What's Wrong with This Picture...?
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I agree... when I first heard about it, I had negative feelings about it... "why are they making this a requirement for someone identifying with us?"
But, after thinking it over, and seeing positive results, and no negative results, I agree it is a good thing to do.. it's more of a welcoming "come on in, this is who we are" kind of thing.
We have good shepherds in our assembly...
But, after thinking it over, and seeing positive results, and no negative results, I agree it is a good thing to do.. it's more of a welcoming "come on in, this is who we are" kind of thing.
We have good shepherds in our assembly...
CYBORG.....you have already proven that a CoCo Puff's box has more validity concerning the truth over about 3/4 of everything you push and espouse......and sure my post applies......
He that acknowledges me before men will be acknowledge before my Heavenly Father....
Mat 12:37 For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned.
He that acknowledges me before men will be acknowledge before my Heavenly Father....
Mat 12:37 For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned.
Really? Not sure how you're arriving at you don't think the issue is false converts bro when it is glaringly obvious that it is.
Many people join churches in this manner, and believe they became a Christian when they did so.
Sorry, but I don't see your point as a valid argument.
Many people join churches in this manner, and believe they became a Christian when they did so.
Sorry, but I don't see your point as a valid argument.
Maybe I can clarify what I was trying to say.
The following was part of my post you responded to but didn’t address. Maybe because you couldn’t see the relevance or I didn’t explain within the context I was trying to explain.
I still say I don’t think the issues is false converts or non converts when it comes to wanting to be part of the church.
By this I am distinguishing between being a church member and someone who comes to church.
If the gospel of Jesus is being preached in a church then everyone hearing will know what being born again is and what it means.
Church membership in the main is allowed when a person agrees to the doctrines of the church (well over here it does) so a simple example may be the Trinity. If you accept the trinity and other doctrines then church membership is accepted. I know of someone in the US, who goes to a church (baptist) and wanted to come into membership. One of their doctrines or requirements is not to drink alcohol.
So to me if the gospel of Jesus is taught and what it means to be a believer if a person wishes to become a church member they can answer the questions yet we don’t know whether they are genuine or not because they know the answers.
The point I was trying to make is that if a person wants to be or feel part of a church or come to our church and is not a believer the church should be ready and willing to accept them as they are. If the church is teaching Christ crucified, buried and risen believing in that and confessing Jesus as their Lord then they know what it truly means to be a Christian.
If they are not willing to take that step they should still feel welcome and accepted for whom they are and not as a result of telling them what they should be.
I came alongside a guy who wasn’t a believer (with mental health issues). He loved coming to the church and for some reason why I don’t know why but he loved spending time with me.
He called me one night and was very distressed, very tearful.
He asked a question which broke my heart “Bill I love you, I love coming to your church but I am not ready to become a Christian will you reject me?
How heartbreaking is that?
Thats the point I was trying to make. The church should be a place where people want to come to, feel safe and feel accepted.
Just so you know I am not being shlushy shlushy here. If it becomes apparent that anyone is causing conflict, strife anything that disrupts the harmony of the church then it needs to be dealt with.
Hopefully that makes it a bit clearer.
The OP is not speaking of those who visit, but it is about those who want to join a local church.
They should have the ability to articulate the basic Christian beliefs
Being Born Again, Trusting in the Triune God, believing in the scriptures as the inerrant word of God, believing jesus is the way the truth and the life, believers baptism etc
They should have the ability to articulate the basic Christian beliefs
Being Born Again, Trusting in the Triune God, believing in the scriptures as the inerrant word of God, believing jesus is the way the truth and the life, believers baptism etc
As you can see, many have a flippant attitude about the entire thing. A person comes forward to make a statement of faith, hopefully that they've been born again, and because of this wish to worship with the body they present themselves to. In turn the body acknowledges their profession of faith, being saved from their sins, living in repentance &c and resounds back in acceptance of this person's profession of faith.
Apparently some just don't know what a profession of faith is while they argue day and night about theology on a forum, nor is it taken seriously.
In the OP the profession was not there. She just wanted to join a church. She needed further instruction, further looking into her spiritual condition, the Gospel needed to be shared. How many join a church think that means they are then saved by doing just that, or it turned them into a Christian, and they are on their way to heaven for it?
All I am hearing is this vitriol and contrariety; "You don't have to join a church!" "Membership isn't biblical!" "She shouldn't need to express her faith!!!!" "Going forward doesn't save!" And other nonsense along those lines.
Seems quite apparent the LORD added to the church daily those who were being saved. Obviously they acknowledged their conversion, or it was recognized. It is why they were baptized and they knew why they were being baptized.
We carry on this same principle and take it serious when one presents their statement of faith. We're certainly not going to be flippant about any person's soul condition. Who knows if she is even saved or not? If she has come to be saved, then she needs to be baptized as well, but many here would never get to that point because they're too busy being flippant about the whole thing; "You don't need to join a church!"
Then this problem would arise for bringing up baptism: "Baptism isn't necessary!!!" "You're making baptism what saves!" "Just let her join, if she wants to be baptized fine, if not, fine, who are you to say she needs to be????!!!!!" "You can still go to heaven if you're not baptized!"
All this just shows how complacent people are about entering eternity. Making unbiblical statements and unbiblical and irreverent conclusions about a person's faith, repentance, statement of faith, understanding of the Gospel, baptism, as if a person can just waltz into heaven any old way they like, burn strange fire on the altar as if God isn't even in heaven and that they can just do it their way.
When a person has come under Gospel conversion, they will know what repentance is, what faith they have, will have a testimony, albeit it may be concise but they will understand these things.
Yes. It is quite apparent with all this we see on here why churches are in such disarray. Which brings up another issue: wonder how many here arguing about this even belong to a church, a local body? My guess is there are many who don't but they're arguing about how a person should join or be accepted into an assembly. Certainly God is watching over that, we can count on this for sure.
Apparently some just don't know what a profession of faith is while they argue day and night about theology on a forum, nor is it taken seriously.
In the OP the profession was not there. She just wanted to join a church. She needed further instruction, further looking into her spiritual condition, the Gospel needed to be shared. How many join a church think that means they are then saved by doing just that, or it turned them into a Christian, and they are on their way to heaven for it?
All I am hearing is this vitriol and contrariety; "You don't have to join a church!" "Membership isn't biblical!" "She shouldn't need to express her faith!!!!" "Going forward doesn't save!" And other nonsense along those lines.
Seems quite apparent the LORD added to the church daily those who were being saved. Obviously they acknowledged their conversion, or it was recognized. It is why they were baptized and they knew why they were being baptized.
We carry on this same principle and take it serious when one presents their statement of faith. We're certainly not going to be flippant about any person's soul condition. Who knows if she is even saved or not? If she has come to be saved, then she needs to be baptized as well, but many here would never get to that point because they're too busy being flippant about the whole thing; "You don't need to join a church!"
Then this problem would arise for bringing up baptism: "Baptism isn't necessary!!!" "You're making baptism what saves!" "Just let her join, if she wants to be baptized fine, if not, fine, who are you to say she needs to be????!!!!!" "You can still go to heaven if you're not baptized!"
All this just shows how complacent people are about entering eternity. Making unbiblical statements and unbiblical and irreverent conclusions about a person's faith, repentance, statement of faith, understanding of the Gospel, baptism, as if a person can just waltz into heaven any old way they like, burn strange fire on the altar as if God isn't even in heaven and that they can just do it their way.
When a person has come under Gospel conversion, they will know what repentance is, what faith they have, will have a testimony, albeit it may be concise but they will understand these things.
Yes. It is quite apparent with all this we see on here why churches are in such disarray. Which brings up another issue: wonder how many here arguing about this even belong to a church, a local body? My guess is there are many who don't but they're arguing about how a person should join or be accepted into an assembly. Certainly God is watching over that, we can count on this for sure.
Wow. Really?
Frankly, that's the flippancy I'm talking about and you've shown it perfectly yourself. The OP explains or implies how a church recognizes a person's profession of faith, whether they understand the Gospel and conversion, or not. It isn't like coming into Cheers for a tall one, it is about the state of one's soul in relation to God and professing conversion, or maybe not, perhaps they are professing they don't understand and need a clear Gospel presentation.
Apples and oranges sir, your illustration is non sequitur.
This has nothing to do with the OP or topic at all.
Frankly, that's the flippancy I'm talking about and you've shown it perfectly yourself. The OP explains or implies how a church recognizes a person's profession of faith, whether they understand the Gospel and conversion, or not. It isn't like coming into Cheers for a tall one, it is about the state of one's soul in relation to God and professing conversion, or maybe not, perhaps they are professing they don't understand and need a clear Gospel presentation.
Apples and oranges sir, your illustration is non sequitur.
This has nothing to do with the OP or topic at all.
It makes me sick....nothing but entertainment centers that have devalued the truth in favor of a "give the dog a bone" sell out philosophy......Jesus said and Paul confirmed it....preach the word and let the chips fall where they fall.....we have no right or leeway to "improve" upon God's plan..........VOMIT!!!
I know that I have failed the Lord many ways in my life, but I WILL NEVER sell out the truth in favor of the "Burger King Theology" that gets squirted out from most pulpits today.....Even if we preach 120 years build an ark and no one listens....on day 43,800 and 1 I will get on the ark and say I told you so..........