The tithe.

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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#61
Giving more than 10% would also be a good way to show you are not being legalistic.
a tithe was not even money.

so to say the church should tithe is quite legalistic
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#62
I understand why someone would feel that way.
I am not sure if it can be defined exactly.
I like the idea of giving a proportion to the work of the Kingdom (support of the church) according to the income received before spending it on anything else even food.
But that is where my faith and conscience is at. I can't really tell people what to do. It has to be faith and a cheerful heart. I think that is why tithe is not mentioned in the New Testament or any amount. Peter telling Ananias and Saphira that it was theirs to do with what they wanted is a clear instruction that we are not told how much to give. They could have given only part if they wanted to but their lying about it was the sin.

In response to the OP if the pastor had said, "you can give whatever you want, in faith and a cheerful heart, but if everyone would plan on 10% and be consistent the church can plan on various outreach ministries to reach the lost in our community and missions to reach the lost world wide and we can budget accordingly." It might be more effective in getting people to get on board with that rather than trying to argue about it being a New Testament law which it is not.
My church asks people to commit to,give what they pledge for the year.they ask for no percents, just ask people to pledge. Then the budget accordingly.

they take into account that those ho do not pledge but give and those who theough hardhip can not meet their pledge when making their budget,

it has worked for a few decades.
now if you want to be part of the fiscal support team, they do ask you pledge at least 5%. But it is not required and they only speak on giving one time a year when it is time for pledging

my church has a budget of over 6 million dollars. and has never asked for a tithe or anything near it. And unlike most churches, again only speaks on giving one time a year
 

TheIndianGirl

Well-known member
Nov 22, 2019
1,522
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#63
My church asks for a tithe the first Sunday of the month, and then an offering the remaining Sundays. My pastor has the position that all church leadership (deacons, teachers, church administration team, other leaders in music, etc.) should give 10%. Any thoughts on this? Should church leadership give 10% (or similar amount)? It is not required, but expected.
 

breno785au

Senior Member
Jul 23, 2013
6,003
760
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Australia
#64
My church asks for a tithe the first Sunday of the month, and then an offering the remaining Sundays. My pastor has the position that all church leadership (deacons, teachers, church administration team, other leaders in music, etc.) should give 10%. Any thoughts on this? Should church leadership give 10% (or similar amount)? It is not required, but expected.
I'll put it this way.
We love to think that us Christians have moved away from the man made traditions and rules of the catholic Church some 500 years ago yet, make up all new ones for ourselves.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#65
My church asks for a tithe the first Sunday of the month, and then an offering the remaining Sundays. My pastor has the position that all church leadership (deacons, teachers, church administration team, other leaders in music, etc.) should give 10%. Any thoughts on this? Should church leadership give 10% (or similar amount)? It is not required, but expected.
A tithe is not required

a tithe was a tenth off all you have it’s not even money,

so they are not even Interprering it right
 
B

Blackpowderduelist

Guest
#66
A tithe is not required

a tithe was a tenth off all you have it’s not even money,

so they are not even Interprering it right
Wouldn't these churches that demand to tithe freak out if you brought 20 chickens 45 eggs two 5 gallon buckets full of sweet potatoes a goat 10 bushels of corn and 5 gallons of wine.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#67
Wouldn't these churches that demand to tithe freak out if you brought 20 chickens 45 eggs two 5 gallon buckets full of sweet potatoes a goat 10 bushels of corn and 5 gallons of wine.
Yeah they would. But that would be an actual tithe..lol
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
19,351
10,633
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#68
My church asks for a tithe the first Sunday of the month, and then an offering the remaining Sundays. My pastor has the position that all church leadership (deacons, teachers, church administration team, other leaders in music, etc.) should give 10%. Any thoughts on this? Should church leadership give 10% (or similar amount)? It is not required, but expected.
Ask your pastor to present a biblically sound case to support his "request".
 
S

Scribe

Guest
#69
If you ask your pastor he will probably tell you that the givers are the tithers. 95% of those who say they do not believe in tithing do not give much at all. Regardless of all their lofty reasonings why tithe is a Law and we should not teach it, and people should give from their heart they don't give much at all.

I know from having to enter the data into accounting software. The numbers don't lie. Talk is cheap. literally. :)
 

TheIndianGirl

Well-known member
Nov 22, 2019
1,522
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#70
If you ask your pastor he will probably tell you that the givers are the tithers. 95% of those who say they do not believe in tithing do not give much at all. Regardless of all their lofty reasonings why tithe is a Law and we should not teach it, and people should give from their heart they don't give much at all.

I know from having to enter the data into accounting software. The numbers don't lie. Talk is cheap. literally. :)
I agree with much of this. I believe that is why pastors make it seem that tithing is a requirement/Biblical (when many Christians argue that it is not) so that people give. It may be considered a means to an end, since churches do need money to keep going forward.
 
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Blackpowderduelist

Guest
#71
So
If you ask your pastor he will probably tell you that the givers are the tithers. 95% of those who say they do not believe in tithing do not give much at all. Regardless of all their lofty reasonings why tithe is a Law and we should not teach it, and people should give from their heart they don't give much at all.

I know from having to enter the data into accounting software. The numbers don't lie. Talk is cheap. literally. :)
So it's ok to twist scripture to manipulate people to give more. Even if it is a false burden that you heap on them. I guess that selling indulgence wasn't so bad it filled the coffers right.
 
S

Scribe

Guest
#72
So

So it's ok to twist scripture to manipulate people to give more. Even if it is a false burden that you heap on them. I guess that selling indulgence wasn't so bad it filled the coffers right.
If you tell people that tithing is not a law but a good way to support the church and the ministries of the church in spreading the Gospel then you have not twisted any scripture. If people don't want to do that then they don't have to.

The fact still remains that those members who believe in tithing tithe. MOST of the members who don't believe in tithing don't give squat. So with all their excellent talk about better methods of giving than tithing, they still don't give. Which means their talk is useless, and they themselves should adopt some sort of structure and budget of giving. Call it a proportion if they want, but do something.

Of course this whole conversation would not be important to the mind of the person who has given up meeting with the local church as God's method. Why would they care?
 

breno785au

Senior Member
Jul 23, 2013
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Australia
#73
I agree with much of this. I believe that is why pastors make it seem that tithing is a requirement/Biblical (when many Christians argue that it is not) so that people give. It may be considered a means to an end, since churches do need money to keep going forward.
Even if people are being stingy, teaching a false teaching so people give more is equally as bad, if not worse as it is deceitful.
 

breno785au

Senior Member
Jul 23, 2013
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#74
If you tell people that tithing is not a law but a good way to support the church and the ministries of the church in spreading the Gospel then you have not twisted any scripture. If people don't want to do that then they don't have to.

The fact still remains that those members who believe in tithing tithe. MOST of the members who don't believe in tithing don't give squat. So with all their excellent talk about better methods of giving than tithing, they still don't give. Which means their talk is useless, and they themselves should adopt some sort of structure and budget of giving. Call it a proportion if they want, but do something.

Of course this whole conversation would not be important to the mind of the person who has given up meeting with the local church as God's method. Why would they care?
No, giving should be from the heart, not out of compulsion. Any form of manipulation to get people to cough up should not be done.
 
S

Scribe

Guest
#75
No, giving should be from the heart, not out of compulsion. Any form of manipulation to get people to cough up should not be done.
Agreed. Not sure why you said "no, " since I said nothing about that. But I agree with your statement.
 
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Blackpowderduelist

Guest
#76
If you tell people that tithing is not a law but a good way to support the church and the ministries of the church in spreading the Gospel then you have not twisted any scripture. If people don't want to do that then they don't have to.

The fact still remains that those members who believe in tithing tithe. MOST of the members who don't believe in tithing don't give squat. So with all their excellent talk about better methods of giving than tithing, they still don't give. Which means their talk is useless, and they themselves should adopt some sort of structure and budget of giving. Call it a proportion if they want, but do something.

Of course this whole conversation would not be important to the mind of the person who has given up meeting with the local church as God's method. Why would they care?
Just calling it the tithe is manipulation. It's using the term of the law, and this the implications that go along with. Except those are false implications. Because the tithe was never money. It wasn't given, it was eaten before the Lord. We call telling a lie to extract money from people a scam. You can excuse the practice all you want but it's very bad doctrine.
 
S

Scribe

Guest
#78
Just calling it the tithe is manipulation. It's using the term of the law, and this the implications that go along with. Except those are false implications. Because the tithe was never money. It wasn't given, it was eaten before the Lord. We call telling a lie to extract money from people a scam. You can excuse the practice all you want but it's very bad doctrine.
If the pastor says "give as the Lord leads" and people want to give 10% that is their business. It is between them and God.

People who are faithful tithers with their paychecks do so because they believe God wants them too. It is an age old tradition that they understand and that is how they plan to do it. It is not for anyone to tell them they are doing it wrong.

Especially if they say that they know that it is not a law but they want to do it that way, it would be a sin to tell them they are wrong. If they prayed and asked God what they should give and they believe that the Lord lead them to give 10% no one has a right to tell them differently.

And the fact is no one who faithfully gives would ever tell another giver how to give. Only the people who don't give have advice about how not to tithe. No faithful consistent giver supporting the local assembly would ever discourage another giver from tithing.
 
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Blackpowderduelist

Guest
#79
If the pastor says "give as the Lord leads" and people want to give 10% that is their business. It is between them and God.

People who are faithful tithers with their paychecks do so because they believe God wants them too. It is an age old tradition that they understand and that is how they plan to do it. It is not for anyone to tell them they are doing it wrong.

Especially if they say that they know that it is not a law but they want to do it that way, it would be a sin to tell them they are wrong. If they prayed and asked God what they should give and they believe that the Lord lead them to give 10% no one has a right to tell them differently.

And the fact is no one who faithfully gives would ever tell another giver how to give. Only the people who don't give have advice about how not to tithe. No faithful consistent giver supporting the local assembly would ever discourage another giver from tithing.
Donating 10th of your income is not tithing. Tithing would be bringing a bunch of food to the church and having a feast. Tithing is also connected to the sacrifices.
And I know you where the one who entered the money numbers into the accounting books or what ever, there is always someone, and they then look down their nose at those who don't have to give, that's why I never put a name on the envelope and only put in cash. Envelope so the plate passers don't know, and cash so the bean counters don't know. I always noticed the plates would have piles of cash in them, you don't know who gave that. So your judgement is wrong. Which is one more reason to end that false teaching. Because people like you casting judgement on others according to the record books.
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
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#80
From what has been given to my understanding, true tithing would be akin to the tax system of the first Israel, and it amounted to ten per cent of your profit at the end of a year, not of your earnings.

Let me know how you come to think tithing is for a Christian theocracy? You responses will be welcome, and they will be interesting.

A collection plate in the assembly is for supporting the assembly at all levels, nothing more, nothing less.