Water baptism is necessary to be in the first resurrection
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Acts is such a lovely book. If anything it shows that there isn’t a cookie cutter way to receive the Holy Spirit.
Acts 19:1-7
1And it happened that while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul passed through the inland country and came to Ephesus. There he found some disciples. 2And he said to them, “Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?” And they said, “No, we have not even heard that there is a Holy Spirit.”3And he said, “Into what then were you baptized?” They said, “Into John’s baptism.”4And Paul said, “John baptized with the baptism of repentance, telling the people to believe in the one who was to come after him, that is, Jesus.” 5On hearing this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 6And when Paul had laid his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and they began speaking in tongues and prophesying. 7There were about twelve men in all.
Acts 19:1-7
1And it happened that while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul passed through the inland country and came to Ephesus. There he found some disciples. 2And he said to them, “Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?” And they said, “No, we have not even heard that there is a Holy Spirit.”3And he said, “Into what then were you baptized?” They said, “Into John’s baptism.”4And Paul said, “John baptized with the baptism of repentance, telling the people to believe in the one who was to come after him, that is, Jesus.” 5On hearing this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 6And when Paul had laid his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and they began speaking in tongues and prophesying. 7There were about twelve men in all.
Born again is synonymous with Salvation.
You insist on ignoring Jesus teaching in John 3:1-21.
You're also wrong to cite Revelation 22 so to defend your errant conditional doctrine.
The last book of the NT, the book of attributed to John, the book of apokalypsis, Greek for disclosure:—appearing, coming, lighten, manifestation, be revealed, revelation., in that chapter pertains only to his scrolls,book, the book of Revelations of Jesus the Christ.
https://www.blueletterbible.org/lexicon/g602/kjv/tr/0-1/
This is obvious because the bible we know today that carries the current version of the New Testament canon did not yet exist.
Further, the grammar indicates John is speaking only of his book of apokalypsis.
As is clear in the verse excerpt you posted. "from the words of the book of this prophecy,"
Regarding Paul again. He baptized but a few. And as we've read was thankful he did not baptize others.
And also stated he did not come to baptize.
If Salvation is mandatory else one is not saved, those would be inflammatory statements implying Paul did not come to lead people to Salvation.
You insist on ignoring Jesus teaching in John 3:1-21.
You're also wrong to cite Revelation 22 so to defend your errant conditional doctrine.
The last book of the NT, the book of attributed to John, the book of apokalypsis, Greek for disclosure:—appearing, coming, lighten, manifestation, be revealed, revelation., in that chapter pertains only to his scrolls,book, the book of Revelations of Jesus the Christ.
https://www.blueletterbible.org/lexicon/g602/kjv/tr/0-1/
This is obvious because the bible we know today that carries the current version of the New Testament canon did not yet exist.
Further, the grammar indicates John is speaking only of his book of apokalypsis.
As is clear in the verse excerpt you posted. "from the words of the book of this prophecy,"
Regarding Paul again. He baptized but a few. And as we've read was thankful he did not baptize others.
And also stated he did not come to baptize.
If Salvation is mandatory else one is not saved, those would be inflammatory statements implying Paul did not come to lead people to Salvation.
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Yes, you did.
You believe the living can save the dead through baptism?
If so, now your pov makes sense. You're Pauline. Not what is termed Christian.
Paul was a Pharisee. Even identifyinv as such when identifying as apostle.
He did not believe Jesus was God, the word made flesh. He taught baptism of the liv8ng is on behalf of those that are dead.
1 Corinthians15:27 For “God has put all things in subjection under his feet.” But when it says, “all things are put in subjection,” it is plain that he is excepted who put all things insubjection under him. 28 When all things are subjected to him, then the Son himself will also be subjected to him who put all things in subjection under him, that God may be all in all.
29 Otherwise, what do people mean by being baptized on behalf of the dead? If the dead are not raised at all, why are people baptized on their behalf?
Where did Jesus teach we are baotized on behalf if the dead?
You believe the living can save the dead through baptism?
If so, now your pov makes sense. You're Pauline. Not what is termed Christian.
Paul was a Pharisee. Even identifyinv as such when identifying as apostle.
He did not believe Jesus was God, the word made flesh. He taught baptism of the liv8ng is on behalf of those that are dead.
1 Corinthians15:27 For “God has put all things in subjection under his feet.” But when it says, “all things are put in subjection,” it is plain that he is excepted who put all things insubjection under him. 28 When all things are subjected to him, then the Son himself will also be subjected to him who put all things in subjection under him, that God may be all in all.
29 Otherwise, what do people mean by being baptized on behalf of the dead? If the dead are not raised at all, why are people baptized on their behalf?
Where did Jesus teach we are baotized on behalf if the dead?
Let's try this again having fixed GBoard errors and paying more attention before hitting, post .
Repost to RM's post quoted above.
Yes, you did.
You believe the living can save the dead through baptism?
If so, now your pov makes sense. You're Pauline. Not what is termed Christian.
Paul was a Pharisee. Even identifying as such when identifying as apostle.
He did not believe Jesus was God, the word made flesh. He taught baptism of the living is on behalf of those that are dead.
1 Corinthians15:27 For “God has put all things in subjection under his feet.” But when it says, “all things are put in subjection,” it is plain that he is excepted who put all things insubjection under him. 28 When all things are subjected to him, then the Son himself will also be subjected to him who put all things in subjection under him, that God may be all in all.
29 Otherwise, what do people mean by being baptized on behalf of the dead? If the dead are not raised at all, why are people baptized on their behalf?
Where did Jesus teach we are baptized on behalf of the dead?
Repost to RM's post quoted above.
Yes, you did.
You believe the living can save the dead through baptism?
If so, now your pov makes sense. You're Pauline. Not what is termed Christian.
Paul was a Pharisee. Even identifying as such when identifying as apostle.
He did not believe Jesus was God, the word made flesh. He taught baptism of the living is on behalf of those that are dead.
1 Corinthians15:27 For “God has put all things in subjection under his feet.” But when it says, “all things are put in subjection,” it is plain that he is excepted who put all things insubjection under him. 28 When all things are subjected to him, then the Son himself will also be subjected to him who put all things in subjection under him, that God may be all in all.
29 Otherwise, what do people mean by being baptized on behalf of the dead? If the dead are not raised at all, why are people baptized on their behalf?
Where did Jesus teach we are baptized on behalf of the dead?
Cut from , Scripture Subjects: https://www.scripturesubjects.net/salvation-born-again-commentary
The term born-again is synonymous with saved, redeemed, regenerated, justified, and reborn. Each of these terms refers to the spiritual birth that occurs when a person stops pursuing sin and trusts Jesus for their forgiveness and salvation. Without being born-again, a person cannot enter heaven when they die but will spend eternity apart from God in the Lake of Fire.
Many people struggle to understand what “born-again” means or how to achieve it. Jesus addressed this issue in John 3:1-21 by telling a man named Nicodemus he must be born-again to go to heaven. Nicodemus was perplexed by Jesus’ statement since re-entering his mother’s womb was an impossibility. In response to Nicodemus’ confusion, Jesus spoke the following words in John 3:5-7 to distinctly differentiate a person’s human birth from the born-again spiritual rebirth He referenced: “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Do not be amazed that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’”
Jesus’ use of the phrase “born of water” references the human birthing process that occurs in and through the womb when “flesh gives birth to flesh.” In this birth, a human being gives birth to another human being. In contrast, Jesus used the phrase “that which is born of the Spirit is spirit” to teach Nicodemus that the born-again spiritual birth is not a human achievement but a supernatural work of God’s Spirit giving life to a human spirit.
Individuals must be born-again to redeem them from the sins that otherwise render them spiritually dead and eternally lost. Having fallen short of God’s perfect, holy standards because of sin, people will reap the full measure of God’s wrath unless the Holy Spirit regenerates their dead spirit. This regeneration is what being born-again means and why Jesus told Nicodemus, “You must be born-again.” more reading: https://www.scripturesubjects.net/salvation-born-again-commentary
Their Statement of Faith:
https://www.scripturesubjects.net/faith-statement
The term born-again is synonymous with saved, redeemed, regenerated, justified, and reborn. Each of these terms refers to the spiritual birth that occurs when a person stops pursuing sin and trusts Jesus for their forgiveness and salvation. Without being born-again, a person cannot enter heaven when they die but will spend eternity apart from God in the Lake of Fire.
Many people struggle to understand what “born-again” means or how to achieve it. Jesus addressed this issue in John 3:1-21 by telling a man named Nicodemus he must be born-again to go to heaven. Nicodemus was perplexed by Jesus’ statement since re-entering his mother’s womb was an impossibility. In response to Nicodemus’ confusion, Jesus spoke the following words in John 3:5-7 to distinctly differentiate a person’s human birth from the born-again spiritual rebirth He referenced: “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Do not be amazed that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’”
Jesus’ use of the phrase “born of water” references the human birthing process that occurs in and through the womb when “flesh gives birth to flesh.” In this birth, a human being gives birth to another human being. In contrast, Jesus used the phrase “that which is born of the Spirit is spirit” to teach Nicodemus that the born-again spiritual birth is not a human achievement but a supernatural work of God’s Spirit giving life to a human spirit.
Individuals must be born-again to redeem them from the sins that otherwise render them spiritually dead and eternally lost. Having fallen short of God’s perfect, holy standards because of sin, people will reap the full measure of God’s wrath unless the Holy Spirit regenerates their dead spirit. This regeneration is what being born-again means and why Jesus told Nicodemus, “You must be born-again.” more reading: https://www.scripturesubjects.net/salvation-born-again-commentary
Their Statement of Faith:
https://www.scripturesubjects.net/faith-statement
No I don’t believe in post-mortem or substitutionary baptism and that certainly isn’t what the OP says. You are completely misrepresenting me now. SMH.
By quoting 1 Corinthians 15:29, I was making the point that I believe Paul is saying that if there is no resurrection of the dead then water baptism is unnecessary. On the contrary, there is a resurrection of the dead so water baptism is necessary. Paul seems to have used a literary device known as a rhetorical question.
Directly from my OP:
Question 2:
why are they then baptized for the dead? KJV
If the dead are not raised at all, why are people baptized for them? NIV
If the dead are not raised at all, why are people baptized on their behalf? ESV
Answer 2:
This question is similar to the first question and so is the answer. The answer is that people are attempting to help deceased people by performing a water baptism for them so that they can be resurrected. There is no evidence from scripture that a substitutionary posthumous water baptism is effective to qualify a dead person for a resurrection, but there is evidence that a water baptism can provide a living person a resurrection.
By quoting 1 Corinthians 15:29, I was making the point that I believe Paul is saying that if there is no resurrection of the dead then water baptism is unnecessary. On the contrary, there is a resurrection of the dead so water baptism is necessary. Paul seems to have used a literary device known as a rhetorical question.
Directly from my OP:
Question 2:
why are they then baptized for the dead? KJV
If the dead are not raised at all, why are people baptized for them? NIV
If the dead are not raised at all, why are people baptized on their behalf? ESV
Answer 2:
This question is similar to the first question and so is the answer. The answer is that people are attempting to help deceased people by performing a water baptism for them so that they can be resurrected. There is no evidence from scripture that a substitutionary posthumous water baptism is effective to qualify a dead person for a resurrection, but there is evidence that a water baptism can provide a living person a resurrection.
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Totally agree.
I really don't see the point of engaging with someone who gets narky when I post a verse that clearly states Jesus did not baptise then responds of tangent quoting Mat28: 19-20 to then post later posts the verses I posted stating Jesus did not baptise.
Oh well you and @BeeThePeace are stalwarts.
God bless you.
I really don't see the point of engaging with someone who gets narky when I post a verse that clearly states Jesus did not baptise then responds of tangent quoting Mat28: 19-20 to then post later posts the verses I posted stating Jesus did not baptise.
Oh well you and @BeeThePeace are stalwarts.
God bless you.
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You are totally wrong on baptism.
Study scriptures;
Baptism is Required
Peter 3: 21.... whereunto even baptism doth also now save us...
John 3:5 .......Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Acts 2;38-....Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Acts 22;16... And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.
Galations 3:26...... For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
KJV Marrk 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
KJV Matthew 3:14... But John forbad him, saying, I have need to be baptized of thee, and comest thou to me? 15. Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now, for thus it becometh us to fulfil all rightesousness. Then He suffered Him.
KJV Matthew 28:19..... Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:.
Acts 8:12-18: But when they believed Philip as he preached the things concerning the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, both men and women were baptized.
John 3; 22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized.
23 And John also was baptizing in Aenon near to Salim, because there was much water there: and they came, and were baptized.
Quote from Billy Graham that is note worthy;
....Also, to clarify I did not say remission of sin takes place at repentance. Scripture makes it clear that it occurs upon obedience to water baptism in the name of the Lord Jesus. Each is a step of faith, along with receiving the Holy Ghost, in the process of one's spiritual rebirth
.."Paul explains the doctrinal significance of what occurs when one is baptized.His explanation is found in his letter to those who had already been obedient to the command.
Paul tells the Roman Christians what actually occurred when they were/are baptized; they were baptized into His death. Being buried with Jesus into His death resulted in their sin being destroyed.
Even though Paul explains this concept, the NEW AGE RELIGION TEACHING is......... that water baptism is nothing other than a mere public display.......... And that is so far removed from the truth.
Keep in mind that Satan knows if he can continue to perpetuate that lie ...... he can keep people from entering the kingdom of God. Thus He has proven scripture which says ...in the end times there will be ...great delusions.....they are here.
Conclusion....teaching that baptism is not necessary is violation of Rev. 22;19.... And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book. 20 He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus. (Also two other books of the Bible).
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You are free to IGNORE context all you want, but the context for Jesus' statement is based on Nic's confusion, much like your confusion.
In v.4 Jesus told Nic he must be BORN AGAIN. That means a SECOND birth. ol' Nic was thinking another PHYSICAL birth, from what he said to Jesus.
So Jesus clarified for ol' Nic what He was referring to by referring to BOTH a physical (water) and a spiritual birth is required to enter the kingdom. iow, no animals allowed. iow, no dogs go to heaven, regardless of what cartoon movies say.
That is ridiculous. I clarified YOUR confusion, just as ol' Nic was very confused too.
Oh, but I do. Even today when a woman is aabout to give birth, and there is a gush of fluid from the womb, it is referred to as her WATER BREAKING. Don't be so naive as to not know that.
I've never tried to stop this discussion. Like you have. And I reject your confusion. As Jesus rejected ol' Nic's confusion.
That's why Jesus clarified by noting the 2 births required for entrance into the kingdom.
There is NOTHING in John 3 that relates to the Christian ritual of water baptism. Not even John's baptism was what we call Christian baptism today.
John didn't baptize ANYONE "in the name of Jesus", or "in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
Or, if you disagree, prove your claim.
In v.4 Jesus told Nic he must be BORN AGAIN. That means a SECOND birth. ol' Nic was thinking another PHYSICAL birth, from what he said to Jesus.
So Jesus clarified for ol' Nic what He was referring to by referring to BOTH a physical (water) and a spiritual birth is required to enter the kingdom. iow, no animals allowed. iow, no dogs go to heaven, regardless of what cartoon movies say.
That is ridiculous. I clarified YOUR confusion, just as ol' Nic was very confused too.
Oh, but I do. Even today when a woman is aabout to give birth, and there is a gush of fluid from the womb, it is referred to as her WATER BREAKING. Don't be so naive as to not know that.
I've never tried to stop this discussion. Like you have. And I reject your confusion. As Jesus rejected ol' Nic's confusion.
That's why Jesus clarified by noting the 2 births required for entrance into the kingdom.
There is NOTHING in John 3 that relates to the Christian ritual of water baptism. Not even John's baptism was what we call Christian baptism today.
John didn't baptize ANYONE "in the name of Jesus", or "in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
Or, if you disagree, prove your claim.
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Can you explain the difference, PER SCRIPTURE?
How dishonest, again ignoring the first part of 1 Peter 3:21 which REFUTES your error. Literal water SYMBOLIZES the baptism that does not save us.
And NO verse says immersion in water is required to be born again.
More confusion here. When Jesus told Nic he must be BORN AGAIN, Nic thought Jesus was referring to a SECOND physical birth.
So Jesus explained the two births required for entrance into the kingdom; physical and spiritual in v.5.
iow, no NON-humans will enter the kingdom.
Context refutes your confused misunderstanding of John 3:5.
How dishonest, again ignoring the first part of 1 Peter 3:21 which REFUTES your error. Literal water SYMBOLIZES the baptism that does not save us.
And NO verse says immersion in water is required to be born again.
More confusion here. When Jesus told Nic he must be BORN AGAIN, Nic thought Jesus was referring to a SECOND physical birth.
So Jesus explained the two births required for entrance into the kingdom; physical and spiritual in v.5.
iow, no NON-humans will enter the kingdom.
Context refutes your confused misunderstanding of John 3:5.
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peldom10 said:
Not saved...born again. .....Per scripture.
So I asked this, in post #1,313:
Can you explain the difference, PER SCRIPTURE?
His response was a red round X on my post. Real mature, of course. But it shows that his ilk cannot answer simple questions.
He is full of these red round X's on the posts of others, but he seems only able to copy and paste.
Can't answer a thing. No ability to. He cannot defend his position. He can only repeat it ad nauseam.
Not saved...born again. .....Per scripture.
So I asked this, in post #1,313:
Can you explain the difference, PER SCRIPTURE?
His response was a red round X on my post. Real mature, of course. But it shows that his ilk cannot answer simple questions.
He is full of these red round X's on the posts of others, but he seems only able to copy and paste.
Can't answer a thing. No ability to. He cannot defend his position. He can only repeat it ad nauseam.
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Then, in post #1,314 I asked another poster this:
Doesn't matter what the OP says. You have NOT proven your claim. In fact, it's been disproven and refuted over and over.
And you have no answer to the question about the saved people who were never baptized in water.
What say you about that? What happens to them?
So, how does Peldom respond to my very legitimate questions? You guess it! another red round X.
Unable to answer, unable to explain. Just those little emoji's to express his emotions.
And that's all he has; emotions. No reasons, no rationale, no nothing. Just is own feelings.
The Bible is based on facts, knowledge, not feelings.
That's why we get no answers from him.
Facts and feelings are opposites. Feelings have no answers, no facts.
Doesn't matter what the OP says. You have NOT proven your claim. In fact, it's been disproven and refuted over and over.
And you have no answer to the question about the saved people who were never baptized in water.
What say you about that? What happens to them?
So, how does Peldom respond to my very legitimate questions? You guess it! another red round X.
Unable to answer, unable to explain. Just those little emoji's to express his emotions.
And that's all he has; emotions. No reasons, no rationale, no nothing. Just is own feelings.
The Bible is based on facts, knowledge, not feelings.
That's why we get no answers from him.
Facts and feelings are opposites. Feelings have no answers, no facts.
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Notice that Jesus left the area after hearing people were saying He was the one water baptizing people. Someone once shared that it is likely that Jesus didn't water baptize people because it would cause confusion concerning administration of the separate experiences. Per scripture, the God-given command to water baptize for remission of sin is administered by born again believers. Whereas those who believe receive the Holy Ghost directly from God.
Also important to note, submitting to God's command to be water baptized in the name of Jesus is an act of faith in association with the resurrection of Jesus Christ. Those who accept God's word and act in obedience receive what the word says they will receive. Both water and Spirit baptism are parts of one whole; the NT rebirth. (Acts 2:38-41, 8:12-18, 9:17-18, 10:43-48, 19:1-6, 22:16)
Also important to note, submitting to God's command to be water baptized in the name of Jesus is an act of faith in association with the resurrection of Jesus Christ. Those who accept God's word and act in obedience receive what the word says they will receive. Both water and Spirit baptism are parts of one whole; the NT rebirth. (Acts 2:38-41, 8:12-18, 9:17-18, 10:43-48, 19:1-6, 22:16)
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This is a misunderstanding. Water baptism symbolizes baptism of the Holy Spirit. 1 Pet 3:21
Failing to acknowledge the difference between the two always leads to a false doctrine about baptism.
1 Tim 1:16 - But for that very reason I was shown mercy so that in me, the worst of sinners, Christ Jesus might display his immense patience as an example for those who would believe in him and receive eternal life.
The pattern throughout the NT is to believe an receive. It ryhmes, even.
If water baptism were required for salvation, it would ALWAYS be included. In fact, the VAST majority of verses regarding salvation/eternal life have NO MENTION of water baptism at all.
Those who believe in Christ receive eternal life. John 5:24.
“Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life."
That is salvation. No water required. And salvation involves the baptism of the Holy Spirit. Eph 1:13
"And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit,"
From the MOMENT of belief in Christ as Savior, the believer receives the Holy Spirit, IS saved and SHALL NEVER PERISH. John 10:28
"I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand."
Demanding water baptism and faith in Christ for salvation is just like the Judaizers demanding circumcision for salvation.
Acts 15-
1 Certain people came down from Judea to Antioch and were teaching the believers: “Unless you are circumcised, according to the custom taught by Moses, you cannot be saved.”
2 This brought Paul and Barnabas into sharp dispute and debate with them. So Paul and Barnabas were appointed, along with some other believers, to go up to Jerusalem to see the apostles and elders about this question.
3 The church sent them on their way, and as they traveled through Phoenicia and Samaria, they told how the Gentiles had been converted. This news made all the believers very glad.
4 When they came to Jerusalem, they were welcomed by the church and the apostles and elders, to whom they reported everything God had done through them.
5 Then some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, “The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to keep the law of Moses.”
6 The apostles and elders met to consider this question.
7 After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: “Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe.
The blue words in v.1-2 are no different than this debate here on this thread. Except instead of circumcision, today it is water baptism.
The conclusion?
8 God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us.
9 He did not discriminate between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. This verse PROVES that water isn't required.
10 Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of Gentiles a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear?
11 No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are.”
Failing to acknowledge the difference between the two always leads to a false doctrine about baptism.
1 Tim 1:16 - But for that very reason I was shown mercy so that in me, the worst of sinners, Christ Jesus might display his immense patience as an example for those who would believe in him and receive eternal life.
The pattern throughout the NT is to believe an receive. It ryhmes, even.
If water baptism were required for salvation, it would ALWAYS be included. In fact, the VAST majority of verses regarding salvation/eternal life have NO MENTION of water baptism at all.
Those who believe in Christ receive eternal life. John 5:24.
“Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life."
That is salvation. No water required. And salvation involves the baptism of the Holy Spirit. Eph 1:13
"And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit,"
From the MOMENT of belief in Christ as Savior, the believer receives the Holy Spirit, IS saved and SHALL NEVER PERISH. John 10:28
"I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand."
Demanding water baptism and faith in Christ for salvation is just like the Judaizers demanding circumcision for salvation.
Acts 15-
1 Certain people came down from Judea to Antioch and were teaching the believers: “Unless you are circumcised, according to the custom taught by Moses, you cannot be saved.”
2 This brought Paul and Barnabas into sharp dispute and debate with them. So Paul and Barnabas were appointed, along with some other believers, to go up to Jerusalem to see the apostles and elders about this question.
3 The church sent them on their way, and as they traveled through Phoenicia and Samaria, they told how the Gentiles had been converted. This news made all the believers very glad.
4 When they came to Jerusalem, they were welcomed by the church and the apostles and elders, to whom they reported everything God had done through them.
5 Then some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, “The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to keep the law of Moses.”
6 The apostles and elders met to consider this question.
7 After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: “Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe.
The blue words in v.1-2 are no different than this debate here on this thread. Except instead of circumcision, today it is water baptism.
The conclusion?
8 God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us.
9 He did not discriminate between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. This verse PROVES that water isn't required.
10 Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of Gentiles a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear?
11 No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are.”
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All are required to believe the entire gospel message and obey the associated commands; repentance, water baptism in the name of Jesus and receive the Holy Ghost. One's spiritual rebirth is the result of one's belief and obedience to those God-given commands. Consider Paul warned those who had already acquired their rebirth of the need to work out their our own salvation with fear and trembling. (Phil. 2:12) Most don't like to hear it but salvation is an ongoing process.