Tree of "Good and Evil". What is it really?

[prodigal]

MEOLOGY

col 2

[SUP]8 [/SUP]See to it that no one takes you captive through hollow and deceptive philosophy, which depends on human tradition and the elemental spiritual forces[SUP][a][/SUP] of this world rather than on Christ.


and now for something factual..

Counsel ([SIZE=+1]עצה[/SIZE] eytsah, Strong's #6098): The word eytsah, meaning counsel, is the feminine form of the masculine word eyts [SUP][str:6086][/SUP] meaning a tree. Counsel is the giving of advice, encouragement or guidance. Within the family or the community this would be an elder, one filled with years of wisdom and experience. In the Hebrew mind this elder, or counselor, and his counsel is seen as the support to the community in the same way that the trunk of a tree supports the branches of the tree.

 

[RussellJBenigno]

I asked you 3 specific questions.
Why don't you answer them?

Are you afraid to stand up, and state clearly what you believe?
Is it all just talk, or can you stand up and state clearly what you believe?

Unless you're afraid, answer my 3 questions.

Never heard of the great falling away teachings??? Hmm! I guess not!
(1Tim 4:1-2 [UKJV])
Now the Spirit speaks expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
(2Thess 2:10-12 [UKJV])
And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
Altering the teachings of Jesus and His Gospel is "Doctrines of demons and unrighteousness".
How's that shoe fitting?

 

[prodigal]

Ecclesiastes 1:9

[SUP]9 [/SUP]That which has been is what will be,
That which is done is what will be done,
And there is nothing new under the sun.


HIPPOLYTUS OF ROME THE REFUTATION OF ALL HERESIES

CHURCH FATHERS: Refutation of All Heresies (Hippolytus)

 

[RussellJBenigno]

TY very much, this post has made some things "click". Yes, the powers (spiritual) are living (controlling) men! The parenthesis, as I understand it, are snapshots of explanation inserted within the message.perhaps showing the "backdrop" ..it's crucial to know where they are, otherwise you would read it all together in a linear fashion, not knowing it's a plot within a plot. You have demonstrated where they are!

John 4:24 God is a spirit. Those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth." kjv

Excellent! Good! Yes it is a story in a story. Like a good novel there is always a plot within the plot. Who's behind the curtain moving the puppets. When we understand this we can see the movement of demons and angels in the spiritual realms and how they effect mankind. Thank you!

 

[Tintin]

I'm impressed with and thankful for the work you put into finding the quotes from RJB's posts. It's okay if there are people out there whose beliefs fall outside of the norm, but it probably shouldn't be called Christian. What I'm wondering, though, is about this fella's edification. It would seem that he probably doesn't have many places where he can talk about this sort of thing and get serious responses, you know? It's kind of fringe; I can imagine a home group getting up in arms over what he's saying and having a big, ugly, and painful breaking of fellowship. Recall that our friend's phrase at the bottom of his window has to do with being hurt by the church. Is there any way to build him up, senior members? in a way that jives with your conscience regarding his stated beliefs? just wondering...as a child.

The biblical thing to to do is bring correction, if they don't listen cut them off. False teachings are a poison to the Church. Methinks the Church hasn't responded kindly to his musings for the simple reason that they're so whacked and not biblical.

 

[posthuman]

I'm impressed with and thankful for the work you put into finding the quotes from RJB's posts. It's okay if there are people out there whose beliefs fall outside of the norm, but it probably shouldn't be called Christian. What I'm wondering, though, is about this fella's edification. It would seem that he probably doesn't have many places where he can talk about this sort of thing and get serious responses, you know? It's kind of fringe; I can imagine a home group getting up in arms over what he's saying and having a big, ugly, and painful breaking of fellowship. Recall that our friend's phrase at the bottom of his window has to do with being hurt by the church. Is there any way to build him up, senior members? in a way that jives with your conscience regarding his stated beliefs? just wondering...as a child.

i understand & agree with you -- but this isn't the beginning of my conversation with him.
he has me on ignore (( he gets to "delete" me because i disagree with him )), but i won't ignore him. how do you edify someone who refuses to listen to you? it comes down to this:

Open rebuke is better than secret love.
(Proverbs 27:5)​

all those quotes are from a single thread a few weeks old, that i remember - and i put it for the benefit of anyone who hasn't read that one, or didn't remember.

thank you for chastising me to be gentle.
may i remember that too!

 

[Karraster]

These verses are in the same vain and possible show us something. Read carefully and keep the verse in their order. Tell me what you see.
(Jer 4:23-27 [UKJV])
I beheld the earth, and, lo, it was without form, and void; and the heavens, and they had no light.
I beheld the mountains, and, lo, they trembled, and all the hills moved lightly.
I beheld, and, lo, there was no man, and all the birds of the heavens were fled.
I beheld, and, lo, the fruitful place was a wilderness, and all the cities thereof were broken down at the presence of the LORD, and by his fierce anger.
For thus has the LORD said, The whole land shall be desolate; yet will I not make a full end.

This part reminds me of the beginning of Genesis. But then after reading this, read the chapter and it is about the end of the age. It's a new canvas, so to speak. That's my take anyways...

 

[Tintin]

This part reminds me of the beginning of Genesis. But then after reading this, read the chapter and it is about the end of the age. It's a new canvas, so to speak. That's my take anyways...

I don't know. It strikes me as reminiscent of what happened during the Great Flood of Noah's time.

 

[Karraster]

I don't know. It strikes me as reminiscent of what happened during the Great Flood of Noah's time.

Do you remember the verses? I know the story, but the way the words are arranged I'm not remembering it from the after-flood.

 

[Angela53510]

normally i dont reply to troll accts but here is a question, when Jesus spoke in parables were those just daisy chains?

I just wanted to point out, Jaybird, that Rachel has been here since 2010. She posts very biblically. She does not take a weird topic and turn it into pantheism, like RusselJBenigno.

As for you, maybe when you are off the year's probation list, then we can decide if you are the troll or not.

I really fear for people who are so out of touch with what the Bible says, they will follow any false prophet who turns up on the internet. If you are bored by the Bible, and the truth of it, maybe you need to seek God.

The total fantasies presented by the OP in this post that you are so fascinated with, worries me that you are slipping away from the real message of the Bible - that is our relationship with Jesus Christ.

 

[Angela53510]

This is off topic but!
Another point about the stones are that everything which is created is not made from nothing, but something. My personal belief is that all things are made from God's own being. In the beginning there was God and nothing else. Everything is birthed into being from the Creators essence [whatever that is]. There was no darkness because God is light. Every object has a frequency and light is a frequency. The stones would cry out because every atom or particle is a resonating frequency of light, a piece of God.

Posthuman already dissected the bad physics in this, so I would like to talk about the terrible doctrine. I won't call it theology, since it is gnosticism and pantheism.

God is transcendent - he is above all - he is the creator.

God is immanent - he was incarnated as Jesus Christ, who came to save us from our sins.

God is NOT "a piece of" the stones, the atoms or the particles.

God is separate from his creation, except when Jesus came to earth.

He did NOT create the earth from his own being. He is above and beyond the universe.

This is heresy of the vilest sort. And it shows a complete lack of understanding of the character of God.


Please take your idle speculation, ill advised personal beliefs and pantheism elsewhere.

 

[MarcR]

Posthuman already dissected the bad physics in this, so I would like to talk about the terrible doctrine. I won't call it theology, since it is gnosticism and pantheism.

God is transcendent - he is above all - he is the creator.

God is immanent - he was incarnated as Jesus Christ, who came to save us from our sins.

God is NOT "a piece of" the stones, the atoms or the particles.

God is separate from his creation, except when Jesus came to earth.

He did NOT create the earth from his own being. He is above and beyond the universe.

This is heresy of the vilest sort. And it shows a complete lack of understanding of the character of God.


Please take your idle speculation, ill advised personal beliefs and pantheism elsewhere.

They wouldn't let me give you REP again!

 

[Angela53510]

The bible we now have did not exist for 300yrs after Pentecost. What did the early Christians depend upon? It was not the bible. Our knowledge is dependent upon the Holy Spirit and our relationship with God. There were many times I read something in the bible and my soul said there was something wrong with the passage. When I went to the Hebrew and Greek it said exactly what was in my soul. So how did my soul know that the passage was mistranslated? Its by my relationship with God and His Holy Spirit teaching me all things. The Pharisees had head knowledge, but no Holy Spirit knowledge. The Holy Spirit is what the early church depended upon until a bible was created. Sadly the modern church thinks that because they have the bible, they think they have life, the the bible speaks of Jesus. Just like the Pharisees the modern church commits the same sin.

Well, I am pretty sure you have no knowledge of Hebrew or Greek. When OldHermit challenged you to an exegetical study of Genesis 3, you totally passed. I am also quite willing to go the exegetical route with you. Let's look at the Hebrew and Greek and see if what you are saying is actually in the original languages.

As for as your false statement that the church did not have a Bible till 300 years after Pentecost, going to challenge you on that one, too!

For one thing, they had the Old Testament, in full, in many languages. In fact, all the the New Testament was written before 100 AD. The last one was Revelation, with Mark being written as early as 55 AD. Internal evidence shows that at least Matthew, Mark and Luke and probably Acts had to be written before 70 AD and the fall of the temple in Jerusalem, or the biblical authors would have pointed to it as evidence of prophecy Jesus prophecies fulfilled. Paul also wrote some of his epistles very early on. Maybe in the 40's AD.

The Rylands papyrus, a fragment of John, is dated to the first century is from the gospel of John. So if a fragment has been found, that means that a LOT of other copies had to exist. In fact, there are literally so many manuscripts dating back to between 100-200 AD, it actually blows your misinformation totally out of the water.

Papyrus 52 - a Fragment of John's Gospel
https://carm.org/when-was-bible-written-and-who-wrote-it
https://carm.org/when-were-gospels-written-and-whom

Seriously, being led by the Holy Spirit is esssential. But making things up that aren't true is totally a different thing. The early church collected, copied and transmitted the New Testament long before it was canonized. The Bible is also essential - and it seems like you really don't know much about it, especially how it was formed, when it was written and how the early church used it.

There is another whole argument for the earliest use of the Bible from the quotes in the early church fathers, who dated well before 300 years after Pentecost. But I will leave that for another day.

 

[Angela53510]

When man kind was created it was created in the image of God. What is that image? Part of that image is to make our own decisions. We were put in charge of the world and we were to make decisions. Adam and Eve were created rulers and rulers make decisions. The problem came when they were given information which corrupted the decision making process. It was no longer a decision between good and good or good even better, but the opposite of a good decision. Now all of this is conjecture because we don't have a complete narrative.

Really? A decision, based on information which corrupted the "decision making" process???

My Bible is quite clear that Adam and Eve SINNED in the Garden of Eden. And the result was that death and corruption entered the world. And God promised to send Jesus, to pay for our sins. That is the gospel, what are you preaching? Certainly not the Biblical gospel.

"15 I will put enmity between you and the woman,
and between your offspring[a] and her offspring;
he shall bruise your head,
and you shall bruise his heel.” Genesis 3:15

 

[Angela53510]

Not if you hold the view that Genesis 1:1 is the recreation of the earth, which came after the fall. There are theories and conjectures in passages of scripture which point to a pre-Adamic existence. I hold to a view which holds that the earth and universe were salvaged from desolation, because of Lucifer's rebellion. Lucifer did not go quietly when he took 2/3 of the angelic host with him. If you read this thread from the beginning I speak of other beings being present in the Garden along with Adam and Eve.

I remember this nonsense! I studied it when I was in the New Age Movement, about 4 years before I got saved.

So you are a New Ager?



And to anyone else who is reading my post, I hope people realize that heresy, made up stories, misinformation need to be countered with the truth.

I would just hate to have any new Christians reading the nonsense Russel is posting, and think it was the truth, or in any way based on the Bible, history, etc.

 

[prodigal]

MEOLOGY

in 1 minute he writes: Do you disagree with Jesus' teaching or have to change them?
Do you preach the same Gospel He preached or do you have to change it?
An old saying. "If the shoe fits wear it".

then then he writes

Our knowledge is dependent upon the Holy Spirit and our relationship with God. There were many times I read something in the bible and my soul said there was something wrong with the passage. When I went to the Hebrew and Greek it said exactly what was in my soul. So how did my soul know that the passage was mistranslated? Its by my relationship with God and His Holy Spirit teaching me all things.

so he can change the bible to fit whatever he wants but if anyone else was too, then they are in error, he needs to measure himself by his own set standard.

 

[oldhermit]

I remember this nonsense! I studied it when I was in the New Age Movement, about 4 years before I got saved.

So you are a New Ager?



And to anyone else who is reading my post, I hope people realize that heresy, made up stories, misinformation need to be countered with the truth.

I would just hate to have any new Christians reading the nonsense Russel is posting, and think it was the truth, or in any way based on the Bible, history, etc.

Finally. It's about time someone banned that clown.

 

[LieDetector]

Finally. It's about time someone banned that clown.

I honestly do not understand why people have ganged up on Russell to get him banned. I've found that many 'Christians' here at this forum are mean spirited bullies. Why do Christians attack people who are different from them and why bully people instead of discuss or ask Q's?

Admittedly, I haven't read through the entire thread here, and there's stuff he wrote which I don't quite understand, but I don't have the patience to read through it all. However, what I did see was this member attempting to discover if there was a deeper symbolic meaning to some part of scripture. Jesus spoke to us in parables and symbolism. The bible is full of metaphors, parables, symbolisms, dark sayings, etc....

The bible interprets the bible after all = If it were not so we would never understand the book of Revelation.

Some examples of how scripture interprets scripture is this:

a TREE can symbolize a number of things = such as: shelter, a person or righteous believer [Psalm 1:3; Isa 7:2], a cedar tree could symbolize a country or nation [1 Kings 4:33, Ps 29:5],the Cross [1 Pet 2:24, Acts 5:30 as in being hung on a 'tree']

The OCEAN can symbolize things such as: the world (Isa 17:12 sea of humanity Ps 98:7, Rev 17:15), Baptism[1 Cor 10:1-2], mean or merciless attacks from people (Jer 6:23, Jer50:42),Spiritual/emotionalinfluences the Word ofGod or truth (water of the word), people, sea of humanity/people or nations or unruly massesof society/people (Isa 57:20)

Does anyone think what I've posted above is "occult"? ... seriously..?
Do the majority of Christians not understand that the bible interprets itself?
Go look at all the dreams people in scripture had and look at how those dreams were interpreted via symbolism. Rarely was a dream literal. Look at the dream about the 7 ugly cows swallowing 7 fat cows.. What looks like foolishness is often from God. (God also speaks to non believers by the way - That dream was given to Pharaoh)

The bible isn't occult. - It interprets itself. ---- That doesn't mean people will always get it right of course.

Being here at CC is certainly an eye opening experience.. I'm seeing all manner of behaviours, accusations, suspiciousness, bullying, and the likes.. It leaves me scratching my head. But at the same time, Yeshua was also bullied & persecuted and misunderstood. When He told the pharisees that He would rebuild the temple in 3 days the pharisees went all sideways gnashing their teeth...... so I guess I should not be so surprised at what I have witnessed at CC.

The bullying I myself have been subjected to here from Ember and her possé has been extreme and unrelenting. I most likely will be leaving at some point. My own experience here has not been pleasant because of mean spirited bullies and rude remarks. I don't quite understand how people can be so suspicious and ignorant.

 

[oldhermit]

I honestly do not understand why people have ganged up on Russell to get him banned. I've found that many 'Christians' here at this forum are mean spirited bullies. Why do Christians attack people who are different from them and why bully people instead of discuss or ask Q's?

Admittedly, I haven't read through the entire thread here, and there's stuff he wrote which I don't quite understand, but I don't have the patience to read through it all. However, what I did see was this member attempting to discover if there was a deeper symbolic meaning to some part of scripture. Jesus spoke to us in parables and symbolism. The bible is full of metaphors, parables, symbolisms, dark sayings, etc....

The bible interprets the bible after all = If it were not so we would never understand the book of Revelation.

Some examples of how scripture interprets scripture is this:

a TREE can symbolize a number of things = such as: shelter, a person or righteous believer [Psalm 1:3; Isa 7:2], a cedar tree could symbolize a country or nation [1 Kings 4:33, Ps 29:5],the Cross [1 Pet 2:24, Acts 5:30 as in being hung on a 'tree']

The OCEAN can symbolize things such as: the world (Isa 17:12 sea of humanity Ps 98:7, Rev 17:15), Baptism[1 Cor 10:1-2], mean or merciless attacks from people (Jer 6:23, Jer50:42),Spiritual/emotionalinfluences the Word ofGod or truth (water of the word), people, sea of humanity/people or nations or unruly massesof society/people (Isa 57:20)

Does anyone think what I've posted above is "occult"? ... seriously..?
Do the majority of Christians not understand that the bible interprets itself?
Go look at all the dreams people in scripture had and look at how those dreams were interpreted via symbolism. Rarely was a dream literal. Look at the dream about the 7 ugly cows swallowing 7 fat cows.. What looks like foolishness is often from God. (God also speaks to non believers by the way - That dream was given to Pharaoh)

The bible isn't occult. - It interprets itself. ---- That doesn't mean people will always get it right of course.

Being here at CC is certainly an eye opening experience.. I'm seeing all manner of behaviours, accusations, suspiciousness, bullying, and the likes.. It leaves me scratching my head. But at the same time, Yeshua was also bullied & persecuted and misunderstood. When He told the pharisees that He would rebuild the temple in 3 days the pharisees went all sideways gnashing their teeth...... so I guess I should not be so surprised at what I have witnessed at CC.

The bullying I myself have been subjected to here from Ember and her possé has been extreme and unrelenting. I most likely will be leaving at some point. My own experience here has not been pleasant because of mean spirited bullies and rude remarks. I don't quite understand how people can be so suspicious and ignorant.

The guy was certifiable. It is obligatory that we challenge false teaching. This guy was a self proclaimed prophet and nothing he said is even remotely scriptural. He was nothing but an abuser of the text.

 

[MarcR]

Finally. It's about time someone banned that clown.

********AMEN