What is a Judaizer?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Jun 30, 2019
77
15
8
#81
Hi, 3rdAngel, I think Paul was the first to use the verb JUDAIZE. My question would be, why do Judaizers judaize in the first place? Could it be they think salvation by grace is too easy? No, salvation is not easy as they may think. Salvation is a free gift, but without holiness no one will be saved.
Hi Marcelo, I guess your saying in regards to true faith, by their fruits you shall know them. Thanks Marcelo very wise.

blessings
 
Jun 30, 2019
77
15
8
#82
We are not to ignore water baptism at all. Indeed it is Christ's command to every believer. And indeed it should ideally follow immediately upon conversion.

But we are not to make it essential for salvation either. That is similar to making physical circumcision essential for salvation. Both are unbiblical ideas.
Good point Nehemiah, so what your saying here is that both circumcision and baptism are symbolic of a new heart and dying to the flesh to walk in newness of life in the Spirit of God to follow Jesus.
 
Jun 30, 2019
77
15
8
#83
Why is it similar to physical circumcision? Did someone say that? Why does it matter if it is required or not? Why not just do it and not correlate anything to it? View attachment 202312
Hi Deade, I guess none of these outward signs are important if someone has yet to receive the inward fulfillment that the outward pointed to. Cicumcision being the sign of a new heart through faith and baptism being the sign of being dead to the flesh and alive through the Spirit.

blessings
 
Jun 30, 2019
77
15
8
#84
They are speaking hebrew, where there is no vowels. They somehow think this pleases God. They forget that God had a name long before the hebrew language was created.

God speaks to all people in their own language, Thats why this is called a hebrew roots or judiazer Trait.
Hi eternally-greatefull, nice alias we all should be eternally grateful to Jesus andhow blessed are we :)? I also beleive the same as you that it does not matter where we are from God speaks to us in our own language. None of us can undstand God's ways unless he is our teacher.

blessings
 

Adstar

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2016
4,871
1,712
113
#85
Hi Adstar, in your view do we show our faith by doing what God's word asks us to do or by not doing what God word asks us to do? Also, has Jesus in your view come to save us from our sins or so we can continue living in sin?

Blessings.
Being loving and caring for others is a good thing.. But we have many non-Christian religons that also make an effort to do charitable works and to help the poor..

What distinuishes us is the Message of Jesus we carry and should share with others when we are given a good opportunity to do so..

The term ""Jesus came to save us from our sins"" is pointing to Jesus saving us from the eternal consequences of our unforgiven sins, which is eternity in te Lake of Fire.. Jesus did not come to cause us to cease sinning in this world in our current flesh.. Yes people who believe God will fight the good fight against their own sinning and often that will see the sinning reduced significantly.. But no one ceases to sin 100% thats why we are in continual need of the Atonement of our LORD Jesus Christ..
 

garee

Senior Member
Mar 28, 2016
10,540
890
113
#86
Doesn't faith come by hearing and hearing by the word of God and if someone believes and follows God's word do they have the faith of Jesus?
Yes, before that faith is given they had none .Not little or some.
 

Deade

Called of God
Dec 17, 2017
9,835
5,181
113
73
#87
Hi Deade, I guess none of these outward signs are important if someone has yet to receive the inward fulfillment that the outward pointed to. Cicumcision being the sign of a new heart through faith and baptism being the sign of being dead to the flesh and alive through the Spirit.

blessings
Why is it similar to physical circumcision? Did someone say that? Why does it matter if it is required or not? Why not just do it and not correlate anything to it?
Wow! Just reading that quote without reading the quote I was answering, it does appear I was speaking of circumcision. When I said "why not just do it" I was speaking of baptism not circumcision. As I pointed out earlier, circumcision is not required according to scripture. 3spin-grin.gif
 
Jun 30, 2019
77
15
8
#88
Being loving and caring for others is a good thing.. But we have many non-Christian religons that also make an effort to do charitable works and to help the poor..

What distinuishes us is the Message of Jesus we carry and should share with others when we are given a good opportunity to do so..

The term ""Jesus came to save us from our sins"" is pointing to Jesus saving us from the eternal consequences of our unforgiven sins, which is eternity in te Lake of Fire.. Jesus did not come to cause us to cease sinning in this world in our current flesh.. Yes people who believe God will fight the good fight against their own sinning and often that will see the sinning reduced significantly.. But no one ceases to sin 100% thats why we are in continual need of the Atonement of our LORD Jesus Christ..
So in your view Jesus came to save us only from the penalty of sin and did not come to free us from the power of sin to walk in newness of life? What do you think Romans 6 and 1 John 2 and 1 John 3 are talking about? You also may want to consider Romans 3:31; Romans 8:13, Romans 13:8-10, Romans 8:13, Hebrews 10:26-31 and John 8:31-36.

blessings
 
Jun 30, 2019
77
15
8
#89
Yes, before that faith is given they had none .Not little or some.
Thanks garee so you agree faith comes by the word of God. Soo the reason for the question was that if those who many say are Juadaizers have the word of God and believe it how can they not have faith?
 
Jun 30, 2019
77
15
8
#90
Wow! Just reading that quote without reading the quote I was answering, it does appear I was speaking of circumcision. When I said "why not just do it" I was speaking of baptism not circumcision. As I pointed out earlier, circumcision is not required according to scripture. View attachment 202440
Thanks for the clarification Deade :) although I was just making the point that none of those things mean anything unless what they point to are fulfilled in our lives. They are all only outward signs of an inward experience by the operation of God through faith.
 
Jun 30, 2019
77
15
8
#91
According to scripture we no longer need to use fleshly rites in our worship, they were given to the Hebrews to help them understand the spiritual truths of worship and through Christ and the Holy Spirit given to all they are not needed any longer to be used as our guides. To use these rites the church calls judaism.

Hebrews 9: 11 But when Christ came as high priest of the good things that are now already here, he went through the greater and more perfect tabernacle that is not made with human hands, that is to say, is not a part of this creation. 12 He did not enter by means of the blood of goats and calves; but he entered the Most Holy Place once for all by his own blood, thus obtaining eternal redemption.

However, the church councils that gathered after Christ to set up church policy used this direction from the Lord to get rid of even what God told us was to be followed "for all generations". They did this to follow their anti-semitic believes so they tossed even Passover, pretending that God ordered it.
Did they get rid of circumcision or is circumcision the fulfillment of the new covenant promise to love?
 
Jun 30, 2019
77
15
8
#92
Acts 15:5 But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.

That is a judaizer. A Pharisee who believes and commands to keep the law of moses.

This was the question posed by Peter;

Acts 15:10 Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?

And this was his conclusion;

Acts 15:11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts Grandpa. Some people get the law of God mixed up with the law of Moses though. Circumcision is not one of God's 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is when broken.

blessings
 
Jun 30, 2019
77
15
8
#93
Well 3rdAngel, some call me a Judaizer because I honor God from Friday sunset to Saturday sunset. God did not name the days of the week, pagans did. I don't do it to get saved or to earn anything. I just do it. I delight in God Sabbath, I hope God delights in me just a little bit. I keep other laws too because I don't see all fulfilled as some claim. I am saved by grace like everyone else but they still claim I am trying to save myself. Oh well, you can't please everyone. View attachment 202336
Sorry for the slow replies here brother Deade, I am still playing catch up. From my understanding of the word JUDAIZER it seems that it's application by many that use this term is not justified according to the true definition of the words meaning and application and people use the term without understanding it's meaning.

blessings
 

Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
9,032
1,431
113
#94
Thanks for sharing your thoughts Grandpa. Some people get the law of God mixed up with the law of Moses though. Circumcision is not one of God's 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is when broken.

blessings
Sure it is.

Romans 2:25-29
25 For circumcision verily profiteth, if thou keep the law: but if thou be a breaker of the law, thy circumcision is made uncircumcision.

26 Therefore if the uncircumcision keep the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision?

27 And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfil the law, judge thee, who by the letter and circumcision dost transgress the law?

28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:

29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.
 

oldethennew

Senior Member
Feb 28, 2016
9,021
1,576
113
#95
in both of our opinions, most of what people describe today as Judaizers is off the wall -
what we think is, that this is a movement of people who are truly seeking to discover the connection
between Jesus the Jew, and what to do!!!

they are NOT in the main-stream of 'paganism', their 'hearts' are trying to find God and to get right with God'...
 
Jun 30, 2019
77
15
8
#96
Sure it is.

Romans 2:25-29
25 For circumcision verily profiteth, if thou keep the law: but if thou be a breaker of the law, thy circumcision is made uncircumcision.

26 Therefore if the uncircumcision keep the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision?

27 And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfil the law, judge thee, who by the letter and circumcision dost transgress the law?

28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:

29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.
Where is circumcision written in the 10 commandments? It looks like you are confusing the law of God with the laws of Moses (TORAH or first five books of the bible.
 

Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
9,032
1,431
113
#97
Where is circumcision written in the 10 commandments? It looks like you are confusing the law of God with the laws of Moses (TORAH or first five books of the bible.
Circumcision isn't written in the 10 commandments.

But circumcision of the Heart is DEFINITELY part of Gods Law.

So yes, there definitely is a confusion between Gods Law and the 10 commandments.
 

Adstar

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2016
4,871
1,712
113
#98
So in your view Jesus came to save us only from the penalty of sin and did not come to free us from the power of sin to walk in newness of life? What do you think Romans 6 and 1 John 2 and 1 John 3 are talking about? You also may want to consider Romans 3:31; Romans 8:13, Romans 13:8-10, Romans 8:13, Hebrews 10:26-31 and John 8:31-36.

blessings
Are you now sinless 3rdAngel ??
 

garee

Senior Member
Mar 28, 2016
10,540
890
113
#99
Wow! Just reading that quote without reading the quote I was answering, it does appear I was speaking of circumcision. When I said "why not just do it" I was speaking of baptism not circumcision. As I pointed out earlier, circumcision is not required according to scripture. View attachment 202440

In the same way as a ceremonial shadow as a law that preaches the gospel beforehand neither is water baptism, they offer no substance neither is required .

Circumcision is a sign of the first born of God, our bloody husband Christ. .

Exodus 4: 19-23 And the Lord said unto Moses in Midian, Go, return into Egypt: for all the men are dead which sought thy life. And Moses took his wife and his sons, and set them upon an ass, and he returned to the land of Egypt: and Moses took the rod of God in his hand. And the Lord said unto Moses, When thou goest to return into Egypt, see that thou do all those wonders before Pharaoh, which I have put in thine hand: but I will harden his heart, that he shall not let the people go.And thou shalt say unto Pharaoh, Thus saith the Lord, Israel is my son, even my firstborn:And I say unto thee, Let my son go, that he may serve me: and if thou refuse to let him go, behold, I will slay thy son, even "thy firstborn"

To help Moses to make sure he understood the parable of the "first born" he used Moses and his son as an example of the Son of man, Jesus signifying the firstborn, Son of God. . . .preaching the gospel beforehand


Exodus 4:24-27And it came to pass by the way in the inn, that the Lord met him, and sought to kill him.ThenZipporah took a sharp stone, and cut off the foreskin of her son, and cast it at his feet, and said, Surely a bloody husband art thou to me. So he let him go: then she said, A bloody husband thou art, because of the circumcision. And the Lord said to Aaron, Go into the wilderness to meet Moses. And he went, and met him in the mount of God, and kissed him.

In that way during that time period when the Jews were under the pagan goverment of kings in Israel. I would offer all of the ceremonial laws and furniture used to represent the things not seen the eternal signified Christ coming as our bloody suffering husband .

1 Peter 1:9-12 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls. Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven; which things the angels desire to look into.
 
Jun 30, 2019
77
15
8
Are you now sinless 3rdAngel ??
Hi Ad, happy to to answer your question directly but I did ask you some questions first and you did not answer them. What do you think Romans 6 and 1 John 2 and 1 John 3 are talking about? You also may want to consider Romans 3:31; Romans 8:13, Romans 13:8-10, Romans 8:13, Hebrews 10:26-31 and John 8:31-36.

blessings