What must I do to be saved
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And yet Israel for whom He came "to the Jew first" rejected Him and sent Him to the cross.
Christ taught that whosoever would may come unto Him and be saved. Problem is that many will not come unless it is on their terms. Grace is mercy or even better pity. God has concluded them all in unbelief that He might have mercy on all.
Nobody is elect until they are saved and sealed unto redemption. Then some fancy themselves elect.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
Christ taught that whosoever would may come unto Him and be saved. Problem is that many will not come unless it is on their terms. Grace is mercy or even better pity. God has concluded them all in unbelief that He might have mercy on all.
Nobody is elect until they are saved and sealed unto redemption. Then some fancy themselves elect.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
Sorry I can't accept that as being completely Biblically correct, we have the other view that nobody is saved unless they are elect in the first place. Please have a quick read of this article, it compares both views with the scriptures
https://carm.org/does-regeneration-precede-faith
https://carm.org/does-regeneration-precede-faith
What must i do to be saved (delivered from my sin and its consequences) ?
If we are believers then Acts 2: 37- 39 will tell us what we must do to be saved.
Now when they heard this, they were pierced to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, "Brethren what shall we do?" And Peter said to them, "Repent, and let each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. For the promise is for you and your children, and for all who are far off, as many as the Lord our God shall call to Himself." (Acts 2: 37- 39)
If we are non-believers, then Acts 16: 30, 31 will tell us what we must do to be saved.
and after he brought them out, he said, "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?" And they said, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you shall be saved, you and your household." Acts 16: 30, 31)
We are all saved through the grace of our Lord Jesus, in the same way as they also are. (Acts 15: 11)
God bless
If we are believers then Acts 2: 37- 39 will tell us what we must do to be saved.
Now when they heard this, they were pierced to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, "Brethren what shall we do?" And Peter said to them, "Repent, and let each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. For the promise is for you and your children, and for all who are far off, as many as the Lord our God shall call to Himself." (Acts 2: 37- 39)
If we are non-believers, then Acts 16: 30, 31 will tell us what we must do to be saved.
and after he brought them out, he said, "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?" And they said, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you shall be saved, you and your household." Acts 16: 30, 31)
We are all saved through the grace of our Lord Jesus, in the same way as they also are. (Acts 15: 11)
God bless
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The natural man according to 1 Cor 2:14 can not be pricked in his heart, same goes for the jailer, which has a reference footnote to the Acts event. there is a deliverance ( salvation ) when a child of God comes to a knowledge of the truth. Same example of those children of God, in Romans 10. who had a zeal of God, but were lacking in knowledge.
These people were already born of the Spirit.
These people were already born of the Spirit.
In Acts 2:38, "for the remission of sins" does not refer back to both clauses, "you all repent" and "each one of you be baptized," but refers only to the first. Peter is saying "repent unto the remission of your sins," the same as in Acts 3:19. The clause "each one of you be baptized" is parenthetical. This is exactly what Acts 3:19 teaches except that Peter omits the parenthesis.
*Also compare the fact that these Gentiles in Acts 10:45 received the gift of the Holy Spirit (compare with Acts 2:38 - the gift of the Holy Spirit) and this was BEFORE water baptism (Acts 10:47).
In Acts 10:43 we read ..whoever believes in Him receives remission of sins. Again, these Gentiles received the gift of the Holy Spirit - Acts 10:45 - when they believed on the Lord Jesus Christ - Acts 11:17 - (compare with Acts 16:31 - Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved) BEFORE water baptism - Acts 10:47. This is referred to as repentance unto life - Acts 11:18.
*So the only logical conclusion when properly harmonizing Scripture with Scripture is that faith in Jesus Christ "implied in genuine repentance" (rather than water baptism) brings the remission of sins and the gift of the Holy Spirit (Luke 24:47; Acts 2:38; 3:19; 5:31; 10:43-47; 11:17,18; 15:8,9; 16:31; 26:18). *Perfect Harmony*
*Also compare the fact that these Gentiles in Acts 10:45 received the gift of the Holy Spirit (compare with Acts 2:38 - the gift of the Holy Spirit) and this was BEFORE water baptism (Acts 10:47).
In Acts 10:43 we read ..whoever believes in Him receives remission of sins. Again, these Gentiles received the gift of the Holy Spirit - Acts 10:45 - when they believed on the Lord Jesus Christ - Acts 11:17 - (compare with Acts 16:31 - Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved) BEFORE water baptism - Acts 10:47. This is referred to as repentance unto life - Acts 11:18.
*So the only logical conclusion when properly harmonizing Scripture with Scripture is that faith in Jesus Christ "implied in genuine repentance" (rather than water baptism) brings the remission of sins and the gift of the Holy Spirit (Luke 24:47; Acts 2:38; 3:19; 5:31; 10:43-47; 11:17,18; 15:8,9; 16:31; 26:18). *Perfect Harmony*
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He was referring to His twelve disciples who the Father gave Him.
He did lose Judas.
9 “I pray for them. I do not pray for the world but for those whom You have given Me, for they are Yours. 10 And all Mine are Yours, and Yours are Mine, and I am glorified in them. 11 Now I am no longer in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to You. Holy Father, keep through Your name those whom You have given Me, that they may be one as We are. 12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in Your name. Those whom You gave Me I have kept; and none of them is lost except the son of perdition, that the Scripture might be fulfilled. John 17:9-12
- Those whom You gave Me I have kept; and none of them is lost except the son of perdition, that the Scripture might be fulfilled.
BY context, those who You gave Me, refer to the twelve disciples, while He was in the world.
Judas was appointed, elected, destined to rule with Christ and the other eleven disciples in the age to come.
28 So Jesus said to them, “Assuredly I say to you, that in the regeneration, when the Son of Man sits on the throne of His glory, you who have followed Me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. Matthew 19:28
- you who have followed Me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
It's up to us to take the "talents", the gift of a new nature empowered by the Holy Spirit, and make our calling and election sure.
Peter says it this way -
5 But also for this very reason, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue, to virtue knowledge, 6 to knowledge self-control, to self-control perseverance, to perseverance godliness, 7 to godliness brotherly kindness, and to brotherly kindness love. 8 For if these things are yours and abound, you will be neither barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins.
10 Therefore, brethren, be even more diligent to make your call and election sure, for if you do these things you will never stumble; 11 for so an entrance will be supplied to you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
- be even more diligent to make your call and election sure, for if you do these things you will never stumble;
Stumble is an important word here, as it means to depart from Christ in unbelief; Turn away from Christ to another.
JPT
Peter was speaking to believers, when he warned them not to stumble. So he was speaking to the elect of God, and Judas was not one of Gods elect. He was created to betray Jesus, he was predestined to do exactly as he did. Just as Gods elect will do exactly as they were created to do.
We in the Reformed Church believe God predestined every single person to either believe or reject the Gospel. There are just too many scriptures supporting our view, they can't be understood any other way without changing their intended meaning.
We in the Reformed Church believe God predestined every single person to either believe or reject the Gospel. There are just too many scriptures supporting our view, they can't be understood any other way without changing their intended meaning.
According to your beliefs, those who reject the Gospel are doing exactly as God "willed" for them.
You even go so far as to state that Judas "was created to betray Jesus, he was predestined to do exactly as he did".
Since (according to you) that is the case, and those who reject were obedient to God's Will, they should not be consigned to the lake of fire ... they have lived their lives much more in alignment with God's Will than the one you claim to be "God's elect" because God's elect stray from God's Will and fall into sin.
You even go so far as to state that Judas "was created to betray Jesus, he was predestined to do exactly as he did".
Since (according to you) that is the case, and those who reject were obedient to God's Will, they should not be consigned to the lake of fire ... they have lived their lives much more in alignment with God's Will than the one you claim to be "God's elect" because God's elect stray from God's Will and fall into sin.
God created them without the gift of belief, so they can't believe. It leaves them free to do whatever they like without the fear of punishment, because they don't believe that God will punish them. They choose to sin against God, because they love their sin so God must punish them for sinning against Him.
God didn't force them to sin, they choose to sin because they love sinning. They don't have to sin but they do because they don't respect or love God, so God is well within His rights to punish them.
God didn't force them to sin, they choose to sin because they love sinning. They don't have to sin but they do because they don't respect or love God, so God is well within His rights to punish them.
In your Post #1,029, you stated "God predestined every single person to either believe or reject the Gospel".
In your Post #1,031, you stated "God didn't force them to sin".
Those two statements contradict each other.
If God "predestined" some to "reject the Gospel", then God did, in fact, force them to sin. To reject the Gospel is sin.
In your Post #1,031, you stated "God didn't force them to sin".
Those two statements contradict each other.
If God "predestined" some to "reject the Gospel", then God did, in fact, force them to sin. To reject the Gospel is sin.
N
judas was a devil
it is only your false understanding that clouds you from seeing this
john 6
68Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life.
69And we believe and are sure that thou art that Christ, the Son of the living God.
70Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil?
he didnt only become a devil when he betrayed Jesus
but he was chosen so that scripture would be fulfilled <- never a born again believer regardless of how bad you want to use him as an example for your weak man made doctrine which gives humans the power to save themself and keep themself saved.....
not one biblical teaching have i seen from you
only weak arguements for works salvation based on your own personal understanding which ignores scripture
it is only your false understanding that clouds you from seeing this
john 6
68Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life.
69And we believe and are sure that thou art that Christ, the Son of the living God.
70Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil?
he didnt only become a devil when he betrayed Jesus
but he was chosen so that scripture would be fulfilled <- never a born again believer regardless of how bad you want to use him as an example for your weak man made doctrine which gives humans the power to save themself and keep themself saved.....
not one biblical teaching have i seen from you
only weak arguements for works salvation based on your own personal understanding which ignores scripture
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N
definitely none of those here who are pushing their ridiculous conclusions which say man can save himself through his own effort or keep himself saved
we are saved by grace through faith
but God isnt decieved
even if WE are ourself
just because someone thinks they believe
and says they believe
does not mean they arent like the reprobate
or the self righteous
a genuine faith IN Christ endures <- is not so weak it can be walked away from
it is also followed by a new God given heart
and the indwelling Holy spirit
and your spirit will testify that you are His
God will chasten His own (obviously not when they do well... but stumble in order to correct His ALREADY saved children)
and your new heart will hate the things of the world
even if your flesh still desires them
genuine faith is not powerless <- but this doesnt change the fact that
salvation is a GIFT and not a reward
huge difference
it is not our walk that saves us
it is Jesus who saves us
we are saved by grace through faith
but God isnt decieved
even if WE are ourself
just because someone thinks they believe
and says they believe
does not mean they arent like the reprobate
or the self righteous
a genuine faith IN Christ endures <- is not so weak it can be walked away from
it is also followed by a new God given heart
and the indwelling Holy spirit
and your spirit will testify that you are His
God will chasten His own (obviously not when they do well... but stumble in order to correct His ALREADY saved children)
and your new heart will hate the things of the world
even if your flesh still desires them
genuine faith is not powerless <- but this doesnt change the fact that
salvation is a GIFT and not a reward
huge difference
it is not our walk that saves us
it is Jesus who saves us
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And Peter?
What about Peter, was he a fallen angel?
22 Then Peter took Him aside and began to rebuke Him, saying, “Far be it from You, Lord; this shall not happen to You!”
23 But He turned and said to Peter, “Get behind Me, Satan! You are an offense to Me, for you are not mindful of the things of God, but the things of men.”
Matthew 16:22-23
- He turned and said to Peter, “Get behind Me, Satan!
So your saying Judas was an unclean spirit, and not a human being?
You might want to look up the meaning of that word devil.
You will find it’s a metaphorical reference to a person who is opposing God.
According to Jesus, Judas was destined to sit on one of the twelve thrones in the age to come, judging and reigning with Jesus.
Judas fell by transgression and never repented by returning to Jesus like Peter did, and was restored for denying Him.
JPT
John 17:12 - While I was with them in the world, I kept them in Your name. Those whom You gave Me I have kept; and none of them is lost except the son of perdition, that the Scripture might be fulfilled. John 18:9 - that the saying might be fulfilled which He spoke, "Of those whom You gave Me I have lost none." Jesus did not lose Judas. Judas was already lost. Judas was an unbelieving, unclean devil who would betray Jesus (John 6:64-71; 13:10-11).
Syllogism
1. All given by the Father to Jesus are kept.
2. Judas was not kept.
3. Judas was not given to Jesus by the Father
Or, this way.
1. None of those given to Jesus by the Father will be lost by Jesus.
2. Judas is lost.
3. Judas was not given to Jesus by the Father.
Syllogism
1. All given by the Father to Jesus are kept.
2. Judas was not kept.
3. Judas was not given to Jesus by the Father
Or, this way.
1. None of those given to Jesus by the Father will be lost by Jesus.
2. Judas is lost.
3. Judas was not given to Jesus by the Father.
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N
no
satan <- can be used as "enemy" for standing against God is different than saying he "IS A DEVIL" when someone isnt currently opposing God as peter did when Jesus said that
im saying judas was a bad tree
from the start
chosen as a bad tree to fulfill scripture
this is not the same as peter
nice try though
but scripture is clear
judas <- never saved
even some of your other works salvation pals understand that much
satan <- can be used as "enemy" for standing against God is different than saying he "IS A DEVIL" when someone isnt currently opposing God as peter did when Jesus said that
im saying judas was a bad tree
from the start
chosen as a bad tree to fulfill scripture
this is not the same as peter
nice try though
but scripture is clear
judas <- never saved
even some of your other works salvation pals understand that much
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Thanks but I'll take the bible over dubious doctrines of men.
Take responsibility for your sin and ask Christ for forgiveness. No one is elect to be saved. They are elect after they are saved. Israel who was Gods elect among the nations only received blessing if they heard and obeyed the word of God. Those in Israel had forgiveness of sin only if they believed in the blood covering of the lamb offered one time a year to cover their sin. Those who did not believe did not receive forgiveness because of their personal unbelief. God always deals with men on a personal one to one face to face basis in the matter of redemption.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
Take responsibility for your sin and ask Christ for forgiveness. No one is elect to be saved. They are elect after they are saved. Israel who was Gods elect among the nations only received blessing if they heard and obeyed the word of God. Those in Israel had forgiveness of sin only if they believed in the blood covering of the lamb offered one time a year to cover their sin. Those who did not believe did not receive forgiveness because of their personal unbelief. God always deals with men on a personal one to one face to face basis in the matter of redemption.
For the cause of Christ
Roger