Romans 8:1-2, is conditional

[PeterJens]

You want me to tell you that you are wrong sand then you want me to list the facts of why you are wrong
and I won't do it
it has no bearing on THE GOSPEL or the discussion sir
and!
because I won't profess myself you are trying to use this to invalidate me as if you are right that there is something hidden in me that I am trying to keep hidden
all because I won't do what you want me to do
profess myself

My friend I intend you no harm.
It is you who said everything I was sharing was of the "flesh".
Biblical translation of this is carnal, evil, sexual immorality, lust, greed, murder, envy etc.

If all of life and social interaction is this, society is a very evil place, but I know most interaction
is not this at all, but often people empathising and caring for each other in one way or another.

As I said before, this language is typical of social issues and nothing to do with faith.

I grew up in a family with relating social issues, and have many relatives with social disabilities
in various areas, some under permanent medication, so I know a lot about this area.

But finding a safe place to share and be relaxed can be very hard to find, as many simply do
not appreciate the strengths and weaknesses we all live with.

God bless you, however you work things out, the Lord is Good.

 

[miknik5]

I am now "evil", "charging you", "wicked"

I am not surprised people find it hard to be friendly to you.
But this is what Christ came to change in our lives, the ability to reach
out and share from our hearts.

I sometimes wonder what a conversation would have been like with me
20 years ago. Probably quite strange, but then you never know, lol.

Go away "friend"
And don't take this to an ignorant baby lamb who has not first entered in by way of THE DOOR lest they somehow think that you will lead them

no one should follow you because you can't promise eternal life through yourself

Do the right work and point all to the ONE who can and step away and let HIM shepherd HIS SHEEP

You were NOT given a flock to tend

 

[valiant]

Originally Posted by valiant

This is where you go so drastically wrong. We are recreated FIRST. That then leads on to change and work and bearing fruit,

valiant - you are not being fair to me.

I am talking about Jesus initiates the change in our hearts through coming to faith.

That is not what you said.

,

But then being fair is not what you are about.

Others must judge that, but I must confess I always find you very difficult to follow.

I am a "legalist" so must be wrong on else you would call me a brother.

I never said one or the other. I have never called anyone a legalist or a brother on here. I write generally, not to specific people. Are you a legalist? you often give that impression

 

[PeterJens]

Go away "friend"

miknik5 - is it that hard to have friends?
Is there a reason why you would distrust me?

I can think of 1000's because this is the internet, but many on
cc share some unbelievably painful and personal things and find real support,
so I know it can help some.

One guy I tried to help, could not slow down and actually share what was going
on inside, he would shoot off just the first thing, and would need someone face to
face to make progress. I could not help like this though being 1000's of miles away.

My house group helps me, and try and encourage them into more openness and trust of
each other in Christ. That reminds me I should visit a brother in hospital who is having
a bad time, but has such a good heart.

 

[PeterJens]

That is not what you said.
Others must judge that, but I must confess I always find you very difficult to follow.
I never said one or the other. I have never called anyone a legalist or a brother on here. I write generally, not to specific people. Are you a legalist?

I am not a legalist. And if you take a note I have written and respond line by line
that is a personal response. Or are these conversations just personal airings in general terms.
lol

 

[valiant]

I am not a legalist. And if you take a note I have written and respond line by line
that is a personal response. Or are these conversations just personal airings in general terms.
lol

My replies are intended for the general reader so that he can think about it, not for you. I do not anticipate that the recipient will alter his views on major issues.,

 

[Gr8grace]

Is there a reason why you would distrust me?

The belief that we can lose salvation. The constant promotion of self and what you are doing that is 'good.'

And hardly a word about the Lord Jesus Christ and what He has done.

I believe this is why you see so much 'distrust' or contention.

 

[PeterJens]

My replies are intended for the general reader so that he can think about it, not for you. I do not anticipate that the recipient will alter his views on major issues.,

The problem I find with cc is short statements often lead to miss-understanding.
When I first came here I defended someone who was being attacked for something which
I thought was actually a balanced position and I was accused of being a legalist.

After a long discussion, they admitted I was not. It is always hard in the middle ground.
Like I am partly calvanist and partly armenian. Like I believe we are chosen yet we can
choose to walk away.

Now for those with a superficial understanding of the complexities, it is just a single stop
shop. That is why I look for a debate, putting the arguments from both sides, because
over time I actually grow in faith and knowledge. cc has taught me a lot, lol, even bdf...

 

[heavenly_bound]

The word confess is the Greek word . What that means is that we agree with God that we have missed the mark laid out in His Word.

The definition is correct but the exegesis (interpretation) is so wrong. confession is the exact opposite of what you are sayings. Yes homologeō means to say the same thing as another(God). The question is, what is God saying or what has God been saying through His Son? What has God been saying through the Cross of Christ; What has God been saying concerning humanity, when we look at the of the cross? what has God been saying in regards to what He has done with our sins at the cross? God said at the cross "TETELESTIAL" ; IT IS FINISHED!!!! THE OLD(the Law) IS GONE AND THE NEW ( the new creation in Christ)HAS COME!!! when we say the exact same things that God says regarding the perfect work of Jesus Christ, then we are "homoologeoing" Together with God!!

 

[PeterJens]

The belief that we can lose salvation. The constant promotion of self and what you are doing that is 'good.'
And hardly a word about the Lord Jesus Christ and what He has done.
I believe this is why you see so much 'distrust' or contention.

If the above is true, then spirituality here is very poor.

You talk like someone training to sprint the 100 metres and went everyone to confirm
they cannot leave the race track. It is not relevant, at all.

And I talk about Jesus and His love all the time. It is through Jesus we change and gain
anything of value. I also quote reams of biblical verses, but people do not want to read them.

And what is my passion, is the victory Jesus has brought us through the cross.
Do you know His love is so great, it can change your life? Or possibly you are still living in defeat
and have not met Jesus up close and personal, touched His hands and side, felt His overflowing, eternal,
perfect, pure love break your heart into worship and tears.

But thanks for the encouragement to share the above, because for me to live is Christ, to die is gain.

 

[heavenly_bound]

Originally Posted by reneweddaybyday
The word confess is the Greek word homologeō and it means to say the same thing as another. What that means is that we agree with God that we have missed the mark laid out in His Word.

We know when have broken fellowship with Father for whatever reason and we know when we have missed the mark. That is what the word "sin" (Greek hamartia) means ... to miss the mark. God lets us know directly by prodding us. He is very hands-on and we become convicted in our hearts. In other words, we know in our heart of hearts when we have broken fellowship.

We agree with God that we have stumbled and God, as a loving, faithful, heavenly Father opens His arms to us and brings us close to Him.


That is my understanding of 1 John 1:9.


If we do not agree, we subject ourselves to the chastening of the Lord:

Hebrews 12:

6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.

7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?

8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.

9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?

10 For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness.

11 Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby.


I think our natural tendency is to run/hide from chastening when in all actuality we should be running to it so that we might have the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby and once again partake of His holiness.
[/QUOTE]


The definition is correct but the exegesis (interpretation) is so wrong. confession is the exact opposite of what you are sayings. Yes homologeō means to say the same thing as another(God). The question is, what is God saying or what has God been saying through His Son? What has God been saying through the Cross of Christ; What has God been saying concerning humanity, when we look at the cross? what has God been saying in regards to what He has done with our sins at the cross? God said at the cross "TETELESTIAL" ; IT IS FINISHED!!!! THE OLD(the Law) IS GONE AND THE NEW ( the new creation in Christ)HAS COME!!! when we say the exact same things that God says regarding the perfect work of Jesus Christ, then we are "homoologeoing" Together with God!!

 

[Gr8grace]

Do you know His love is so great, it can change your life? Or possibly you are still living in defeat

Do you know His love is so great that He gives NEW life?

Eternally secure or not? Who really is living in defeat? Who really doesn't truly know His love?



Rom 8~~37But in all these things we overwhelmingly conquer through Him who loved us. 38For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, 39nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, will be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

1 Cor 13:8~~New American Standard Bible
Love never fails; but if there are gifts of prophecy, they will be done away; if there are tongues, they will cease; if there is knowledge, it will be done away.

 

[garee]

So all the promises to Israel were conditional. Remind you of what His Son came to preach?

Yes there are conditions to any sinner. I will offer a couple.

(1) As many as the father gave to the Son.

(2) God who has no beginning and therefore no end does not have flesh.

(3) Jesus as the Son of man, says His flesh profits for nothing.

(4) We are commanded not to look for a fleshly Christ, the anointing Holy Spirit of God.(2Corinthians 5:16) Once was enough to demonstrate the spiritual work of the faith generated by Christ of Christ pouring out His Spirit on corrupted flesh in a hope of our new bodies. Which will be neither Jew nor Gentile as one bride.

Or otherwise a person will be found guilty of crucifying Christ over and over to public shame as if one demonstration was not enough as those in what I would call the Hebrew 6 boat heading towards its eternal destination.

Better things accompany actual salvation like eternal security.

If any man have not the same spirit of faith (Christ's)) according as it is written (not the spirit of men) as informed in Romans then neither do they belong to God. God is simply no respecter of persons as if he was served by human hands/will and needed something from the clay he is forming Christ in..He informs us that he who has begun the good work of salvation in us He will work to finish it to the end .Its the Christians confidence as an anchor to our souls .Finishing is much better than starting just a patience the first work of His labor of love is better than pride.

I think we will be surprised.

John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

 

[eph610]

(4) We are commanded not to look for a fleshly Christ, the anointing Holy Spirit of God.

What do you mean here?

 

[PeterJens]

Do you know His love is so great that He gives NEW life?
Eternally secure or not? Who really is living in defeat? Who really doesn't truly know His love?
Rom 8~~37But in all these things we overwhelmingly conquer through Him who loved us. 38For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, 39nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, will be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
1 Cor 13:8~~New American Standard Bible
Love never fails; but if there are gifts of prophecy, they will be done away; if there are tongues, they will cease; if there is knowledge, it will be done away.

Biting, not. The real point about love is it unlocks you. Are you unlocked or still wrapped up
inside? I need say no more, my friend.

 

[garee]

But you do not become a saint overnight, and all the things you have learnt to do do not miraculous change at gaining faith. There is no such thing as instant perfection.

God perfects all things in the twinkling of the eye. In the beginning God said; Let there be light a perfect light came

We are sanctified set apart for a purpose of God our new birth in the twinkling of eye having been given a new spirit a new heart as the Spirit of Christ that indwell the believer at birth .

He is the author and perfecter of the Christian faith.(Christ's not of ourselves.) He makes us perfect in every good work to do his will, working in us. Job informs us He performs that which is appointed to us, He makes our heart soft. We plant the incorruptible seed by which all men are born again from above. But he causes the growth is there is growth.

If we begin with the Spirit of Christ He finishes the work. There is no limbo in between. If any man has not the Spirit of Christ the anointing Holy Spirit of God they simply do not belong to Him.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Do you know His love is so great that He gives NEW life?

Eternally secure or not? Who really is living in defeat? Who really doesn't truly know His love?



Rom 8~~37But in all these things we overwhelmingly conquer through Him who loved us. 38For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, 39nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, will be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

1 Cor 13:8~~New American Standard Bible
Love never fails; but if there are gifts of prophecy, they will be done away; if there are tongues, they will cease; if there is knowledge, it will be done away.

I just love how he always brings about our living in defeat, When we teach the Christ has conquered death, and we are secure in him, thus we have entered his rest.

Yet he teaches one can lose salvation, and must always be on guard,, And he does not consider that defeat..

Thats the problem with religion. It thinks it is so right, it is blind to what he is really teaching, and can not even see that what they always blame others of doing, they are guilty themselves. And the ones they blame do not even believe what they say they believe.

Maybe it is a defense mechanism?

 

[Gr8grace]

Biting, not. The real point about love is it unlocks you. Are you unlocked or still wrapped up
inside? I need say no more, my friend.

This is what I am talking about. Your emphasis is always on self or another person.

And very rarely on Christ.

The love of Christ never fails,never. If the believer thinks that His love can fail, and He will take His gift of eternal life away........That believer has not "unlocked" the Love of Christ.

 

[garee]

What do you mean here?

Christ put on corrupted flesh typified as sinful to condemn sin in the flesh .He did that work according to His unseen Spirit .

God has no flesh as beginning . He remains suppernatural without a beginning. But it was needed to demonstrate the spiritual work of pouring out His Spirit on flesh as to the rest we have in Him.

When he left he left us instruction that we known him no more forever more in respect to the things seen in this world. We simply do not know God after the rudiments of this world. Flesh and blood will not enter the new heavens and earth.The new creation. When we think of God we think of no form.

Hearing the voice of an angel of light who put its words in the mouth of a creature (serpent) marks the fall. Christ the anointing Holy Spirit of God has no form.

Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now "henceforth" know we him no more.Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.2Co 5:16

 

[eternally-gratefull]

This is what I am talking about. Your emphasis is always on self or another person.

And very rarely on Christ.

The love of Christ never fails,never. If the believer thinks that His love can fail, and He will take His gift of eternal life away........That believer has not "unlocked" the Love of Christ.

I was hoping if i stopped responding to him, Maybe he would listen to someone else. But sadly, He still continues to do the same things,, He just can't blame me anymore..