Should Christians contend for the faith?

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May 13, 2017
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#41
I don't know how Wisdom defines contend but I can tell you the Greek word is a compound verb "epagonizomai, and this word is only found in this text. The word comes from the fierce compition of the athletic field. Beleivers must fight, strive, strugle for the faith. In fact, it's where we get the English transliteration "agonize."

This "agonizing" is what the Apostle Paul was talking about at Acts 20:28-31. Now, there's another interesting aspect to this verse where it says, "Once for all delievered to the saints." This means the message of Christianity was given to the Church at the beginning; it had not come in instgallments. This shoots down some of the cults like "Moromonism" which of course they have the Book of Mormon which is to them "another" testament. There is no other testament execpt the Bible.

In fact when I witness to Mornmons to them I ask them to please tell what you prophets are going to tell that is not already in the Bible? So there you go deanaii, you agonize for the faith once for all delievered to the saints and I don't mean Word of faith teachings. :eek:

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
OK....Is Agonizing the same as fighting?
 

bluto

Senior Member
Aug 4, 2016
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#42
OK....Is Agonizing the same as fighting?
Come denadii, what kind of question is that? No, agonizing is not the same as fighting. To agonize is to suffer extreme pain or anguish or to put forth great effort of any kind. Fight or fighting, is displaying conflicit or engaging in violence, combat of aggression.

So let me ask you this question? Jesus before Jesus was going to the cross what was He doing with He was sweating great drops of blood? Was he fighting or was he agonizing and putting forth great "anguish?" :eek: :rolleyes:

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
 
May 13, 2017
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#43
Come denadii, what kind of question is that? No, agonizing is not the same as fighting. To agonize is to suffer extreme pain or anguish or to put forth great effort of any kind. Fight or fighting, is displaying conflicit or engaging in violence, combat of aggression.

So let me ask you this question? Jesus before Jesus was going to the cross what was He doing with He was sweating great drops of blood? Was he fighting or was he agonizing and putting forth great "anguish?" :eek: :rolleyes:

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
He was agonizing of course, but I was looking at you, at me, and many of the others on this forum...Do we agonize? Or do we fight?
 
Dec 12, 2013
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#44
What does the word contend mean....it means to struggle as prepared for battle.....people need to get over the fact that we are in a spiritual war and the enemy will use every trick in the book..........put your armor on, unsheath your sword and make a stand as a good soldier of the cross and contend for the faith ONCE DELIVERED unto the saints!!!
 
May 13, 2017
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#45
What does the word contend mean....it means to struggle as prepared for battle.....people need to get over the fact that we are in a spiritual war and the enemy will use every trick in the book..........put your armor on, unsheath your sword and make a stand as a good soldier of the cross and contend for the faith ONCE DELIVERED unto the saints!!!
Ok We're in a battle....Why are we fighting each other?
 
Dec 12, 2013
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#46
Ok We're in a battle....Why are we fighting each other?
To be frank, If I need to answer this question it seems obvious you are missing a lot....another thing people need to get over....not everyone on this site is Christian, not everyone on this site is biblical, not everyone on this site proclaims biblical truth...
 
May 13, 2017
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#47
To be frank, If I need to answer this question it seems obvious you are missing a lot....another thing people need to get over....not everyone on this site is Christian, not everyone on this site is biblical, not everyone on this site proclaims biblical truth...
Well....True
 

OneFaith

Senior Member
Sep 5, 2016
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#48
We are to contend for the faith even to the point of death.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
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#49
OK....Is Agonizing the same as fighting?
However you want to interpret it, Scripture is clear that Christians are in a war with Satan and his evil spirits, who use mockers, scoffers, apostates, atheists, Muslims, etc. to attack "the faith once delivered to the saints".

There is presently tremendous persecution of Christians in Muslim and Hindu lands, not to mention godless China and other part of the world. That is all a part of the war against Christ and Christians. North American society will tolerate every kind of perverted notion, but the minute you preach the Gospel and speak of Christ, or preach the truth about homosexuality, everyone is up in arms about "hate speech" and how Christians should be muzzled.

So there is no point quibbling about the meaning of warfare (and contending is a part of that). As you will note when you go further into Jude, he attacks false teachers, and pronounces a woe upon them, and reminds his listeners that at the second coming of Christ (with His saints and angels), there will be severe judgment on the unbelieving, the ungodly, and unrepentant sinners. Also, we should be mindful of the fact that the preaching of the Cross is foolishness to those who are not saved. So here is Jude's advice as instructed by the Holy Ghost:

22 And of some have compassion, making a difference:

23 And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.
 

Desertsrose

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2016
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#50
Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.

Jude 1:3

I was watching a Dinesh D'Souza video the other day, and in the video he was talking about the importance of being able to defend faith in Christ. He wasnt really talking about every Christian becoming a debater or anything like that, but really just learning of a few common arguments against Christianity, and learning how to argue against them.

He said that most Christians shy away from these things, and that when he was young he used to hear other Christians talk about how they didnt want to "debate", but just have an "open dialog".

We all know the verses about doing all things with love and not using harsh words and all that, I dont think anyone is debating that idea at all. Im just curious about the thoughts of others. Do you believe that there are Christians who refuse to argue against arguments made against Christianity? Do you believe that there are Christians who lack the ability to do so, and if there are, is it due to the teachings of others against being able to do so, or just a lack of knowledge themselves?

Im curious about the thoughts of others on this issue.
Hi Yeraza,

Excellent OP. :)

What to do for the seeker - always be ready to give an answer
1 Peter 3:13-16 Who is there to harm you if you prove zealous for what is good? But even if you should suffer for the sake of righteousness, you are blessed. And do not fear their intimidation, and do not be troubled, but sanctify Christ as Lord in your hearts, always being ready to make a defense to everyone who asks you to give an account for the hope that is in you, yet with gentleness and reverence; and keep a good conscience so that in the thing in which you are slandered, those who revile your good behavior in Christ will be put to shame.

This should be easy.......Give a mini testimony as God leads. Why do you have hope in God? What has He done for you in your life? How did you get saved?

For those who oppose the truth of the gospel - contend for the faith
Jude 1:3,4
Beloved, while I was making every effort to write you about our common salvation, I felt the necessity to write to you appealing that you contend earnestly for the faith which was once for all handed down to the saints. For certain persons have crept in unnoticed, those who were long beforehand marked out for this condemnation, ungodly persons who turn the grace of our God into licentiousness and deny our only Master and Lord, Jesus Christ.


Reasons why some don't contend or give an account

Fear
Shy
Immature
Christian in name only
Lack of biblical knowledge

Think it's wrong to share their faith/it's a personal thing
Haven't been discipled or mentored themselves
Are a babe in Christ
Want to be liked/fear of man
Aren't totally surrendered to God

There's lots more we could add to the list, but I see it as a command to contend for the faith. Many leave gentleness and reverence at home or lost it along the way. That's what we need to practice and that's another reason why some don't share. They're not contentious and that's all they see mostly of those who do contend for the faith. :(



 

Yeraza_Bats

Senior Member
Dec 11, 2014
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#51
We need not be polished apologists only be able to articulate what Christ has done for us and what He will do for others who call upon Him for salvation. Just give a testimony of how each has come to Christ and how your life has changed since you were saved. No need to give a doctoral dissertation.

For the cause of Christ

Roger
I agree, and that was in my opening post. It doesnt hurt to take an argument that seems sound against Christianity, look into it and learn about it, and be able to defend Christ later on when it happens again.
Claims such as the Bible supports the enslavement of other people, or that a man can rape a woman and get away with it by paying 50 pieces of silver. Or even that the earth is flat. These things are not Biblical, but we live in a world where the world claims its true.
 

Yeraza_Bats

Senior Member
Dec 11, 2014
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#52
This is what I am talking about........ completely missing the point of Jesus' life.

How much better (and more effective) it would be to explain what Jesus desires for them, and the pain they are causing Him with their lifestyle.
The thing that bothers me the most is that you come into the thread Ive started with that assumption, as if that is what is being discussed, when that was never brought up at all. Which leads others to "take your side" and speak out against people who do go out condemning others, which leads them to believe that this was the whole point of the thread to begin with, when it was nothing more than "Should Christians know how to defend their faith", as in when their faith is under attack, should they take the time to study the Bible and history themselves and share the truth with others.

It would have been one thing to have started your point with "I think its good to know how to defend your faith, but we must be careful how we do it" or anything like that. But instead you come in saying one person is more Christ-like than others, and immediately shoot down even the talk of being able to defend your faith, turning it into a monstrous thing from the start.
 

Yeraza_Bats

Senior Member
Dec 11, 2014
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#53
Can you define "Contend for the Faith"? How does Wisdom define it?
I have no idea what you are looking for specifically, to be honest. But by contending for the faith, we live in a world that does not love God, and puts down the world. What Im talking about specifically is knowing how to handle such claims of God being evil and helping other believers learn how to handle these claims, and how to respond to them.
 
F

FeedtheMachine

Guest
#54
I have no idea what you are looking for specifically, to be honest. But by contending for the faith, we live in a world that does not love God, and puts down the world. What Im talking about specifically is knowing how to handle such claims of God being evil and helping other believers learn how to handle these claims, and how to respond to them.
Sadly we live in a world where we at times have to defend our faith against "Christians"...even more disturbing than having to defend it against non-believers...
 

lastofall

Senior Member
Aug 26, 2014
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#57
[for me anyway] we must not be imposing or intrusive, but gentle unto all, apt to teach, instructing them that oppose themselves: as for striving (or debate) speaking of God's Word must be to a receptive ear, and not a mocker: for conveying the Word of God is for them that believe, not for them that believe not. What about men that creep in, pretending themselves to be receptive: like I said a receptive ear; and if they were only pretending, still God's Word was heard.
As for contending (struggling) to defend, as it is written, that after the first or second instructive warning is conveyed toward a skeptic, then reject and say no more, knowing that they are impenitent, and are in the state of condemning their own self.
 
Feb 7, 2015
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#58
The thing that bothers me the most is that you come into the thread Ive started with that assumption, as if that is what is being discussed, when that was never brought up at all. Which leads others to "take your side" and speak out against people who do go out condemning others, which leads them to believe that this was the whole point of the thread to begin with, when it was nothing more than "Should Christians know how to defend their faith", as in when their faith is under attack, should they take the time to study the Bible and history themselves and share the truth with others.

It would have been one thing to have started your point with "I think its good to know how to defend your faith, but we must be careful how we do it" or anything like that. But instead you come in saying one person is more Christ-like than others, and immediately shoot down even the talk of being able to defend your faith, turning it into a monstrous thing from the start.
Did I compose the post that stated we should "condemn" other people? The post I clearly replied to?

No, I did not.

So, what is your problem with me saying I don't think that is at all Christ-like?
 

bluto

Senior Member
Aug 4, 2016
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#59
He was agonizing of course, but I was looking at you, at me, and many of the others on this forum...Do we agonize? Or do we fight?
What your doing denadii is comparing "apples and oranges." Look again what Jude says at vs3 and notice he says, "I felt the NECESSITY to write to you APPEALING to you that you CONTEND for the faith." Why denadii? Look at vs4, "For (or because) certain persons have CREPT in unnoticed, those who were long beforehand maked out for this condemnation, ungodly persons (how are they ungodly denadii?) who turn the grace of our God into licentiousness and deny our ONLY MASTER AND LORD, JESUS CHRIST."

The "apples" in this case is what I would call one putting their "whole heart" into contending for the faith which is the agonizing part. The "oranges" part is like you said the "battle" part. Then you said, "Why are we fighting each other?" Were not fighting each other, were fighting those who have "crept" in unnoticed.

What did the Apostle Paul say at Acts 20:28-31? "Be on guard for yourselves and for all the flock, among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers to shepherd the church of God which He purchased with His own blood. vs29, I KNOW that after my departure savage wolves will come in (or as Jude said creep in unnoticed) among you, not sparing the flock. vs30, AND FROM AMONG YOUR OWN SELVES MEN WILL ARISE, speaking PERVERSE things, to draw away the diciples after them. So the church is being attacked not only from without but also from within the church. And you know it's easy to spot those teaching pervese things outside of the church. But who are the ones teaching perverse things within the church?

Who do you think these men are denadii in todays church that have crept in speaking perverse things? Give me some examples of what kind of "perverse" things these men and women are introducing to the flock drawing the flock/sheep to themselves? Can you name anybody denadii? I sure can? That's what were fighting denadii. :eek:

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
 

Demi777

Senior Member
Oct 13, 2014
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#60
Well some people are more gifted than others. Sometimes its a lack of knowledge (yea sometimes ppl just dont have the backbone either). I gotta say that in some circumstances its better to be silent and sometimes its better to speak out.
Also after a while u do get tired of arguments, especially when often people are only out to attack the faith instead of asking questions and being sensible
Thats just my opinion tho