Rich and Famous Pastors

[KennethC]

oh wow Joel has moved since then!!!!!???? He has the nerve to move into a different house AND one that is even bigger!!!!! and cost more!!!

Seriously? The man works and sells his work and makes a living and he isn't allowed to buy a house you or I can't afford? By your definition we are not allowed to go over a specific criteria that you or someone else deems "too" costly for a house. lets take this to more extremes., what about the furniture his wife picked out? what about the linens on the bed...what about the food they eat? what about the value of the socks they wear and the ties he wears for work., and the suits he wears and the shoes he and his family buy, and the curtains they have and the carpet, and the toilet paper....does he get Charmin (the expensive brands) do they get to buy high end shampoos and body lotions and perfumes.., what kind of tv and stereo equipment do they have...

I just bought a pair of Clarks shoes for work because I'm on my feet a lot during the day and they are soooooooooooooo comfortable and allow me to work better when my feet don't hurt. They cost $80 and many people would say that is way too expensive for shoes. But they don't know my feet., they don't know my job and my life. I'm blessed to be able to buy expensive shoes and they are absolutely 99% better and different than my usual shoes. Only I know my motivation for buying them before God. Not those who see my shoes and me wearing them. Joel has the same right to buy what he wants for reasons only he knows.
shhhhhheeeeeeesssssssssshhhhhhhhhhhhh

Your trying to compare an $80 pair of shoes to a $10 million dollar home ???

That is just a ridiculous comparison, plus once again there is nothing wrong with wanted to live a nice lifestyle but a $80,000 to $100,000 dollar home is good enough. There is absolutely no need to live in a house worth 10 million dollars.

You are focusing to much on the carnal world and not on the ways of God.

God does not respect a man who has lavish possessions that they have attained, for He our Lord even says "do not build up possessions on earth."...........Matthew 6:19-21

Most to almost all of the passages about being rich in the new testament are warnings to those that are not blessings !!!


Once again it is not wrong to have money, it becomes wrong depending on how they use it !!!

 

[shotgunner]

Good for him when he could live in that same house he lived in for 13 years his dad gave him and still be fine, or if he wanted another house he could have got one around $100,000 or less and used that extra money to help others ???

As for you shotgunner like I have said before it is not wrong to have money, what is wrong is what one does with that money.

You speak about honoring God, well according to the word of God He would be honoring God if the majority of his money went to helping others then mainly edifying himself.

The word of God says it is harder or more difficult for a rich person to go to heaven then any other person, or do you think Jesus and Paul lied when they said and showed this ???

Kenneth, I actually like you a lot. I think you have a heart to serve God. I also think you would be able to do that a lot better if you would let go of your poverty mentality. Do you really think God is interested in cutting corners to save money? Why did God build the old temple so lavish? Why wasn't all that gold used to feed the poor instead of lining the walls?

The spirit that you are speaking from is the same as Judas. Why wasn't that bottle of ointment sold to feed the poor?

Nowhere does the bible teach us to give the majority of what we have away. It does teach us to give and to have compassion. I figure the best way for me to do that is to be wealthy enough that I can give $10000 instead of $1000.

Honestly, do you give away the majority of your income, or do you need all you have just to survive? I'm sure you give but are you giving away most of it like you want someone else to do? Why do you need a 50K house? You could get an old trailer for $2000 and give the rest to the poor. Why stop there? There are people all over the world living in cardboard and tin shanties built from scavenged scrap. Why not live in one of those and give all the rest to help everyone else?

The answer isn't in what we can do for the poor. Jesus said they would be with us always. The answer is to get them to believe God who is the source and supply? How and why would they believe God is their source if there were no examples of his blessing his children? Isn't it just possible that God makes men rich to fulfill his covenant and to be a blessing to others? At least that's what my bible says.

 

[KennethC]

Kenneth, I actually like you a lot. I think you have a heart to serve God. I also think you would be able to do that a lot better if you would let go of your poverty mentality. Do you really think God is interested in cutting corners to save money? Why did God build the old temple so lavish? Why wasn't all that gold used to feed the poor instead of lining the walls?

The spirit that you are speaking from is the same as Judas. Why wasn't that bottle of ointment sold to feed the poor?

Nowhere does the bible teach us to give the majority of what we have away. It does teach us to give and to have compassion. I figure the best way for me to do that is to be wealthy enough that I can give $10000 instead of $1000.

Honestly, do you give away the majority of your income, or do you need all you have just to survive? I'm sure you give but are you giving away most of it like you want someone else to do? Why do you need a 50K house? You could get an old trailer for $2000 and give the rest to the poor. Why stop there? There are people all over the world living in cardboard and tin shanties built from scavenged scrap. Why not live in one of those and give all the rest to help everyone else?

The answer isn't in what we can do for the poor. Jesus said they would be with us always. The answer is to get them to believe God who is the source and supply? How and why would they believe God is their source if there were no examples of his blessing his children? Isn't it just possible that God makes men rich to fulfill his covenant and to be a blessing to others? At least that's what my bible says.

First who does the Lord or God say is blessed in the scriptures the rich or the poor ???

Second man gave gold and silver financial aspects to it not God, and as when building the 1st and 2nd temple those also where done for God not man's gain.

Third I think you need to read again on that about giving and doing more for others then self, because we have the rich man in Matthew 19, Mark 10:21, and Luke 18:22 who asked Jesus what he needed to do to enter into eternal life. Jesus told him to keep the commandments, and he told Jesus that he has but what does he still lack?

Jesus told him to go sell everything he had and give to the poor !!!

The rich man went away sad because he could not do it, how many of these rich preachers if told to give up all they had to give to the poor would do it ? Would you ????

 

[Willie-T]

That article is an old article from 2007 as Osteen no longer lives in that house that he got from his dad.
He now lives in a 17,000 sg. ft. house worth over 10.5 million dollars.

I didn't notice that..... but it says even more for how well he supports himself. Do the math. If he was getting 13 M for a book advance in those days, what do you think he has earned in the 5 years since then....... WITHOUT taking a dime from the church? Yes, he has bucks. But he has bilked no one.

 

[KennethC]

I didn't notice that..... but it says even more for how well he supports himself. Do the math. If he was getting 13 M for a book advance in those days, what do you think he has earned in the 5 years since then....... WITHOUT taking a dime from the church? Yes, he has bucks. But he has bilked no one.

I didn't say he has conned some out of money like other TV evangelist's have done.

I was responding on the fact he still takes and lives a lavish lifestyle while millions of others suffer daily, and selling those books and charging to hear him speak when he comes to your town is still part of his ministry. So yes he did and still getting rich off others.

Like I have said multiple times that keeps to be overlooked is I do not see it as wrong for these people to be rich.

What is wrong by the word of God says is how they use that money, if it is mainly or mostly used for self and very little for others then it is selfish lifestyle they are living and according to God's word that is sin for it is selfishness.

In the NT almost every time being rich is mentioned it is a warning about that lifestyle, and even mentions how many will leave the truth in the faith to follow after those lavish ways and teach others falsehoods for personal gain.

 

[Willie-T]

What are you suggesting here, that God didn't personally pour out every bit of His righteous wrath on Jesus? That is EXACTLY what He did, He forsook Him on that cross so that we could be made clean, that's the ultimate expression of His love for us. Are you saying God didn't pour out the wrath we deserved on His only Son? I sure hope I'm misunderstanding something here, because if He didn't we are all in trouble. You don't really think the cup that Jesus was praying to be passed if possible, or reason He was sweating blood over was in fear of what us men were going to do to Him do you?

You didn't misunderstand me at all. It would take too long to write you a book so that you would see (It took me a lot of study to learn it, too), so just go on believing what you want. Perhaps one day you, too, will discover what I have.

 

[Willie-T]

Good for him when he could live in that same house he lived in for 13 years his dad gave him and still be fine, or if he wanted another house he could have got one around $100,000 or less and used that extra money to help others ???

As for you shotgunner like I have said before it is not wrong to have money, what is wrong is what one does with that money.

You speak about honoring God, well according to the word of God He would be honoring God if the majority of his money went to helping others then mainly edifying himself.

The word of God says it is harder or more difficult for a rich person to go to heaven then any other person, or do you think Jesus and Paul lied when they said and showed this ???

Why do I suspect "the majority of YOUR money" does NOT go to help others. No problem there, neither does mine... nor probably anyone else on this forum.

 

[shotgunner]

First who does the Lord or God say is blessed in the scriptures the rich or the poor ???

Second man gave gold and silver financial aspects to it not God, and as when building the 1st and 2nd temple those also where done for God not man's gain.

Third I think you need to read again on that about giving and doing more for others then self, because we have the rich man in Matthew 19, Mark 10:21, and Luke 18:22 who asked Jesus what he needed to do to enter into eternal life. Jesus told him to keep the commandments, and he told Jesus that he has but what does he still lack?

Jesus told him to go sell everything he had and give to the poor !!!

The rich man went away sad because he could not do it, how many of these rich preachers if told to give up all they had to give to the poor would do it ? Would you ????

Jesus only specifically told the rich young ruler that. The reason was because he trusted in his riches. Yes, for him it was the thing he lacked, but specifically for him. Nowhere does the scriptures teach us to give all we have and you know it!

Have you ever read the blessings from Deut.28? Read it and tell me God wants us poor, and blessings are only spiritual. You have to be blind to think that! I suppose the cattle and gold Abraham was very rich with was spiritual cattle and spiritual Gold.

 

[Willie-T]

Your trying to compare an $80 pair of shoes to a $10 million dollar home ???

That is just a ridiculous comparison, plus once again there is nothing wrong with wanted to live a nice lifestyle but a $80,000 to $100,000 dollar home is good enough. There is absolutely no need to live in a house worth 10 million dollars.

You are focusing to much on the carnal world and not on the ways of God.

God does not respect a man who has lavish possessions that they have attained, for He our Lord even says "do not build up possessions on earth."...........Matthew 6:19-21

Most to almost all of the passages about being rich in the new testament are warnings to those that are not blessings !!!


Once again it is not wrong to have money, it becomes wrong depending on how they use it !!!

You are still in dreamland. I told you my tiny, old house built in 1954 appraised for $114,000..... and many people I know wouldn't dream of living in the dump I own.

 

[KennethC]

Why do I suspect "the majority of YOUR money" does NOT go to help others. No problem there, neither does mine... nor probably anyone else on this forum.

Well you have made a wrongful statement there as 95% of my money has always gone to others rather it be family, friends, or others in need.

If I had to break it down in percentages after I pay normal bills to live it the rest would be divided as such: 50% goes to my kids, 25% to my spouse, 10% to others in need, 10% to family members who need help, and then 5% for myself.

 

[AceMichaels]

Kenneth, I actually like you a lot. I think you have a heart to serve God. I also think you would be able to do that a lot better if you would let go of your poverty mentality. Do you really think God is interested in cutting corners to save money? Why did God build the old temple so lavish? Why wasn't all that gold used to feed the poor instead of lining the walls?

The spirit that you are speaking from is the same as Judas. Why wasn't that bottle of ointment sold to feed the poor?

Nowhere does the bible teach us to give the majority of what we have away. It does teach us to give and to have compassion. I figure the best way for me to do that is to be wealthy enough that I can give $10000 instead of $1000.

Honestly, do you give away the majority of your income, or do you need all you have just to survive? I'm sure you give but are you giving away most of it like you want someone else to do? Why do you need a 50K house? You could get an old trailer for $2000 and give the rest to the poor. Why stop there? There are people all over the world living in cardboard and tin shanties built from scavenged scrap. Why not live in one of those and give all the rest to help everyone else?

The answer isn't in what we can do for the poor. Jesus said they would be with us always. The answer is to get them to believe God who is the source and supply? How and why would they believe God is their source if there were no examples of his blessing his children? Isn't it just possible that God makes men rich to fulfill his covenant and to be a blessing to others? At least that's what my bible says.

What did Jesus say to the rich man?

 

[KennethC]

You are still in dreamland. I told you my tiny, old house built in 1954 appraised for $114,000..... and many people I know wouldn't dream of living in the dump I own.

I am not living in dream land but I can not comment on your tiny house, because I do not know what your understanding of tiny is.

I know of 30 houses that are up for sell around where I grew up that are two story or ranch style 3 to 5 bedroom houses, with two or three bathrooms that are in the $75,000 to $100,000 price range.

A couple years ago if I could of come up with $2,000 for the down payment, which I didn't, I could have owned a two story 6 bedroom house that was on the market for $55,000. Nothing was wrong with the house as I had it inspected as well did the reality company. I just came up $500 dollars short of closing the deal !!!

 

[Willie-T]

Well you have made a wrongful statement there as 95% of my money has always gone to others rather it be family, friends, or others in need.

If I had to break it down in percentages after I pay normal bills to live it the rest would be divided as such: 50% goes to my kids, 25% to my spouse, 10% to others in need, 10% to family members who need help, and then 5% for myself.

No....... Not AFTER you spend what you want to in order to live. BEFORE.

 

[Willie-T]

What did Jesus say to the rich man?

He answered the Rich Man's question as it pertained to him. And the Rich Young Ruler asked: "What must I do to gain Eternal Life?" Not, "What is required for us to receive Eternal Life." (Besides, the guy lied to Jesus when he answered that he had kept every commandment since childhood.) I had an idol that he put before (higher than) God.

 

[Willie-T]

I am not living in dream land but I can not comment on your tiny house, because I do not know what your understanding of tiny is.

I know of 30 houses that are up for sell around where I grew up that are two story or ranch style 3 to 5 bedroom houses, with two or three bathrooms that are in the $75,000 to $100,000 price range.

A couple years ago if I could of come up with $2,000 for the down payment, which I didn't, I could have owned a two story 6 bedroom house that was on the market for $55,000. Nothing was wrong with the house as I had it inspected as well did the reality company. I just came up $500 dollars short of closing the deal !!!

943 square feet, without the one-car garage.

 

[pottersclay]

Willie-t you say I hate and I do. Maybe I need help in this matter. I hate to see people hoodwinked into thinking that if their good they will go to heaven. If they do the right thing God will except them. These so called preachers that like to stand up for civil rights and litigate a person's right according to the constitution and parades around with a white collar and says look at me I am a man of God and as he gets his 10 minutes of fame it's sickening.
There are real hurts, real pain, real suffering out in this world and there are real so called preachers who take advantage of these things. That's what I hate.
Destroyers that's what they are. People well meaning to give their all falling victim to these vipers.
That's what I hate. Mothers losing their sons on the streets, kids waking up to parents not home or passed out because of the drug and alcohol abuse. The flesh peddlers who take kids by force or bribe.
I hate this......your right I need help.
I've lived in the so called hood, I've worked for slum Lord's, I've shared my lunch with the kids that are waiting for mom or dad to wake up or come home. And then I see these white collar vipers getting their 10 min of fame over someone else's tragedy....yup I hate.
When I read my favorite verses in the bible proverbs 1:20-33 and think that one day the Lord won't hear the cries it puts tears in my eyes, my stomach turns to think of no hope to be found.
I'm sorry I got off track here but I needed to vent... but your right I do hate.

 

[KennethC]

Jesus only specifically told the rich young ruler that. The reason was because he trusted in his riches. Yes, for him it was the thing he lacked, but specifically for him. Nowhere does the scriptures teach us to give all we have and you know it!

Have you ever read the blessings from Deut.28? Read it and tell me God wants us poor, and blessings are only spiritual. You have to be blind to think that! I suppose the cattle and gold Abraham was very rich with was spiritual cattle and spiritual Gold.

I never said that God will not bless some with money, but if they do not use what God has given them in the way the bible states then it becomes sin.

Lord Jesus says in Luke 12:48 to those who are given more, more from them will be required.

Lord Jesus said the woman in poverty who gave only two mites gave more then those rich people gave, because the Lord does not count giving more by dollars and cents as we do.

Therefore if I give the only $20's out of my pocket to feed a couple people and another with $10,000 on them only gave $1,000 to feed others the Lord would say I gave more to by the example in Mark 12:44.

Plus that was not specific for just that one rich man, that was an example to all people mainly that of rich that if you put your trust in your possessions instead of the Lord then eternal life is not where they are headed.

It was a testing of his faith to see where his heart truly belongs !!!

 

[AceMichaels]

He answered the Rich Man's question as it pertained to him. And the Rich Young Ruler asked: "What must I do to gain Eternal Life?" Not, "What is required for us to receive Eternal Life." (Besides, the guy lied to Jesus when he answered that he had kept every commandment since childhood.) I had an idol that he put before (higher than) God.

From my own experience, the rich people I know like to talk about their things and things they're going to get and where the vacation will be that year and so on. Kinda sounds like the rich man in the bible. Maybe your experience is different

 

[Willie-T]

Willie-t you say I hate and I do. Maybe I need help in this matter. I hate to see people hoodwinked into thinking that if their good they will go to heaven. If they do the right thing God will except them. These so called preachers that like to stand up for civil rights and litigate a person's right according to the constitution and parades around with a white collar and says look at me I am a man of God and as he gets his 10 minutes of fame it's sickening.
There are real hurts, real pain, real suffering out in this world and there are real so called preachers who take advantage of these things. That's what I hate.
Destroyers that's what they are. People well meaning to give their all falling victim to these vipers.
That's what I hate. Mothers losing their sons on the streets, kids waking up to parents not home or passed out because of the drug and alcohol abuse. The flesh peddlers who take kids by force or bribe.
I hate this......your right I need help.
I've lived in the so called hood, I've worked for slum Lord's, I've shared my lunch with the kids that are waiting for mom or dad to wake up or come home. And then I see these white collar vipers getting their 10 min of fame over someone else's tragedy....yup I hate.
When I read my favorite verses in the bible proverbs 1:20-33 and think that one day the Lord won't hear the cries it puts tears in my eyes, my stomach turns to think of no hope to be found.
I'm sorry I got off track here but I needed to vent... but your right I do hate.

That's good. Keep on sharing your lunch without fretting over what others do. Nothing you or I do is going to change any of it. These people that give their money to the crooks (and, of course I know there are many) do so because they are not listening to the same God you and I listened to. Don't sell God short. He did not just let the people run to these preachers without putting the same call in their hearts as you and I heard. They preferred to listen to the preaching instead.

 

[KennethC]

No....... Not AFTER you spend what you want to in order to live. BEFORE.

Sorry but that makes no sense as even Jesus said to give to Caesar what is Caesar when asked about taxes, so paying what one needs to pay to survive in society today as the governments set up is not considered as part of what we give.

The giving comes from the heart out of the abundance that God has allowed us to have after we take care of what we need to pay to live in society, and nobody needs to live above and beyond what is necessary to survive while watching others struggle or starve.

Nowhere does the bible say to neglect taking care of your family and paying your bills to feed and clothe others, we are to do all of that together !!!