Romans 10:13

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Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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And that is fine you are entitled to believe as you will ------and we will leave it at that -----
I believe what the Bible teaches. You do not, and that really is not fine, though you will probably not change.

If God did not draw unbelievers to Himself, none would seek Him. That is Bible Truth, which you deny.

I really cannot condone your lack of comprehension in this regard.

Hopefully God will open your eyes.
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
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Titus 2:11-12 agrees, Grace saves
Titus 2:11-12 agrees, Grace saves
No one has said grace doesn't save. Only that the vehicle it uses is faith. And faith always has an object.
All who call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. But how can one call upon one they have not believed in? And how does one believe in one they have not heard?
 

studentoftheword

Well-known member
Nov 12, 2021
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If God did not draw unbelievers to Himself, none would seek Him. That is Bible Truth, which you deny.

I really cannot condone your lack of comprehension in this regard.

Hopefully God will open your eyes.

Magenta -----your statement was that God was involved in your life as an unbeliever -----

Who was your god when you were unsaved -----Satan ---not God ----
-Questions -----I will wait for your answer

So what change did God make in your personal life as an unbeliever -----Did He Bless your life as an unbeliever ---or were you under the Curse -- ------as Scripture say ----

did God answer your Prayers as an unbeliever ----Scripture says NOT

Did you have God's protection as an unbeliever ---Scripture says NOT ---

-Did you have redemption as an unbeliever ----Scripture says NOT ---

-Did you have Sanctification as an unbeliever---Scripture says Not

did you have the title of Saint as an unbeliever -----Scripture says NOT ---

if God is involved in Sinners lives this world would be different ---

If God was involved in Sinners lives then Jesus would have not had to shed his blood to cover sin ------we would all be saints -----and be blessed -----not under the curse -----

I say
Your taking the word Draw and making it say what you want it to say ------

And you need to do some research on the Holy Spirit convicts the world ---so you understand what that means ------
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


God and Satan both pull on the hearts of people every day --it is a SOUL WINNING FIGHT

The Battle is who will win your SOUL ----Satan fights and Draws as well to keep people away from God ---otherwise all would accept God's drawing ------and not all do ------


God does pull on our hearts everyday to come to Him ---I agree with that ----But we have to respond to that Draw--God does not make any unbeliever respond to His Drawing ---- we have a choice to Accept that DRAW or REJECT the Draw ---many reject the Draw ---SOME ACCEPT that draw -----

The unbeliever is away From God their god is Satan ------so you can believe that God was somehow involved in your life but the Scripture clearly says That He is Not until you have come to your senses and accept that your a Sinner in need of a Saviour -------and God knows every single person's heart to know who will accept His Drawing and who will Not -------

So say what you will but God is Not personally involved in the Sinners Life ---Satan is -----

Commentary on John 6:44

Ellicott's Commentary for English Readers
(44) No man can come to me.—The subject is still the mystery of the varying effects of His revelation on the minds of men. These depend upon their present mental state, which is itself the result of acceptance of, or rejection of, divine influence.

I say----- the Disciples are an example of being Drawn ------they accepted that Draw from The Father and left their boats and followed Jesus ------they could have refused the Draw ----but they didn't -----God did not------ hog tie----- them to Follow His Son -----they voluntarily went ------

The Jews are an example of rejecting the Draw -----and many still reject the Draw from God on their Hearts -------Some Jews have accepted the Draw -----
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
23,790
12,595
113
Drawing there is regeneration, it saves. And the drawing there is restricted to Gods elect
You are so utterly confused with your false gospel that you really have no clue about either drawing or regeneration or God's elect. What you need to do is dump your false theology and go back to the Bible.
 

Fundaamental

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2023
3,289
420
83
Magenta -----your statement was that God was involved in your life as an unbeliever -----

Who was your god when you were unsaved -----Satan ---not God ----
-Questions -----I will wait for your answer

So what change did God make in your personal life as an unbeliever -----Did He Bless your life as an unbeliever ---or were you under the Curse -- ------as Scripture say ----

did God answer your Prayers as an unbeliever ----Scripture says NOT

Did you have God's protection as an unbeliever ---Scripture says NOT ---

-Did you have redemption as an unbeliever ----Scripture says NOT ---

-Did you have Sanctification as an unbeliever---Scripture says Not

did you have the title of Saint as an unbeliever -----Scripture says NOT ---

if God is involved in Sinners lives this world would be different ---

If God was involved in Sinners lives then Jesus would have not had to shed his blood to cover sin ------we would all be saints -----and be blessed -----not under the curse -----

I say
Your taking the word Draw and making it say what you want it to say ------

And you need to do some research on the Holy Spirit convicts the world ---so you understand what that means ------
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


God and Satan both pull on the hearts of people every day --it is a SOUL WINNING FIGHT

The Battle is who will win your SOUL ----Satan fights and Draws as well to keep people away from God ---otherwise all would accept God's drawing ------and not all do ------


God does pull on our hearts everyday to come to Him ---I agree with that ----But we have to respond to that Draw--God does not make any unbeliever respond to His Drawing ---- we have a choice to Accept that DRAW or REJECT the Draw ---many reject the Draw ---SOME ACCEPT that draw -----

The unbeliever is away From God their god is Satan ------so you can believe that God was somehow involved in your life but the Scripture clearly says That He is Not until you have come to your senses and accept that your a Sinner in need of a Saviour -------and God knows every single person's heart to know who will accept His Drawing and who will Not -------

So say what you will but God is Not personally involved in the Sinners Life ---Satan is -----

Commentary on John 6:44

Ellicott's Commentary for English Readers
(44) No man can come to me.—The subject is still the mystery of the varying effects of His revelation on the minds of men. These depend upon their present mental state, which is itself the result of acceptance of, or rejection of, divine influence.

I say----- the Disciples are an example of being Drawn ------they accepted that Draw from The Father and left their boats and followed Jesus ------they could have refused the Draw ----but they didn't -----God did not------ hog tie----- them to Follow His Son -----they voluntarily went ------

The Jews are an example of rejecting the Draw -----and many still reject the Draw from God on their Hearts -------Some Jews have accepted the Draw -----
Yeah say what you like to.
 

studentoftheword

Well-known member
Nov 12, 2021
1,566
521
113
You are so utterly confused with your false gospel that you really have no clue about either drawing or regeneration or God's elect. What you need to do is dump your false theology and go back to the Bible.
Worth Repeating ----an I say ----

 

studentoftheword

Well-known member
Nov 12, 2021
1,566
521
113
Magenta ----

https://www.bibleversestudy.com/johngospel/john16-convict-the-world-of-sin.htm

JOHN 16 COMMENTARY ◄
John 16:8-12 Convict the World of Sin
John 16:13-15 Spirit of Truth

JOHN 16:8-11 8 “And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: 9 of sin, because they do not believe in Me; 10 of righteousness, because I go to My Father and you see Me no more; 11 of judgment, because the ruler of this world is judged.

What impact will the Holy Spirit have on the world?

"He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment" (John 16:8).
How will the Holy Spirit convict the world of sin, righteousness and judgment?

Through Christians whom He will indwell, empower and lead.


What did Jesus mean by convicting the world "of sin, because they do not believe in Me" (John 16:9)?

The Holy Spirit will lead Christians to preach Jesus' gift of salvation, which delivers people from their sins (plural).
When people reject that, they will be convicted of the "sin" (singular) of not believing Jesus' sacrifice on the cross paid the death penalty due for their sins, and therefore remain guilty of them.
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Nov 21, 2020
5,365
473
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No one has said grace doesn't save. Only that the vehicle it uses is faith. And faith always has an object.
All who call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. But how can one call upon one they have not believed in? And how does one believe in one they have not heard?
Grace saves, it doesnt use anything. Faith is a product of Grace. Its of Faith that it may be by grace Rom 4:16

16 Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,

In other words, man doesnt have Faith until Grace gives it to him when Grace saves Him.
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Nov 21, 2020
5,365
473
83
You are so utterly confused with your false gospel that you really have no clue about either drawing or regeneration or God's elect. What you need to do is dump your false theology and go back to the Bible.
Again Drawing is regeneration, once God regenerates you He draws and causes you to believe
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
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Grace saves, it doesnt use anything. Faith is a product of Grace. Its of Faith that it may be by grace Rom 4:16

16 Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,

In other words, man doesnt have Faith until Grace gives it to him when Grace saves Him.
You've changed the argument. We were talking about salvation. Grace uses faith to produce salvation. But no one is saved who doesn't believe on the Lord Jesus Christ.

God can elect people before the foundation of the world. And on the basis of His intention, He can speak of it as though it has already come to pass. But He exists outside of time. Individuals have to realize the salvation God has provided in space and time. And part of that will be faith in Christ. They will come to believe on Him.
 

Inquisitor

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2022
2,167
673
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I understand your point but you may not be using the best model. It's not a like-for like comparison.
In Afghanistan, Jihadis murder or forcibly convert Christians. Brazil is largely Catholic.
Actually what it means, is that Afghanistan is not fertile ground for the gospel. The gospel cannot be successfully preached in Afghanistan, the conversion ratio is next to zero. Millions upon millions of people just like you and I, unable to become Christians.

Afghanistan is a perfect example of why Calvinism is incorrect.

There are many factors in play in the background as to why the gospel advances, in one country over another country.
 

Inquisitor

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2022
2,167
673
113
Again Drawing is regeneration, once God regenerates you He draws and causes you to believe
You are not preaching the good news.

You are preaching a factional doctrine, a doctrine that generates discord.

There is only one name under heaven that we preach, Jesus Christ.
 

Inquisitor

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2022
2,167
673
113
Again Drawing is regeneration, once God regenerates you He draws and causes you to believe
Do you believe that God forced Adam to sin?

That would be logical, if Calvinism was true.
 

DJT_47

Active member
Oct 20, 2022
980
171
43
Romans 10:13
King James Version

13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Does this mean that everyone who has ever called upon the name of Jesus will be saved?
Absolutely not. And you can't take just obe scripture and run with it as though it said all there is to say on the subject. There are other scriptures that provide more information on what is required to be saved. When you look at ALL pertinent scriptures, you wind up with the following;
1. Belief and faith
2. Confession of belief
3. Repentance
4. Baptism

Doing ALL the above saves your soul.
 
Jun 20, 2022
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Romans 10:13
King James Version

13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Does this mean that everyone who has ever called upon the name of Jesus will be saved?
Better throw away that Verse, it doesn't fit what the Chosen/Selected/Predestined crowd pushes as gospel..

That Verse demonstrates FREE WILL, and that kind of idealism ain't allowed to breathe.
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Nov 21, 2020
5,365
473
83
You've changed the argument. We were talking about salvation. Grace uses faith to produce salvation. But no one is saved who doesn't believe on the Lord Jesus Christ.

God can elect people before the foundation of the world. And on the basis of His intention, He can speak of it as though it has already come to pass. But He exists outside of time. Individuals have to realize the salvation God has provided in space and time. And part of that will be faith in Christ. They will come to believe on Him.
No I havent changed. I may have expanded, but not changed. A Person must be saved by grace before they can believe.
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Nov 21, 2020
5,365
473
83
You are not preaching the good news.

You are preaching a factional doctrine, a doctrine that generates discord.

There is only one name under heaven that we preach, Jesus Christ.
Yes I am, it may not be good news to you. A Person must be saved before they can call upon the Name of the Lord.