The Trinity Discussion

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MarkHasFaith

Junior Member
Jul 15, 2017
27
0
0
#41
Your interpretation of these texts is wrong.

As human beings and believers in Christ we are NOT part of the Godhead.
We may be part of the Kingdom of God of which Jesus Christ is the head but that does NOT make us divine!

The Trinity is a doctrine about the nature of the divinity of God.
Human beings are never a part of that.

The fact that you do believe that humans are part of the Godhead unmasks a severe problem with your theology...



I'm just telling you what it says. It states clearly that in Jesus is the fulness of the Godhead and that we are complete in him.
So how could we not be part of it, if we are indeed in Christ? So you believe that you are a human being, a natural person?
According to the word we are born again from the spirit and are no longer in the flesh. Romans 8:9- But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you...
I agree with you that humans beings are not part of God's divine nature, flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom it says in 1Corinthians 15:50. But any born again person who is in Christ, is one Spirit in him and is indeed part of that divine nature. Just as 2Peter 1:4 states that he has given us great promises so that by them we are partakers of the divine nature.
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
9,257
376
83
#42
it makes no difference what i say or believe, what does the scripture say. where does it say that a believer must believe the Son is the Most High to obtain salvation?
This question is illogic.

Same like "where does the Scripture say I must believe Jesus is not angel to obtain salvation" etc.

You should ask "what does Scripture say about Jesus and about salvation?"
 

graceNpeace

Senior Member
Aug 12, 2016
2,180
83
48
#45
I'm just telling you what it says. It states clearly that in Jesus is the fulness of the Godhead and that we are complete in him.
So how could we not be part of it, if we are indeed in Christ? So you believe that you are a human being, a natural person?
According to the word we are born again from the spirit and are no longer in the flesh. Romans 8:9- But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you...
I agree with you that humans beings are not part of God's divine nature, flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom it says in 1Corinthians 15:50. But any born again person who is in Christ, is one Spirit in him and is indeed part of that divine nature. Just as 2Peter 1:4 states that he has given us great promises so that by them we are partakers of the divine nature.
Then you are saying that we are God!
And clearly that is NOT true!

So, I think you need to take another look at how you are interpreting Scripture...
 

savedtoast

Senior Member
Jul 19, 2017
151
0
0
#46
Alright I will try a different tack:

If God is the God Most High, then, what does that make Jesus Christ?
If the father is greater than Jesus and Jesus was the father, then is the father greater than himself. What of the spirit, is it lesser than the both of them?
 

jaybird88

Senior Member
Jan 7, 2015
4,115
98
48
#48
This question is illogic.

Same like "where does the Scripture say I must believe Jesus is not angel to obtain salvation" etc.

You should ask "what does Scripture say about Jesus and about salvation?"
[SUP]30 [/SUP]Now Jesus did many other signs in the presence of the disciples, which are not written in this book; [SUP]31 [/SUP]but these are written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.

and this passage is not good enough? "life in his name" IMO would mean salvation. why add to it?
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
9,257
376
83
#51
[SUP]30 [/SUP]Now Jesus did many other signs in the presence of the disciples, which are not written in this book; [SUP]31 [/SUP]but these are written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.

and this passage is not good enough? "life in his name" IMO would mean salvation. why add to it?
Because Bible has more verses?

Like

"No one has ever yet seen God. The only begotten God, the One being in the bosom of the Father, He has made Him known."
John 1:18

Why to remove it from the Bible?
 
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jaybird88

Senior Member
Jan 7, 2015
4,115
98
48
#52
So, was He sired by God, like you were, or, is something else implied by that title?
the Father calls Him Son, the Apostles call Him the Son, the Son calls Himself Son. there could be many things implied but IMO it does not give man the right to add doctrine to scripture.
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
9,257
376
83
#53
jaybird88:

If I understand you right, you want to believe wrongly about Jesus and still be saved?

Like to deny many verses about Him and demanding us to bring verses saying you will not be saved in such a faith?

I do not get this logic...
 

jaybird88

Senior Member
Jan 7, 2015
4,115
98
48
#54
jaybird88:

If I understand you right, you want to believe wrongly about Jesus and still be saved?

Like to deny many verses about Him and demanding us to bring verses saying you will not be saved in such a faith?

I do not get this logic...
so its wrong to believe John 20:31? is this a false statement?
 

graceNpeace

Senior Member
Aug 12, 2016
2,180
83
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#55
the Father calls Him Son, the Apostles call Him the Son, the Son calls Himself Son. there could be many things implied but IMO it does not give man the right to add doctrine to scripture.
The point is: In what way is Jesus the Son of God?
Is it because He is divine (just like the Father), or something else?
If He is the Son was there a time when He did NOT exist?

These questions are central to Christianity!
If Jesus Christ is NOT eternal, and NOT of the same essence, and therefore divinity, as the Father (and the Holy Spirit for that matter) then He cannot be our Saviour and His death was in vain - and our faith is hopeless!

But, actually the answers are all in Scripture and Scripture affirms that Jesus Christ is eternal, in as much God as the Father and the Holy Spirit are, that He took on a human form and allowed Himself to be humiliated, obedient even unto a death on the cross, where He died a substitute for our sins!
 

notbythesword

Senior Member
Apr 28, 2015
305
5
0
#57
Jesus claimed to have come “from” God. If Jesus was God (rather than the Son or Holy One of God), then this would certainly mean that God sent Himself into this world. Jesus plainly tells us that He did not send Himself, rather, it was God who sent Him. He professes a distinction between Himself and God by saying this in John 8:42.

Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love Me, because I came from God and I am here. For I didn’t come on My own, but He sent Me.” (John 8:42)
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
9,257
376
83
#59
Jesus claimed to have come “from” God. If Jesus was God (rather than the Son or Holy One of God), then this would certainly mean that God sent Himself into this world. Jesus plainly tells us that He did not send Himself, rather, it was God who sent Him. He professes a distinction between Himself and God by saying this in John 8:42.

Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love Me, because I came from God and I am here. For I didn’t come on My own, but He sent Me.” (John 8:42)
Again, why do you ignore other verses saying He is God?
 

Zmouth

Senior Member
Nov 21, 2012
2,924
41
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#60
"In the beginning was the Logos, and the Logos was with God, and the Logos was God.
Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.
In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind.
He was in the world, and though the world was made through him.
The Logos became flesh and made his dwelling among us.
We have seen his glory, the glory of the one and only Son, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.
"

John 1


Exactly, the audible voice of the Holy Ghost became the written word.

. bible_open_new.jpg

That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life; [FONT=&quot]1 John 1:1[/FONT]



"This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God."
John 1:14

----

Do I need to say more?
Exactly, that which is born of the flesh is flesh. And it had been written that the LORD would raise up from amongst the breathen a Prophet liken unto you, but the LORD would put his words in that Prophet's mouth.