Whatever happened to faith?

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crossnote

crossnote

Senior Member
#1
Nov 24, 2012
30,709
3,650
113
#1
Many here want to leave Calvary and return to Mt Sinai where...

12:18-21 For ye are not come unto the mount that might be touched, and that burned with fire, nor unto blackness, and darkness, and tempest,
And the sound of a trumpet, and the voice of words; which voice they that heard intreated that the word should not be spoken to them any more:
(For they could not endure that which was commanded, And if so much as a beast touch the mountain, it shall be stoned, or thrust through with a dart:
And so terrible was the sight, that Moses said, I exceedingly fear and quake:

Instead shouldn't they be seeking Jerusalem above where...

Hebrews 12:22-24 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,
To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,
And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

In the light of the above, I ask...

Were the first generation of Israelites barred from going into the promised land because they failed to keep the Big 10 or because they failed to believe the promise that God would give them the land?



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RedTent

RedTent

Banned
#2
Oct 31, 2011
8,200
182
0
#2
Were the first generation of Israelites barred from going into the promised land because they failed to keep the Big 10 or because they failed to believe the promise that God would give them the land?
Click to expand...
It was because they failed to act on the promise that God would give them the land.

We have been trying to divorce action from faith ever since, when the word itself includes action.
 
resurrection33

resurrection33

Banned
#3
Dec 19, 2009
27,513
128
0
71
#3
crossnote said:
Many here want to leave Calvary and return to Mt Sinai where...

12:18-21 For ye are not come unto the mount that might be touched, and that burned with fire, nor unto blackness, and darkness, and tempest,
And the sound of a trumpet, and the voice of words; which voice they that heard intreated that the word should not be spoken to them any more:
(For they could not endure that which was commanded, And if so much as a beast touch the mountain, it shall be stoned, or thrust through with a dart:
And so terrible was the sight, that Moses said, I exceedingly fear and quake:

Instead shouldn't they be seeking Jerusalem above where...

Hebrews 12:22-24 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,
To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,
And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

In the light of the above, I ask...

Were the first generation of Israelites barred from going into the promised land because they failed to keep the Big 10 or because they failed to believe the promise that God would give them the land?



*
Click to expand...
Satan rules this world and leads people away from their faith in God. It's not politically correct to trust the Lord, or to even speak of him. Yes?
 
crossnote

crossnote

Senior Member
#4
Nov 24, 2012
30,709
3,650
113
#4
RedTent said:
It was because they failed to act on the promise that God would give them the land.

We have been trying to divorce action from faith ever since, when the word itself includes action.
Click to expand...
But is not the promise and believing the promise the root by which the 'action' is anchored?
 
RedTent

RedTent

Banned
#5
Oct 31, 2011
8,200
182
0
#5
crossnote said:
But is not the promise and believing the promise the root by which the 'action' is anchored?
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Ah, so true. But what good is the root of a tree unless it produces a tree? Same thing.
 
Cobus

Cobus

Banned
#8
Feb 17, 2010
3,620
27
0
#8
Crossnote, AGAIN you mis the point because you do not believe.... They were NEVER JUST MEN MADE PERFECT. ONLY THE PERFECT will enter into God's LAND.....

I will give you a NEW HEART and MY SPIRIT and you shall live in the land I promised to your fathers..... Only people witht the SEED of GOD, born of GOD and CANNOT SIN will enter as Just men made perfect.....

No SINNER can inherit the Kingdom of God. NO SINNER!
 
K

Kerry

Guest
#9
#9
Cobus said:
Crossnote, AGAIN you mis the point because you do not believe.... They were NEVER JUST MEN MADE PERFECT. ONLY THE PERFECT will enter into God's LAND.....

I will give you a NEW HEART and MY SPIRIT and you shall live in the land I promised to your fathers..... Only people witht the SEED of GOD, born of GOD and CANNOT SIN will enter as Just men made perfect.....

No SINNER can inherit the Kingdom of God. NO SINNER!
Click to expand...
Then we are all doomed. Even Paul said" I have not attained".
 
crossnote

crossnote

Senior Member
#10
Nov 24, 2012
30,709
3,650
113
#10
It's
Cobus said:
Crossnote, AGAIN you mis the point because you do not believe.... They were NEVER JUST MEN MADE PERFECT. ONLY THE PERFECT will enter into God's LAND.....

I will give you a NEW HEART and MY SPIRIT and you shall live in the land I promised to your fathers..... Only people witht the SEED of GOD, born of GOD and CANNOT SIN will enter as Just men made perfect.....

No SINNER can inherit the Kingdom of God. NO SINNER!
Click to expand...
Whatever COBUS,
It's still by faith...not by law we enter.
 
K

Kerry

Guest
#11
#11
Show one man that entered by law? from the bible, who was so lawful that God took Him.
 
S

starfield

Senior Member
#12
Jun 13, 2009
3,393
58
48
#12
Joshua and Caleb gave a good report by faith after they spied the land, and entered the Promised Land. Those who humble themselves and believe in the promise of God will receive the fullness of His grace.
 
K

Kerry

Guest
#13
#13
I like that Starfield, Joshua and Caleb had faith. They said they could take it and they took it. The other ones are dead in the wilderness and never saw the promised land because of their doubt and they kept the law of Moses. Matter of a fact Moses did not enjoy the promised land. he was allowed to see it from a mountain top and thats it.
 
T

TruthTalk

Guest
#15
#15
crossnote said:
Were the first generation of Israelites barred from going into the promised land because they failed to keep the Big 10 or because they failed to believe the promise that God would give them the land?
Click to expand...
Numbers 32:11
"Because they have not followed me wholeheartedly, not one of those who were twenty years old or more when they came up out of Egypt will see the land I promised on oath to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob"

It was both - they failed to enter Canaan Land because of their unbelief and disobedience. It was Jesus of Nazareth who over came the temptations of the devil in the wilderness who restored "Paradise Lost" - It is His Messianic credentials that will take Him all the way to Calvary to die on a cross for our sins. We only need to repent of our sin and believe in Jesus Christ to enter the promised Land. "What ever happened to faith?" - unbelief and disobedience walk hand in hand and will led to destruction, believe and be saved. God bless!
 
RedTent

RedTent

Banned
#16
Oct 31, 2011
8,200
182
0
#16
So many are giving good scriptural answers, yet just as the devil advised Christ with good scripture when Christ was tested for 40 days, each is cutting out other scripture so it is not complete, and being incomplete becomes wrong.

No one has ever made themselves holy by doing, it takes God. Truth. So don't do anything Not truth.
Christ is the root of Christianity. Truth. Therefore we don't have to learn of God principles. Not truth.
Faith is required of us, we need to absolutely trust with faith. Truth. We don't need to step out on this faith. Not truth.
We need the cross that gives us forgiveness of sins. Truth. We need other things too, including understanding of sin.
 
crossnote

crossnote

Senior Member
#17
Nov 24, 2012
30,709
3,650
113
#17
For Moses writes about the righteousness that is based on the law, that the person who does the commandments shall live by them.
(Rom 10:5)

But the righteousness based on faith says, "Do not say in your heart, 'Who will ascend into heaven?'" (that is, to bring Christ down) "or 'Who will descend into the abyss?'" (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead). But what does it say? "The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart" (that is, the word of faith that we proclaim); because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved. For the Scripture says, "Everyone who believes in him will not be put to shame."
(Rom 10:6-11)


Is the law then contrary to the promises of God? Certainly not! For if a law had been given that could give life, then righteousness would indeed be by the law. But the Scripture imprisoned everything under sin, so that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe.
(Gal 3:21-22)
 
RedTent

RedTent

Banned
#18
Oct 31, 2011
8,200
182
0
#18
crossnote said:
For Moses writes about the righteousness that is based on the law, that the person who does the commandments shall live by them.
(Rom 10:5)

But the righteousness based on faith says, "Do not say in your heart, 'Who will ascend into heaven?'" (that is, to bring Christ down) "or 'Who will descend into the abyss?'" (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead). But what does it say? "The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart" (that is, the word of faith that we proclaim); because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved. For the Scripture says, "Everyone who believes in him will not be put to shame."
(Rom 10:6-11)


Is the law then contrary to the promises of God? Certainly not! For if a law had been given that could give life, then righteousness would indeed be by the law. But the Scripture imprisoned everything under sin, so that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe.
(Gal 3:21-22)
Click to expand...
Do you believe God is telling us that to be righteous we must not listen to law? I thought he was telling us that we cannot make ourselves righteous, only Christ can do that. And Christ says you must repent from sin. We need the Holy Spirit and the law to point out what law is so we know about repenting. Without repentance we can not have forgiveness. So is we must not have law we are up a creek. Dead in our sins.
 
E

Exoaria

Guest
#19
#19
Cobus said:
Crossnote, AGAIN you mis the point because you do not believe.... They were NEVER JUST MEN MADE PERFECT. ONLY THE PERFECT will enter into God's LAND.....

I will give you a NEW HEART and MY SPIRIT and you shall live in the land I promised to your fathers..... Only people witht the SEED of GOD, born of GOD and CANNOT SIN will enter as Just men made perfect.....

No SINNER can inherit the Kingdom of God. NO SINNER!
Click to expand...
I'm super lucky that I found Jesus then, otherwise there would be no way that I could enter the Kingdom of God... phew! :) Thanks Cobus, you just reminded me again how blessed I am that my precious Jesus took everything I deserve and had my sin condemned at the cross. He really is so beautiful, don't you all agree?
Thank you Jesus for what you did for me! Your blood is so precious, and you spilled every drop so that you could have the joy of knowing me and loving me. I don't think I could ever ask for a better friend. Thank you so much!
 
E

Exoaria

Guest
#20
#20
RedTent said:
Do you believe God is telling us that to be righteous we must not listen to law? I thought he was telling us that we cannot make ourselves righteous, only Christ can do that. And Christ says you must repent from sin. We need the Holy Spirit and the law to point out what law is so we know about repenting. Without repentance we can not have forgiveness. So is we must not have law we are up a creek. Dead in our sins.
Click to expand...
Still, all people see is the law and we're all obsessed with who's going to heaven and who's going to hell. If you confess that Jesus is Lord with your mouth and believe it in your heart, because 1 Corinthians 12:3 says that nobody can do this except by the Spirit - your flesh is condemned and you will be saved according to scripture as you rise again in the Spirit.
This is not from ourselves, but the gift of God. (Ephesians 2:8)
Even Paul himself struggled with sin, but he said in Romans 7:20
"Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it."

We will always struggle with sin, but we are not conformed to this world, but have our minds renewed in our Lord Jesus Christ. Our flesh is condemned and a desire to do what is good is a naturally recurring by-product of starting to walk with and focus on Jesus. Just as Moses held up the bronze serpent, anyone who looked at it would be healed from their venomous bites, but if they did not look at it and focused on their venom they would die from the bites.
In the Bible, wherever you see bronze, it stands for Judgement.
The serpent has been judged.

Focus on Jesus, look to the cross and not to yourself and the power to overcome sin becomes manifest as you begin to walk in the Spirit. As you overcome sin, you reign in life. When you reign in life, the devil doesn't.
 
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