The end of the world is coming. What should we be looking for?

[abcdef]

This is just my point. What does the single word, "soon" (or any variation of it your translation might use) mean? Even in the original Greek, there is no way you can stretch it to mean, "2,000 years from now." Yet this is exactly what you guys are swallowing, then you are basing all sorts of wild speculations upon that change you have accepted. Read the word for what it is, and deal with the facts as the book states them.

It may be, that the 7 seals are meant to be a recognition of the fulfillment of prophecies, made in the OT, concerning the dest of Jeru., such as Ezek 5. Note the similarity of vs 16-17 to the 1st 4 seals (horsemen).



And there is a day of the Lord against Jerusalem, Peter tells us that it was beginning on the day of Pentecost, that it was the 1st sign of many, Acts 2:16-21.


Jesus sets the time of the 6th seal, as the dest in 70 AD by His words to the women of Jerusalem on the way to the cross Lk 23:28-30,30- Rev 6:16. This prophecy could ONLY have been fulfilled during the lifetime of the women and children of Jerusalem of that time.

 

[stonesoffire]

If Revelation is the unveiling of Jesus, Messiah, should that not be how we study it? With looking as to how this speaks of Him?

And I haven't yet been able to do this with some of it.

But, I did see that "seals" has to do with opening the Bible. If you don't agree, look at this in the greek.

Opening as in the revelation of what is written, unveiled Christ.

 

[PennEd]

As I have said numerous times, no "proof" comes from squirting out a verse here and there on a forum page that each of us interprets in our own ways.

I have "proof in the forms of more text than this place permits posting, and could provide it to any of you to research on your own. But, there is no point, since it's a sure bet none of you will spend the time necessary to "truly" read any of it. (One of them, BTW, is the best and most comprehensive commentary on The apocalypse that I believe has ever been written...... even though I largely disagree with the author's theology.)

Do you guys actually think that a 72 year-old man who has more time in some of the most serious Bible College study than most people have sitting on the toilet would actually just invent this stuff? I was inculcated with all the same things most of you absorbed. I was convinced there is going to be a surprise secret Rapture. I was also taught, for decades, that Revelation was written between 94-96AD..... and that the book was solidly about The End of The Physical World. I had not one doubt about it. Like you, I KNEW. I believed it all just as you do.... maybe more. And I argued with people about it for years.

Then God opened my eyes. I think He presented me with the question as to whether or not I had the guts to walk relatively in charted wastelands and look at the things others saw. Frankly, for a few years, I did not have the nerve. I WOULD NOT dare to look for anything other than what I had been so diligently taught. Then one day, I risked a step or two out of the "safety of the boat of the majority" because Jesus called me to walk the waves of disruption disturbance that were Jesus' whole life on earth.

This issue is becoming quite the obsession for you.

You accuse others of not desiring to read your stuff on YOUR take of Rev. or a literal view of Scripture, yet you do the exact same thing!

YOU are NOT the only one who has studied Scripture!

I am solidly convinced you are completely wrong on your interpretation. What's more, I think your view is dangerous, yet I allow for the possibility that I'm wrong.

You give no such quarter.

Can we hear you say that you might be wrong? Without a bunch of qualifications?

It would do us all good to see everyone show a little humility.

 

[stonesoffire]

It may be, that the 7 seals are meant to be a recognition of the fulfillment of prophecies, made in the OT, concerning the dest of Jeru., such as Ezek 5. Note the similarity of vs 16-17 to the 1st 4 seals (horsemen).



And there is a day of the Lord against Jerusalem, Peter tells us that it was beginning on the day of Pentecost, that it was the 1st sign of many, Acts 2:16-21.


Jesus sets the time of the 6th seal, as the dest in 70 AD by His words to the women of Jerusalem on the way to the cross Lk 23:28-30,30- Rev 6:16. This prophecy could ONLY have been fulfilled during the lifetime of the women and children of Jerusalem of that time.

maybe, maybe not.

 

[prove-all]

There is no end of the world, only a end of the age which came in the generation that heard Jesus speak.

Mat 24:34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

Biblical prophecy is clear that our present civilization is about to be replaced by a far
better world. Though today’s cities will be destroyed (ex. Ezekiel 6:6; 12:20),

"Thy Kingdom come" The Good news of the comming Kingdom of God to earth.
After human misrule causes great tribulation that almost wipes out civilization,
Jesus Christ will return to Earth to establish His rule. Christ will be Unwelcome.

The nations will be angry at His coming (Revelation 11:15 with 11:18), and the
military forces will actually attempt to fight Him to destroy Him! (Revelation 17:14).

The living Christ is coming as “King of kings and Lord of lords” (Revelation 19:11-21),
to put down the rebellion of warring nations (Revelation 17:14), and establish God’s
world-ruling government over all nations (Daniel 2:44; 7:9, 13-14, 18, 22, 27; Isaiah 9:7).

He went away (to heaven) to be coronated, and to return to Earth (Luke 19:12-27).
He will then be on the Earth—Zechariah 14:3-4, 1 Thessalonians 4:16 (Nahum 1:5)
“We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come;
because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned” (Revelation 11:17)

-The seventh angel sounds-Kingdoms of current world become Christs (Rev 11:15)
Will commit thy government into his hand, established with judgement and jutice.
(Isaiah 22:21) Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end,
upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom,...(Isaiah 9:7)

beginning of that rule and world government “And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them,
and judgment was given unto them…and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years”
(Revelation 20:4).(Isaiah 11:2-4) And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall
separate them one from another,...Matthew 25:32

-A Kingdom appointed to the saints , made rulers over some cities.
the glorified saints of God made perfect,cities will be ruled by spirit beings.

Jesus said: “And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will
I give power over the nations: And he shall rule them with a rod of iron…” (Rev 2:26-27).
And again, “To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne [on this Earth]”
(Revelation 3:21; Luke 1:32-33). And, “…we shall reign on the earth” (Revelation 5:10).
And I appoint unto you a kingdom, as my Father hath appointed unto me;(Luke 22:29)

Some resurrected saints will rule over 10 cities, some over five (Luke 19:12-19)
Saints shall take the kingdom, and possess the kingdom for ever, (Daniel 7:18)
We shall inherit the earth. (Psalms 25:13-22:26, 37:9, 22,29) not now flesh and blood.

-Jerusalem, the future headquarters city of the Earth (Haggai 2:6-8)
-Land Beneath Sea Reclaimed, converted to Jerusalem(Isaiah 60:5, 11:15).
World’s gold and silver reserves under the seas for beautiful decorations there.
-Gods latter house shall be greater than of the former (Haggai 2:9)
-Jerusalem is uniquely describes as being “compact together,” tall 122:3

-Desolate land shall be tilled - will be like the garden of Eden (Ezekiel 36:34-35)
-Build the waste cities-fresh produce-drink there own wine-farming (Amos 9:14)
-Waste cities “filled with flocks of men” being very social(Ezekiel 36:36-37-38)
-Superhighways between major cities (Isaiah 19:23)

-Cities being crime-free , dwell safely-none be made afried (Ezekiel 34:28-Micah 4:4)
-No more Violence, nor wasting, nor destruction (Isaiah 60:18)
-Cities overflow with prosperity (Zechariah 1:17) -Equitable property distribution
- every man shall own his vine and fig tree (Micah 4:4-Lev25) and

-“Joy and gladness-thanksgiving-the voice of melody(Isaiah 51:3)(Jeremiah 33:10-11)
-Where old men and old women dwell -full of boys and girls playing (Zechariah 8:4-5)
-No lion shall be there, nor any ravenous beast shall go up (Isaiah 35:9 )
-There will be Shepherds and local animal husbandry (Jer. 33:12)

-Pure Water—Fertile Deserts where trees grow (Isaiah 35)
-No more hunger-He will raise up a plant of renown (Ezekiel 34:29
-A new sharp threshing instrument -the mountains made small(Isaiah 41:14-16)

-If any thrist and seek water, the God of Israel will not forsake them. (ver 17-18

-Trees planted and growing-consider and understand that the [Eternal] hath
done this, and the Holy One of Israel hath created it” . (verse 19-20)

The whole earth is at rest, and is quiet: they break forth into singing. (Isaiah 14:7)

All the earth shall worship thee, and shall sing unto thee; they shall sing to thy name.
Psalms 66:4 -God has spoken it, and He is not one to go back on His word (Isaiah 55:11

those who think this Kingdom has come already are very much in for a suprise.


They Kingdom come, thy will be done on Earth...

 

[stonesoffire]

In the first verse, there is always argument about the word shortly.

But, looking at the Greek, it's saying it's a fixed time of happening, and is compared to the tachometer of a vehicle.

Look if you disagree.

 

[stonesoffire]

Biblical prophecy is clear that our present civilization is about to be replaced by a far
better world. Though today’s cities will be destroyed (ex. Ezekiel 6:6; 12:20),

"Thy Kingdom come" The Good news of the comming Kingdom of God to earth.
After human misrule causes great tribulation that almost wipes out civilization,
Jesus Christ will return to Earth to establish His rule. Christ will be Unwelcome.

The nations will be angry at His coming (Revelation 11:15 with 11:18), and the
military forces will actually attempt to fight Him to destroy Him! (Revelation 17:14).

The living Christ is coming as “King of kings and Lord of lords” (Revelation 19:11-21),
to put down the rebellion of warring nations (Revelation 17:14), and establish God’s
world-ruling government over all nations (Daniel 2:44; 7:9, 13-14, 18, 22, 27; Isaiah 9:7).

He went away (to heaven) to be coronated, and to return to Earth (Luke 19:12-27).
He will then be on the Earth—Zechariah 14:3-4, 1 Thessalonians 4:16 (Nahum 1:5)
“We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come;
because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned” (Revelation 11:17)

-The seventh angel sounds-Kingdoms of current world become Christs (Rev 11:15)
Will commit thy government into his hand, established with judgement and jutice.
(Isaiah 22:21) Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end,
upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom,...(Isaiah 9:7)

beginning of that rule and world government “And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them,
and judgment was given unto them…and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years”
(Revelation 20:4).(Isaiah 11:2-4) And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall
separate them one from another,...Matthew 25:32

-A Kingdom appointed to the saints , made rulers over some cities.
the glorified saints of God made perfect,cities will be ruled by spirit beings.

Jesus said: “And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will
I give power over the nations: And he shall rule them with a rod of iron…” (Rev 2:26-27).
And again, “To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne [on this Earth]”
(Revelation 3:21; Luke 1:32-33). And, “…we shall reign on the earth” (Revelation 5:10).
And I appoint unto you a kingdom, as my Father hath appointed unto me;(Luke 22:29)

Some resurrected saints will rule over 10 cities, some over five (Luke 19:12-19)
Saints shall take the kingdom, and possess the kingdom for ever, (Daniel 7:18)
We shall inherit the earth. (Psalms 25:13-22:26, 37:9, 22,29) not now flesh and blood.

-Jerusalem, the future headquarters city of the Earth (Haggai 2:6-8)
-Land Beneath Sea Reclaimed, converted to Jerusalem(Isaiah 60:5, 11:15).
World’s gold and silver reserves under the seas for beautiful decorations there.
-Gods latter house shall be greater than of the former (Haggai 2:9)
-Jerusalem is uniquely describes as being “compact together,” tall 122:3

-Desolate land shall be tilled - will be like the garden of Eden (Ezekiel 36:34-35)
-Build the waste cities-fresh produce-drink there own wine-farming (Amos 9:14)
-Waste cities “filled with flocks of men” being very social(Ezekiel 36:36-37-38)
-Superhighways between major cities (Isaiah 19:23)

-Cities being crime-free , dwell safely-none be made afried (Ezekiel 34:28-Micah 4:4)
-No more Violence, nor wasting, nor destruction (Isaiah 60:18)
-Cities overflow with prosperity (Zechariah 1:17) -Equitable property distribution
- every man shall own his vine and fig tree (Micah 4:4-Lev25) and

-“Joy and gladness-thanksgiving-the voice of melody(Isaiah 51:3)(Jeremiah 33:10-11)
-Where old men and old women dwell -full of boys and girls playing (Zechariah 8:4-5)
-No lion shall be there, nor any ravenous beast shall go up (Isaiah 35:9 )
-There will be Shepherds and local animal husbandry (Jer. 33:12)

-Pure Water—Fertile Deserts where trees grow (Isaiah 35)
-No more hunger-He will raise up a plant of renown (Ezekiel 34:29
-A new sharp threshing instrument -the mountains made small(Isaiah 41:14-16)

-If any thrist and seek water, the God of Israel will not forsake them. (ver 17-18

-Trees planted and growing-consider and understand that the [Eternal] hath
done this, and the Holy One of Israel hath created it” . (verse 19-20)

The whole earth is at rest, and is quiet: they break forth into singing. (Isaiah 14:7)

All the earth shall worship thee, and shall sing unto thee; they shall sing to thy name.
Psalms 66:4 -God has spoken it, and He is not one to go back on His word (Isaiah 55:11

those who think this Kingdom has come already are very much in for a suprise.


They Kingdom come, thy will be done on Earth...

The only problem I have with your interpretation, is that the Kingdom of God has already come to "earth". It's within us, and we are Spirit, and dust.

So, interpretation of a symbolic book should be based on the symbols found in scripture, should it not?

 

[Willie-T]

This issue is becoming quite the obsession for you.

You accuse others of not desiring to read your stuff on YOUR take of Rev. or a literal view of Scripture, yet you do the exact same thing!

YOU are NOT the only one who has studied Scripture!

I am solidly convinced you are completely wrong on your interpretation. What's more, I think your view is dangerous, yet I allow for the possibility that I'm wrong.

You give no such quarter.

Can we hear you say that you might be wrong? Without a bunch of qualifications?

It would do us all good to see everyone show a little humility.

Are you deaf, Ed? I just got finished telling you I believed all that End of The World/Rapture stuff for decades....... for longer than you have been alive. I just get irritated that people (perhaps like you) think I never heard of Jesus before someone told me the things I speak of.

 

[Willie-T]

This issue is becoming quite the obsession for you.

You accuse others of not desiring to read your stuff on YOUR take of Rev. or a literal view of Scripture, yet you do the exact same thing!

YOU are NOT the only one who has studied Scripture!

I am solidly convinced you are completely wrong on your interpretation. What's more, I think your view is dangerous, yet I allow for the possibility that I'm wrong.

You give no such quarter.

Can we hear you say that you might be wrong? Without a bunch of qualifications?

It would do us all good to see everyone show a little humility.

I'll tack that belief right at the bottom of the posts that state you guys believe you could be wrong about Revelation and the Rapture.

But, see none of you can say that what I speak of might be right, either.

 

[Muzungu256]

whats the next booked date for the rapture to happen????? anyone know, what saith the rumormill, whats the word on the mean streets of churchville? i wanna plan accordingly u see.
i hope its before i finish typing this mes................

 

[prove-all]

So, interpretation of a symbolic book should be based on the symbols found in scripture, should it not?

So what is your interpation of just a few verses?

Jesus said: “And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will
I give power over the nations: And he shall rule them with a rod of iron…” (Rev 2:26-27).


When have any of these verses happened?

-Cities being crime-free , dwell safely-none be made afried (Ezekiel 34:28-Micah 4:4)
-No more hunger-He will raise up a plant of renown (Ezekiel 34:29
-A new sharp threshing instrument -the mountains made small(Isaiah 41:14-16)


let scripture interprets scripture, yes

 

[Willie-T]

whats the next booked date for the rapture to happen????? anyone know, what saith the rumormill, whats the word on the mean streets of churchville? i wanna plan accordingly u see.
i hope its before i finish typing this mes................

Here is a short list of just the more publicized dates.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_dates_predicted_for_apocalyptic_events

 

[Willie-T]

The only problem I have with your interpretation, is that the Kingdom of God has already come to "earth". It's within us, and we are Spirit, and dust.

So, interpretation of a symbolic book should be based on the symbols found in scripture, should it not?

I think you are absolutely correct and accurate in all of that.

 

[Bladerunner]

Please show me where (in the Bible) you found all men's deaths to be 'Imminent', and not "eventual" and "certain."

Ah, we want to play on words,,, I can do that....?

"certain" Yes, we are all certain to die....

" eventual"....Yes, we will all eventually DIE.....

"imminent"...Yes, our deaths are imminent. Do YOU NOT AGREE?

Is our death Imminent (implied). Yes, because I doubt very serious if no-one wakes in the mornings and wonders if this will be the last day???? This word spoken or NOT tells us that our death can happen at any time.

The word is implied because we are looking for it to happen in the back of our minds meaning it is going to happen.

If I used your word "soon". the Rapture is going to happen 'Soon' and compared it with this sentence. The Rapture is Imminent!

While they are not the same word, the results of the their meaning in this case is the same. The Rapture will happen in some future time. This time could be the next 10 minutes or the 1000+ years. Neither one of them have any limits on the time needed to complete their action.

You are using an old way to dispute the Rapture and many other events that are still to happen through out the Bible and especially in Revelation to fit your eschatology. The Bible does not say Imminent but it does say, in your own words "SOON"...

The people of that time period understood that Jesus would come back for them (in the Clouds) SOON but not necessarily in their lifetime for He also says that the ones who have died believing in Jesus will be resurrected FIRST.


Now--Willie, you and I are facing a fact that our time on this earth and in these bodies is running out. With each passing second, the odds of death's cold hands reaching out and touching us is becoming smaller and smaller.

You might say your death will be soon. It WILL happen in the Future. NO TIME LIMITS

I might say my death is Imminent. It will happen in the Future. NO TIME LIMITS..

Either one describes the event (in this case our deaths) is to HAPPEN.

That is unless you expect to live forever in this body...

 

[PennEd]

Are you deaf, Ed? I just got finished telling you I believed all that End of The World/Rapture stuff for decades....... for longer than you have been alive. I just get irritated that people (perhaps like you) think I never heard of Jesus before someone told me the things I speak of.

To address your following post 1st.

I JUST SAID in my previous post that I allow for the possibility that I'm wrong!

Obviously, if I thought i WAS wrong I wouldn't believe what I believe, but aside from THE Gospel, I am willing to admit I could have a wrong interpretation of Rev, and especially the Rapture. I lean very heavily pre-trib, and believe there is good evidence to support that, but I'm not going to denigrate those that think there is NO Rapture.

Even, what I believe to be the astoundingly ludicrous preterism view, is not something I am willing to bet my salvation on. NOT saying you need to believe the right view about premillennial vs. amillennial to be saved. Just saying it's a pride issue, if we are not capable of saying we could be wrong.

There are MANY here, whom I love, admire and respect greatly, yourself included, who do not believe as I do in this regard, and for the very most part we steer clear of each other on this issue.

But your daily drumbeat on this issue against premillennials is getting difficult to ignore. I know this has traditionally been Atwaukee's baby for yrs now, ebbing and flowing, but the response has gotten significantly harsher lately.

Now I posted debatable stuff (obviously debate is fine) earlier in the thread, and I'm pretty sure you ignored it. So why should someone read stuff supporting your position?

I'm a little surprised to see you try and pull the age card! LOL Dude, I'm not that young, but thanks for seeing me that way.

 

[prove-all]

I think you are absolutely correct and accurate in all of that.

-One will certainly know when they are born again, they will be spirit...

Joh 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee,
Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

Joh 3:4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old?
can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?

Joh 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water
and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

Joh 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
Joh 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
Joh 3:8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst
not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

-One does not inherit the Kingdom in the flesh...

1Co 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit
the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

-Flesh and blood are visible. So if you are still flesh and blood,
you have not inherited the Kingdom and therefore are not born again.

1Co 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound,
and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

Paul explains when, at the last trump. We will be CHANGED to spirit, changed
such that we do not see corruption. Changed to immortal.


For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
1Co 15:53-corruptible:G5349

f?a?t?´?
phthartos
fthar-tos'
From G5351; decayed, that is, (by implication) perishable: - corruptible.
Total KJV occurrences: 6

incorruption:G861

a?f?a?s?´a
aphtharsia
af-thar-see'-ah
From G862; incorruptibility; generally unending existence; (figuratively) genuineness: - immortality, incorruption, sincerity.
Total KJV occurrences: 8

mortal:G2349

???t?´?
thne¯tos
thnay-tos'
From G2348; liable to die: - mortal (-ity).
Total KJV occurrences: 6

immortality:G110

a??a?as?´a
athanasia
ath-an-as-ee'-ah
From a compound of G1 (as a negative particle) and G2288; deathlessness:
- immortality. Total KJV occurrences: 3

It will be quite evident at the resurrection when one is BORN again.
Now if you want to discuss being begotten, that is something that does occur in this lifetime.

-
3Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ,
which according to his abundant mercy [hath begotten us] again
unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,


1Pe 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible,
by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

-The word used here for "Being born again" is: G313

a??a?e??a´?
anagennao¯
an-ag-en-nah'-o
From G303 and G1080; to beget or (by extension) bear (again): - beget, (bear) X again.
Total KJV occurrences: 2


It means begettal, not birth. If you don't understand the difference, ask your wife,
if she has had children, she will make it very clear to you there is a BIG difference.
-

That which is born of the flesh is flesh: in a physical birth, we are physical beings.
But that which is born of the Spirit is spirit: in a spiritual birth, we are spiritual beings!


“Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God;
neither doth corruption inherit incorruption” (I Cor. 15:50).

-Flesh and blood are visible. So if you are still flesh and blood,
you have not inherited the Kingdom and therefore are not born again.

1Co 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit
the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

-As long as we have flesh that is subject to decay, we cannot enter the Kingdom.
We enter the Kingdom at the resurrection...

1Co 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
1Co 15:23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits;

afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

-
To be born of the spirit is made plain in this passage...

1Co 15:35 But some man will say, How are the dead raised up?
and with what body do they come?
1Co 15:36 Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die:

1Co 15:37 And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be,
but bare grain, it may chance of wheat, or of some other grain:
1Co 15:38 But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body.

1Co 15:42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:
1Co 15:43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:
1Co 15:44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

6That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof,
but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth:

-wind is invisible, you can not see it.
so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

if you where born again you would be an invisible spirit.
we are begotten not yet born, still growing from that seed he planted in you

2Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be:
but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

-

 

[stonesoffire]

This issue is becoming quite the obsession for you.

You accuse others of not desiring to read your stuff on YOUR take of Rev. or a literal view of Scripture, yet you do the exact same thing!

YOU are NOT the only one who has studied Scripture!

I am solidly convinced you are completely wrong on your interpretation. What's more, I think your view is dangerous, yet I allow for the possibility that I'm wrong.

You give no such quarter.

Can we hear you say that you might be wrong? Without a bunch of qualifications?

It would do us all good to see everyone show a little humility.

my like was for the last line..

 

[stonesoffire]

I think you are absolutely correct and accurate in all of that.

Thank you. I don't get a lot of agreement with this. Lol

 

[abcdef]

If Revelation is the unveiling of Jesus, Messiah, should that not be how we study it? With looking as to how this speaks of Him?

And I haven't yet been able to do this with some of it.

The whole Bible is a revealing of God/Jesus.

Jesus is revealed, not all at once, but over time.

Paul says in Ro 16:25-26, that Jesus was a mystery to the prophets.

He says in 1 Cor 2:7-8, that Jesus being crucified was a mystery even to the angels.


See how the mystery of God is finished in Rev 10:7, "In the days of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound."

The mystery is the final mystery of God, We shall see His face.

But, I did see that "seals" has to do with opening the Bible. If you don't agree, look at this in the greek.

Opening as in the revelation of what is written, unveiled Christ.

The "Bible" at the time that the Rev was written was the OT. So if you are saying that the Rev reveals mysteries of the OT, then I have to agree.

That is why the symbols are confirmed in the OT, taken from the OT.

The little scroll/book of the 7 seals, seen in Rev 5:1-8:8, and Rev 10:8- 11:13, is the little scroll/book that is seen in Dan. 12:4-7. It is the story of Israel (natural branches), from after the dest of Jerusalem, until the end of the planet, at the resurrection appearing of Jesus to take possession of the kingdom Rev 11:15.

 

[abcdef]

maybe, maybe not.

Which part is maybe? And which part is maybe not?