Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer

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dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
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It's not a denial that He gives us purity of heart to say we still have some struggles. We grow in grace, we grow in faith, we constantly improve. He gives us more light as we are able to bear it.
I bet he believes the Corinthian brother who was put out for the destruction of the flesh so the spirit could be saved in the Day of Christ was lost as well.......

Saved children of God can fail horribly <--David murdered Uriah and took his wife.......yet was saved, never lost it, lost his joy, prayed to get it back, paid physically by disease and the sword (chastisement) but remained a son of God throughout the while process as evidenced by the PSALMS....and this was UNDER the LAW before GRACE was fully extended....

AND the full scope and picture of JESUS as the INNOCENT SON of DAVID paying our sin debt is found in the INNOCENT YOUNG CHILD of DAVID paying his PRICE in death....UNDER the LAW David should have died!

BLOWS MY MIND how many are IGNORANT of these truths....BLINDED like the self righteous PHARISEES......
 
Nov 12, 2015
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I think he went a bit overboard and will rethink what he said, because I've been reading a fair amount of his posts...
 
Mar 7, 2016
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So then, is it better to say you have received that which
is the highest and best, or to say you hope to receive such?
Nope i stay on Guard for the enemy who can make you stumble. I also hope i dont press the self destruction button..

I know as long as i dont do this i will keep the faith to the end and see his glory..
 
Nov 12, 2015
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My mind has not been able to fully put down this perpetual argument for over a year now. Honestly, how could I put it down when it's basically the only thing ever argued about in bible forum?

A thinks B is saying we will never gain full victory over our pride, arrogance, murdering, etc.
B thinks A is saying yes we will gain victory by our hard work.

Neither is usually saying either of those things the other thinks they are and I can so plainly see it that it's surreal almost.
 
Feb 5, 2017
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Maybe its just American exceptionalism at work in you. :)

My mind has not been able to fully put down this perpetual argument for over a year now. Honestly, how could I put it down when it's basically the only thing ever argued about in bible forum?

A thinks B is saying we will never gain full victory over our pride, arrogance, murdering, etc.
B thinks A is saying yes we will gain victory by our hard work.

Neither is usually saying either of those things the other thinks they are and I can so plainly see it that it's surreal almost.
 

notmyown

Senior Member
May 26, 2016
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I don't often get angry but you my friend have just made my blood boil. I am so angry I would want to place the burdens and crap that you have placed upon genuine struggling people who have sought help and comfort here.
you may want to skip his posts. :)

they frequently cause that reaction in the believers.

sadly, he doesn't know the Gospel. i pray for him.
 
Nov 12, 2015
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Here's one of the odder things I've noticed in following the argument for over a year. (Same handful of people, though one of them disappeared.)

The thing they say they are not saying but are being accused of, as they become more entrenched and narrow, actually does become what they begin to say.

How is that possible...?
 
Feb 5, 2017
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What nationality does the one being accused tend to be?

Here's one of the odder things I've noticed in following the argument for over a year. (Same handful of people, though one of them disappeared.)

The thing they say they are not saying but are being accused of, as they become more entrenched and narrow, actually does become what they begin to say.

How is that possible...?
 
Nov 12, 2015
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It's like...the more either side tries to say what they really, really mean, the more they both begin to actually say what they were accused of by the other. And I truly think I can see the way to clarity in it, but no one will listen to my american exceptionalism...
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
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I do understand that you are talking about the condition of the heart. Corruptibility is separated from mortality in that verse, even if ascribed similar meanings; the reason for death is sin, and we all die the first death, for all sin and fall short of the glory of God. If you say you are without sin, you deceive yourself, and the Truth is not in you. Jesus is our intercessor in the here and now because we are being accused constantly by Satan before God. If we were 100% blameless 100% of the time, Satan would have no ammunition. Everything that does not come from faith is sin.
God said only three people out of the entire OT had the righteousness to deliver themselves if it were possible...Daniel was one of the three and he confessed sin....tells me all I need to know about all who deceptively claim to be without sin before the resurrection/transformation!
 
Feb 24, 2015
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My mind has not been able to fully put down this perpetual argument for over a year now. Honestly, how could I put it down when it's basically the only thing ever argued about in bible forum?

A thinks B is saying we will never gain full victory over our pride, arrogance, murdering, etc.
B thinks A is saying yes we will gain victory by our hard work.

Neither is usually saying either of those things the other thinks they are and I can so plainly see it that it's surreal almost.
It is easy to polarise - but if people are unwilling to listen and to reach out,
then maybe it is pointless for those parties. What I have learnt is normally
there are people the Lord has on both sides and He will work through them,
so I trust the King and His ways.
 
Nov 12, 2015
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I agree that a man who has come to know himself would not claim to be without any sin ever. But it is very possible to be able to say one is not aware of any sin they have committed for a day or two days, etc.

The goal is not sinless perfection, for me anyway. Isn't the goal to abide in Him for increasing amounts of time?
 
Mar 2, 2016
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I agree that a man who has come to know himself would not claim to be without any sin ever. But it is very possible to be able to say one is not aware of any sin they have committed for a day or two days, etc.

The goal is not sinless perfection, for me anyway. Isn't the goal to abide in Him for increasing amounts of time?
How about a peace that surpasses all understanding?