The Error is Baptism in Jesus name only for salvation

[Wansvic]

The RCC is the king of works. But there are also several princes of works here as well. I see grace through faith with baptism being an affirmation of my faith. People demanding this and that seem to have no faith in Jesus Christ and his finished work on the cross. Im done here now so continue to post the walls of text time and again. Like the U.S. marxists know, repetitive statements, true or false, repeated often enough will convince at least some of the people.

What Jesus could do while in the flesh was finished at the cross.

1 Cor 15:14-21
And if Christ be not risen, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain.
Yea, and we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God that he raised up Christ: whom he raised not up, if so be that the dead rise not.
For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:

And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.

Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.
If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable.

But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.
For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.

 

[Wansvic]

It’s how God has always been baptism is exactly this principle

“And the LORD said unto Moses, Stretch out thine hand toward heaven, that there may be darkness over the land of Egypt, even darkness which may be felt. And Moses stretched forth his hand toward heaven; and there was a thick darkness in all the land of Egypt three days:”
‭‭Exodus‬ ‭10:21-22‬ ‭

what God said to Moses made Moses lifting his hand integrated into the word Moses had to move his hand or what zgod said wouldn’t come to pass. The power and value is what God said about whatever the subject is that’s what gives it meaning and Importance

at he darkness didn’t come because Moses moved his hand it came because God told him. “ lift up your hand Moses so that the darkness will come as I said “ moses acted upon what it was God said
And Gods word came to pass spoken to and tbrough Moses that’s the operation of baptism

you hear the truth about it like this

“Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins,

and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭2:38‬ ‭

a there’s only value to it if I believe what Gods messenger is saying about it if I believe Peter who said “ get baptized for remission of your sins in his name who died for your sins “

then it has value to me because I believe God spoke this word of baptism for remission of sins .

if my friend is with me and hears it and he rejects it then it becomes meaningless and doesn’t have any value because it’s not of faith believing

if we were making the case “ anyone who gets dunked in water shall be saved !” It would be ridiculous . The value is what God said baptism is done for and what he said it means when we do it.

consider noah he was saved by grace through faith

“But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD.

These are the generations of Noah: Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God.

And God said unto Noah, The end of all flesh is come before me; for the earth is filled with violence through them; and, behold, I will destroy them with the earth. Make thee an ark of gopher wood;

( after he sees Noah with grace he gives him a warning of what’s going to happen and instructs him to build an ark and be saved )

……. Thus did Noah; according to all that God commanded him, so did he.” ( Noah acted by faith when he obeyed the lord according to what god said to him )
‭‭Genesis‬ ‭6:8-9, 13-14, 22‬ ‭KJV‬‬


“By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭11:7‬ ‭

faith isn’t a reason we don’t need to do anything gods grace isn’t either

faith is when we hear what God said and believe him and if he’s called us to act , to act because we believe him

had Noah responded to God saying “ I believe you lord but I’m not going to do what you said will save me “ it would t have been faith and Noah would have surely drown

The action is what completes the idea of faith

Great explanation sir.

Saved by grace THROUGH faith. (Heb. 11)

 

[Wansvic]

maybe you're mistaken.

No, he's not. I saw the post as well. The answer is you just made edits to your original post within the 5 minute time frame.

 

[Wansvic]

Dear Wansvic, I hope you are not omitting passages or misinterpreting the Bible because they don't align with your beliefs. As some have done, When I said that the Pentecostal faith in the one God theory was wrong, I mean in the cruel way they go about doing it, the way they omit God, our heavenly Father, is abominable, evil and entirely unnecessary for them to dishonour to beautiful our heavenly Father that way. To try to erase God, our heavenly Father, from the Bible is unbiblical and unwise. I thought it was okay to remove the Father's name from the Lord's Prayer. I prayed the Lord's Prayer in Jesus' name instead of the Father's name, as in, Our Father who art in heaven,
However, I used the name of Jesus, thinking that Jesus wanted me to pray to Him this way because it seemed logical to me in light of the oneness theory. After praying this way a couple of times, I received a strong rebuke from the Holy Spirit, and Our Lord Jesus did not want me to remove his holy Father from the prayer. Additionally, I want to share a true story with you that happened to me.
I had the misfortune of witnessing the horrible spectacle of this visiting pastor stepping on specific passages of God's word that contradicted his teachings. After his disastrous sermon, I went up to talk with him, arguing his point, and he rejected the passages of scripture I declared unto him; as I looked into his face, I noticed his pupils had dilated to become the same as two wormholes pitch-black and long like wiggly worms, and somehow I could see his black soul.
Our Father who art in heaven,
Hallowed be thy name.
Thy (your) kingdom come.
Thy (your) will be done
on earth as it is in heaven.
Give us this day our daily bread,
and forgive us our trespasses,
as we forgive those who trespass against us,
and lead us not into temptation,
but deliver us from evil.
For thine is the kingdom and the power, and the glory,
forever and ever. Amen.

I never once excluded the Heavenly Father.

God is one. I am aware of no biblical reference to His actually being three distinct persons. However, the bible does reveal He manifests Himself in three ways; Father in creation, Son in redemption, and Holy Ghost in regeneration.

Consider this, Is Jesus a separate person in the Godhead or is the Godhead actually IN Jesus? Scripture answers the question: "In Jesus DWELLS the fulness of the Godhead." Col. 2:9

The scripture goes on to say we are COMPLETE in Jesus:

"And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:
In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:
Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead." Col. 2:10-12

Furthermore, scripture reveals there is but one God not three persons:

Isa 44:6
Thus saith the Lord the King of Israel, and his redeemer the Lord of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.

Isa 44:8
Is there a God beside me? yea, there is no God; I know not any.

Isa 44:24
Thus saith the Lord, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the Lord that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth BY MYSELF;

 

[Wansvic]

...I thought it was okay to remove the Father's name from the Lord's Prayer. I prayed the Lord's Prayer in Jesus' name instead of the Father's name, as in, Our Father who art in heaven,
However, I used the name of Jesus, thinking that Jesus wanted me to pray to Him this way because it seemed logical to me in light of the oneness theory. After praying this way a couple of times, I received a strong rebuke from the Holy Spirit, and Our Lord Jesus did not want me to remove his holy Father from the prayer....

The word of God instructs us how we are to pray. And I would expect no less than a rebuke for usurping God's authority and modifying what He said concerning the Lord's Prayer.

Also, Jesus in talking about prayer reveals something many fail to notice. He reveals that He is God. This is just one of the many instances this truth is revealed in the biblical record:

Jesus speaking, "And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son.
If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it." John 14:13-14

Afterward Jesus said:
"Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall ask the Father in my name, HE will give it you." John 16:23

 

[Wansvic]

If it is said for us to do in the bible, and another group says don't do it, they are literally being anti-christian. It's that simple. The only potential is in other things like should we still obey OT laws, some say yes or no. But, the people in these camps do not do something against these laws, therefore the general model is we follow the bible, one way or another, that we do our best is all we can do. But not doing what the bible says, and doing another way that the bible still says, as both methods of naming are mentioned, is fine. It is only the issue of saying the bible is wrong and we should not do it with the trinity naming when the bible has this model also, as acceptable, and guided to do so, that people cross the line by saying it is anti-christian. They are by saying it. They are divisive yes? It seems. Yes?

Jesus told His disciples to baptize in a name that represents the titles Father, Son and Holy Ghost. (Matt. 28:19) Since the apostles water baptized in the name of Jesus it is clear they knew in Jesus dwelled the fulness of the Godhead; Father, Son and Holy Ghost. (Acts 2:38, 8:12-18, 10:43-48, 19:1-7, 22:16, Col. 2:9)

 

[lrs68]

"And John answered him, saying, Master, we saw one casting out devils in thy name, and he followeth not us: and we forbad him, because he followeth not us.

But Jesus said, Forbid him not: for there is no man which shall do a miracle in my name, that can lightly speak evil of me.

For he that is not against us is on our part." Mark 9:38-40

Amen, I was thinking about this passage of Scripture when posting my thoughts

 

[Wansvic]

...

A Spirit led life will not sin therefore they are not under the law which the law cannot touch them for prosecution.

...

Scripture does reveal if we confess our sins Jesus will forgive and cleanse us of all unrighteousness. (1 John 1:7-2:2) Whereas, Heb. 10:26 states if we sin wilfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

I never once excluded the Heavenly Father.

God is one. I am aware of no biblical reference to His actually being three distinct persons. However, the bible does reveal He manifests Himself in three ways; Father in creation, Son in redemption, and Holy Ghost in regeneration.

Consider this, Is Jesus a separate person in the Godhead or is the Godhead actually IN Jesus? Scripture answers the question: "In Jesus DWELLS the fulness of the Godhead." Col. 2:9

The scripture goes on to say we are COMPLETE in Jesus:

"And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:
In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:
Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead." Col. 2:10-12

Furthermore, scripture reveals there is but one God not three persons:

Isa 44:6
Thus saith the Lord the King of Israel, and his redeemer the Lord of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.

Isa 44:8
Is there a God beside me? yea, there is no God; I know not any.

Isa 44:24
Thus saith the Lord, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the Lord that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth BY MYSELF;

“Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour. I am the LORD, your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.”
‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭43:10-11, 15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Scripture does reveal if we confess our sins Jesus will forgive and cleanse us of all unrighteousness. (1 John 1:7-2:2) Whereas, Heb. 10:26 states if we sin wilfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

Mmhm think about that. if I have sinned and I confess I’ve done wrong ……….and if I simply pretend I didn’t sin.

One is willfully sinning because I refuse to acknowledge its sin and repent ( this allows me to dull my conscience and continue sinning in blissful ignorance

the other is not willfully sinning because when I recognize I’ve sinned it’s a grievance and repents me and I confess I’ve don’t the wrong trusting the lords mercy according to his word

were not perfect we all still do a lot that’s less than holy in truth but some sin and it’s just another step others sin and it’s a step on a rusty nail ……it stings

 

[CS1]

No, he's not. I saw the post as well. The answer is you just made edits to your original post within the 5-minute time frame.

what is the issue I am still not understanding what was it I "edited " That I have not answered repeatedly? If I revised something for whatever reason, perhaps I made a mistake, which I'm sure your Hypocritical self would never admit to, and I would make the correction. Don't act like you have never done the same thing in 5 minutes; such self-righteous Pharisees.

 

[CS1]

"you have to be saved before you are water-baptized and also to receive the Holy Spirit to confirm your born-again experience that had to happen before water baptism"

Are you saying that you did not delete this statement from your post# 970?

I await your honest response.

Help me AGAIN. What statement did I delete?

 

[Aaron56]

Hebrews 10:26 is often misunderstood.
I think it has something to do with how church leaders use the scriptures to keep parishioners from growing.

Here's the full passage:

"For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, 27 but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries. 28 Anyone who has rejected Moses’ law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace?"


Certainly there are many warnings about partaking of sin once one is born again.

This section, however, is about how it is impossible to be born again after being born again.

It is impossible to renew such a person in the manner in which they were brought into salvation.

Now that they are a child of God they will face correction, punishment, or even excommunication with the intent to produce godly sorrow so that they might confess their sins and turn from their ways. The writer ends the passage with this:

“Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” says the Lord. And again, “The Lord will judge His people.” 31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God."

So this is about correcting the wayward believer who is willfully sinning NOT about losing his place in Christ.

Furthermore, no man may crucify the Lord for themselves. It is impossible.
And no man may bring shame upon the Lord. That is also impossible.

The believer caught in sin cannot, AGAIN, be born of the Spirit. But because he is born of the Spirit and of the house of God, he will face the correction that God brings to him; first through the saints and lastly by His own hand. It is always best to heed the word of correction spoken by the elders than to have the Lord intervene directly.

 

[BillG]

what is the issue I am still not understanding what was it I "edited " That I have not answered repeatedly? If I revised something for whatever reason, perhaps I made a mistake, which I'm sure your Hypocritical self would never admit to, and I would make the correction. Don't act like you have never done the same thing in 5 minutes; such self-righteous Pharisees.

Talk about making a mountain out of a mole hill.
It's not unusual to amend or update a post based on the time limit given.
That's why it's there.
The wolves like to gather.

 

[Branch]

The word of God instructs us how we are to pray. And I would expect no less than a rebuke for usurping God's authority and modifying what He said concerning the Lord's Prayer.

Also, Jesus in talking about prayer reveals something many fail to notice. He reveals that He is God. This is just one of the many instances this truth is revealed in the biblical record:

Jesus speaking, "And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son.
If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it." John 14:13-14

Afterward Jesus said:
"Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall ask the Father in my name, HE will give it you." John 16:23

Dear Wansvic, The Father and the Son act in distinct roles during the crucifixion. The Father sends the Son to take on human nature and to confront sin, while the Son, in obedience, takes up human flesh and suffers death on the cross. The Father does not send himself, nor does he die; rather, he sends his Son* who alone experiences death in his humanity.

 

[Branch]

The word of God instructs us how we are to pray. And I would expect no less than a rebuke for usurping God's authority and modifying what He said concerning the Lord's Prayer.

Also, Jesus in talking about prayer reveals something many fail to notice. He reveals that He is God. This is just one of the many instances this truth is revealed in the biblical record:

Jesus speaking, "And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son.
If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it." John 14:13-14

Afterward Jesus said:
"Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall ask the Father in my name, HE will give it you." John 16:23

Dear Wansvic,
The events of the cross show that the Father and the Son are not the same person. They have different wills, voices, and functions, yet work together in perfect unity for the salvation of humanity. The Father’s act of sending and the Son’s act of self-giving love are distinct but inseparable actions within the one divine purpose.

While the cross reveals the distinction between the Father and the Son, it does not divide the Trinity. The Father, Son, and Spirit operate in concert, with the Father sending, the Son dying, and the Spirit sustaining. The distinction is in their persons and roles, not in their divine essence or unity.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Hebrews 10:26 is often misunderstood.
I think it has something to do with how church leaders use the scriptures to keep parishioners from growing.

Here's the full passage:

"For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, 27 but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries. 28 Anyone who has rejected Moses’ law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace?"


Certainly there are many warnings about partaking of sin once one is born again.

This section, however, is about how it is impossible to be born again after being born again.

It is impossible to renew such a person in the manner in which they were brought into salvation.

Now that they are a child of God they will face correction, punishment, or even excommunication with the intent to produce godly sorrow so that they might confess their sins and turn from their ways. The writer ends the passage with this:

“Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” says the Lord. And again, “The Lord will judge His people.” 31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God."

So this is about correcting the wayward believer who is willfully sinning NOT about losing his place in Christ.

Furthermore, no man may crucify the Lord for themselves. It is impossible.
And no man may bring shame upon the Lord. That is also impossible.

The believer caught in sin cannot, AGAIN, be born of the Spirit. But because he is born of the Spirit and of the house of God, he will face the correction that God brings to him; first through the saints and lastly by His own hand. It is always best to heed the word of correction spoken by the elders than to have the Lord intervene directly.

“For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, but a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭10:26-27‬ ‭KJV‬‬

It seems like they question should be what does willfully mean there ?


if I sin and I act like I’ve done nothing wrong won’t confess it as sin and repent it’s willful .

If I’ve sinned and when I realize I’ve sinned it bothers me and greives my heart and so I co fess tbat I’ve sinned and ask the lord to forgive my sin ….this shows tbat my Will isnt to keep sinning ( sincerity of course being necassary )

she’s basically saying if we are using Jesus death for our sins as a reason to keep on sinning claiming “ I’ll never be held accountable so I can sin freely now “

Bit if you understand Jesus death as a propitiation and atonement for your sins you are going to come to repentance where it’s just not okay with you when you sin anymore it bothers you you’ve heard the call to repentance and so when you realize you have sinned it’s troubling and you want to talk to the lord like a person when you have offended them .

willful sin is when you use Christ as an excuse to continue on without repentance , repentance and confession of sin as sin shows your Will is not to keep sinning .

i would say ( just a fools opinion ) this can reveal if our sin is willful or if it’s not

“but if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin. If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.”
‭‭1 John‬ ‭1:7-10‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I think recognizing and confessing my wrongs or ignoring and pretending it doesn’t matter if I sin or not anymore “thier all on Jesus now “ type thinking shows us how we are forgiven of sin and not forgiven notice there’s sin either way but how we respond to it and how we recognize our own actions as sinful makes the difference between forgiven and making god a liar and having no truth in us

I think recognition of our own actions in the light of Christs word and how we respond to it really shows of sin is willful or not


a crude example is if I throw a bottle soda to a friend and I accidentally hit another person in the head … I’m probably going to realize I made a mistake and tell them oh I did that I’m sorry I apologize I feel terrible for that lump on your head . “

Your planned intent wasn’t to hit the person with the bottle but your action still manifested thier bump. But you didnt deny you did it and pretend tbier big head was on the way either you acknowledged what you did wrong .


In just a lot of situations this makes all the difference but if o do it then scoff at you and call you a baby and complainer or deny I did it or made a mistake then this is totally different

If I planned on hitting you then it was willful I wanted to hit you so I might deny it or laugh at you even make you out to be wrong somehow but not me to didn’t do anything wrong “

sin happens in the world even by believers but repentance means we aren’t going to be alright with it anymore when we recognize it in ourselves it’s going to bring recognition a bit of sorrow and confession to God repentance …..

Sincere repentance shows somthing wasn’t willful .

If we argue and we’re lifelong friends but I say something in anger I didn’t actually mean . Then I tell you I didnt mean that I shouldn’t have said it bro please forgive me “

Im assuming your thinking “ already forgiven man “

But if instead the same thing happens and I continue saying it the next day then start spreading rumors about you and telling the same thing to everyone …..you then begin to realize “ this is something he’s actually meaning to do “

now you still of course aren’t gonna as a Christian hold a grudge but we aren’t gonna be friends anymore unless I repent at some point either . You can offer forgivness to me but if I keep the beef going on my end there’s still not going to be reconciliation ….

we have to turn to the light from the darkness willfully even though we’re imperfect and when we know we have sinned we should recognize and acknolwedge it so it doesn’t become something we just live daily . If we don’t acknowledge it sin we might just continue on in it and be making Jesus into the reason we can keep sinning … doing “ spite unto the spirit of grace “

“but a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭10:27-29‬ ‭KJV‬‬

We need to turn against sin and see it as a problem and evil ……then we’ll not feel right doing it as we are enlightened by his word

 

[Branch]

The word of God instructs us how we are to pray. And I would expect no less than a rebuke for usurping God's authority and modifying what He said concerning the Lord's Prayer.

Also, Jesus in talking about prayer reveals something many fail to notice. He reveals that He is God. This is just one of the many instances this truth is revealed in the biblical record:

Jesus speaking, "And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son.
If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it." John 14:13-14

Afterward Jesus said:
"Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall ask the Father in my name, HE will give it you." John 16:23

Dear Wansvic,
On the cross, it is the Son who suffers and dies physically, experiencing the agony of separation and the penalty for sin in his human nature. The Father, by contrast, suffers the grief of the death of his Son but does not die himself. This distinction is highlighted in the way the Son cries out to the Father, “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?” (Mark 15:34), expressing the unique suffering of the Son in his humanity. I hope this helps. God bless you, brother.

 

[Kroogz]

Hebrews 10:26 is often misunderstood.
I think it has something to do with how church leaders use the scriptures to keep parishioners from growing.

Here's the full passage:

"For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, 27 but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries. 28 Anyone who has rejected Moses’ law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace?"


Certainly there are many warnings about partaking of sin once one is born again.

This section, however, is about how it is impossible to be born again after being born again.

It is impossible to renew such a person in the manner in which they were brought into salvation.

Now that they are a child of God they will face correction, punishment, or even excommunication with the intent to produce godly sorrow so that they might confess their sins and turn from their ways. The writer ends the passage with this:

“Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” says the Lord. And again, “The Lord will judge His people.” 31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God."

So this is about correcting the wayward believer who is willfully sinning NOT about losing his place in Christ.

Furthermore, no man may crucify the Lord for themselves. It is impossible.
And no man may bring shame upon the Lord. That is also impossible.

The believer caught in sin cannot, AGAIN, be born of the Spirit. But because he is born of the Spirit and of the house of God, he will face the correction that God brings to him; first through the saints and lastly by His own hand. It is always best to heed the word of correction spoken by the elders than to have the Lord intervene directly.

I believe you nailed it.

The Hebrews went back to animal sacrifice and the law.

Christ did it once and for all. Once renewed, always renewed.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Dear Wansvic,
On the cross, it is the Son who suffers and dies physically, experiencing the agony of separation and the penalty for sin in his human nature. The Father, by contrast, suffers the grief of the death of his Son but does not die himself. This distinction is highlighted in the way the Son cries out to the Father, “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?” (Mark 15:34), expressing the unique suffering of the Son in his humanity. I hope this helps. God bless you, brother.

Mmhm only in Jesus the son is their remission of sins it’s one of the reasons he became a man so he could bleed and die for humanities sins. Spirits can’t sacrifice thier flesh and blood to save humanity

“God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.”
‭‭John‬ ‭4:24‬ ‭KJV‬‬

In order for him (God ) to sacrifice his perfect flesh and blood he needed to be born as a man in the flesh and blood

“Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, And they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭1:23‬ ‭KJV‬‬

In other words to suffer and die for our sins This needed to happen

“And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.”
‭‭1 Timothy‬ ‭3:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

who was manifest in the flesh ?

“God is a Spirit:”

“God was manifest in the flesh, “

God with us.”

“Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour.

I am the LORD, your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.

Remember ye not the former things, neither consider the things of old. Behold, I will do a new thing; now it shall spring forth; shall ye not know it? I will even make a way in the wilderness, and rivers in the desert.”
‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭43:10-11, 15, 18-19‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the LORD, make straight in the desert a highway for our God. Every valley shall be exalted, and every mountain and hill shall be made low: and the crooked shall be made straight, and the rough places plain: and the glory of the LORD shall be revealed, and all flesh shall see it together: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it. The grass withereth, the flower fadeth: but the word of our God shall stand for ever.

…Behold, the Lord GOD will come with strong hand, and his arm shall rule for him: behold, his reward is with him, and his work before him. He shall feed his flock like a shepherd: he shall gather the lambs with his arm, and carry them in his bosom, and shall gently lead those that are with young.”
‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭40:3-5, 8, 10-11‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.

I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.

…….. I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches.

I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star. And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭22:12-13, 16-17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last: I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭1:17-18‬ ‭KJV‬‬