presentation, not introduction. He is presenting us to the Father, (see Exodus 19:17, Isaiah 8:14-18). This speaks of divine acceptance of those presented. God is no longer hiding his face as in Ezekiel 39:29, Hebrews 2:13.

d. There are eternal consequences for abandoning one's covenant with the Lord. These represent a complete disconnect or disassociation between the unfaithful, and the Lord assures us that he will enforce that separation. We can lose our salvation on the basis of how we live our lives and how we fail to honor our covenant with the Lord!