Some things about the law that need explaining.

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ewq1938

ewq1938

Well-known member
#261
Oct 18, 2018
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#261
Guojing said:
Yes, so when was this revealed?
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When it was revealed is irrelevant, When did the body first form is the relevant question. It was formed by the first disciples. It grew larger when gentiles were allowed to become part of the BOC.
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#262
Jul 3, 2015
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#262
Guojing said:
If you agree the Body of Christ has not replaced Israel, why do you insist that the New Covenant, that was explicitly stated to be cut with Israel in Hebrews 8:8, is also cut with us?
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Christ was purposed from before the foundation of the world to be the Savior of all who believe by grace through faith. Failing to grasp that, one must wonder: what is it about Christianity you do understand?
 
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Guojing

Banned
#263
Jan 12, 2019
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#263
Magenta said:
Christ was purposed from before the foundation of the world to be the Savior of all who believe by grace through faith. Failing to grasp that, one must wonder: what is it about Christianity you do understand?
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Does what you say implies we are under the New Covenant in Hebrews 8:8?
 
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Guojing

Banned
#264
Jan 12, 2019
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#264
ewq1938 said:
When it was revealed is irrelevant, When did the body first form is the relevant question. It was formed by the first disciples. It grew larger when gentiles were allowed to become part of the BOC.
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Alright then, we can agree to disagree here.
 
ewq1938

ewq1938

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#267
Oct 18, 2018
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#267
Guojing said:
Of course, we are always the protagonist in our own minds remember? ;)
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This is just avoidance. You wrongly claim the BOC is separate from Israel but Paul writes Israel (Jews) and Gentiles (non-Jews) are the BOC.

You are also wrong to claim the BOC does not partake of the new covenant.
 
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Guojing

Banned
#268
Jan 12, 2019
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#268
ewq1938 said:
This is just avoidance. You wrongly claim the BOC is separate from Israel but Paul writes Israel (Jews) and Gentiles (non-Jews) are the BOC.
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Romans 10:1

Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved.

Try replacing the bolded term with BOC and see whether it still makes sense to you
 
ewq1938

ewq1938

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#269
Oct 18, 2018
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#269
Guojing said:
Romans 10:1

Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved.

Try replacing the bolded term with BOC and see whether it still makes sense to you
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He is speaking of faithless Israel, not those who accept Christ and are in the BOC. Never confuse non-believers with believers.
 
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Guojing

Banned
#270
Jan 12, 2019
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#270
ewq1938 said:
He is speaking of faithless Israel, not those who accept Christ and are in the BOC. Never confuse non-believers with believers.
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But you do agree that Israel is not equivalent to the Body of Christ, at least not in that verse right?
 
ewq1938

ewq1938

Well-known member
#271
Oct 18, 2018
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#271
Guojing said:
But you do agree that Israel is not equivalent to the Body of Christ, at least not in that verse right?
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There is true Israel, and faithless Israel. It is unwise to confuse the two. True Israel was the first to become the BOC.
 
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Guojing

Banned
#272
Jan 12, 2019
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#272
ewq1938 said:
There is true Israel, and faithless Israel. It is unwise to confuse the two. True Israel was the first to become the BOC.
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This common method of yours, that I have encountered numerous times, makes your argument a tautological one.

Whenever it suits your purpose, you can deemed the term "Israel" stated in Scripture, to be either true Israel, or faithless Israel.

That is why, in the end, wiser to just agree to disagree.
 
ewq1938

ewq1938

Well-known member
#273
Oct 18, 2018
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#273
Guojing said:
This common method of yours, that I have encountered numerous times, makes your argument a tautological one.

Whenever it suits your purpose, you can deemed the term "Israel" stated in Scripture, to be either true Israel, or faithless Israel.
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Obviously the Israel Paul wrote of in the last scripture you referenced was the unsaved, non-Christian Israel. That is not established by simply deciding it based on "when it suits your purpose".
 
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Guojing

Banned
#274
Jan 12, 2019
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#274
ewq1938 said:
Obviously the Israel Paul wrote of in the last scripture you referenced was the unsaved, non-Christian Israel. That is not established by simply deciding it based on "when it suits your purpose".
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It is obvious to you because you are the protagonist, remember? ;)
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#275
Jul 3, 2015
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#275
Guojing said:
Does what you say implies we are under the New Covenant in Hebrews 8:8?
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Hebrews is quoting Jeremiah predicting the NC. Do you deny Jesus was purposed from before the foundation of the world to be the Savior of all who would believe by grace through faith is His shed righteous blood for the remission of sin that we might be reconciled to God?
 
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Guojing

Banned
#276
Jan 12, 2019
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#276
Magenta said:
Hebrews is quoting Jeremiah predicting the NC. Do you deny Jesus was purposed from before the foundation of the world to be the Savior of all who would believe by grace through faith is His shed righteous blood for the remission of sin that we might be reconciled to God?
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Yes, the cross is where we are reconciled with God, no one is denying that.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#277
#277
ewq1938 said:
No, that's wrong.

Israel is the body of Christ. Gentiles that believe in Christ join that body.
Israel is the Church. Gentiles that believe in Christ join that Church.
Israel is the Bride of Christ. Gentiles that believe in Christ join that Bride.
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Where do you get this?

and where would abraham Noah and other pre Israel believers fits. Since there was no Israel?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#278
#278
ewq1938 said:
According to the bible. Don't you understand the gospel went to Israel first and the first disciples were Jewish? That was the beginning of the body of Christ, Jews of Israel. Gentiles did not join that body of Christ until later.

Your theology that Israel and the body of Christ are separate groups is non-biblical.
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Actually there was a Roman family (gentile) who also received the gospel,

but yes, in Gods plan it did go to Israel first, then Samaria then the ends of the earth
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#279
#279
Guojing said:
The Body of Christ was a secret, a mystery that was hidden in God, only to be revealed to the apostle Paul later on (Ephesians 3:9).

So I could say yours is unbiblical as well, but then again, we are always the protagonist in our own minds.
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Actually Christ as the suffering servant was the mystery. The body of Christ was no mystery, the Oat speaks of the word going to gentiles as shown in a post above
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#280
#280
ewq1938 said:
That doesn't change that the first disciples were Jewish and were the first to form the body of Christ and that Gentiles joined the BOC later.
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Again, I point you to Cornelius in acts 10.
 
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