The word of God is not a secret code that needs unlocked.
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I just dont think the translators of Kjv and other modern translators does not even know what they are doing. The conditional word if have different usage and good thing is that you are just repeating what is already known in the past. For the obvious, i believe that is based on the context so simple not a complex.
First, it is written:
Wow. We appear to agree a little here (at least on the interpretation of the underlying Greek).
I did look this up with the help of ChatGPT. There does appear to be some merit to this.
The verb paideuō in this context appears to convey more than simple instruction alone. It suggests a kind of training that involves not only imparting knowledge but also shaping character, often through corrective discipline. The word paideuō was historically used to describe the kind of guidance a parent would give to a child, which could include instruction, discipline, and correction as necessary to foster growth and maturity.
In Titus 1–3, the theme of corrective teaching and training as part of Christian life and growth is evident in several places, providing a context for understanding paideuō ("teaching" or "discipline") in Titus 2:12. Here are some key passages that build this context:
In fact, if we understand God's grace as personified in Jesus Christ, it aligns well with the idea that His grace would involve not only instruction but also discipline and chastening. Hebrews 12:6 supports this, saying, “For whom the Lord loves He chastens, and scourges every son whom He receives.” This passage reflects the idea that Jesus, in His love and grace, does not merely instruct us passively but actively trains us in righteousness, including discipline where necessary, to help us grow in holiness and obedience.
Ephesians 5:25-27 basically says that Christ gave Himself for us so that we might sanctify ourselves by the washing of the water of the Word (Scripture) so that we may present to ourselves to Him as a church that is holy, and without spot. The corrective Scripture and the moving of Jesus in our lives to correct us can help us to obey.
But again, as I pointed out before, just because less information like this is not conveyed does not mean the KJV is inferior or not perfect. God may also simply want to convey more basic truths to us first before we are ready to grasp the deeper truth. If such is not the case, then there would be no such thing as the milk of the Word vs. the meat of the Word.
In any event, while learning Greek is good, you have to be careful with teachers of Greek in these last days. There are some Greek definitions on certain Greek words that are false which have been pushed upon us since the Westcott and Hort movement. Monogenēs (μονογενής)s, and the Greek word "spoudazō" (σπουδάζω) are two examples off the top of my head. I say this because such Critical Text Scholarly interpretations on these words were only invented by this Westcott and Hort movement and it is not recognized by the Greek world of linguists of people who actually live in Greece and speak the language natively, which can be traced back to Koine Greek (Which can at times show changes with certain words).
In fact, it makes sense that there would be a hostile take over of Scripture because that is what Satan seeks to destroy.
It is written:
"But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him." (1 John 2:27).
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"But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;" (1 Corinthians 1:27).
Second, Jesus spoke in Hebrew when He read the Scriptures but when Jesus cried out, "Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?" on the cross, He spoke in a language that the Jews did not understand. So my talking to angels unawares in my own language is not proof that God did not preserve His words in 1600s English.Wow. We appear to agree a little here (at least on the interpretation of the underlying Greek).
I did look this up with the help of ChatGPT. There does appear to be some merit to this.
The verb paideuō in this context appears to convey more than simple instruction alone. It suggests a kind of training that involves not only imparting knowledge but also shaping character, often through corrective discipline. The word paideuō was historically used to describe the kind of guidance a parent would give to a child, which could include instruction, discipline, and correction as necessary to foster growth and maturity.
In Titus 1–3, the theme of corrective teaching and training as part of Christian life and growth is evident in several places, providing a context for understanding paideuō ("teaching" or "discipline") in Titus 2:12. Here are some key passages that build this context:
- Titus 1:9, 13 – Paul instructs Titus to ensure that elders hold “fast the faithful word” so they can “convict those who contradict.” He also urges Titus to “rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith.” The idea here is that faithful teaching includes both encouragement and correction, which aligns with a broader understanding of paideuō as training that often involves discipline.
- Titus 2:7-8, 15 – Paul emphasizes the need for Titus to be an example of good works and sound doctrine, marked by “integrity” and “sound speech.” He adds that Titus should “exhort and rebuke with all authority.” This reinforces the idea that instruction is not just informative but also corrective, involving moral training that may require reproving or rebuking.
- Titus 3:10-11 – Paul advises Titus to “reject a divisive man after the first and second admonition,” which reflects a disciplinary approach where correction and rejection (if the person remains divisive) are part of maintaining the health of the community. This implies that teaching and guidance sometimes include a disciplinary component when individuals resist correction.
In fact, if we understand God's grace as personified in Jesus Christ, it aligns well with the idea that His grace would involve not only instruction but also discipline and chastening. Hebrews 12:6 supports this, saying, “For whom the Lord loves He chastens, and scourges every son whom He receives.” This passage reflects the idea that Jesus, in His love and grace, does not merely instruct us passively but actively trains us in righteousness, including discipline where necessary, to help us grow in holiness and obedience.
Ephesians 5:25-27 basically says that Christ gave Himself for us so that we might sanctify ourselves by the washing of the water of the Word (Scripture) so that we may present to ourselves to Him as a church that is holy, and without spot. The corrective Scripture and the moving of Jesus in our lives to correct us can help us to obey.
But again, as I pointed out before, just because less information like this is not conveyed does not mean the KJV is inferior or not perfect. God may also simply want to convey more basic truths to us first before we are ready to grasp the deeper truth. If such is not the case, then there would be no such thing as the milk of the Word vs. the meat of the Word.
In any event, while learning Greek is good, you have to be careful with teachers of Greek in these last days. There are some Greek definitions on certain Greek words that are false which have been pushed upon us since the Westcott and Hort movement. Monogenēs (μονογενής)s, and the Greek word "spoudazō" (σπουδάζω) are two examples off the top of my head. I say this because such Critical Text Scholarly interpretations on these words were only invented by this Westcott and Hort movement and it is not recognized by the Greek world of linguists of people who actually live in Greece and speak the language natively, which can be traced back to Koine Greek (Which can at times show changes with certain words).
In fact, it makes sense that there would be a hostile take over of Scripture because that is what Satan seeks to destroy.
It is written:
"But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him." (1 John 2:27).
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Sorry, I am not looking to be brain washed by another. God has been teaching me His Word by the Spirit just fine.
You also don't appear to understand the spiritual state of the times we are living in. Sure, I imagine that your Greek teacher may teach things that are correct, but if he is for the Critical Text (Which I believe he is), then is also most likely pushing the false Westcott and Hort movement interpretations on certain Greek words that are false. I say this because I can actually research to see how these Greek words were used from in the past all the way up until now. AI searches now make it a lot more easier to check these kinds of things (not saying they are perfect always).
Try saying that to those in 1 John 2:27.
So we are so dumb that we cannot learn Greek, and 1600s English on our own?
That sounds like a Democratic party lie to me or a lie from Satan himself.
Evil is all about blaming others wrongfully.
But this is the psyop agenda that is happening in these last days.
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You also don't appear to understand the spiritual state of the times we are living in. Sure, I imagine that your Greek teacher may teach things that are correct, but if he is for the Critical Text (Which I believe he is), then is also most likely pushing the false Westcott and Hort movement interpretations on certain Greek words that are false. I say this because I can actually research to see how these Greek words were used from in the past all the way up until now. AI searches now make it a lot more easier to check these kinds of things (not saying they are perfect always).
Try saying that to those in 1 John 2:27.
So we are so dumb that we cannot learn Greek, and 1600s English on our own?
That sounds like a Democratic party lie to me or a lie from Satan himself.
Evil is all about blaming others wrongfully.
But this is the psyop agenda that is happening in these last days.
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If you were under a teacher with the integrity and competency as Paul was, that verse would work.
For you would have an accurate understanding to think with.
I have seen some Christians, who assume they are wise, act foolishly to the world.
And, then hide in that verse to be their justification.
As the world was justified in what they claimed to see.
If the world is going to see you as foolish?
At least tell them truth, truth that the Lord can show them they had been shown when they face their condemnation.
For you would have an accurate understanding to think with.
I have seen some Christians, who assume they are wise, act foolishly to the world.
And, then hide in that verse to be their justification.
As the world was justified in what they claimed to see.
If the world is going to see you as foolish?
At least tell them truth, truth that the Lord can show them they had been shown when they face their condemnation.
Like Democrats, they ignore the reality of things you bring up,, which involves facts, and common sense logic.
While you may disagree with the Democratic Left like I do, the thing is that you are doing the same thing.
You are not dealing with the points I brought up even when I deal with your points.
Again, 1 John 2:27. What do you think it is saying?
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While you may disagree with the Democratic Left like I do, the thing is that you are doing the same thing.
You are not dealing with the points I brought up even when I deal with your points.
Again, 1 John 2:27. What do you think it is saying?
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While Scripture upholds the value of teachers, it also affirms that the Holy Spirit is the ultimate guide into truth, particularly when believers are at risk of being led astray. In situations of doctrinal clarity and discernment, this Spirit-led anointing equips believers to recognize and abide in the truth without being dependent on human validation. Scripture and the Spirit are our ultimate guides. But again, I would say we are living in the last days, and finding those who truly are correct on everything they say has not really happened for me yet. Most often, there are no teachers that I found to be perfect in what they preach and teach. Most often, I encounter Christians who want to justify a sin and still be saved type belief or to obey Modern Bibles that teach false doctrines (as they secretly bash the KJV). Again, I see that we are living in a spiritual wasteland. At least, that has been my experience as a Bible believer. In the Westcott and Hort movement, many of them are simply Bible correctors.
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Here is one you are not going to find to understand in all your "searches."
Matthew 4:3....
"Now when the tempter came to Him, he said, “If You are the Son of God,
command that these stones become bread.”
The word "if" is in the Greek in the first class condition. What that means is not what the typical English translation is indicating.For Satan was not attempting to impugn Jesus by trying to get him to prove he is the Son of God by turning the stones into bread.
For the Greek is stating that Satan was admitting and knew that Jesus is the Son of God.
Mark 1:23-24
Just then a man in their synagogue who was possessed by an impure spirit cried out, “What do you want with us, Jesus of Nazareth? Have you come to destroy us? I know who you are—the Holy One of God!”
Even evil spirits that Jesus cast out recognized hum, and Jesus had to command them to be silent. Mark 1:24-25
A more accurate translation with understanding could read...
"Now when the tempter came to Him, he said, “If You are the Son of God - and you are -
command that these stones become bread.”
So then, why was Satan tempting the One whom Satan knew could turn stones into bread, to do so?
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Which says....
"But the anointing that you received from him abides in you, and you have no need
that any man should teach you". 1 John 2:27
You can not see the irony of what you are missing.
For who taught them that they need no man to teach them?
John! Who is man.
The anointing we have (if we are humble, and correctly abiding in 1 John 1:9) ... will teach us all we need to know from what we have been shown by those whom God gave us to teach us.
Yes! Without a real pastor teacher we will all be like dumb sheep.
For the anointing can not teach us unless we are first taught correctly what we need to think with.
The anointing will teach us what to believe, and not to believe, as we are being taught by teachers.
Not meaning that we are to teach ourselves.
"But the anointing that you received from him abides in you, and you have no need
that any man should teach you". 1 John 2:27
You can not see the irony of what you are missing.
For who taught them that they need no man to teach them?
John! Who is man.
The anointing we have (if we are humble, and correctly abiding in 1 John 1:9) ... will teach us all we need to know from what we have been shown by those whom God gave us to teach us.
Yes! Without a real pastor teacher we will all be like dumb sheep.
For the anointing can not teach us unless we are first taught correctly what we need to think with.
The anointing will teach us what to believe, and not to believe, as we are being taught by teachers.
Not meaning that we are to teach ourselves.
This is how they concluded to use the word robbery...
Who {Christ}, though He eternally existed in the essence of God, He did not think equalities
with God, a gain to be seized {means to violently take} and held.
In other words?
To agree to become as a man? And, having two natures in union?
He had to let go of the preciousness and power of his own Deity!
He did not consider to violently snatch it back in the process. (no robbery)
And, besides... how could he consider it robbery? If it was rightfully his own to begin with? That's the point.
Jesus willingly made himself poor, so that we could be made rich.
grace and peace ........
Who {Christ}, though He eternally existed in the essence of God, He did not think equalities
with God, a gain to be seized {means to violently take} and held.
In other words?
To agree to become as a man? And, having two natures in union?
He had to let go of the preciousness and power of his own Deity!
He did not consider to violently snatch it back in the process. (no robbery)
And, besides... how could he consider it robbery? If it was rightfully his own to begin with? That's the point.
Jesus willingly made himself poor, so that we could be made rich.
grace and peace ........
"Bible believer"? Instead of using high-sounding words with insulting insinuations, you should just say "KJV-onlyists". At least that would be honest. Your premise, however, would remain fallacious.
Streeeeeeetch... *pop*
Not a chance. There are far too many matching details in both accounts that require, by all manner of evidence, that your second and third Ahaziah's are one and the same. There is no "third" Ahaziah. The KJV is in error here. The "explanations" are ridiculous. Were such a matter ever to come before a competent judge, the KJV case would be laughed out of court.
Actually, I found another error in the KJV while studying this...
2 Kings 8:25 In the twelfth year of Joram the son of Ahab king of Israel did Ahaziah the son of Jehoram king of Judah begin to reign.
2 Kings 9:29 And in the eleventh year of Joram the son of Ahab began Ahaziah to reign over Judah.
Streeeeeeetch... *pop*
Not a chance. There are far too many matching details in both accounts that require, by all manner of evidence, that your second and third Ahaziah's are one and the same. There is no "third" Ahaziah. The KJV is in error here. The "explanations" are ridiculous. Were such a matter ever to come before a competent judge, the KJV case would be laughed out of court.
Actually, I found another error in the KJV while studying this...
2 Kings 8:25 In the twelfth year of Joram the son of Ahab king of Israel did Ahaziah the son of Jehoram king of Judah begin to reign.
2 Kings 9:29 And in the eleventh year of Joram the son of Ahab began Ahaziah to reign over Judah.
16 And in the fifth year of Joram the son of Ahab king of Israel, Jehoshaphat being then king of Judah, Jehoram the son of Jehoshaphat king of Judah began to reign.
17 Thirty and two years old was he when he began to reign; and he reigned eight years in Jerusalem.
18 And he walked in the way of the kings of Israel, as did the house of Ahab: for the daughter of Ahab was his wife: and he did evil in the sight of the Lord.
Textual Criticism doesn't teach anything. It is a set of practices, not a teacher, preacher, or professor. Personification doesn't work when you're laying blame.
It is more likely that a person who is discouraged from studying outside certain narrow parameters will lose trust. I encourage you and every reader to do their own homework, and not to limit themselves to any particular sources.
Given your error with regard to Ahaziah, you need to rethink this. As to "contributing to doubt", you and all KJV-only proponents do that by casting aspersions on other translations. Don't be a hypocrite!
Finding anomalies should lead to further study, not to doubt. If your trust is in the perfection of your translation, you have no hope. My trust is in the risen Lord Jesus, and I'm not shaken in the least when I find errors in a printed translation of Scripture. I know God is bigger than the Bible in my hands. I'm not sure that most KJV-onlyists can say that.
There is a valid, sound, and satisfying explanation for the difference between the two verses noting Ahaziah's age, but it is not any of the convoluted fantasies I've heard from KJV-onlyists. In fact, I have NEVER seen it cited by any KJV-only proponent. I suspect most of them don't even know it, because they use Bibles that have had the marginal notes deleted.
It is more likely that a person who is discouraged from studying outside certain narrow parameters will lose trust. I encourage you and every reader to do their own homework, and not to limit themselves to any particular sources.
Given your error with regard to Ahaziah, you need to rethink this. As to "contributing to doubt", you and all KJV-only proponents do that by casting aspersions on other translations. Don't be a hypocrite!
Finding anomalies should lead to further study, not to doubt. If your trust is in the perfection of your translation, you have no hope. My trust is in the risen Lord Jesus, and I'm not shaken in the least when I find errors in a printed translation of Scripture. I know God is bigger than the Bible in my hands. I'm not sure that most KJV-onlyists can say that.
There is a valid, sound, and satisfying explanation for the difference between the two verses noting Ahaziah's age, but it is not any of the convoluted fantasies I've heard from KJV-onlyists. In fact, I have NEVER seen it cited by any KJV-only proponent. I suspect most of them don't even know it, because they use Bibles that have had the marginal notes deleted.
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Majority Text vs. Critical Text vs. Textus Receptus – Textual Criticism 101
https://www.bereanpatriot.com/major...ext-vs-textus-receptus-textual-criticism-101/
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Majority Text vs. Critical Text vs. Textus Receptus – Textual Criticism 101
https://www.bereanpatriot.com/major...ext-vs-textus-receptus-textual-criticism-101/
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