The Lie of Parental Forgiveness: Rebuilding the Veil Jesus Broke
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K
Well you are wrong by thinking that and I put such things forward to see if the one or ones who did this would be honest and admit it, or see if they will be dishonest and avoid or deny they said it.
If they are dishonest then I know where they stand and thus lets me know to withdraw from such a person....
If they are honest then we can move forward and share more of God's word....
There is no use carrying on conversations with another if they won't even admit their faults, that shows there is other things they are doing that does not align with God !!!
No, we can grieve the Holy Spirit but I think people need to understand He grieves FOR you. He loves you and cares for your well-being and doesn't want you to live in the consequences of sin. He wants to set you free. It isn't so much "sinning against a holy and righteous God" that's the source of the grieving but the repercussions of our actions. Holy Spirit is for us and not against us.
If we are grieving Him, He will let us know. Not by some means of coercion and condemnation but as a friend hurt. He is our friend and we have an intimacy with Him. Do you wish to hurt your friend? No, you value that relationship in the same way with the Holy Spirit you don't wish to grieve Him because you care about Him and He cares for you. He is precious to you, and you don't wish to offend Him.
Our response, of course, is obedience to His chastisement and correction, done in love.
If we are grieving Him, He will let us know. Not by some means of coercion and condemnation but as a friend hurt. He is our friend and we have an intimacy with Him. Do you wish to hurt your friend? No, you value that relationship in the same way with the Holy Spirit you don't wish to grieve Him because you care about Him and He cares for you. He is precious to you, and you don't wish to offend Him.
Our response, of course, is obedience to His chastisement and correction, done in love.
G
And I agree. But we did offend Him by grieving or Quenching Him............Name it and site it and carry on.
We need to recognize where we offended Him to get back in His plan..................if not ,we continue in our grieving or quenching. 99% of the time it is not in our sin, but quenching Him in our own "good"(little 'g'ood.")
And in reality, "offend" is not on the table in my opinion..............he just wants us back in His Plan for our lives.
We need to recognize where we offended Him to get back in His plan..................if not ,we continue in our grieving or quenching. 99% of the time it is not in our sin, but quenching Him in our own "good"(little 'g'ood.")
And in reality, "offend" is not on the table in my opinion..............he just wants us back in His Plan for our lives.
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In fact, Willie, נָחַם (naham) is used most often of God in the OT and means to relent rather than to repent. That is, God changing his dealings with men according to his sovereign purposes. The language seems inconsistent with who God is - but it is anthropopathic. From our perspective, it only appears that God's purposes have changed, but he hasn't changed his mind at all (see the Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament, pp. 570, 571). Not only is this the case, but the word in the Septuagint isn't μετάνοια (metanoia) anyway, it's ἱλάσκομαι, hilaskomai. But you're right; this OT use of the word has nothing to do with stopping sinning.
As for repentance in the NT (since this seems to be what some posters to this thread are more focussed on), the definition of metanoia as a change of mind and no more can't be right if we take Romans 2 seriously. It can't mean remembering that God has forgiven also our future sins and that we need to come to terms with the fact, because vv. 3ff. speak of God's judgement on the unrepentant.
"Do you suppose, O man - you who judge those who practise such things and yet do them yourself - that you will escape the judgement of God? Or do you presume on the riches of his kindness and forbearance and patience, not knowing that God's kindness is meant to lead you to repentance (metanoia)? But because of your hard and impenitent (ametanoetos) heart, you are storing up wrath for yourself on the day of wrath when God's righteous judgement will be revealed."
Paul goes on to describe the outcome for the unrepentant: wrath and fury, tribulation and distress.
Perhaps you're right though, and I don't have a fully developed understanding of what repentance means. But to me, in passages like this, God certainly is saying "stop your sinning".
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As for repentance in the NT (since this seems to be what some posters to this thread are more focussed on), the definition of metanoia as a change of mind and no more can't be right if we take Romans 2 seriously. It can't mean remembering that God has forgiven also our future sins and that we need to come to terms with the fact, because vv. 3ff. speak of God's judgement on the unrepentant.
"Do you suppose, O man - you who judge those who practise such things and yet do them yourself - that you will escape the judgement of God? Or do you presume on the riches of his kindness and forbearance and patience, not knowing that God's kindness is meant to lead you to repentance (metanoia)? But because of your hard and impenitent (ametanoetos) heart, you are storing up wrath for yourself on the day of wrath when God's righteous judgement will be revealed."
Paul goes on to describe the outcome for the unrepentant: wrath and fury, tribulation and distress.
Perhaps you're right though, and I don't have a fully developed understanding of what repentance means. But to me, in passages like this, God certainly is saying "stop your sinning".
....Yes it is interesting because it is a load of baloney..it is just the same typical myths and garbage that we hear people say when they slander a gift sent to teach on the grace of our Lord Jesus to the body of Christ. They should be ashamed to speak the garbage that they do.
Joseph Prince is sent by our Lord to teach about the love and beauty of our Lord Jesus! In every sermon he uplifts Jesus and always points to Jesus.
Here is a statement that is completely is false.
For example, he still thinks poor and sick believers cannot bless anyone, and maintains, “
“Religion will tell you that ‘God’ wants you sick to teach you character and patience. Religion will tell you that ‘God’ wants you poor, so that you will learn humility. It sounds noble, doesn’t it? But these are LIES from the pit of hell!”
The author uses the above statement to "conclude the lie " ..that Prince "thinks poor and sick believers cannot bless anyone, "
What a bunch of malicious slanderous garbage.
And the fact that Jesus wants us well and whole is so well documented that It's unfathomable how anyone could think a loving God wants His people to be " sick to teach" them things. We would throw our own parents in jail for doing things like that.
Where do we see Jesus " brought sickness to" people to teach them things? We don't. We have a New Covenant built upon better promises than the Old Covenant.
Jesus healed every person that came to Him. Jesus is perfect theology!
Jesus is the exact representation of the Father. Jesus said no one knows my Father. So, whatever understanding of God we get from the Old Covenant that doesn't line up with Jesus' manifestation of the Father will be inaccurate.
Hebrews 1:1-3 (NASB)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways,
[SUP]2 [/SUP] in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world.
[SUP]3 [/SUP] And He is the radiance of His glory and the exact representation of His nature, and upholds all things by the word of His power. When He had made purification of sins, He sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high,
As far as prosperity gospel....there is no such gospel.. the fact that God wants to bless His people is well documented in scripture. Jesus provided all things for us.
What this author is really saying is....Prince's teachings conflict with my beliefs so I can slander him .....
Just the typical garbage and malicious slander that we see by religious people when their "sacred cows" are being sacrificed....God love them!
Joseph Prince is sent by our Lord to teach about the love and beauty of our Lord Jesus! In every sermon he uplifts Jesus and always points to Jesus.
Here is a statement that is completely is false.
For example, he still thinks poor and sick believers cannot bless anyone, and maintains, “
“Religion will tell you that ‘God’ wants you sick to teach you character and patience. Religion will tell you that ‘God’ wants you poor, so that you will learn humility. It sounds noble, doesn’t it? But these are LIES from the pit of hell!”
The author uses the above statement to "conclude the lie " ..that Prince "thinks poor and sick believers cannot bless anyone, "
What a bunch of malicious slanderous garbage.
And the fact that Jesus wants us well and whole is so well documented that It's unfathomable how anyone could think a loving God wants His people to be " sick to teach" them things. We would throw our own parents in jail for doing things like that.
Where do we see Jesus " brought sickness to" people to teach them things? We don't. We have a New Covenant built upon better promises than the Old Covenant.
Jesus healed every person that came to Him. Jesus is perfect theology!
Jesus is the exact representation of the Father. Jesus said no one knows my Father. So, whatever understanding of God we get from the Old Covenant that doesn't line up with Jesus' manifestation of the Father will be inaccurate.
Hebrews 1:1-3 (NASB)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways,
[SUP]2 [/SUP] in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world.
[SUP]3 [/SUP] And He is the radiance of His glory and the exact representation of His nature, and upholds all things by the word of His power. When He had made purification of sins, He sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high,
As far as prosperity gospel....there is no such gospel.. the fact that God wants to bless His people is well documented in scripture. Jesus provided all things for us.
What this author is really saying is....Prince's teachings conflict with my beliefs so I can slander him .....
Just the typical garbage and malicious slander that we see by religious people when their "sacred cows" are being sacrificed....God love them!
Too many lies. Jospeh Prince WOF, prosperity gospel and grace all rolled into one. Those contributing here literally said this was not true, but where actually lying.
There is no conversation when my spirituality is denied and I am called a legalist, a pharisee, striving to earn my salvation.
You can make everything a human does as sin, evil but only that which is done in Christ as good, but that is foolish.
The good samaritan. Here is an enemy of Jews doing good. The whole point of the parable is good exists outside religious faith or position.
Now your whole position is condemning the church as walking only in the flesh, doing evil.
You, therefore, have no excuse, you who pass judgment on someone else, for at whatever point you judge another, you are condemning yourself, because you who pass judgment do the same things.
Rom 2:1
You, therefore, have no excuse, you who pass judgment on someone else, for at whatever point you judge another, you are condemning yourself, because you who pass judgment do the same things.
Rom 2:1
do you show contempt for the riches of his kindness, forbearance and patience, not realising that God’s kindness is intended to lead you to repentance?
Rom 2:4
However you look at faith in the past what matters is how you walk in the present. It is easy to distort ones sense of worth, how precious, pure, holy we are in His sight because of the work He has done in our lives.
To keep you in the hyper-grace theology you are completely helpless to "carnal sin" which has been created when it has no reality in your life. It is continual condemnation of who you are, and saying to you unless you walk under "grace" you are lost. The truth is you are lost if you stop following Jesus and His principles, the Holy Spirit in your heart. You are in His covenant, and reassured of this reality daily by His Spirit. But maybe this is not a reality for you and that is the real problem. In reality you hate yourself and do not even count yourself as acceptable.
"Carnal sin" is doing anything in life but for non-spiritual reasons. The reason why this concept is so dangerous is everything has an element of self, or Jesus, or friends, or family, or status involved in it. But Jesus washes this clean, He becomes our focus and we stop self analysing and self condemning, as if we are justifying everything before the Lord which is not sin.
So in reality those who claim to walk under-grace are walking in 1000's more condemnation than I am who knows how to define sin. In this regard love is freedom, knowing when things are acceptable.
There is no conversation when my spirituality is denied and I am called a legalist, a pharisee, striving to earn my salvation.
You can make everything a human does as sin, evil but only that which is done in Christ as good, but that is foolish.
The good samaritan. Here is an enemy of Jews doing good. The whole point of the parable is good exists outside religious faith or position.
Now your whole position is condemning the church as walking only in the flesh, doing evil.
You, therefore, have no excuse, you who pass judgment on someone else, for at whatever point you judge another, you are condemning yourself, because you who pass judgment do the same things.
Rom 2:1
You, therefore, have no excuse, you who pass judgment on someone else, for at whatever point you judge another, you are condemning yourself, because you who pass judgment do the same things.
Rom 2:1
do you show contempt for the riches of his kindness, forbearance and patience, not realising that God’s kindness is intended to lead you to repentance?
Rom 2:4
However you look at faith in the past what matters is how you walk in the present. It is easy to distort ones sense of worth, how precious, pure, holy we are in His sight because of the work He has done in our lives.
To keep you in the hyper-grace theology you are completely helpless to "carnal sin" which has been created when it has no reality in your life. It is continual condemnation of who you are, and saying to you unless you walk under "grace" you are lost. The truth is you are lost if you stop following Jesus and His principles, the Holy Spirit in your heart. You are in His covenant, and reassured of this reality daily by His Spirit. But maybe this is not a reality for you and that is the real problem. In reality you hate yourself and do not even count yourself as acceptable.
"Carnal sin" is doing anything in life but for non-spiritual reasons. The reason why this concept is so dangerous is everything has an element of self, or Jesus, or friends, or family, or status involved in it. But Jesus washes this clean, He becomes our focus and we stop self analysing and self condemning, as if we are justifying everything before the Lord which is not sin.
So in reality those who claim to walk under-grace are walking in 1000's more condemnation than I am who knows how to define sin. In this regard love is freedom, knowing when things are acceptable.
Carnal Sin
If I do anything, it is put on the analysis table to be regarded as acceptable or a failure.
This idea works on the basis the Lord does not use his broken, limited, mortal people for His purposes, but only the "perfect" parts. So why am I writing here? Because I am truly saddened by what I am reading and what people claim as truth.
I am called by the Lord to defend His glorious gospel and share the love that is overflowing.
Now grace7x77 can only continue this theology in the belief we are not saved, that his mission is to convert the church.
Strangely I am here to share that changing the emotional reality within is the walk with Jesus. Believing going to church does to transform you into someone else is the mistake. We are a people of change, led by the Holy Spirit, empowered by openness, honesty and truth of where we are.
God does change us, refine us, make us like pure gold. Many will testify of this in their lives, how the power of sin has been broken and the light of life has dawned in them, with streams of living water flowing.
But what hyper-grace is saying is after years of walking with the Lord, the dry desert of their hearts was just that, until they found release from an over condemning spirit which said everything they did was wrong, so they changed the gospel, and they found peace. But still carnal sin condemns them, so grace must abound more. So rather than being free they are actually more bound to sin and slaves to more intricate condemnation.
If I do anything, it is put on the analysis table to be regarded as acceptable or a failure.
This idea works on the basis the Lord does not use his broken, limited, mortal people for His purposes, but only the "perfect" parts. So why am I writing here? Because I am truly saddened by what I am reading and what people claim as truth.
I am called by the Lord to defend His glorious gospel and share the love that is overflowing.
Now grace7x77 can only continue this theology in the belief we are not saved, that his mission is to convert the church.
Strangely I am here to share that changing the emotional reality within is the walk with Jesus. Believing going to church does to transform you into someone else is the mistake. We are a people of change, led by the Holy Spirit, empowered by openness, honesty and truth of where we are.
God does change us, refine us, make us like pure gold. Many will testify of this in their lives, how the power of sin has been broken and the light of life has dawned in them, with streams of living water flowing.
But what hyper-grace is saying is after years of walking with the Lord, the dry desert of their hearts was just that, until they found release from an over condemning spirit which said everything they did was wrong, so they changed the gospel, and they found peace. But still carnal sin condemns them, so grace must abound more. So rather than being free they are actually more bound to sin and slaves to more intricate condemnation.
Does it matter that these christians so easily lie?
Yes. Because it suggests they do not know the Lord.
Imagine if they concluded they were wrong. They have condemned traditional faith empty lost is religion or carnal good works, they have bound themselves to a teacher of liberty with total condemnation, where could they go but unbelief?
I have met christian ship-wrecks like this. To much religion and not enough just living and being loving people.
This is often the fate of those who want to understand too much and think their own emotions and drives are innocent and not self deceptive.
Yes. Because it suggests they do not know the Lord.
Imagine if they concluded they were wrong. They have condemned traditional faith empty lost is religion or carnal good works, they have bound themselves to a teacher of liberty with total condemnation, where could they go but unbelief?
I have met christian ship-wrecks like this. To much religion and not enough just living and being loving people.
This is often the fate of those who want to understand too much and think their own emotions and drives are innocent and not self deceptive.
Thanks for the article, it just confirms the false doctrine of men by which these online disciples of his also preach falsely in the name of the Lord.
Jeremiah 17:5
Thus saith the Lord; Cursed be the man that trusteth in man, and maketh flesh his arm, and whose heart departeth from the Lord.
Jeremiah 17:5
Thus saith the Lord; Cursed be the man that trusteth in man, and maketh flesh his arm, and whose heart departeth from the Lord.
F
You are wrong in thinking we are saying not to confess. Just don't think that it affects your forgiveness one way or the other. In Christ, you are forgiven. Period. Our forgiveness is in Christ Jesus, if you have Him, you have all the forgiveness you will ever get - and all you will ever need.
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