TITHING IS NOT FOR TODAY

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I

ib4gzus

Guest
#1
#1
Tithing
Many churches today continue to teach that believers must give 10% of their income to the church. However, the apostle Paul, our apostle in the dispensation of grace, never once mentions tithing as the prescribed means for giving. On the contrary, Paul says that we should give as we purpose in our hearts, and not of necessity
(2 Cor 9:7). Paul makes it clear that giving in the dispensation of grace is based on a willing mind (2 Cor 8:12), not a fixed percentage of your income.
While it is true that giving is of the highest importance for the support of the ministry, this giving is the result of a grateful heart, not a legal regulation. In fact, the Bible teaches that we are no longer under the law (Rom 6:14; Gal 3:23-25, 5:18). Grace frees us to give from a willing heart, not for the sake of necessity.
 
L

Laodicea

Guest
#2
#2
Exodus 25:2
(2) Speak unto the children of Israel, that they bring me an offering: of every man that giveth it willingly with his heart ye shall take my offering.
1 Corinthians 9:14
(14) Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.

 
P

prophecyman

Guest
#3
#3
ib4gzus said:
Tithing
Many churches today continue to teach that believers must give 10% of their income to the church. However, the apostle Paul, our apostle in the dispensation of grace, never once mentions tithing as the prescribed means for giving. On the contrary, Paul says that we should give as we purpose in our hearts, and not of necessity
(2 Cor 9:7). Paul makes it clear that giving in the dispensation of grace is based on a willing mind (2 Cor 8:12), not a fixed percentage of your income.
While it is true that giving is of the highest importance for the support of the ministry, this giving is the result of a grateful heart, not a legal regulation. In fact, the Bible teaches that we are no longer under the law (Rom 6:14; Gal 3:23-25, 5:18). Grace frees us to give from a willing heart, not for the sake of necessity.
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People who teach this doctrine, really lack understanding in biblical principals of giving or setting aside a certain amount of their income.

He that sows sparingly, shall also reap sparingly. Its my experience that people who speak against tithes are usually the one's that don't support the local church anyway.

Muzzle not the Ox that treadeth out the corn. When the Pastor wears a suit that allows for the sunshine to seep through or his wife wears the same dress that is at least 15 years old, the children look underfed, etc. Then you might say... Hey Pastor go get a job! I say have you ever tried to effectively pastor a church of 200 people plus? Do you know how hard it is to be an effective Pastor and do the job that God called you to do on a salary that most men would be ashamed to admit to?

The LORD said: This whole Nation has robbed me! and the people replied... Wherein have we robbed you? The LORD replied... In tithes and offerings!

Go ahead make your strong argument, but I would hate to stand before God and explain to him why I did not support the local church, oh ye that make $100,000 or even less $50,000 or so.

Churches are required to keep insurance, have you priced what a church must spend yearly to be in line with the Law?

Someone has to pay that light bill.

The water bill.

Someone has to mow the grass, and put in the gas to run the mower .

YES PREACHER... GO GET A JOB!
 
musiclover123

musiclover123

Senior Member
#4
Sep 6, 2009
133
0
16
31
#4
One teaching of paying tithes is backed up with NT scripture, from the book of Matthew.

Matthew 23:23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

Paul does tell us to give willingly of our hearts in offering, but many would argue that tithes and offerings are not the same thing. The point of tithes payed in the Old Testament were to be used for the Temple needs (before that the Tabernacle needs). This would feed the priests and Levites, because their only job was to take care of the Temple and serve in it. Some would say that there is a similar need for tithes today, to take care of congregational needs within churches. Offerings are seen as being extra aside from tithes, which makes sense because there are several times in Scripture where these are mentioned together, as 'tithes and offerings', and if they were the same thing I don't know why a distinction would need to be made.

It is seen also that even Abraham, who was not under the Mosaic Law, also payed tithes to Melchizedek. It seems that tithes go far beyond just being an ordinance of the Law.
 
U

Ugly

Guest
#5
#5
Most churches i've been to use the 10% as a good standard for tithing, but not a requirement. Often saying if you aren't sure what to give, then thats a good start, but otherwise give as you feel led.
 
Z

Zilla64007

Banned
#6
Jan 14, 2010
1,010
5
0
#6
for starters, tithing was NEVER ABOUT MONEY. it was either land or animals, but never money.
 
J

jb

Senior Member
#7
Feb 27, 2010
4,940
589
113
#7
ib4gzus said:
Tithing
Many churches today continue to teach that believers must give 10% of their income to the church. However, the apostle Paul, our apostle in the dispensation of grace, never once mentions tithing as the prescribed means for giving. On the contrary, Paul says that we should give as we purpose in our hearts, and not of necessity
(2 Cor 9:7). Paul makes it clear that giving in the dispensation of grace is based on a willing mind (2 Cor 8:12), not a fixed percentage of your income.
While it is true that giving is of the highest importance for the support of the ministry, this giving is the result of a grateful heart, not a legal regulation. In fact, the Bible teaches that we are no longer under the law (Rom 6:14; Gal 3:23-25, 5:18). Grace frees us to give from a willing heart, not for the sake of necessity.
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Tithing was (as you say) NOT (I repeat, NOT) practised by the early NT Church, it did not become canon law until the Council of Macon in 585 AD...Tithing was an OT practice used mainly for keeping the Levites and looking after the poor, widows, orphans and strangers in Israel, it was basically their 'welfare state.'

The Pastor Teachers (who are also referred to as Elders and Overseers in the Scriptures) in the NT Church generally had full-time (secular) work and on occassions might give themselves to seeking the Lord in a more earnest way, during which time their local Church may have given them a small allowance to live on.

This is a far cry to Pastors today twisting and using the Scriptures to extract vast amounts of money out of their flock to line their own pockets, the Lord Jesus will certainly deal with with these robbers! 2Peter 2v1-3.

Obviously some of the posters in this thread have not studied the Scriptures and Church history on this subject! ;)
 
H

hislastwalk

Guest
#8
#8
If you wanna see God's idea of tithing go visit a soup kitchen. That's stuff tithe money is suppose to go to.
 
P

prophecyman

Guest
#9
#9
hislastwalk said:
If you wanna see God's idea of tithing go visit a soup kitchen. That's stuff tithe money is suppose to go to.
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Hey great idea ! Lets go and build a a large soup kitchen and I will place you in charge.
 
J

Jordache

Guest
#11
#11
First, tithing was land and livestock because THAT was currency then. There were people was gave coinage also. This day people also tithe labor and material possessions, but cash is the currency of our day; not cows.
Soup kitchens are great ideas. Outwardly reaching ministries are biblical. They are our calling, but the church is still a hospital which requires money to function. The church must take care of it's own and not forsake those outside the walls, we also must take care of those outside the walls and not forsake those inside. It takes money to do both and not all of it goes to the soup kitchen. I go to a smallish church with a lot of ministries that are all lay led. Men's, women's, children's, youth, marrieds, music, hospitality, cleaning, 30 meal team, neighborhood initiative outreach, college campus, dozens of kinships, more private women's and mens groups, school of discipleship, seminary, bookstore, etc...They all require money... And they are all doing great work for the kingdom.
 
H

hislastwalk

Guest
#12
#12
Jordache said:
First, tithing was land and livestock because THAT was currency then. There were people was gave coinage also. This day people also tithe labor and material possessions, but cash is the currency of our day; not cows.
Soup kitchens are great ideas. Outwardly reaching ministries are biblical. They are our calling, but the church is still a hospital which requires money to function. The church must take care of it's own and not forsake those outside the walls, we also must take care of those outside the walls and not forsake those inside. It takes money to do both and not all of it goes to the soup kitchen. I go to a smallish church with a lot of ministries that are all lay led. Men's, women's, children's, youth, marrieds, music, hospitality, cleaning, 30 meal team, neighborhood initiative outreach, college campus, dozens of kinships, more private women's and mens groups, school of discipleship, seminary, bookstore, etc...They all require money... And they are all doing great work for the kingdom.
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We ARE the church... the money went to US to go help people, not to pay a light bill......
if you're (speaking in general) if you're church is putting the tithe money into paying the light bill, then that's dangerous. I didn't tithe with money yesterday... I spent my money on bibles to hand out to people.
 
H

hislastwalk

Guest
#13
#13
we need to realize that there is a bigger number OUTSIDE the spiritual wall-mart (church building) that are perishing, than there are inside the four walls.
 
Z

Zilla64007

Banned
#14
Jan 14, 2010
1,010
5
0
#14
Jordache said:
First, tithing was land and livestock because THAT was currency then.
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NO it wasn't. they had a monetary currency in those days. but tithing was something separate altogether, and should not be followed today anymore.

it is an old testament law that was made null and void by the Covenant of Christ (Hebrews 7)
 
LightningClap0002

LightningClap0002

Senior Member
#16
Feb 10, 2008
3,371
16
38
#16
Am I the only one who has the story of ananias and sapphira come to mind with this discussion?
 
A

AnandaHya

Guest
#17
#17
LightningClap0002 said:
Am I the only one who has the story of ananias and sapphira come to mind with this discussion?
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nope it popped into my head too

with the addition that the requirement is not longer 10 percent but 100 percent.

we are to present our bodies and lives as living sacrifices unto God. Holy Temples of the Holy Spirit, all members of the Bride of Christ.

<<<<<<
Paul was ONE apostle.

Jesus, Peter and everyone else in the NT spoke the SAME Gospel to ALL (note to the OP) its called the Gospel of Christ
 
C

Consumed

Guest
#18
#18
ananias and saphire were judged on not why they didnt give 100%, Peter makes that clear to them both the money was theirs to do as they chose however they lied when confronted.

abrahamic tithe
levitical tithe

abraham gave under no law to give
mosaic tithe under the law
give from your heart not because of anything else. Gods interested in our character, definately doesnt take kindly to liars lol
 
Canadian36

Canadian36

Banned
#19
Oct 20, 2011
490
1
0
#19
Ya very true. here's what I do. I only give to the church but I only pick out specific missionary trips in which they're raising money to go on there trip. That way I know the money is going to something of significance, not just into the church coffers which who knows what it might end up getting used for. Perhaps somethign you disagree with like stopping global warming or some other farse.

the other thing I do is when I got out in public I try and keep my eyes pelled. Almost always you might run into someone who needs some help. They're down and out. And it doesn't matter what they plan to do with the money. don't worry about that. The fact that they're looking for a handout means they're at the bottom of the barrel and they're in need. So just give them something. Buy them a burger and give it to them. Or give them a few dollars, or if you can afford it 10, 20, 50 or even 100, and say "Jesus loves you". Like imagine giving some bum 100 bucks and just say "Jesus loves you!" and smile. They'll remember that they're whole life! Who's to say they do start to ask the question "wow there's something about those Christians, something special about them, I got to find out what it is!" Like it might be a cause set in motion. That way at least they go something to get them by over the next few days. Maybe they are trying to get work or something going on, but they just can't find anything so they've exhaused all there options. Again don't worry about what they'll do with the money. All that matter is your challenging your greed factor. The opportunity presents itself, and it usually springs up when you're busy and you don't have time to stop or help, and the greed factor asks you "how greedy am I today, lets find out?" So do you stop and help, be the good sameritan, or do you just pass by and leave them next to dead, to self absorbed in your busy day and own issues. Like you got to address the greed inside you, thats why I like to give people money if I see them on the street. it's not about them at all. It's about me, just saying to myself "yes I'm still a generious guy!" and I will give to the poor and lend to the lord. Anyway that's my take.
 
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G

GreenNnice

Guest
#20
#20
Canadian36 said:
Ya very true. here's what I do. I only give to the church but I only pick out specific missionary trips in which they're raising money to go on there trip. That way I know the money is going to something of significance, not just into the church coffers which who knows what it might end up getting used for. Perhaps somethign you disagree with like stopping global warming or some other farse.

the other thing I do is when I got out in public I try and keep my eyes pelled. Almost always you might run into someone who needs some help. They're down and out. And it doesn't matter what they plan to do with the money. don't worry about that. The fact that they're looking for a handout means they're at the bottom of the barrel and they're in need. So just give them something. Buy them a burger and give it to them. Or give them a few dollars, or if you can afford it 10, 20, 50 or even 100, and say "Jesus loves you". Like imagine giving some bum 100 bucks and just say "Jesus loves you!" and smile. They'll remember that they're whole life! Who's to say they do start to ask the question "wow there's something about those Christians, something special about them, I got to find out what it is!" Like it might be a cause set in motion. That way at least they go something to get them by over the next few days. Maybe they are trying to get work or something going on, but they just can't find anything so they've exhaused all there options. Again don't worry about what they'll do with the money. All that matter is your challenging your greed factor. The opportunity presents itself, and it usually springs up when you're busy and you don't have time to stop or help, and the greed factor asks you "how greedy am I today, lets find out?" So do you stop and help, be The good sameritan, or do you just pass by and leave them next to dead, to self absorbed in your busy day and own issues. Like you got to address the greed inside you, thats why I like to give people money if I see them on the street. it's not about them at all. It's about me, just saying to myself "yes I'm still a generious guy!" and I will give to the poor and lend to the lord. Anyway that's my take.
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The Lord leads, but this I do know , we are to follow The Holy Spirit in our life, and, if the HS convicts you of any matter it will be diametric opposition to His correction and you will be attended to, usually in a great bearable lesson learned.

And, that money going into the 'church coffers' might actually be going to pay the pastor and others' salaries, including YOUR youth leader who will LEAD you on the 'mission trip' you are ONLY giving to God to. Lol, how selfish and crass is the whole above post. Churches have not BLESSED you ever? Lol, start gathering your nickels right now and give ALL that change to God in His house Sunday.

Don't you think too that God will bless you for your best-lamb and not first-fruit to Him? He will !
 
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