The seven candlesticks of God

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1

1still_waters

Guest
#21
#21
VW said:
Rev 4:5-6 And from the throne proceed flashes of lightning and sounds and peals of thunder. And there were seven lamps of fire burning before the throne, which are the seven Spirit of God; and before the throne there was, as it were, a sea of glass like crystal; and in the center and around the throne, four living creatures full of eyes in front and behind.

I did not actually read this passage before I posted this, but remember by the Holy Spirit. So maybe candlesticks might have not been the best of words to use. But I know that candlesticks has been used by the Spirit to describe these Spirit of God before, and they have been represented by candlesticks in the old testament many times.

I read the NASB.
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This portion talks about seven lamps of fire burning before the throne. These are defined as the Seven spirits of God.

So....

Seven lamps of fire = Seven Spirits of God.

Seven Candlesticks =The churches.

Lamps of fire does not equal the churches

Seven candlesticks does not equal the seven spirits of God.
 
1

1still_waters

Guest
#22
#22
Ramon said:
This is where it is important to see what the Church is, as it is not a building people go to. But it is all those who are lead by the Spirit of God. So to say that it is a church is to say that it is a body of believers lead by the Spirit. If a lamp is removed from it's place how will that church receive light?
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Lampestand = church--Jesus
 
VW

VW

Banned
#23
Dec 22, 2009
4,579
9
0
#23
Ramon said:
This is where it is important to see what the Church is, as it is not a building people go to. But it is all those who are lead by the Spirit of God. So to say that it is a church is to say that it is a body of believers lead by the Spirit. If a lamp is removed from it's place how will that church receive light?
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Is the church anything? Is the building anything? What makes the church something alive to God, that she actually becomes a dwelling place for God, is the Holy Spirit in her. Without the Holy Spirit, she can call herself a church, but she is not. And Jesus is the One who can give or take this candlestick, this Spirit of God to the church.

That the seven lampstands in heaven are called a fire, while in the church they are called a candlestick, shows one thing, how much we actually reflect the Spirit of God. In heaven the Spirits of God burn like fire before the throne. In the church, the Spirit of God is a candlestick. Same Spirit, but how much we reveal Him is how much light we have.

And that was why I wrote the message above.

In Christ,
 
1

1still_waters

Guest
#24
#24
VW said:
T Oh well, I guess this makes me a false prophet even more.
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If I thought you were a false prophet you'd be banned. Like I said in a post yesterday, sometimes we gotta press you a lil bit to figure you what you're tryin to say and seein u claim to be a prophet with access to God's voice directly, I'm gonna test the stuff you say.
 
VW

VW

Banned
#25
Dec 22, 2009
4,579
9
0
#25
In fact the church owes her very existence to the Spirit of God, for we are all added by the Spirit, making up the body of Christ.
 
R

Ramon

Guest
#26
#26
VW said:
Is the church anything? Is the building anything? What makes the church something alive to God, that she actually becomes a dwelling place for God, is the Holy Spirit in her. Without the Holy Spirit, she can call herself a church, but she is not. And Jesus is the One who can give or take this candlestick, this Spirit of God to the church.

That the seven lampstands in heaven are called a fire, while in the church they are called a candlestick, shows one thing, how much we actually reflect the Spirit of God. In heaven the Spirits of God burn like fire before the throne. In the church, the Spirit of God is a candlestick. Same Spirit, but how much we reveal Him is how much light we have.

And that was why I wrote the message above.

In Christ,
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Yes. I understood this. I don't see where the disagreement here is. I thought we should all understand this.

May Jesus bless you.
 
R

Ramon

Guest
#27
#27
1still_waters said:
If I thought you were a false prophet you'd be banned. Like I said in a post yesterday, sometimes we gotta press you a lil bit to figure you what you're tryin to say and seein u claim to be a prophet with access to God's voice directly, I'm gonna test the stuff you say.
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And how does one judge a prophet? God judges prophets. And the prophets are subject to the prophets. Not to any other. By what measure do you measure a man even? It will be measured to you again. And anyone who receives a righteous man in the name of a righteous man will receive a righteous man's reward. And anyone who receives a prophet only in the name of a prophet receives a prophets reward. AND ANYONE WHO RECEIVES A SERVANT OF JESUS IN THE NAME OF A SERVANT OF JESUS will receive His reward.

It was written to test the spirits to see if they are of God, but what measurement do you use? Do you use your own idea of what a prophet should say? Or do you hear from the Lord yourself?

Jesus made it clear that his sheep HEAR HIS VOICE AND THEY OBEY HIM. So we all should hear his voice and obey him.

May Jesus bless you.
 
A

AnandaHya

Guest
#28
#28
lol and everyone ignore the seven stars which are the seven angels of the churches....i wonder if stars give off any light?
 
R

Ramon

Guest
#29
#29
AnandaHya said:
lol and everyone ignore the seven stars which are the seven angels of the churches....i wonder if stars give off any light?
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The light of an angel cannot be compared to the Light of God. The messages were to the angels by the Spirit. No one can worship an angel and be in the Light. We worship Jesus Christ. We worship the Lord in Spirit and truth. Not any other being.
 
1

1still_waters

Guest
#30
#30
Ramon said:
And how does one judge a prophet? God judges prophets. .
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1 thes 5



19 Do not quench the Spirit; 20 do not despise prophetic [l]utterances. 21 But examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good; 22 abstain from every [m]form of evil.

1 John 4

1 Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.
 
R

Ramon

Guest
#31
#31
1still_waters said:
1 thes 5



19 Do not quench the Spirit; 20 do not despise prophetic [l]utterances. 21 But examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good; 22 abstain from every [m]form of evil.

1 John 4

1 Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.
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My friend you are fine in that you consider something before you accept it. As we all should. But again how do you measure it? Is it by what you suppose should be said or by what the Spirit tells you is right? Again how does one discern evil from good except that the SAME Spirit testifies of it. This also is one of the gifts. But I tell you the truth, the same Spirit that was in Christ MUST be in you if you are to be called the child of God.

And there are many gifts but ONE Spirit. If the Lord has given you the gift of discernment then that is good, but no one can magnify gifts over the Lord Jesus. The truth is that Jesus Christ, even his own words will measure EVERY man according to his deeds. So no one is without excuse. The words of Jesus judge every man. You and I. So how do you measure a man?

No authority of man on earth can thwart the authority that comes from heaven.

May Jesus bless you.
 
A

AnandaHya

Guest
#32
#32
Ramon said:
This is where it is important to see what the Church is, as it is not a building people go to. But it is all those who are lead by the Spirit of God. So to say that it is a church is to say that it is a body of believers lead by the Spirit. If a lamp is removed from it's place how will that church receive light?
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do you remember the parable of the 10 virgins and their lamps?
 
A

AnandaHya

Guest
#34
#34
Ramon said:
My friend you are fine in that you consider something before you accept it. As we all should. But again how do you measure it? Is it by what you suppose should be said or by what the Spirit tells you is right? Again how does one discern evil from good except that the SAME Spirit testifies of it. This also is one of the gifts. But I tell you the truth, the same Spirit that was in Christ MUST be in you if you are to be called the child of God.

And there are many gifts but ONE Spirit. If the Lord has given you the gift of discernment then that is good, but no one can magnify gifts over the Lord Jesus. The truth is that Jesus Christ, even his own words will measure EVERY man according to his deeds. So no one is without excuse. The words of Jesus judge every man. You and I. So how do you measure a man?

No authority of man on earth can thwart the authority that comes from heaven.

May Jesus bless you.
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no but you can determine if the person claiming to come from Jesus is preaching things that blatantly contradict God's revealed words and the Holy Spirit can testify they are speaking falsely and should not be trusted.

why add things to the Book of Revelation? why change words around to mean things they don't say in the Bible?

why condemn the church and claim that the lampstand will be removed? who can put out the lamps of the faithful? which church does VW claim will be destroyed? all of them? are all the churches of Christ corrupt in this world? all thousands of them? He knows this how?

no Ramon discernment is needed and it is only through the Holy Spirit that such falsehoods are revealed.
 
R

Ramon

Guest
#35
#35
AnandaHya said:
no but you can determine if the person claiming to come from Jesus is preaching things that blatantly contradict God's revealed words and the Holy Spirit can testify they are speaking falsely and should not be trusted.

why add things to the Book of Revelation? why change words around to mean things they don't say in the Bible?

why condemn the church and claim that the lampstand will be removed? who can put out the lamps of the faithful? which church does VW claim will be destroyed? all of them? are all the churches of Christ corrupt in this world? all thousands of them? He knows this how?

no Ramon discernment is needed and it is only through the Holy Spirit that such falsehoods is revealed.
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Anandahya. Jesus has all power to remove any lampstand. And it is HE who said he would if the people don't repent. Jesus has made this claim. That if the people don't repent he will remove it. So now then. If our testimony is of Jesus Christ and we know he has all power given to him, and we believe his words, why then can we not accept his authority.

The grace is here, that if the people repent then things will be okay. If not, as Jesus has all power to it will be removed from it's place.

May Jesus bless you.
 
Red33

Red33

Banned
#36
Jun 24, 2010
3,822
19
0
#36
VW said:
In fact the church owes her very existence to the Spirit of God, for we are all added by the Spirit, making up the body of Christ.
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NO! It was Jesus Christ that laid His life down for the church and the Holy Spirit reveals that to our hearts through the written word. Sinners are saved by believing upon the Lord Jesus Christ, who shed His blood and who forgives and cleanses us from all sin. We are born of the Spirit and the incorruptible seed of God's word through the faith of the Son of God. It is the life of the Son that saves us and His blood that cleanses us. The Spirit is given to us as a Spirit of promise to indwell and seal us until the day of redemption. Jesus Christ is our Savior, He is our redeemer, He is our Deliverer and it is in Him that we trust. Jesus Christ has given us His righteousness, His salvation, His eternal life that is in Himself and of His Spirit and our faith is in Him and we live by the faith of the Son of God, who died and gave His life for us. The Holy Spirit reveals Christ in us and these precious truths that we have been given by the Lord.
 
R

Ramon

Guest
#37
#37
Red33 said:
NO! It was Jesus Christ that laid His life down for the church and the Holy Spirit reveals that to our hearts through the written word. Sinners are saved by believing upon the Lord Jesus Christ, who shed His blood and who forgives and cleanses us from all sin. We are born of the Spirit and the incorruptible seed of God's word through the faith of the Son of God. It is the life of the Son that saves us and His blood that cleanses us. The Spirit is given to us as a Spirit of promise to indwell and seal us until the day of redemption. Jesus Christ is our Savior, He is our redeemer, He is our Deliverer and it is in Him that we trust. Jesus Christ has given us His righteousness, His salvation, His eternal life that is in Himself and of His Spirit and our faith is in Him and we live by the faith of the Son of God, who died and gave His life for us. The Holy Spirit reveals Christ in us and these precious truths that we have been given by the Lord.
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Before the scriptures was the breathe. And that breathe was breathed into man and then they became living souls. It is the Spirit of God that has testified since the beginning of Jesus Christ. It is the Spirit that draws one to the Lord. No other way. Not by might nor by knowledge. It is by the Spirit of God to establish us. It is the Spirit who pointed ALWAYS to the savior. Though when scripture is read many can't hear his voice. The Spirit points to the Son and the Son to the Father so that God is glorified.

It has been the purpose of the Father since the beginning which Jesus Christ clearly speaks of to those who have ears to hear.

May Jesus bless you.
 
VW

VW

Banned
#38
Dec 22, 2009
4,579
9
0
#38
Lord, Jesus our savior, please, with the mercies of Your love, please reveal Yourself here, That You are God, that You have all authority, that You have received glory from the Father, that You are worthy of all praise. I ask You to make the light of Your love by Your Spirit to shine and burn so brightly that the whole world will be astonished, that the candle of Your Spirit be fanned into a flame that lights the entire world. For Your glory, in Your name,

please
 
R

Ramon

Guest
#39
#39
VW said:
Lord, Jesus our savior, please, with the mercies of Your love, please reveal Yourself here, That You are God, that You have all authority, that You have received glory from the Father, that You are worthy of all praise. I ask You to make the light of Your love by Your Spirit to shine and burn so brightly that the whole world will be astonished, that the candle of Your Spirit be fanned into a flame that lights the entire world. For Your glory, in Your name,

please
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Amen my friend Amen!
 
A

Abiding

Guest
#40
#40
Ramon said:
And how does one judge a prophet? God judges prophets. And the prophets are subject to the prophets. Not to any other. By what measure do you measure a man even? It will be measured to you again. And anyone who receives a righteous man in the name of a righteous man will receive a righteous man's reward. And anyone who receives a prophet only in the name of a prophet receives a prophets reward. AND ANYONE WHO RECEIVES A SERVANT OF JESUS IN THE NAME OF A SERVANT OF JESUS will receive His reward.

It was written to test the spirits to see if they are of God, but what measurement do you use? Do you use your own idea of what a prophet should say? Or do you hear from the Lord yourself?

Jesus made it clear that his sheep HEAR HIS VOICE AND THEY OBEY HIM. So we all should hear his voice and obey him.

May Jesus bless you.
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I judge by the bible i worship what else:)
 
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