The Rapture

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Roadkill

Senior Member
Dec 19, 2017
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Was it Gabriel, and did he give you some new revelations? ;)
No not Gabriel. Their names are too complicated for our voices to mechanically reproduce at this time. He gave me an alias that is a short version of his name if you must know. I'm not at liberty to write what this is but it's a very basic alias name. Here's something concerning this though, All the angel's names in the Bible are Aliases. Shocker I know, but we just can't speak their true names correctly and to do so would actually give us power to call on them at this time, which we are not supposed to have this courtesy as of yet.
 

louis

Senior Member
Nov 1, 2017
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God told Daniel that there would be more revealed as the end times approached. Do you speak for God the Father? Don't discredit until May lest you prove to struggle against God.
Good common sense reasoning towards the Word. Something here many discard in favor of their own unsupported by scriptures dogmas.
 

Ahwatukee

Senior Member
Mar 12, 2015
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How do you think the little horn wonderfully destroys the saints through peace and prosperity, if he will not be standing in our hearts? Off to lunch...

Daniel 8:24 And his power shall be mighty, but not by his own power: and he shall destroy wonderfully, and shall prosper, and practise, and shall destroy the mighty and the holy people.25 And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.
Well first of all, in answer to your question, there is nothing in that scripture that would allude to the little horn, the antichrist, standing the temple of our hearts. That is just a misapplication of scripture. For the scripture states that he is going to stand in the literal temple proclaiming himself to be God. Those who worship him, his image and receive his mark, are doomed!

We know from 2 Thessalonians 2:9-10 and Revelation 13:13-14, that this little horn, the antichrist, will deceive the inhabitants of the earth through Satanic counterfeit miracles, signs and wonders, which the false prophet will perform on behalf of the first beast, the purpose of which will be to give credibility to the antichrist's/Beasts claim of being God.

"One of the heads of the beast appeared to be fatally wounded. But the mortal wound was healed, and the whole world was astonished and followed the beast. They worshiped the dragon who had given authority to the beast, and they worshiped the beast, saying, “Who is like the beast, and who can wage war against him?” - Rev.13:3-4

"The beast that you saw was, and now is no more, but is about to come up out of the abyss and go to its destruction. And those who dwell on the earth whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world will be astonished when they see the beast that was, and is not, and yet will be. " - Rev.13:8

This coming man of lawlessness, the antichrist/beast, is going to be promising the people prosperity here and now in this life, which is what people are interested in and not in the promise of eternal life in the kingdom of God. This man will be promising them prosperity here and now. This along with all of those miracles, signs and wonders that will be performed, will deceive the inhabitants of the earth through peaceful means, leading them to their doom.
 

Ahwatukee

Senior Member
Mar 12, 2015
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God told Daniel that there would be more revealed as the end times approached. Do you speak for God the Father? Don't discredit until May lest you prove to struggle against God.
We'll see come May if your claim is true, won't we.

I only speak what God says in his word, not what He doesn't say. You are the one who is speaking on behalf of God the Father, for it says so right in your post.
 
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Ahwatukee

Senior Member
Mar 12, 2015
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I did not write May 18th, knuckle head. Get it right. I wrote in May of 2018 that they would break ground for the Temple Mount. It's going to be right beside the Al-Aqsa Mosque. It is politically impossible for me to know this at this time.
Oh, excuse me. As I corrected my own self in the post, when May of this year passes by and there is no fulfillment of your claim from God for the ground breaking of the temple, then at that time you will become a false prophet, because If God told you that, then it must happen. If it doesn't, then God didn't tell you. As I said, this is important and not a trivial issue. You have claimed something from God and have given a specific month. Therefore, it is important for us to watch. For if it was from God, then it will happen, but if not, then it makes you a false prophet/teacher.
 

louis

Senior Member
Nov 1, 2017
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Well first of all, in answer to your question, there is nothing in that scripture that would allude to the little horn, the antichrist, standing the temple of our hearts.[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
You basically ignore the scriptures I posted showing the Lord and Holy Spirit residing in the Holy people, and as such you cannot bring yourself to acknowledge some indivdual (the antichrist) will for a time stand more prominent in our hearts than the Lord.

That is just a misapplication of scripture. For the scripture states that he is going to stand in the literal temple proclaiming himself to be God. [FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
2 Thessalonians 2:4 [FONT=&quot]Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

[/FONT]
2 Thessalonians 2:4 has him sitting in the temple, shewing himself that he is god. God is love, remember (1 John 4:8 & 16)?
He is therefore showing himself through the peace and prosperity that he brings about to be the love in peoples hearts, including in the hearts of the saints, where he ought not sit.


We know from 2 Thessalonians 2:9-10 and Revelation 13:13-14, that this little horn, the antichrist, will deceive the inhabitants of the earth through Satanic counterfeit miracles, signs and wonders, which the false prophet will perform on behalf of the first beast, the purpose of which will be to give credibility to the antichrist's/Beasts claim of being God. [FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
Do you really believe that in this day and age that if someone were to stand in some building in Jerusalem and proclaim himself god, and then was able to do some counterfeit miracles, signs and wonders; that the whole world would then worship him for these false signs? The people for the most part didn't love Jesus, or the apostles,... and they raised the dead.

They worshiped the dragon who had given authority to the beast, and they worshiped the beast, saying, “Who is like the beast, and who can wage war against him?” - Rev.13:3-4
To paraphrase Rev 13:3-4, and in context with Daniel 8:24-25; Whose system is like that of the beasts which brings about peace and prosperity, what other system can contend with the beasts system and provide a better lifestyle?
This coming man of lawlessness, the antichrist/beast, is going to be promising the people prosperity here and now in this life, which is what people are interested in and not in the promise of eternal life in the kingdom of God. This man will be promising them prosperity here and now. This along with all of those miracles, signs and wonders that will be performed, will deceive the inhabitants of the earth through peaceful means, leading them to their doom.
The beast and the little horn will bring peace and prosperity (Daniel 8:24-25), through which the whole world will be deceived, including the saints in whose hearts his prosperous, peaceful kingdom will also be for a time.
Remember the scripture about when the Lord returns, He asks: whether He will find faith on the earth?
Maybe it has something to do with the peace and prosperity the beasts system will produce that has a negative effect on faith, and thereby destroys the holy peoples faith?
 

Ahwatukee

Senior Member
Mar 12, 2015
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You basically ignore the scriptures I posted showing the Lord and Holy Spirit residing in the Holy people, and as such you cannot bring yourself to acknowledge some indivdual (the antichrist) will for a time stand more prominent in our hearts than the Lord.

2 Thessalonians 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

2 Thessalonians 2:4 has him sitting in the temple, shewing himself that he is god. God is love, remember (1 John 4:8 & 16)?
He is therefore showing himself through the peace and prosperity that he brings about to be the love in peoples hearts, including in the hearts of the saints, where he ought not sit.


Do you really believe that in this day and age that if someone were to stand in some building in Jerusalem and proclaim himself god, and then was able to do some counterfeit miracles, signs and wonders; that the whole world would then worship him for these false signs? The people for the most part didn't love Jesus, or the apostles,... and they raised the dead.

To paraphrase Rev 13:3-4, and in context with Daniel 8:24-25; Whose system is like that of the beasts which brings about peace and prosperity, what other system can contend with the beasts system and provide a better lifestyle?
The beast and the little horn will bring peace and prosperity (Daniel 8:24-25), through which the whole world will be deceived, including the saints in whose hearts his prosperous, peaceful kingdom will also be for a time.
Remember the scripture about when the Lord returns, He asks: whether He will find faith on the earth?
Maybe it has something to do with the peace and prosperity the beasts system will produce that has a negative effect on faith, and thereby destroys the holy peoples faith?
Regardless of all that you have written above, the context of the scripture speaks for itself. I am not against you, but I am just making it known that, the antichrist is going to make his agreement with Israel, initiating that last seven year period. Then in the middle he is going to cause the sacrifices and offerings to cease and will set up that abomination in the holy place.

In 2 Thes.2:4, Paul states that this man of lawlessness will literally stand in the temple proclaiming himself to be God or and exalt himself above anything that is called God or worshiped. There is nothing in the context that would infer the antichrist figuratively standing the temple of our hearts. It's going to be a literal event, which is what causes Israel to flee out into the wilderness to that place God will have prepared for here as described in Matt.24:15-22 and Rev.12:6, 14.

It will be a literal event in the future temple.
 
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louis

Senior Member
Nov 1, 2017
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Regardless of all that you have written above, the context of the scripture speaks for itself. I am not against you, but I am just making it known that, the antichrist is going to make his agreement with Israel, initiating that last seven year period. Then in the middle he is going to cause the sacrifices and offerings to cease and will set up that abomination in the holy place.

In 2 Thes.2:4, Paul states that this man of lawlessness will literally stand in the temple proclaiming himself to be God or and exalt himself above anything that is called God or worshiped. There is nothing in the context that would infer the antichrist figuratively standing the temple of our hearts. It's going to be a literal event, which is what causes Israel to flee out into the wilderness to that place God will have prepared for here as described in Matt.24:15-22 and Rev.12:6, 14.

It will be a literal event in the future temple.
I agree that the little horn (the antichrist) is scheduled to make a covenant with many or one week according to Daniel 9:27, and that it will include the land of Israel.
This, however, is where our perspectives part ways as to what occurs next in scriptures.
In the middle of the week of the covenant with many, the little horn will cause the cessation to the daily sacrifice.
This daily sacrifice is the taking of Israeli lives according to Isaiah 28:18-20.
The bed shorter than one can stretch himself and the cover to narrow to cover oneself, represnts the land of Israels North to South borders being too short in distance to stretch out away from Death and Hell, and its East to West borders to narrow to find cover from the aerial sorties that will take the lives of Israelis by day and by night during the first half of the week.
After a complete annihilation of the land of Israel is when the abomination of desolation calls off the daily sacrifice.

Isaiah 28:18 [FONT=&quot]And your covenant with death shall be disannulled, and your agreement with hell shall not stand; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, then ye shall be trodden down by it.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]19 From the time that it goeth forth it shall take you: for morning by morning shall it pass over, by day and by night: and it shall be a vexation only to understand the report.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]20 For the bed is shorter than that a man can stretch himself on it: and the covering narrower than that he can wrap himself in it.[/FONT]

Daniel 9:27 [FONT=&quot]And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.[/FONT]
 

louis

Senior Member
Nov 1, 2017
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I also have nothing against you Ahwatukee, and wish the best for you, and that the Lord helps us to gain further knowledge on these events, as indicated in Daniel 12:4 & 9.
I would like to ask you a couple of questions though.
In Matthew 24:15-16, the Lord informs us that when we see the abomination of desolation (aka the little horn/the antichrist) stand in the holy place, that those in Judea should then flee to the mountains.
According to your perspective this would put the antichrist standing in a rebuilt temple in Jerusalem before any desolation takes place, would it not?
Second question is easier. As mountains in the bible are often a metaphor for large nations, and hills often refer to small nations; do you realize that when the people in Judea are told that upon seeing the abomination of desolation standing where he ought not stand that they should then flee into the large nations for cover?

Matthew 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:
 

Endoscopy

Senior Member
Oct 13, 2017
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No not Gabriel. Their names are too complicated for our voices to mechanically reproduce at this time. He gave me an alias that is a short version of his name if you must know. I'm not at liberty to write what this is but it's a very basic alias name. Here's something concerning this though, All the angel's names in the Bible are Aliases. Shocker I know, but we just can't speak their true names correctly and to do so would actually give us power to call on them at this time, which we are not supposed to have this courtesy as of yet.
Are you willing to live with what happened in Biblical times to a prophet that prophecied an error? Death.
 

Lucy-Pevensie

Senior Member
Dec 20, 2017
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Are you willing to LIVE with DEATH?
Is that a trick question?
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
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No not Gabriel. Their names are too complicated for our voices to mechanically reproduce at this time. He gave me an alias that is a short version of his name if you must know. I'm not at liberty to write what this is but it's a very basic alias name. Here's something concerning this though, All the angel's names in the Bible are Aliases. Shocker I know, but we just can't speak their true names correctly and to do so would actually give us power to call on them at this time, which we are not supposed to have this courtesy as of yet.
That's interesting and I certainly would not dispute that. But what exactly did he communicate to you?
 

Ahwatukee

Senior Member
Mar 12, 2015
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In Matthew 24:15-16, the Lord informs us that when we see the abomination of desolation (aka the little horn/the antichrist) stand in the holy place, that those in Judea should then flee to the mountains.
According to your perspective this would put the antichrist standing in a rebuilt temple in Jerusalem before any desolation takes place, would it not?
No! The antichrist establishes his seven year agreement/covenant with Israel, they build their temple and they begin sacrifice and offerings. This continues on until the middle of the seven years where he causes the sacrifice and offerings to cease and sets up that abomination in the holy place, which is the room just outside the Holy of Holies. This setting up of the abomination causes Israel to flee into the desert to that place prepared for her by God where she will remain for 1260 days which is that last 3 1/2 years. (Matt.24:15-22, Rev.12:6, 14)

Israel fleeing into the desert is the desolation. It is the emptying or making Jerusalem desolate. So, at some time during the time he causes the sacrifice and offerings to cease and the abomination is set up, he will stand in the temple proclaiming himself to be God.

Second question is easier. As mountains in the bible are often a metaphor for large nations, and hills often refer to small nations; do you realize that when the people in Judea are told that upon seeing the abomination of desolation standing where he ought not stand that they should then flee into the large nations for cover?
Below are the related scriptures:

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"So when you see standing in the holy place ‘the abomination of desolation,’ described by the prophet Daniel (let the reader understand), then let those in Judea flee (desolation) to the mountains. Let no one on the housetop come down to retrieve anything from his house. And let no one in the field return for his cloak.

"How miserable those days will be for pregnant and nursing mothers! Pray that your flight will not occur in the winter or on the Sabbath. For at that time there will be great tribulation, unmatched from the beginning of the world until now, and never to be seen again. If those days had not been cut short, nobody would be saved. But for the sake of the elect, those days will be shortened."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"The woman fled into the wilderness, where God had prepared a place for her to be nourished for one thousand two hundred sixty days." - Rev.12:6

"But the woman was given two wings of a great eagle to fly from the presence of the serpent to her place in the wilderness, where she was nourished for a time, and times, and half a time.: - Rev.12:14

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

You are correct in that, the word "mountain" is used in scripture to represent kingdoms/governments, but only if the context warrants it, which should always be addressed first. Therefore, if we look at the scriptures, there is nothing in the context that would lead the reader to interpret their fleeing out into the Judean mountains as representing fleeing to another nation, but it says to flee from Judea to the mountains. Below is an example of when scripture infers that the word "Mountain" as not referring to a literal mountain, but as a kingdom:

"While you were watching, a rock was cut out, but not by human hands. It struck the statue on its feet of iron and clay and smashed them. Then the iron, the clay, the bronze, the silver and the gold were all broken to pieces and became like chaff on a threshing floor in the summer. The wind swept them away without leaving a trace. But the rock that struck the statue became a huge mountain and filled the whole earth.

So, the rock represents Jesus Christ, who is dismantling all human government. And after falling on the feet of the statue and smashing it to pieces, the rock then becomes a huge mountainwhich fills the whole earth, which is symbolic for Jesus' millennial kingdom. Because the scripture is written in parable form, in forces the reader to apply a different meaning to the word mountain. Here in Matt.24 there is no such inference to a symbolic meaning and the reader therefore should apply the definition of it referring to literal mountains. This is one of the on-going problems by expositors in interpreting scripture today, which is applying a symbolic interpretation to something that is meant to be interpreted literally and vice versa. When this happens, the meaning that God meant to covey in the scripture is distorted.


So, in Matt.24:15-22 and Rev.12:6, 14, we have the scripture stating that those who are in Jerusalem to flee i.e. make Jerusalem desolate (emptying) when they see the abomination set up. Then in Rev.12:6 and 14, we have the woman, who is symbolically representing Israel, being pursued by the dragon/Satan, where she goes out in the wilderness to a place prepared for her by God. To further emphasize their fleeing, Jesus says "how miserable it will be for "pregnant women and nursing mothers," which would demonstrate the haste in which their fleeing takes place, as well as the command for those on top of their houses to no go down in them to get anything out, nor to come in from the field to get any clothing. Just get the heck out of there!

So, the temple is literal, the antichrist/beast standing in the temple is literal, the desolation or fleeing out of Jerusalem to the mountains is literal. There is not parabolic language used here representing mountains or temple.

I hope that this makes sense.
 
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Endoscopy

Senior Member
Oct 13, 2017
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Are you willing to LIVE with DEATH?
Is that a trick question?
Simple!
In Biblical times if a person claiming to be a prophet prophecied something that didn't happen they were put to death. False prophets were not allowed to live.
 
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louis

Senior Member
Nov 1, 2017
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No! The antichrist establishes his seven year agreement/covenant with Israel, they build their temple and they begin sacrifice and offerings. This continues on until the middle of the seven years where he causes the sacrifice and offerings to cease and sets up that abomination in the holy place, which is the room just outside the Holy of Holies. This setting up of the abomination causes Israel to flee into the desert to that place prepared for her by God where she will remain for 1260 days which is that last 3 1/2 years. (Matt.24:15-22, Rev.12:6, 14)

Israel fleeing into the desert is the desolation. It is the emptying or making Jerusalem desolate. So, at some time during the time he causes the sacrifice and offerings to cease and the abomination is set up, he will stand in the temple proclaiming himself to be God.


I will paraphrase what you claim here and let's see what sense this makes.
The Antichrist is going into the land of Israel, make a covenant with them and build them a new temple.
Israelis will then take up the old ritual of daily animal sacrifices in the new temple; and by doing so the Lord God is then going to consider this as the new holy place.
After some 3.5 years, however, the Antichrist will then decide to stop the daily animal sacrifices, and instead bring in some sort of abomination idol.
At this point, Judeans are suppose to flee into literal mountains of Israel where they are to make do for the next 3.5 years.

What makes sense to me, is that this perspective is equivalent to a bad B rated sci fi flick.




 

Ahwatukee

Senior Member
Mar 12, 2015
11,162
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Morning Louis,

I will paraphrase what you claim here and let's see what sense this makes.


First off, there is not going to be anything with the events during the time of God's wrath that are going to be normal. there is going to be a lot of demonic activity the likes of which have not experienced.

The Antichrist is going into the land of Israel, make a covenant with them and build them a new temple.


Just to be clear, it most likely will not be the beast who builds them a temple, but will allow them to build it. You see, currently the Dome of the Rock, which as you know is the holy site of Islam. Though Israel won the six day war, Moshe Dian left the temple mount under the control of the
Waqf (the Muslim religious authorities), which I believe was definitely by God's design in order to keep Israel from building her temple before the proper time. When that antichrist is revealed, I believe that he will appease both sides, allowing Israel to build her temple. By the way, they already have the blue prints all drawn for the building of the temple, they have reconvened the Sanhedrin, are teaching their priests how to sacrifice and most of the furniture for the temple is ready.

Israelis will then take up the old ritual of daily animal sacrifices in the new temple; and by doing so the Lord God is then going to consider this as the new holy place.


By your use of the words "old ritual" I'm guessing you are referring to the fact that, we are now saved by grace through faith and not by observing the law, and you'd be correct. However, this is the fulfillment of that seventy sets of seven year periods that was decreed upon Israel and Jerusalem (Dan.9:24-27). The seventy sevens are divided up onto three parts 1). Seven sevens to restore and rebuild Jerusalem, 2) at the end of sixty two sevens the Messiah would be cut off, which is Christ crucified. From that time, the Lord put a pause on that last seven years and began to build His church. Once the church has been completed, the Lord will descend from heaven and gather His church taking us back to the Father's house. After that, the Lord will pick up right where He left off with Israel in fulfillment of that last seven years, temple included.

After some 3.5 years, however, the Antichrist will then decide to stop the daily animal sacrifices, and instead bring in some sort of abomination idol.


Yes, that is correct. In the middle of the seven years the antichrist/beast will put a stop to the sacrifices that will have been going on for 3 1/2 years and will set up that abomination, which is the word "bdelugma" meaning a detestable stench that goes up before God.
an abominable thing, an accursed thing. I believe that this abomination is also mentioned in Revelation, but by description only, as that image that the false prophet causes the people of the earth to make.

At this point, Judean's are suppose to flee into literal mountains of Israel where they are to make do for the next 3.5 years.


Yes, correct again! Below is the scriptures:

"
The woman fled into the wilderness, where God had prepared a place for her to be nourished for one thousand two hundred sixty days." - Rev.12:6

"But the woman was given two wings of a great eagle to fly from the presence of the serpent to her place in the wilderness, where she was nourished for a time, and times, and half a time." - Rev.12:14

So, though it seems like the "equivalent of a bad B rated sci fi flick," this time is going to be like no other time in the history of the planet. The scripture states that when Satan sends a flood (army) after the woman/Israel, the earth opens its mouth and swallows that army. Kind of reminds me of when Dathan and Abiram when God caused the ground to open up and swallowed their entire camp with all their wives and children. God is going to do the same thing here, but on a much bigger scale.

God will have a place prepared for Israel out in the wilderness where they will be cared for and protected until the Lord returns 3 1/2 years later.

Just remember that during that time of wrath and everything that will be taking place, normal will be out the window!


 

louis

Senior Member
Nov 1, 2017
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I guess we'll have to see things differently for the time being, until things develop further.
Then we'll see if people start slaughtering cows and burning them on alters.
And whether the few in Judea who recognize the Antichrist, will go camping in the mountains of Israel for 3.5 years, or if they will emigrate to the larger nations of the world.
 

louis

Senior Member
Nov 1, 2017
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I guess we'll have to see things differently for the time being, until things develop further.
Then we'll see if people start slaughtering cows and burning them on alters.
And whether the few in Judea who recognize the Antichrist, will go camping in the mountains of Israel for 3.5 years, or if they will emigrate to the larger nations of the world.
Ahwatukee, Would you deny this sacrifice the Lord has in Bozrah in Isaiah 34:6 is human, despite the metaphors to animals?

Isaiah 34:6 [FONT=&quot]The sword of the [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Lord[/FONT][FONT=&quot] is filled with blood, it is made fat with fatness, and with the blood of lambs and goats, with the fat of the kidneys of rams: for the [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Lord[/FONT][FONT=&quot] hath a sacrifice in Bozrah, and a great slaughter in the land of Idumea.[/FONT]
 

Roadkill

Senior Member
Dec 19, 2017
237
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We'll see come May if your claim is true, won't we.

I only speak what God says in his word, not what He doesn't say. You are the one who is speaking on behalf of God the Father, for it says so right in your post.
Like I said, I'm not a Prophet. I'm just a regular guy with a opportunity presented to me that I just couldn't pass up. Could you?

I'm in the same wait and see mode as all of you as far as this coming to pass. I just got the info differently than you. A different kind of servant if you will.

But yes, we will wait and see. I'm just curious just how you're going to debunk it? Be sure that I'm living in South West United States and that I am a very poor Humble Mechanic. Have no political connections to know this and have no ties ( other than genetic ) to the Jews in Israel.
 

tanakh

Senior Member
Dec 1, 2015
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That's interesting and I certainly would not dispute that. But what exactly did he communicate to you?
Last time an Angel allegedly spoke to someone the outcome was the Koran.