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Then Jesus came and said to them
All authority in Heaven and on earth has been given to me
Matt28:18
Paul states:
[SUP]24 [/SUP]Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power. [SUP]25 [/SUP]For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. [SUP]26 [/SUP]The last enemy to be destroyed is death. [SUP]27 [/SUP]For he “has put everything under his feet.”[SUP][c][/SUP] Now when it says that “everything” has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ. [SUP]28 [/SUP]When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all.
1Cor15:24-28
That seems to echo Christ's words to me. They way I see it is that the Father has stood out of the way as it were, and Christ reigns now in Heaven and on earth as the Father has put everything under his feet, and given him all authority
So Christ is over all, now in Heaven and on earth (but obviously not over the Father), Paul confirms this:
[SUP] [/SUP]Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen.
Rom 9:5
That's just how I see it though
Then Jesus came and said to them
All authority in Heaven and on earth has been given to me
Matt28:18
Paul states:
[SUP]24 [/SUP]Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power. [SUP]25 [/SUP]For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. [SUP]26 [/SUP]The last enemy to be destroyed is death. [SUP]27 [/SUP]For he “has put everything under his feet.”[SUP][c][/SUP] Now when it says that “everything” has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ. [SUP]28 [/SUP]When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all.
1Cor15:24-28
That seems to echo Christ's words to me. They way I see it is that the Father has stood out of the way as it were, and Christ reigns now in Heaven and on earth as the Father has put everything under his feet, and given him all authority
So Christ is over all, now in Heaven and on earth (but obviously not over the Father), Paul confirms this:
[SUP] [/SUP]Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen.
Rom 9:5
That's just how I see it though
H
So, your question is whether the pastor of the church that we attend, has publicly stated that you are only saved if you believe Jesus is God...correct?
I don't think I have ever attended a church that has believed otherwise. I saw you said something about some Baptist ministers shaking their heads at the idea that one must believe Christ is God and not just the 'Son of God'. I attended a Baptist church for years, and can boldly state that the Baptist 'doctrine' upholds Christ being God. It is interesting that you point out the apparent difference between Jesus being the 'Son of God' and Jesus being God. Are they not the same thing?
It is impossible to believe that Jesus is divine, yet not God. It is impossible to believe that Jesus is the Son of God, yet not God. It is impossible to believe that Jesus is the exact imprint of God, yet not God. Again, the NT makes no sense if Jesus is not God, Himself. Didn't God take on the form of a servant? Did not all the fullness of God dwell in Jesus Christ? Doesn't the apostle John say that 'the Word was God'?
Since I have honestly answered your question, above, can you please tell me what your church's doctrinal statement is regarding the Christ, and why any of that matters to this discussion.
Thanks
I don't think I have ever attended a church that has believed otherwise. I saw you said something about some Baptist ministers shaking their heads at the idea that one must believe Christ is God and not just the 'Son of God'. I attended a Baptist church for years, and can boldly state that the Baptist 'doctrine' upholds Christ being God. It is interesting that you point out the apparent difference between Jesus being the 'Son of God' and Jesus being God. Are they not the same thing?
It is impossible to believe that Jesus is divine, yet not God. It is impossible to believe that Jesus is the Son of God, yet not God. It is impossible to believe that Jesus is the exact imprint of God, yet not God. Again, the NT makes no sense if Jesus is not God, Himself. Didn't God take on the form of a servant? Did not all the fullness of God dwell in Jesus Christ? Doesn't the apostle John say that 'the Word was God'?
Since I have honestly answered your question, above, can you please tell me what your church's doctrinal statement is regarding the Christ, and why any of that matters to this discussion.
Thanks
So, your question is whether the pastor of the church that we attend, has publicly stated that you are only saved if you believe Jesus is God...correct?
I don't think I have ever attended a church that has believed otherwise. I saw you said something about some Baptist ministers shaking their heads at the idea that one must believe Christ is God and not just the 'Son of God'. I attended a Baptist church for years, and can boldly state that the Baptist 'doctrine' upholds Christ being God. It is interesting that you point out the apparent difference between Jesus being the 'Son of God' and Jesus being God. Are they not the same thing?
It is impossible to believe that Jesus is divine, yet not God. It is impossible to believe that Jesus is the Son of God, yet not God. It is impossible to believe that Jesus is the exact imprint of God, yet not God. Again, the NT makes no sense if Jesus is not God, Himself. Didn't God take on the form of a servant? Did not all the fullness of God dwell in Jesus Christ? Doesn't the apostle John say that 'the Word was God'?
Since I have honestly answered your question, above, can you please tell me what your church's doctrinal statement is regarding the Christ, and why any of that matters to this discussion.
Thanks
I don't think I have ever attended a church that has believed otherwise. I saw you said something about some Baptist ministers shaking their heads at the idea that one must believe Christ is God and not just the 'Son of God'. I attended a Baptist church for years, and can boldly state that the Baptist 'doctrine' upholds Christ being God. It is interesting that you point out the apparent difference between Jesus being the 'Son of God' and Jesus being God. Are they not the same thing?
It is impossible to believe that Jesus is divine, yet not God. It is impossible to believe that Jesus is the Son of God, yet not God. It is impossible to believe that Jesus is the exact imprint of God, yet not God. Again, the NT makes no sense if Jesus is not God, Himself. Didn't God take on the form of a servant? Did not all the fullness of God dwell in Jesus Christ? Doesn't the apostle John say that 'the Word was God'?
Since I have honestly answered your question, above, can you please tell me what your church's doctrinal statement is regarding the Christ, and why any of that matters to this discussion.
Thanks
Bearing the above in mind, will you utterly condemn as unfit to be a minsiter any preacher who refuses to plainly state from, the pulpit that if a person believes Jesus is the Son of God, but not God Himself they cannot be saved/inherit eternal life with that belief and such a belief means a person is condemned and will go to hell
The above was the question, I am afraid you have not answered it. To be as plain as I can over this
Would you utterly condemn any minister as unfit to preach the Gosepl who will not plainly state from the pulpit if a person believes Jesus is the son of God but not God Himself they can have no eternal life with that belief and are therefore condemned and will go to hell
I do think that is a plain forward question
As the above is undoubteldy your belief, a belief you believe eternal; life hinges on believing, I asume you believe a minister is obligated to plainly tell their flock what is and what is not acceptable belief as to who Christ is unto salvation and the consequences of getting it wrong
Therefore, I am suprised you have hedged. Will you just outrightly condemn as unfit to preach any minister who will not stand in the pulpit and state clearly what I have written. I am sure you understand the question
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