When are we saved ?

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lenna

Guest
Exactly. The right to become children of God is given to us. If the right to become children of God was not given, the power to believe would not be given either. See that?
no

but I do see why you appear to have Calvinistic leanings

ducks again
 
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lenna

Guest
No, the point is that we are not saved by any work, not even an act of the will. John 1:13.
so if I understand you at all (questionable at this point) you are saying believing is a work, so God believes for us?
 
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EleventhHour

Guest
Which were born not of blood, nor Of THE WILL OF THE FLESH, nor of the will of man, but OF GOD.
John 1:13............

“But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.”

This is speaking to the nature of our new birth.. not the means.

Ephesians 1:13 makes is clear and the correct order.

13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
 

OIC1965

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so if I understand you at all (questionable at this point) you are saying believing is a work, so God believes for us?
No. I’m saying faith is more than a mere exercise of the carnal will. Some completely deny the work of God’s Spirit in drawing us
 

ForestGreenCook

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Act 16:27 When the jailer woke up and saw the prison doors wide open, he drew his sword and was about to kill himself, since he thought the prisoners had escaped.

Act 16:28 But Paul shouted in a loud voice, "Don't hurt yourself, because we are all here!"

Act 16:29 The jailer asked for torches and rushed inside. Trembling as he knelt in front of Paul and Silas,

Act 16:30 he took them outside and asked, "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?"

Act 16:31 They answered, "Believe on the Lord Jesus, and you and your family will be saved."

Act 16:32 Then they spoke the word of the Lord to him and everyone in his home.

Act 16:33 At that hour of the night he took them and washed their wounds. Then he and his entire family were baptized immediately.
The natural man, before he has been regenerated, would not have responded to Paul in the manner that the Jailer responded.

Before the natural man has been regenerated he has a stony heart, as indicated in the men that stoned Stephen to death for preaching the same sermon that Peter preached on the day of pentecost.

In Stephen's case the men that stoned Stephen were "CUT TO THE HEART", and the Jews, at pentecost, who had had their stony heart changed to a fleshy heart in regeneration, responded in the same manner as the Jailer, as they were "PRICKED IN THEIR HEART" and ask "what must we do".

When considering your text of Acts 16, The word "saved" in verse 30 & 31, according to the Greek meaning, means "to save, i.e, deliver or protect.

The scriptures teach that there is an eternal deliverance, and there is a deliverance that the regenerated person receives, by their good works, as he sojourns here in this world, that is not eternal.

By misinterpreting this, many of God's well intended regenerated children, tend to believe that there is something they have to do to be delivered eternally.

2 Tim 2:13, If we believe not, yet he (Jesus) abideth faithful, he (Jesus) cannot deny himself. Eph 1:4, According as he has chosen us "in him" before the foundation of the world.
 

OIC1965

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Sep 19, 2020
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John 1:13............

“But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.”

This is speaking to the nature of our new birth.. not the means.

Ephesians 1:13 makes is clear and the correct order.

13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
yes. You were not born of God by the mere exercise of your flesly will. NOR ( born of) THE WILL OF THE FLESH) but of God.
 
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lenna

Guest
No. I’m saying faith is more than a mere exercise of the carnal will. Some completely deny the work of God’s Spirit in drawing us
you have such a quaint way of creating statements that no one has said and then explaining what you say you believe by denying those same statements that are nowhere to be found
 
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lenna

Guest
can someone please explain why our will is constantly being called fleshly? because I do not find this in scripture

are we trying to address some sort of amalgam between flesh and spirit that cancels our own will?

should we leave out the word 'choice' from our vocabulary altogether?
 

OIC1965

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you have such a quaint way of creating statements that no one has said and then explaining what you say you believe by denying those same statements that are nowhere to be found
Throughfaith and eleventh hour contend that no conviction upon the heart is necessary, no necessity for the Spirit to draw in order for a person to have saving faith

You came in late.
 

ForestGreenCook

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Man has the capacity to respond to the Gospel .. and being enslaved to sin is not a prohibiting factor... in fact Jesus came to call sinners.
The natural man, according to 1 Cor 2:14, cannot respond to the things of the Spirit, such as the spiritual gospel, until he has been regenerated to a new spiritual life.
 

OIC1965

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Sep 19, 2020
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can someone please explain why our will is constantly being called fleshly? because I do not find this in scripture

are we trying to address some sort of amalgam between flesh and spirit that cancels our own will?

should we leave out the word 'choice' from our vocabulary altogether?
Will of the flesh is the same as fleshly will. That’s how the preposition usually works. John called it that, not me.
 
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lenna

Guest
IThroughfaith and eleventh hour contend that no conviction upon the heart is necessary, no necessity for the Spirit to draw in order for a person to have saving faith

You came in late.
you have no idea if I have been reading for some time

and I'm not saying I was either

but I would not write those opinions in stone either. I don't think you have quite the gift of understanding you seem to think that you do
 
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EleventhHour

Guest
Throughfaith and eleventh hour contend that no conviction upon the heart is necessary, no necessity for the Spirit to draw in order for a person to have saving faith

You came in late.
Wrong we never stated such.
 
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lenna

Guest
Will of the flesh is the same as fleshly will. That’s how the preposition usually works.
ok

so do you pray over every decision you make during the day? if not, then you have your own will
 

OIC1965

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Sep 19, 2020
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ok

so do you pray over every decision you make during the day? if not, then you have your own will
Daily decisions and the new birth are different things altogether. John said will of the flesh, not me. Believe him.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
I have a problem trying to answer people who love to be obnoxious and believe themselves smarter than all the other earth bound dummies

this is the problem I have.

1. I want to answer them according to their folly with bonus features

2. I do not wish to be banned so therefore I do not do that
Wish other people had your attitude.
 
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lenna

Guest
Will of the flesh is the same as fleshly will. That’s how the preposition usually works. John called it that, not me.
no

you have a comprehension problem

you cannot take a statement and create a blanket doctrine out of it. this is where you have gone over the cliff