The finished work of the cross ?
- Thread starter followjesus
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Romans 6.4-7 is not an opinion
[SUP]3 [/SUP]Or do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus have been baptized into His death? [SUP]4 [/SUP]Therefore we have been buried with Him through baptism into death, so that as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, so we too might walk in newness of life. [SUP]5 [/SUP]For if we have become united with Him in the likeness of His death, certainly we shall also be in the likeness of His resurrection, [SUP]6 [/SUP]knowing this, that our old self was crucified with Him, in order that our body of sin might be done away with, so that we would no longer be slaves to sin; [SUP]7 [/SUP]for he who has died is freed from sin.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]Or do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus have been baptized into His death? [SUP]4 [/SUP]Therefore we have been buried with Him through baptism into death, so that as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, so we too might walk in newness of life. [SUP]5 [/SUP]For if we have become united with Him in the likeness of His death, certainly we shall also be in the likeness of His resurrection, [SUP]6 [/SUP]knowing this, that our old self was crucified with Him, in order that our body of sin might be done away with, so that we would no longer be slaves to sin; [SUP]7 [/SUP]for he who has died is freed from sin.
yes obedience
what are the "works" of the saints during the time of tribulation
what exactly are they doing in obedience to the faith in which they were called?
fir as you know because of HOS elect HE will shorten the days else no flesh would be saved
what "works" do you think these tribulation saints are doing
what are the "works" of the saints during the time of tribulation
what exactly are they doing in obedience to the faith in which they were called?
fir as you know because of HOS elect HE will shorten the days else no flesh would be saved
what "works" do you think these tribulation saints are doing
Naw I look only through the gospel lens which is what Jesus came to explain, the things of God. The gospel contains both grace, and truth. No other "lens" is needed, it's what it's all about faith in Jesus, and faith doesn't just say I believe. How do I define faith ? The way scripture defines it. Believe Gods word, not just what we choose to see but what's there. Such as " Be he doers of the word, and not hearers only, so deceiving yourselves"
Theres no such thing as salvation by works, it's a term the gog uses to turn people away from what God said to do. Just like the serpent. It's not "works" to obey God if a person is supposedly a new creation in Christ, then the result is to do the things God has commanded us to do.
The old man sees the commandments as a work an oppression, a burden. The new man finds joy in learning the ways God teaches us to live. Because they are instructions to live forever. Jesus wasn't teaching anything wrong, what he clearly said and had written as God has always done is life. It's what the Israelites couldn't acknowledge, it's what Jesus made clear. If we die with Christ and claim were walking in him, then the commands of Jesus will be our life, not works of the mosaic law. But obedience to God through the faith of Christ. Meaning what he told his disciples, and then after he raised up, told them to go teach the same things to the world.
God has written down his words always, he wrote them down on Sinai he told Moses to write down the law, he told the prophets to write down his word, he purposes the gospels to be written down, had the apostles write down their epistels.....all so that false teachers couldn't distort the word of God. There is one person Christians need to obey that's Jesus. His gospels are eternal all he spoke will never change. And I'm sorry to say but he said very plainly do the words I'm teaching you, they are like a foundation of rock, they will make you stand, to hear them and not do them is foolish, and you will fall with a great crash having nO foundation...
Thats just his word though, you know the one were to have faith in. It really doesn't even appear in the bible to have faith in the cross and forget about his words. That's just one of those things the written word, keeps us from falling for. Gotta learn from Jesus, and he teaches to obey his word. So if he's a works by Salvationist according to the grace goggles......I'll stick with the gospel that he taught, all because of what he accomplished for me and the suffering he endured. If I fall down I'll simply follow what he taught to do, I'll ask forgiveness and always forgive others. And. I have no worries about condemnation, because he is faithful to his words. Always has been and will be. Faith is to hear, and do the word of God. It comes from accepting what he says, and obedience will come because a person believes the one saying to do what he is saying. Then you have obedience of faith like noah
Theres no such thing as salvation by works, it's a term the gog uses to turn people away from what God said to do. Just like the serpent. It's not "works" to obey God if a person is supposedly a new creation in Christ, then the result is to do the things God has commanded us to do.
The old man sees the commandments as a work an oppression, a burden. The new man finds joy in learning the ways God teaches us to live. Because they are instructions to live forever. Jesus wasn't teaching anything wrong, what he clearly said and had written as God has always done is life. It's what the Israelites couldn't acknowledge, it's what Jesus made clear. If we die with Christ and claim were walking in him, then the commands of Jesus will be our life, not works of the mosaic law. But obedience to God through the faith of Christ. Meaning what he told his disciples, and then after he raised up, told them to go teach the same things to the world.
God has written down his words always, he wrote them down on Sinai he told Moses to write down the law, he told the prophets to write down his word, he purposes the gospels to be written down, had the apostles write down their epistels.....all so that false teachers couldn't distort the word of God. There is one person Christians need to obey that's Jesus. His gospels are eternal all he spoke will never change. And I'm sorry to say but he said very plainly do the words I'm teaching you, they are like a foundation of rock, they will make you stand, to hear them and not do them is foolish, and you will fall with a great crash having nO foundation...
Thats just his word though, you know the one were to have faith in. It really doesn't even appear in the bible to have faith in the cross and forget about his words. That's just one of those things the written word, keeps us from falling for. Gotta learn from Jesus, and he teaches to obey his word. So if he's a works by Salvationist according to the grace goggles......I'll stick with the gospel that he taught, all because of what he accomplished for me and the suffering he endured. If I fall down I'll simply follow what he taught to do, I'll ask forgiveness and always forgive others. And. I have no worries about condemnation, because he is faithful to his words. Always has been and will be. Faith is to hear, and do the word of God. It comes from accepting what he says, and obedience will come because a person believes the one saying to do what he is saying. Then you have obedience of faith like noah
You absolutely are missing the entire content of Hebrews.
Thos verses I showed you are an example like a will and testament. What it's saying, is that a will is written while a man is alive. In his will he determines the conditions and the disperse the of his inheritance. But until the man dies, the will is of no power. In other words his property isn't dispersed, the words of his will aren't enforced until he dies. That's the thinking and explanation there.
its why why it says "neither the first testament"was in force until the shedding of blood. If you would go to the reference that's made there in Hebrews about what Moses did, you would understand why it's there and what it means that the law was a pattern or shadow of the gospel. Moses wrote the book of the law, and then read it to all the people. He then took the blood and sprinkled it on the book of the law they just heard, and on the people. This enjoined the law to the Israelites.
Jesus did the same he spoke the gospel to the people, and then she'd his blood on the people and his testament that enjoins Christians to the only gospel that exists, as re order in the 4 gospels. Simple stuff. A will and testament, is not put into effect until the testator dies. That means that Jesus testament, or his testimony all he said, is of force when he shed his blood and died. It will never change ever. The things he taught are the words of God, he says it again and again in those gospels you all omit, that's why you aren't getting it. Your arguing against the truth and authority of Jesus the lords words, attempting to persuade others that we somehow obey the cross, or obey grace. It's about Jesus never will change what he did on the cross is important, but his words are the same essential. The cross is only a part of the gospel.
Thos verses I showed you are an example like a will and testament. What it's saying, is that a will is written while a man is alive. In his will he determines the conditions and the disperse the of his inheritance. But until the man dies, the will is of no power. In other words his property isn't dispersed, the words of his will aren't enforced until he dies. That's the thinking and explanation there.
its why why it says "neither the first testament"was in force until the shedding of blood. If you would go to the reference that's made there in Hebrews about what Moses did, you would understand why it's there and what it means that the law was a pattern or shadow of the gospel. Moses wrote the book of the law, and then read it to all the people. He then took the blood and sprinkled it on the book of the law they just heard, and on the people. This enjoined the law to the Israelites.
Jesus did the same he spoke the gospel to the people, and then she'd his blood on the people and his testament that enjoins Christians to the only gospel that exists, as re order in the 4 gospels. Simple stuff. A will and testament, is not put into effect until the testator dies. That means that Jesus testament, or his testimony all he said, is of force when he shed his blood and died. It will never change ever. The things he taught are the words of God, he says it again and again in those gospels you all omit, that's why you aren't getting it. Your arguing against the truth and authority of Jesus the lords words, attempting to persuade others that we somehow obey the cross, or obey grace. It's about Jesus never will change what he did on the cross is important, but his words are the same essential. The cross is only a part of the gospel.
jesus said what God said lol that's my point haha common man .....the 4 gospels are the gospel. Paul was doing what he was commanded to do, to spread the gospel already established by the Lord. There's not a single verse which will change or omit that fact. But you have a choice to follow others interpretations......Jesus is the right choice though I'll remain in him, and understand the rest without needing to mit the gospel not the cross or the words of God. Gotta have the light, or its reading in the dark. Faith in anyone besides Jesus isn't a good plan, but again free will belongs to anyone
But they weren't in 'the tribulation'. The 'great tribulation' lasted for the Jews from c 70 ad to the present day.
There was no 'tribulation' period as such. Many have been through tribulation throughout church history, but not through 'the tribulation period' which is in fact unscriptural..
They were saints, but not 'tribulation saints'.
There was no 'tribulation' period as such. Many have been through tribulation throughout church history, but not through 'the tribulation period' which is in fact unscriptural..
They were saints, but not 'tribulation saints'.
And?
The mediator of the covenant?
is where?
I mean a covenant requires two parties
and this ONE entered behind the TRUE VEIL once and for all
and all those who look to HIM as their anchor enter in by THAT VEIL
If they don't enter in by THAT VEIL, they are not in HIM
And no man can come to the FATHER except through THAT VEIL
Now do you have any power to deter or bring on THE BAPTISM done by GOD?
The mediator of the covenant?
is where?
I mean a covenant requires two parties
and this ONE entered behind the TRUE VEIL once and for all
and all those who look to HIM as their anchor enter in by THAT VEIL
If they don't enter in by THAT VEIL, they are not in HIM
And no man can come to the FATHER except through THAT VEIL
Now do you have any power to deter or bring on THE BAPTISM done by GOD?
You are confusing the essence of faith (belief, trust, reliance) in Christ for salvation with the fruit, by product and demonstrative evidence of faith (obedience/good works) which follows and the end result is salvation based on works. You seem to be trusting in "your performance" as the basis of receiving eternal life rather than in Christ alone.
Exactly, it's the same group they just get a few strays here n there. I gotta give me that they sure stick together working hard to ignore the scriptures that don't fit the gog omission. It's because their pastor teaches them about the terrible war on grace, when he speaks about obedience his face distorts lol like he's gonna puke.
Then he explains how that's not from God, stuff like say grace to the mountain , and take communion and be healed.....explains why certain epistels don't belong in the bible, and we need a special grace goggles to really see that were not supposed to acknowledge our sins, how if you sin and that makes you feel guilt....it's of the devil lol. The sin conscience is a bad thing he teaches. Everything is unwarranted favor. So if you see obey my commands, that's not for you it's the law of Moses and you died to that lol even though Jesus said it, he teaches how Jesus taught the law 2.0 to make us realize we can't obey God. And things like the sermon on the mount are Old Testament teachings.....just so many bad interpretations.....but he had to come up with a doctrine people would buy for 29.95....so he's a good salesman.
to to bad to see the effect on his followers though.
Then he explains how that's not from God, stuff like say grace to the mountain , and take communion and be healed.....explains why certain epistels don't belong in the bible, and we need a special grace goggles to really see that were not supposed to acknowledge our sins, how if you sin and that makes you feel guilt....it's of the devil lol. The sin conscience is a bad thing he teaches. Everything is unwarranted favor. So if you see obey my commands, that's not for you it's the law of Moses and you died to that lol even though Jesus said it, he teaches how Jesus taught the law 2.0 to make us realize we can't obey God. And things like the sermon on the mount are Old Testament teachings.....just so many bad interpretations.....but he had to come up with a doctrine people would buy for 29.95....so he's a good salesman.
to to bad to see the effect on his followers though.