Speaking in tongues

garee · Jan 29, 2019

CS1 said:

Hi thanks for reply

No one is saying Jesus does not literally do things as a work of His faithfulness .

Eternal healing is substance of the gospel. Temporal healing is a sign to show a person has the eternal work of the gospel that raises us from eternal; damnation to eternal life. God using different kind of healing specifically designed to show certain aspect . Like the healing of the blind used as a parable to represent we are given the spiritual insight . or the lame to represent those who could not walk by faith, prior to God opening the eyes of our heart, by which we can see.

It I believe would depend on what kind of hermeneutics a person used to uncover the mysteries of God . As in; "how can we hear God not seen.... rather than men seen"?

You suggest I stop allegorizing the word of God but yet he informs us without parables he spoke not to the multitude (any person) Hiding the spiritual unseen understanding from those who do not mix faith in what they do hear or see( .the literalist) there is no warning that we must literalize the spiritual things of God . Not sure where that idea cam from?

Matthew 13:34All these things spake Jesus unto the multitude in parables; and without a parable spake he not unto them:

Mark 4:11And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables:

When looking at those parables where God uses the temporal to show the gospel was received we need to use all the tools he has given us to rightly divide. .

While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.2 Corinthian 4: 18

I would think you need to stop literalizing everything .You could be missing out on some blessings.

I have not read any John Bunyan?

Noose · Jan 29, 2019

presidente said:

Mark 16:…17And these signs will accompany those who believe: In My name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues; 18they will pick up snakes with their hands, and if they drink any deadly poison, it will not harm them; they will lay their hands on the sick, and they will be made well.”

Kindly read a bible before responding.

Dino246 · Jan 29, 2019

Noose said:

Do you talk to your pastor like this? Or do you just snipe from behind your computer? There's no good reason for it.

Noose · Jan 29, 2019

Dino246 said:

I do not have a pastor. Pastoring ceased too.

CS1 · Jan 29, 2019

Huihui said:

this is a very serious disease. my father -law has this and was about to die. God spared his life and he is doing much better at 85. His birthday was the 28 of Dec. The Doctors said he would not walk again. yesterday he took 12 steps. If that is not a miracle and not praiseworthy I don't know what is. I thank God for his healing.

CS1 · Jan 29, 2019

Noose said:

lol

CS1 · Jan 29, 2019

Dino246 said:

he does have a pastor because he knows more than they do and more the God too. you and I are substandard to his liking.

CS1 · Jan 29, 2019

garee said:

Hi thanks for reply

No one is saying Jesus does not literally do things as a work of His faithfulness .

Eternal healing is substance of the gospel. Temporal healing is a sign to show a person has the eternal work of the gospel that raises us from eternal; damnation to eternal life. God using different kind of healing specifically designed to show certain aspect . Like the healing of the blind used as a parable to represent we are given the spiritual insight . or the lame to represent those who could not walk by faith, prior to God opening the eyes of our heart, by which we can see.

It I believe would depend on what kind of hermeneutics a person used to uncover the mysteries of God . As in; "how can we hear God not seen.... rather than men seen"?

You suggest I stop allegorizing the word of God but yet he informs us without parables he spoke not to the multitude (any person) Hiding the spiritual unseen understanding from those who do not mix faith in what they do hear or see( .the literalist) there is no warning that we must literalize the spiritual things of God . Not sure where that idea cam from?

Matthew 13:34All these things spake Jesus unto the multitude in parables; and without a parable spake he not unto them:

Mark 4:11And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables:

When looking at those parables where God uses the temporal to show the gospel was received we need to use all the tools he has given us to rightly divide. .

While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.2 Corinthian 4: 18

I would think you need to stop literalizing everything .You could be missing out on some blessings.

I have not read any John Bunyan?

you don't understand hermeneutics or what is an application. You firs must understand the authorial intent. Then you must look at the context or "circle of contextual meaning" from 1. the verse 2. the paragraph 3. the Chapter 4. book 5. the whole Bible. Clearly, you do not do that.

Huihui · Jan 29, 2019

CS1 said:

this is a very serious disease. my father -law has this and was about to die. God spared his life and he is doing much better at 85. His birthday was the 28 of Dec. The Doctors said he would not walk again. yesterday he took 12 steps. If that is not a miracle and not praiseworthy I don't know what is. I thank God for his healing.

Awesome, Thank God

Dino246 · Jan 29, 2019

Noose said:

Then go read Galatians 5 and consider whether the attitude you exhibited in that post is consistent with the flesh, or with the Spirit.

garee · Jan 29, 2019

CS1 said:

I can understand why you might feel that way. It seems from my perspective that there are many who literalize and do not search out the unseen spiritual application or if I could say a another level that can reveal the mysteries hid .
]
I am trusting that without parables Christ spoke not hiding the spiritual meaning from those who do not search out the understanding.

By looking to a hidden understanding it does not take away from "circle of contextual meaning" But it adds to it by which we can seek out the gospel meaning. Using tools like 2 Corinthians 4:18' I would suggest the gospel thread is woven through the scriptures. I am simply pointing out another view point

Mark 4:10-12 King James Version (KJV)And when he was alone, they that were about him with the twelve asked of him the parable.
And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables That seeing they may see, and not perceive; and hearing they may hear, and not understand; lest at any time they should be converted, and their sins should be forgiven them.

There are many historically true events used as parables. One today I would offer which seems to be handled very carefully almost not spoken of for some reason or other. This is the parable using the flesh of the unbelieving Jews that gathered themselves together to demand that God give them a King as a outward representative to lord it over of the people. It came about because of their jealousy of the surrounding Pagan nations. Samael the last Judge as a prophet at first thought it was him they were rejecting king to lord it over the people . But God said it was him they were rejecting a invisible King of reigning over them. They refused to walk by faith, the unseen eternal. God not seen God gave them over temporally till the time of reformation. that whole time period was used as a parable. Historically

1 Samuel 8:1- King James Version (KJV) And it came to pass, when Samuel was old, that he made his sons judges over Israel. Now the name of his firstborn was Joel; and the name of his second, Abiah: they were judges in Beersheba. And his sons walked not in his ways, but turned aside after lucre, and took bribes, and perverted judgment. Then all the elders of Israel gathered themselves together, and came to Samuel unto Ramah, And said unto him, Behold, thou art old, and thy sons walk not in thy ways: now make us a king to judge us like all the nations. But the thing displeased Samuel, when they said, Give us a king to judge us. And Samuel prayed unto the Lord. And the Lord said unto Samuel, Hearken unto the voice of the people in all that they say unto thee: for they have not rejected thee, but they have rejected me, that I should not reign over them. 8 According to all the works which they have done since the day that I brought them up out of Egypt even unto this day, wherewith they have forsaken me, and served other gods, so do they also unto thee.Now therefore hearken unto their voice: howbeit yet protest solemnly unto them, and shew them the manner of the king that shall reign over them.

Giving them over temporally to do that which they should not of unto the time of reformation.

The Holy Ghost this "signifying". Signifying the language of parables called a figure .

The Holy Ghost this signifying, that the way into the holiest of all was not yet made manifest, while as the first tabernacle was yet standing: Which was a figure "for the time then present", in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience; Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.

Again there are many example signifying a particular time period using a parable to reveal the gospel . The exodus from Egypt is used in many places as another historically accurate parable . or Moses striking the rock . The brining of manna another, parables using the signified language used in mysteries. Or the historically parable of Jonas which speaks of the work of the cross, in respect to the suffering of Christ beforehand .

Every cerinimoinal law is used as a figure or parable in the way .Every piece of furniture in the temple like the veil representing the flesh of Christ has a spiritual understanding that must be comparing to the spiritual or faith to faith.

Natural man does not search out the spiritual meaning in Parable .The mysteries of God remain mysteries (un-solved parables) The idea of comparing spiritual things with spiritual has no value to those who walk by sight as those who literalize.

But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him. But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God. For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God. Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. 1 Corinthians 2:10-14.

garee · Jan 29, 2019

Dino246 said:

I would think consistent with the Spirit. Remembering the time of reformation has come.

Not that pastoring is not needed when many families gather together to help keep order . They simply do not lord it over the flock as when there was a temporal outward fleshly representative as before the reformation.. The period is restored to the era of judges the kind of government when men walked by faith (the unseen).

In the same way that we do not wrestles against flesh and blood(the things seen) The same applies that we are not supported by looking at the things seen . its the un-seen Spirit that brings us consistency.
.

Dino246 · Jan 29, 2019

garee said:

Garee, there's one massive flaw in your reasoning here: you aren't discussing these things with nonbelievers! You aren't the only "spiritual man" in the room! Everyone here who has trusted in Christ for salvation has the Spirit of God teaching us the truth. The truth of the parables are hidden from the natural man, not from the believer!

Take the Scripture at face value. If the Spirit happens to reveal something further to you, that's great, but don't be disregarding the meaning of the surface text for some "hidden parable", lest you be led astray by another gospel. The plain ("literal") text does have important meaning for the reader, so don't assume that those who discuss the plain meaning are somehow "natural, unconverted men".

garee · Jan 29, 2019

Dino246 said:

I am not making any claim of the only "spiritual man" in the room!

The truth of the parables are hidden from the natural man, not from the believer! Take the parables as the hidden spiritual understanding. Don't scrape the surface and literalize the signified language as in some who say... first sense makes all the sense. No need to go any further .

The plain ("literal") text does have important meaning for the reader but if we search for the hidden manna, the gospel appears.

Dino246 · Jan 29, 2019

garee said:

You may not overtly claim it, but you act like that's what you believe when you continually quote verses about "an unbelieving generation asks for a sign" (etc.) and thereby imply that those who disagree with you are faithless. You don't seem to understand the position of those with whom you so vigorously disagree.

garee said:

Where has anyone suggested that we should "just scrape the surface"? Where has anyone claimed that "the first sense makes all the sense"? When you make ridiculous parodies of others' positions and then attack those parodies, you're engaging in fallacious reasoning. Engage with what is actually posted here, please.

garee said:

No, Garee. We already have the gospel in the plain text. We have believed it. What gospel have you believed?

Noose · Jan 29, 2019

Dino246 said:

Gal 5 - Law vs Grace, Your point?
My attitude is just fine.

notuptome · Jan 30, 2019

CS1 said:

Much is attributed to the "Pentecostal experience" that is obviously not biblical nor does it even remotely similar to what was present in the apostolic church.

CS1 said:

You make a common mistake. Healing was to validate the authority of the prophet, apostle or disciple who was speaking the word of God to the audience present. The gospel presented in the bible is that God had sent His Redeemer into the world to redeem Israel and the whole world from their sins. Israel was promised a Redeemer and Christ was that Redeemer sent from the Father to redeem the people from their sins.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Dino246 · Jan 30, 2019

Noose said:

No, Noose; Galatians 5:16-26, the fruit of the flesh versus the fruit of the Spirit.

Noose · Jan 30, 2019

Dino246 said:

On what basis do you judge me to have exhibited the fruit of the flesh rather than spirit?

Dino246 · Jan 30, 2019

Noose said:

I'm not your judge, but I call what I see. You are capable of tracing back through the conversation.

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