The natural man
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So where we see Jesus being the one who takes away the sin of the world. Wont you just add ' Yes every tribe , kindred and nation ' or every Elect in the world ' , or World doesn't mean world ' . I.ll go to a verse that says he reconciled the world , and the same responses will come. We then look at the word ' all ' and this is where the paradigm comes into its own , Where ' all ' is only ' all ' when you say so.
Giving consent? This is a false dichotomy. Salvation comes by faith. You have to agree with this ,even with your worldview. The difference being, you have landed on the concept of ' regeneration precedes faith ' which is a reformed doctrine that is unique to ' Calvinism ' . Its a distinctive feature of the philosophy , that takes some doing to hood wink believers to accept . Once in , you convince yourself it all just made sense and you arrived at it due to just reading the bible.
“one died for ALL” – 2 Corinthians 5:14.
“he died for all” – 2 Corinthians 5:15.
God sent His only begotten Son to die for the sins of “the WHOLE world” – 1 John 2:2
2And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
No one just simply reading the bible could ever conclude that Jesus only died for some ,without an outside influence to the contrary.
A false dichotomy is then introduced to fool the believer. " If Jesus died for all then all must go to heaven then " . The unsuspecting victim who has not yet understood from the scriptures how salvation works ,is tricked into accepting false premises not wanting to be considered what ever scare tactic the person is wanting to avoid . Like ' universalism ' or ' being labelled a pelagian ect .
“he died for all” – 2 Corinthians 5:15.
God sent His only begotten Son to die for the sins of “the WHOLE world” – 1 John 2:2
2And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
No one just simply reading the bible could ever conclude that Jesus only died for some ,without an outside influence to the contrary.
A false dichotomy is then introduced to fool the believer. " If Jesus died for all then all must go to heaven then " . The unsuspecting victim who has not yet understood from the scriptures how salvation works ,is tricked into accepting false premises not wanting to be considered what ever scare tactic the person is wanting to avoid . Like ' universalism ' or ' being labelled a pelagian ect .
I have already stated:
God making it possible for us to choose Him does not equate to Him forcing us
So I am unsure as to what dispute you have with what I have said
God making it possible for us to choose Him does not equate to Him forcing us
So I am unsure as to what dispute you have with what I have said
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Not true. Christ died for all men. God shed His blood to redeem all men.
You are simply defaulting to your position of unteachable. You are deflecting and not addressing the point that man is redeemed by the blood of Christ by grace and that redemption is provided for all men. John 3:18-21 Jesus describes why all do not come but you will not to see the truth presented.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
You are simply defaulting to your position of unteachable. You are deflecting and not addressing the point that man is redeemed by the blood of Christ by grace and that redemption is provided for all men. John 3:18-21 Jesus describes why all do not come but you will not to see the truth presented.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
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All of us were born into this world by our natural birth, tainted with the sin of Adam. Eph 2:3, Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others. We all were as those described in John 3:20 that would not come to the light, but God (Eph 2:4-5) who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, even when we were dead (spiritually, and could not respond to the things of the Spirit) hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace are ye saved).
A regenerated babe in Christ, such as yourself, is teachable, but some babes mature much slower than others. They sustain themselves by the milk of the word, and gradually, by being taught they grow into maturity by coming unto a knowledge of God's righteousness contained in the gospel.
A regenerated babe in Christ, such as yourself, is teachable, but some babes mature much slower than others. They sustain themselves by the milk of the word, and gradually, by being taught they grow into maturity by coming unto a knowledge of God's righteousness contained in the gospel.
Come on! Sanctification starts after salvation it does not lead to salvation. John 3:18-21 clearly demonstrates why some do not come to Christ. The Light appears to all men some turn away and some come into the Light. All men decide to come or to turn away. God knows but we must trust Him because we do not know.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
For the cause of Christ
Roger
Yes, God does know, by his foreknowledge, and tells us that no one would seek (come to him) him, no, not one, Psalms 14:2-3.
That is why God choose an elect people out of those. God would have been a just God had he left us all to go to hell.
Scripture proves scripture, but you must consider all of them to come unto a knowledge of the truth.
That is why God choose an elect people out of those. God would have been a just God had he left us all to go to hell.
Scripture proves scripture, but you must consider all of them to come unto a knowledge of the truth.
You are wrong and will not repent. Good works play not part in my theology of saved by grace. Your theology of saved by election is designed to absolve your of your need to acknowledge that you are a sinner and need Jesus to save you from your sins.
Adam chose to sin and you must choose to receive Christ. It is a choice forged in conviction of sin, righteousness and judgment. Anything else is a corrupt gospel and produces corrupt fruit.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
Adam chose to sin and you must choose to receive Christ. It is a choice forged in conviction of sin, righteousness and judgment. Anything else is a corrupt gospel and produces corrupt fruit.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
That doesn't make sense. " After YOU trusted ' And After YOU believed . What were are dealing with here is common sense . YOU trusted . YOU believed. This is a clear. There's nothing obscure . AFTER YOU BELIEVED . Who believed ? AFTER YOU TRUSTED . Who trusted ? This is too silly to argue. Well unless you have another pressing presupposition that needs to fit .
13¶In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
Now of course with post hoc rationalization your going to have to say . " Well they did believe and trust. But this was because of irresistible grace ect and people can't just believe the Gospel without being regenerated first. Because Jesus only died for the chosen ones ect . This is where the bible can no longer be read plainly because a system is dictating " After YOU trusted . After YOU believed . No longer can we take a common sense approach to that verse and Paul might as well not bothered to put it like that. Preferring instead . " After God caused you to trust " . After God caused you to believe.
13¶In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
Now of course with post hoc rationalization your going to have to say . " Well they did believe and trust. But this was because of irresistible grace ect and people can't just believe the Gospel without being regenerated first. Because Jesus only died for the chosen ones ect . This is where the bible can no longer be read plainly because a system is dictating " After YOU trusted . After YOU believed . No longer can we take a common sense approach to that verse and Paul might as well not bothered to put it like that. Preferring instead . " After God caused you to trust " . After God caused you to believe.