-The Bride-

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Precious_Sunflower

Guest
#1
Hi everyone! :)

Me and my husband we know of a Messianic Jew that whenever we meet with him we always have a lot of interesting talks, especially about the bible. And he told us something I find as interesting to thinking about it. As he meant that "the bride" is meant being Israel, basically this means "the jews" who beleive in Christ Jesus.

And he also mentioned that Jesus also talked about that during the Lord's wedding, a lot of His guests didn't come, and then He chose to go and look for other guests that wanted to join in His wedding.

Our friend said that the other guests are everyone else that chose for Christ's salvation later. Not the jews, but all others that came to faith in Christ Jesus as well.


What do you think?
 
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kenisyes

Guest
#2
I disagree. The guests, Jews or Gentiles need an invitation. The Bride does not need an invitation, as her place is reserved at the party.
 
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Precious_Sunflower

Guest
#3
Yeah, but Israel will never need an invitation from God. ;) And Israel is also often refered as the jews, the chosen ones of God. In the bible it wasn't only seen as a country the way we see it today. Israel was and is God's people too. :)

Same as we see the church, the church in it's self is not a building, it is the people.

As the guests, they need invitations to come to a celebration.
 
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peterT

Guest
#4
Hi everyone! :)

Me and my husband we know of a Messianic Jew that whenever we meet with him we always have a lot of interesting talks, especially about the bible. And he told us something I find as interesting to thinking about it. As he meant that "the bride" is meant being Israel, basically this means "the jews" who beleive in Christ Jesus.

And he also mentioned that Jesus also talked about that during the Lord's wedding, a lot of His guests didn't come, and then He chose to go and look for other guests that wanted to join in His wedding.

Our friend said that the other guests are everyone else that chose for Christ's salvation later. Not the jews, but all others that came to faith in Christ Jesus as well.


What do you think?
There is NO Jew or Greek in Christ Jesus nor any other race in Christ Jesus.

Galatians 3: 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Colossians 3:11 Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.

Acts 17:26 And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;


There is only one blood of ALL nations of men on the face of the earth

And we are his people, we are the sheep of his pasture.

And we are the bride of Christ.

A holy nation a chosen generation

1 Peter 2: 9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:

10 Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy.
 
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SPUZIT

Guest
#5
My family given Nick name is sputz, I Miss, spelled in singing in & cannot fix, it means to Help repair & restore. I am also a Jewis, yes jewis it means female Jew.so as a Jew & a Christian with some Lutheran background, I can feel. Confident to say, not one race is automatically saved, all are dead unless repentance. From christ is excepted not as a whole community or race, yet as each individual person submitted to God thru Christs death for our sins on the cross. God created each person uniquely, & again as individuals. If God created each one of us individualy why do we keep trying to mess with what he has made. Beleave me I wish it so simple as living eternaly just because you were born from a specific race of peoples from old times or not we are all held accountable individualy. Keep on chatting though my words & views are not law, but be careful gods words are. When will we harmonize within his word instead of having snowball fights with a verse thrown here & there at eachother.
 

Shilo

Senior Member
Aug 31, 2011
1,974
102
63
#6
This is My understanding through teachings I have studied
To be part of Israel you do not have to be a Jew

Romans 9:6 It is not as though God's word had failed. For not all who are descended from Israel are Israel
Romans 3:22 This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference,
Galatians 3:28There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus
1 Corinthians 12:13 For we were all baptized by one Spirit into one body--whether Jews or Greeks, slave or free--and we were all given the one Spirit to drink.
Romans 11:17 If some of the branches have been broken off, and you, though a wild olive shoot, have been grafted in among the others and now share in the nourishing sap from the olive root
Israel is both Jew and non-Jewish

I hope you understand what I am saying here I do not want an argument.

The Bride comes out of the body
Genusis 2 the Lord God caused the man to fall into a deep sleep; and while he was sleeping, he took one of the man’s ribs ( picture of the Bride) and then closed up the place with flesh. 22 Then the Lord God made a woman from the rib he had taken out of the man, and he brought her to the man.

John 19:34 One of the soldiers, however, pierced his side with a spear,( picture of the Bride) and immediately blood and water flowed out

Acts 12 Suddenly an angel of the Lord appeared and a light shone in the cell. He struck Peter on the side and woke him up. ( Picture of the Bride) “Quick, get up!” he said, and the chains fell off Peter’s wrists.

Romans 12:5 in Christ we who are many form one body, and each member belongs to all the others.

1 Corinthians 6:15 Do you not know that your bodies are members of Christ himself? Shall I then take the members of Christ and unite them with a prostitute? Never

1 Corinthians 12:20 As it is, there are many parts, but one body.

When you look at it this way The bride will come out of the Body of Yeshua. Every member of the church who is a believer is a member of the body of Yeshua. It is out of this Body ( the Church ) that the bride will come out.
The Bride is the first fruit taken from the earth. She is made up of the people who

Revelation 19:7 Let us rejoice and be glad and give him glory! For the wedding of the Lamb has come, and his bride has made herself ready.

2 Timothy 2:15 15 Study to show yourself approved unto God, a workman that need not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth
Matthew 25 The Parable of the Ten Virgins. 10 is the number of community . This is a picture of the separation of the bride from the body ( Church.)

Malachi 3 16 Then those who feared the Lord talked with each other, and the Lord listened and heard. A scroll of remembrance was written in his presence concerning those who feared the Lord and honored his name. In the day when I act,” says the Lord Almighty, “they will be my treasured possession.(I will spare them, just as a father has compassion and spares his son who serves him. 18 And you will again see the distinction between the righteous and the wicked, between those who serve God and those who do not.

Revelation 3 since you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come on the whole world to test the inhabitants of the earth.

Luke 12:36 like men waiting for their master to return from a wedding banquet, so that when he comes and knocks they can immediately open the door for him

Luke 12:35 "Be dressed ready for service and keep your lamps burning

Revelation 3:20 Here I am! I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in and eat with him, and he with me.

Picture of the body ( Church) of Yeshua that is not the Bride

Revelation 3:18 counsel you to buy from me gold refined in the fire, so you can become rich; and white clothes to wear, so you can cover your shameful nakedness; and salve to put on your eyes, so you can see
 
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Nike

Guest
#7
I believe that the bride is the church, Jews and non-Jews as long as they love God and believe that Jesus Christ is the Savior.

About the invitation, I think it talks about slightly different thing. Jesus was preaching to the Jews but not very many of them came to the faith in Him, they rejected Him. Therefore, the disciples were also sent out to preach the gospel to the Gentiles and make them His follower.
 
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wwjd_kilden

Guest
#8
Agree with PeterT. In the jews of the OT were God's chosen people. Now all who want to follow Christ share in that gift
 
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BarlyGurl

Guest
#9
Replacement theology argument to come.... please stand by.
 

loveme1

Senior Member
Oct 30, 2011
8,087
190
63
#10
The Almighty works in wonderful ways indeed.

His ways do not fail.

Let us be humble of our place and not consider ourselves a replacement but of those that rsvp'd the invitation ahead of others who have yet to rsvp... but will.



Romans 11

I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin. 2God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel, saying, 3Lord, they have killed thy prophets, and digged down thine altars; and I am left alone, and they seek my life. 4But what saith the answer of God unto him? I have reserved to myself seven thousand men, who have not bowed the knee to the image of Baal. 5Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace. 6And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.
7What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded

8(According as it is written, God hath given them the spirit of slumber, eyes that they should not see, and ears that they should not hear) unto this day.

9And David saith, Let their table be made a snare, and a trap, and a stumblingblock, and a recompence unto them:

10Let their eyes be darkened, that they may not see, and bow down their back alway.

11I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy. 12Now if the fall of them be the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness? 13For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office: 14If by any means I may provoke to emulation them which are my flesh, and might save some of them. 15For if the casting away of them be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be, but life from the dead? 16For if the firstfruit be holy, the lump is also holy: and if the root be holy, so are the branches.

17And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree; 18Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee. 19Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be graffed in. 20Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: 21For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee. 22Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off. 23And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again. 24For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be graffed into their own olive tree?

25For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

26And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

27For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

28As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes. 29For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance. 30For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief: 31Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy. 32For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

33O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out! 34For who hath known the mind of the Lord? or who hath been his counseller? 35Or who hath first given to him, and it shall be recompensed unto him again? 36For of him, and through him, and to him, are all things: to whom be glory for ever. Amen.
 
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kenisyes

Guest
#11
Yeah, but Israel will never need an invitation from God. ;) And Israel is also often refered as the jews, the chosen ones of God. In the bible it wasn't only seen as a country the way we see it today. Israel was and is God's people too. :)

Same as we see the church, the church in it's self is not a building, it is the people.

As the guests, they need invitations to come to a celebration.
Israel was invited at Sinai. The Jews say God appeared to each person individually. Also the Jews interpret Deut. 33:2 that other nations received the invitation first and refused.

Most Christians consider that they are invited when they are saved.

The book of revelation separates the Church into four parts: elders (ch. 5), the sealed (ch. 14), the victorious (ch. 15), and the redeemed (ch. 19). Which are the bride?
 
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Precious_Sunflower

Guest
#12
Thank you all for your input. I have just read it all through. ;) :)

Shilo, no worries about wanting any argument out from what you shared. I dislike to argue about such matters, it never brings out anything good when having a discussion or sharing about something. One should remain in peace with one another when opening up for discussion, as well as sharing and correcting with Christ's love in mind. I also understood everything you shared, so no need to worry.


It is mostly a thought given, as well as I do not think he meant saying all of Israel would become saved whether they choose to beleive or not. In his point I beleive it was more meant those who chooses to beleive in Jesus Christ as their Saviour. When he talked about the guests, they were meant for everyone else who received Salvation by also choosing to beleive in Jesus Christ as their Saviour, not about random heathens. But about all the other beleivers in Christ. It is mostly an interesting thought though, I think.

Although I do agree that we all cherish Salvation now and for God we are all equally loved as much, still I do also want to beleive that Israel and the jews still are a very special people for God. "They are the eye of His apple".
 

Bookends

Senior Member
Aug 28, 2012
4,225
99
48
#13
Israel was invited at Sinai. The Jews say God appeared to each person individually. Also the Jews interpret Deut. 33:2 that other nations received the invitation first and refused.

Most Christians consider that they are invited when they are saved.

The book of revelation separates the Church into four parts: elders (ch. 5), the sealed (ch. 14), the victorious (ch. 15), and the redeemed (ch. 19). Which are the bride?
All the parts make up the body, the universal Church. The universal church are those who adhere to essential Christian doctrine both in the OT and NT. If you are in Christ, you are sealed, if you are in Christ you are victorious because Christ is victorious, if you are in Christ, you are redeemed and if you are redeemed you are of the bride, the Church.
 

Bookends

Senior Member
Aug 28, 2012
4,225
99
48
#14
There is NO Jew or Greek in Christ Jesus nor any other race in Christ Jesus.

Galatians 3: 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Colossians 3:11 Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.

Acts 17:26 And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;


There is only one blood of ALL nations of men on the face of the earth

And we are his people, we are the sheep of his pasture.

And we are the bride of Christ.

A holy nation a chosen generation

1 Peter 2: 9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:

10 Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy.

I thought you where in the Pre-trib/pre-mill camp Peter? May ask and I hate to put labels on people, what exactly are you beliefs because most PT/PM believe God has a separate plan for the natural physical Jew.
 

Shilo

Senior Member
Aug 31, 2011
1,974
102
63
#15
Romans 11 As far as the gospel is concerned, they are enemies for your sake; but as far as election is concerned, they are loved on account of the patriarchs, 29 for God’s gifts and his call are irrevocable
Romans 3 What advantage, then, is there in being a Jew, or what value is there in circumcision? 2 Much in every way! First of all, the Jews have been entrusted with the very words of God

Romans 11 have they stumbled that they should fall? Certainly not! But through their fall, to provoke them to jealousy, salvation has come to the Gentiles. 12 Now if their fall is riches for the world, and their failure riches for the Gentiles, how much more their fullness!
13 For I speak to you Gentiles; inasmuch as I am an apostle to the Gentiles, I magnify my ministry, 14 if by any means I may provoke to jealousy those who are my flesh and save some of them. 15 For if their being cast away is the reconciling of the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead?
Hannukah
Acts 1:8 But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes on you; and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth."

On Hannukah you take the middle candle that is Yeshua and you use that candle to light all the other candles one each day. This is so precious because you light the candle on the right of the menorah first . This is the Jerusalem candle.

When I think on this this verse comes to mind. Is 49 15 “Can a woman forget her nursing child, And not have compassion on the son of her womb? Surely they may forget, Yet I will not forget you. 16 See, I have inscribed you on the palms of My hands; Your walls are continually before Me. He has not forgotten them and they are the Bride of choice. It is the story of Leah and Rachel. Jacob (picture of Yeshua ) Loved Rachel ( picture of Jews ) so he made an agreement with her father for her hand. Laban picture of god, at this point only ) did not want to see his older daughter unmarried. He followed the law to give his older daughter to Jacob and secure her future. Jacob (Yeshua )still longed for his Rachel and did not forget her. This is just another story in a story. This is how God saved both jew and non-jew.

Ok back to Hannukah. Then the next day you light the candle to the left of the Jerusalem candle . So everyday the last candle that comes alive is Jerusalem. It is when the gospel comes full circle and the chosen beloved in Jerusalem except him as their bridegroom that he will come back. He is waiting on his beloved.
2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. He is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance

Just think on that next time you here next year in Jerusalem.
They have beautiful gifts from the Lord that are just now being opened and shared with the world.
 
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Precious_Sunflower

Guest
#16
These are very nice as well as very interesting information Shilo. Thank you a lot for sharing. :)

Also Bookends, thanks for your sharing as well.

God's Blessings!
 

Shilo

Senior Member
Aug 31, 2011
1,974
102
63
#17
Rachel ( Jews) and Leah ( gentile church )
Rachel the promised wife of Jacob ( the people of natural Israel ) She was the first promised but the last to be given.
Leah ( Gentile church ) a hidden mystery because Jacob got her under the cover of darkness.
Rachel first promised last to marry Yeshua / Jesus. This is one of the picture of the first shell be last and the last first.

Rachel (the people of natural of Israel ) were the first called to be the bride but Leah came first.
So natural Israel is the first and the last called but we all are part of Spirit Israel.
 
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kenisyes

Guest
#18
All the parts make up the body, the universal Church. The universal church are those who adhere to essential Christian doctrine both in the OT and NT. If you are in Christ, you are sealed, if you are in Christ you are victorious because Christ is victorious, if you are in Christ, you are redeemed and if you are redeemed you are of the bride, the Church.
Then there are no guests at the wedding?
 
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peterT

Guest
#19
I thought you where in the Pre-trib/pre-mill camp Peter? May ask and I hate to put labels on people, what exactly are you beliefs because most PT/PM believe God has a separate plan for the natural physical Jew.
This is what I believe

1 John 2:23 Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: (but) he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.

Acts 3:22 For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you.
23 And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people.

John 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

John 3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

Luke 16:31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

the Jews are just like anybody else they need to repent and believe on him who he has sent, the lord jesus.

We should stop putting the Jews on a pedestal and puffing them up, and give them a chance to humble themselves.

we are never going to lead a Jew to the lord if we keep telling them we Christians are going to be grafted into them, because Jesus is the vine and we all can be grafted into him.

John15:1 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.

4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.

5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
 

Bookends

Senior Member
Aug 28, 2012
4,225
99
48
#20
Then there are no guests at the wedding?
It is of my opinion that the guests are individuals that belong to God through out history, and the bride is the institution of, or the whole assembly of the church of God. They are same group of people. Two different terms describing our relationship with our Father in Heaven.

Or you could say the guests are those who accept the invitation, thus entering into the bride.
 
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