What does born again mean?

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Locoponydirtman

Guest
Effects of faith & baptism!

Ez 36:25-27 washed in baptism, with a new heart and the Spirit
Jn 3:5 born again in baptism
Mk 16:16 faith & baptist
Acts 2:38 repentance & baptism
Acts 8:36-38 faith & baptism
Acts 22:16 baptism washes away sin
Rom 6:3 died with Christ
Col 2:12 risen with Christ
1 cor 12:13 baptized into the church
Gal 3:27 by baptism put on Christ
2 Tim 1:10 eph 2:1 and 5 brought to life
2 cor 5:17 new creation
Eph 1:13 sealed by the Holy Spirit
Eph 4:5 one faith, one baptism
Eph 5:26 faith and baptism
Titus 3:5 baptismal regeneration
1 pet 1:2 washed in Christ’s blood
1 pet 2:9 the kingdom of light
1 pet 3:20-21 baptism saves us!

“Faith alone” accomplishes nothing!
1 cor 13:2 even all faith (alone) without charity avails NOTHING!!!

Faith and baptism!

Scripture says none of the things about “Faith alone”!

Only James 2:24 a man is justified by works and not by “faith alone”

2 Peter 1:11
For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

The Christian sacrament of baptism is the Initiation into the new covenant and must be ministered to you by the apostles!




“Faith alone” Questions

where does scripture says we have died with Christ by “faith alone”?

Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

where does scripture say we are members of Christ and his church by “faith alone”?

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

where does scripture says we put on Christ by “faith alone”?

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Where does scripture say our sins are washed away by “faith alone”?

Acts 22:16
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

where does scripture say we are saved or justified by “faith alone”?

1 pet 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!

The only reference in scripture to “faith alone” is James 2:24 NOT BY “FAITH ALONE”?

2 pet 1: 11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

How can you enter by your own if it must be ministered to you? Baptism is done unto you, “not do it yourself by faith alone”

Jn 3:5 born again by faith alone?

Where is “Accept Christ as your personal lord & savior” is found in scripture?

They did not go preaching this line but went immediately to the river and baptized Jn 3:22

Acts 22:16
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Eph 4:5 one baptism

Why don’t it say one teeny tiny little act of “faith alone”???

When we first believed we are saved?

Romans 13:11
And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.

How can salvation be nearer than when we first believed if you’re saved by believing?

1 pet 1:9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.

Matt 24:13 endures to the end Shall be saved.

How can salvation happen when we first believed if it’s the end?

If salvation is by “faith alone” then faith would be the greatest!
1 cor 13:13 charity is the greatest!

Even all faith much less “faith alone” without charity avails nothing!
1 cor 13:2

“Faith alone” unbiblical!
There are baptism deniers here. It sad actually.
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
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Luke 2:8-12 . . Now there were shepherds in that region living in the fields
0and keeping the night watch over their flock. The angel of The Lord
appeared to them, and the glory of The Lord shone around them, and they
were struck with great fear.


. . .The angel said to them: Do not be afraid; for behold, I proclaim to you
good news of great joy that will be for all the people. For today in the city of
David a savior has been born for you who is Messiah and Lord.


NOTE: The "glory of The Lord" in that incident was but a shadow of the glory
in Heaven off limits to mankind. (1Tim 6:16)


The angel announced the birth of a savior. Webster's defines a "savior" as
one who rescues.


Rescuing is what the Coast Guard does when boats capsize. Rescuing is what
Firemen do when people are trapped inside burning buildings. Rescuing is
what mountaineer teams do when climbers are in trouble. Rescuing is what
EMT paramedics do when someone needs to get to a hospital in a hurry; and
kept alive till they arrive. Rescuing is what surgeons do when someone
needs an organ transplant.


I could go on and on giving example of rescuer after rescuer; but I think we
get the idea. The New Testament's Jesus is like that: he rescues people from
the wrath of God-- people who not only fully deserve it, but definitely in line
to get it; and with no humanly possible way to avoid it.


Now; of what real benefit would the savior of Luke 2:8-12 really be to
anybody if he couldn't guarantee a fail-safe rescue from the wrath of God?
He'd be of no benefit to anybody. No; he'd be an incompetent ninny that
nobody could rely on.


But, if a savior were to be announced who guaranteed anybody who wants
it, a completely free of charge, no strings attached, guaranteed fail-safe, sin
proof, human nature-proof, Ten Commandments-proof, bad behavior-proof,
apostasy-proof, reprobate-proof, back-sliding proof, God-proof, Devil-proof
rescue from the wrath of God, and full-time protection from future
retribution; wouldn't that qualify as good news of great joy?


I think just about everybody concerned about ending up in the lake of
brimstone depicted at Rev 20:10-15 would have to agree with me that news
like that would not only most certainly be good; but also cause for
celebration, and ecstatic happiness.


Luke 2:13-14 . . And suddenly there was a multitude of the heavenly host
with the angel, praising God and saying: Glory to God in the highest and on
earth peace to those on whom His favor rests.
_
 
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Acknowledge God "IS" & that you've sinned against His sovereign rule & deserve heavens sin payment "DEATH' (Rom 6:23).

Then place your faith in Christ's sin atoning death, burial & resurrection. Confessing Jesus as Lord & believing in your heart He rose from from death (Rom 10:9, 1 Cor 15:1-4)

Christ will then place/indwell/baptize you with His eternal life giving Holy Spirit. Imputing (See Lev chapter 4 & Rom 4) His righteousness onto you & your sins onto Himself. Whereby you become the righteousness of God in Christ (2 Cor 5:21). Amen
By “faith alone”?
 
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Very few see it that way. Unfortunately...
No cos of verse 22
Jn 3:22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized.
Also ez 36:25-27 Mk 16:16 acts 8:36-38 1 pet 3:20-21
Thanks
 
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What about John the baptist, when he was still in his mother's womb?
One of the blessings of God thru Mary but he did not receive the Christian sacrament of baptismal regeneration
Thanks

Blessing from God thru Mary!

All graces come to us they Mary, from God by the merits (blood) of Christ!
Jn 1:16
Of His fullness we have all received, grace for grace!

Found our Salvation Lk 1:30
Consented to our salvation Lk 1:38
Mother of Christ Matt 1:16
Mother of the word Jn 1:1
Mother of our savior Matt 1:21
Mother of our salvation Lk 2:30
Our mother Jn 19:26-27

By Mary’s intercession Christ is presented to be worshipped by the angels, shepherds, and the kings at the stable! Cos Mary found the grace of our salvation! Lk 1:30

Elizabeth filled with the Holy Spirit!

Lk 1:41 And it came to pass, that, when Elisabeth heard the salutation of Mary, the babe leaped in her womb; and Elisabeth was filled with the Holy Ghost:

John sanctified in the womb!

Lk 1:15 For he shall be great in the sight of the Lord, and shall drink neither wine nor strong drink; and he shall be filled with the Holy Ghost, even from his mother's womb.

Lk 1:44 For, lo, as soon as the voice of thy salutation sounded in mine ears, the babe leaped in my womb for joy.

Zacharias is filled with the Holy Spirit and prophecy!

Lk 1:67 And his father Zacharias was filled with the Holy Ghost, and prophesied, saying,

The wedding couple have wine and not shame!

Jn 2: 10 And saith unto him, Every man at the beginning doth set forth good wine; and when men have well drunk, then that which is worse: but thou hast kept the good wine until now.

The disciples are supplied with faith, hope, and charity!

11 This beginning of miracles did Jesus in Cana of Galilee, and manifested forth his glory; and his disciples believed on him.

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Mary found this grace! Lk 1:30
Mary believed for us! Lk 1:45
Mother of our salvation! Lk 2:30

All these blessings from God because of Mary most holy!
 
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Faith & Baptism is the initiation of the new and eternal covenant!

You cannot enter on you’re own or by “faith alone”!

You cannot receive Christ or grace by “faith alone”!

“Accept Christ as you’re personal lord and savior” is fundamentalist tradition not found scripture!

Jn 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

2 pet 1: 11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

Baptismal regeneration a new creation in Christ! 2 Cor 5:17

A sacrament is an oath! A sacred promise from God! Ez 36:25-27
Acts 2:38-39 (this promise)

No baptism no grace!

A sacrament is an outward sign for all men including infants And a gift from God to help us see what he does inwardly and invisibly by his grace!

As grace Washes our souls in the merits of Jesus blood from original and personal sin, so the outward action of washing is visible!

without the outward action the inward action cannot take place!

Jn 3:5 Titus 3:5 water and washing
acts 22:16 wash away your sin!

Jn 3:5 Born again BY water and the spirit! Not by “faith alone”!

They did not go to Jerusalem and preach “accept Christ as you’re personal Lord and savior “

They went to the river (water) and they baptized! Jn 3:22

A covenant requires an outward sign of the inward action of grace!

Ez 36:25 I will sprinkle you with clean water and you shall be made white as snow.

Acts 22:16 washing away your sins.

Eph 4:5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism.

1 pet 3:21 baptism saves you.

You cannot enter on you’re own or by faith alone!

2 pet 1: 11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

Heb 2:11 For both he that sanctifieth and they who are sanctified are all of one: for which cause he is not ashamed to call them brethren,


Baptism!

God breathed life into Adam, gen 2:7 and we received this life from our fathers!

Christ breathed on the apostles our spiritual fathers, we receive the new covenant life of God’s grace from them thru faith & baptism! Jn 20:21-23 Mk 16:16 acts 8:36-38 eph 2

Born again! Born from above!

'The Father has set his seal' on Christ (John 6:27) and also seals us in him (cf. 2 Corinthians 1:22; Ephesians 1:23, 4:30). Because this seal indicates the indelible effect of the anointing with the Holy Spirit in the sacrament of Baptism,

Baptism indeed is the seal of eternal life." 87 The faithful Christian who I has "kept the seal" until the end, remaining faithful to the demands of his Baptism, will be able to depart this life "marked with the sign of faith," 88 with his baptismal faith, in expectation of the blessed vision of God - the consummation of faith - and in the hope of resurrection.

St. Paul tells the faithful at Ephesus that they have been “sealed with the promised Holy Spirit.” This is in terms of an indelible character imprinted on the soul in the sacraments of baptism and confirmation. It is not as if this invisible mark is simply decorative. Rather, through it, we are enabled to participate in Christ’s mission and in his offices of priest, prophet, and king. Eph 1:13

Sealed by God eph 1:13 sealed by God (ez 36:25-27) in the ark of salvation by baptism just as Noah was sealed by God in the ark of the flood gen 7:16

1 Pet 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
(Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
(Outside the ark of Noah none were saved, outside the church (the ark of salvation) none are saved!)

Sealed in the ark, sealed in the church the ark of salvation by God thru baptism!



Christ instituted the holy church for the salvation of all men, (repent and believe the gospel, with the institution of the sacraments to convey grace to sanctify souls!


Effects of faith & baptism!

Ez 36:25-27 washed in baptism, with a new heart and the Spirit
Jn 3:5 born again in baptism
Mk 16:16 faith & baptist
Acts 2:38 repentance & baptism
Acts 8:36-38 faith & baptism
Acts 22:16 baptism washes away sin
Rom 6:3 died with Christ
Col 2:12 risen with Christ
1 cor 12:13 baptized into the church
Gal 3:27 by baptism put on Christ
2 Tim 1:10 eph 2:1 and 5 brought to life
2 cor 5:17 new creation
Eph 1:13 sealed by the Holy Spirit
Eph 4:5 one faith, one baptism
Eph 5:26 faith and baptism
Titus 3:5 baptismal regeneration
1 pet 1:2 washed in Christ’s blood
1 pet 2:9 the kingdom of light
1 pet 3:20-21 baptism saves us!

“Faith alone” accomplishes nothing!
1 cor 13:2 even all faith (alone) without charity avails NOTHING!!!

Faith and baptism!

Scripture says none of the things about “Faith alone”!

Only James 2:24 a man is justified by works and not by “faith alone”

2 Peter 1:11
For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

The Christian sacrament of baptism is the Initiation into the new covenant and must be ministered to you by the apostles!
Can you explain all these verses in light of “faith alone”?
Thanks
 
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Is that a a yes or no?

There are three classes in the order of priesthood:
High priest
Low priest
And common priesthood of those who are baptized members of Christ
Thanks

The new covenant priesthood:

High priesthood: “Jesus Christ”
acts 10:14
heb 5:1
heb 8:1
heb 8:3


Ministerial priesthood: “apostles & their successors, and those they ordain”
Mk 3:14
Jn 15:16
Jn 20:23
acts 1:15-26
acts 14:23
Acts 16:4
Rom 15:16
1 cor 9:14
1 Tim 3:1-2
1 Tim 2:7
1 Tim 4:14
Phil 1:1
James 5:14

Royal priesthood: “baptized members of Jesus Christ”
1 pet 2:5-9

The new covenant was a reformation of the mosaic covenant so it has many similarities. Heb 9:10
Thanks
 
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Wrong; in Scripture there are three distinct orders: that of Melchizedek, that of Aaron, and that of the believer. Scripture knows nothing of "high" and "low" classes. There was one high priest, beginning with Aaron, but that does not make the others "low priests".
It does if one is high the others must be low.

The Mosaic covenant priesthood:

Arron and His successors: high priests over the low priests, the Levites:

The common priesthood of the people: ex 19:6


The new covenant priesthood:

High priesthood: “Jesus Christ”
acts 10:14
heb 5:1
heb 8:1
heb 8:3


Ministerial priesthood: “apostles & their successors, and those they ordain”
Mk 3:14
Jn 15:16
Jn 20:23
acts 1:15-26
acts 14:23
Acts 16:4
Rom 15:16
1 cor 9:14
1 Tim 3:1-2
1 Tim 2:7
1 Tim 4:14
Phil 1:1
James 5:14

Royal priesthood: “baptized members of Jesus Christ”
1 pet 2:5-9

The new covenant was a reformation of the mosaic covenant so it has many similarities. Heb 9:10
Thanks
 
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It's clever to lump those who disagree with you as "baptism deniers", but it's meaningless. Who in your opinion is a "baptism denier"?
Maybe there are those who do not reject baptism but say it’s only an obedience or public profession of those who are already saved which is as much and an error as to reject baptism altogether, who knows
Thanks
 
L

Locoponydirtman

Guest
It's clever to lump those who disagree with you as "baptism deniers", but it's meaningless. Who in your opinion is a "baptism denier"?
Whats your concern?
 
L

Locoponydirtman

Guest
Maybe there are those who do not reject baptism but say it’s only an obedience or public profession of those who are already saved which is as much and an error as to reject baptism altogether, who knows
Thanks
If you think baptism is some work of man then you deny baptism. It really is that simple. The works of man avails nothing because it is filthy rags.
And there are some here who reject baptism altogether.
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
11,887
8,705
113
How is the natural man, in 1 Cor 2:14, that cannot know the things of the Spirit, told and shown a gospel of spiritual things, until he has been born spiritually?
Romans 1:20
“For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:”
 

FlyingDove

Senior Member
Dec 27, 2017
1,261
431
83
No cos of verse 22
Jn 3:22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized.
Also ez 36:25-27 Mk 16:16 acts 8:36-38 1 pet 3:20-21
Thanks
While Jesus is alive He's teaching & promoting OT Mosaic law. The new covenant/testament doesn't begin until the death of the testor (Heb 9:16-17)

Regeneration - Vine's Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words: Regeneration

[ 1,,G3824, palingenesia ]
new birth" (palin, "again," genesis, "birth"), is used of "spiritual regeneration," Titus 3:5, involving the communication of a new life,

Strong's Concordance (G3824) paliggenesia: regeneration, renewal
3824 /paliggenesía ("renewal, rebirth") is used twice in the NT referring to: a) the re-birth of physical creation at Christ's return (Advent), which inaugurates His millennial kingdom (Mt 19:28; cf. Ro 8:18-25); and b) the re-birth all believers experience at conversion (Tit 3:5).
https://biblehub.com/greek/3824.htm

ephfourfive, Your posted/personal definition of regeneration. Tying the spiritual baptism phenomenon to water is flawed & incorrect.

Matt 3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:
(MY NOTE: John the Baptist made clear that "Christ alone" would/could baptize with the Holy Spirit)


1 Cor 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
(MY NOTE: Translators capitalized Spirit to identify when referring the Holy Spirit. "Only Christ" can baptize with His eternally indwelling Holy Spirit.)


Col 2:11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:
(MY NOTE: The baptism of the Holy Spirit is a SPIRITUAL circumcision/covenant. Done "WITHOUT hands" & without water)

Deut 30:6 (A) the Lord thy God will circumcise thine heart,

Emblem: a symbolic representation of a particular quality or concept.

Water baptism is an emblem of the true spiritual baptism/circumcision. Preformed only by Christ & without hands.

It's an outwardly public profession of being dead with Christ, and of being raised together with him in new resurrection life.

Living water verses: (Jn 4:10, 6:35, 7:37-39, Jer 17:13, Ps 36:7-9)

Jn 7:37 In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.
(MY NOTE: Day 8, Feast of Tabernacles)

Jn 6:35 And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.

Jn 4:10 Jesus answered and said unto her, If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; thou wouldest have asked of him, and he would have given thee living water.
(MY NOTE: All the Samaritan woman had to do was believe & ASK. All anyone need do, is BELIEVE & ASK!)

John 7:
37 In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.

38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water

39 But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.
(MY NOTE: The true regeneration giving Living Water is Christ's salvation/sealing, eternal life giving, indwelling Holy Spirit. The invitation to drink of His Living Water/Holy Spirit is still open.

Rev 22:17 (B) let him that heareth; come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

After salvation/Christ's eternally sealing spiritual baptism gift. His indwelling Holy Spirit (Matt 3:11, Acts 1:5)

There are two NT Commandments & two Ordinance the Lord invoked.

Love God 1st & love your brother believer. Publicly partake in water baptism & the Lords Supper.

Finally:
Find here the transformation from OT law (Jews only, no gentiles) to the NT, where the two (Jew & gentile) being made one (Eph 2:12-22)

Acts 10:44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Spirit fell on all them which heard the word.
(MY NOTE: They Believed (vs43) & as Peter spoke (vs44) The Holy Spirit fell on then. No REPENTANCE of anykind here, No water baptism, No circumcision, they brought no sin sacrifice to the Temple, No law keeping etc)

Thru Faith & faith alone these gentiles were given/received the baptism OF & were eternally sealed BY Christ's indwelling Holy Spirit (vs45)

Acts 11:18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life
(MY NOTE: God GRANTED the gentiles repentance. Any person that believes they can conquer their sin nature (without Gods help) is mistaken 1 Jn 1:8) Best wishes, JJ
 
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If you think baptism is some work of man then you deny baptism. It really is that simple. The works of man avails nothing because it is filthy rags.
And there are some here who reject baptism altogether.
Baptism is accomplished by God’s sanctifying and justifying grace, but thru man who is the instrument Jn 3:22

Ez 36:25-27
25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.
26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.
Thanks