Where did the idea that the soul is immortal originate?

[Michael50]

If we look at Genesis 3:4 we see the Devils first lie to Eve.

"And the serpant said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die."


Even to this day, men believe Satans lie "ye shall not surely die".


Does 1 lie lead to another?

Once Satan decieved men into believing that the soul is immortal it was easy for him to further decieve men into also believing God has an Eternal Torture Chamber where He will house the wicked and torture them for all eternity.

So we see, that one lie does indeed lead to another.

The lie that God keeps the wicked alive in an Eternal torture chamber forever and ever, has caused countless people to turn away from God.

As we near the end, Satan shall decieve the world through 2 Great errors in Doctrine: The false teaching that the soul is immortal & sunday sacredness. They will go hand in hand.

It is not hard for Satan to make it appear as if our dead loved ones are alive. Satan has an accurate record of all who have ever lived. He knows their voices, their mannerisms and secret things that only his victim and the deceased know about.
Demons shall ape the dead in the last days. Satan has been readying the world to accept his lies. When dead loved ones appear to those who are still alive and talk with them, the living will believe what the demons say.

The demons will demand that Sunday be observed! That Sunday is the Sabbath and the Day we are to Observe! The Only Safeguard to satan and his last day deceptions is the Scripture!

If you have any questions. I will respond. It might take me a couple days.


I realize that most, if not all, will think I'm completely off my rocker.

 

[Elin]

Once Satan decieved men into believing that the soul is immortal it was easy for him to further decieve men into also believing God has an Eternal Torture Chamber where He will house the wicked and torture them for all eternity.

So we see, that one lie does indeed lead to another.

The lie that God keeps the wicked alive in an Eternal torture chamber forever and ever, has caused countless people to turn away from God.

As we near the end, Satan shall decieve the world through 2 Great errors in Doctrine: The false teaching that the soul is immortal & sunday sacredness. They will go hand in hand.

The demons will demand that Sunday be observed! That Sunday is the Sabbath and the Day we are to Observe! The Only Safeguard to satan and his last day deceptions is the Scripture!

If you have any questions. I will respond. It might take me a couple days.

I realize that most, if not all, will think I'm completely off my rocker.

Well, Michael, it matters not what we think.
It matters only what the Scriptures think.
And you've got some reckoning to do with the Scriptures.

1) First, we see an immortal spirit returning to its body in Lk 8:55.

2) Then there is what Jesus said:

Mt 22:31-32 - "In the account of the bush (Lk 20:37-38), have you not read what God said to you, 'I am (present tense) the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob. He is not the God of the dead but of the living."

Two hundred years after the death of the patriarchs, God declared he is (present tense) the God of the patriarchs, Abraham, Isaac and Jacob (Ex 3:6). Since he is (present tense) the God only of the living, and not the God of the dead, what part of the patriarchs are still living?

Lk 16:22-26 - "The time came when the beggar man died and the angels carried him to Abraham's side. . .he called to him, 'Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to. . .cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.'
But Abraham replied. . .'If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.' "

Jesus presented the rich man in hell, with he and Abraham conversing with one another after their deaths.
He presented their spirits as conversing with one another because their spirits are immortal.

Lk 8:51 - "If anyone keeps my word,he will never see death."

Well, all those to whom Jesus spoke those words are now dead.
And God told Adam that the day he ate of the fruit he would die, but he lived for centuries.

So what died, and what did not die?

Jn 5:24 - "Whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal llife. . .he has crossed over from death to life."

So what was dead? . . .it wasn't their bodies.
From what death did they cross over?

3) We find the same thing in the epistles:

1Jn 3:14 - "We know we have passed from death to life, because we love our brothers. Anyone who does not love remains in death. . .no murderer has eternal life in him."

Again, what was dead? . . .it wasn't their bodies.
From what death did they pass?

Col 2:13 - "When you were dead in your sins. . .God made you alive with Christ."

Eph 2:1,3 - "You were dead in your transgressions and sins. . .by nature objects of wrath."

Again, what was dead? It wasn't their bodies.

Php 1:23 - "I am torn between the two: I desire to depart and be with Christ which is better by far, but it is more necessary for you that I remain in the body."

The NT plainly states that when believers die, they are with Christ, apart from their body.

So what part of them is with Christ, apart from their body?

Heb 12:18, 22-24 - "You have not come to a mountain that is burning with fire. . .You have come to Mount Zion. . .You have come to God, the judge of all men, to the spirits of righteous men made perfect, to Jesus the mediator of a new covenant. . ."

The NT reveals that the spirits of former righteous believers (e.g., Abel and Noah, vv.4, 7) are immortal
and are waiting for the resurrection.

Did Jesus' human spirit die before he rose from the dead?

So do you think the Scriptures agree with you?

 

[starfield]

If we look at Genesis 3:4 we see the Devils first lie to Eve.

"And the serpant said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die."


Even to this day, men believe Satans lie "ye shall not surely die".


Does 1 lie lead to another?

Once Satan decieved men into believing that the soul is immortal it was easy for him to further decieve men into also believing God has an Eternal Torture Chamber where He will house the wicked and torture them for all eternity.

So we see, that one lie does indeed lead to another.

The lie that God keeps the wicked alive in an Eternal torture chamber forever and ever, has caused countless people to turn away from God.

As we near the end, Satan shall decieve the world through 2 Great errors in Doctrine: The false teaching that the soul is immortal & sunday sacredness. They will go hand in hand.

It is not hard for Satan to make it appear as if our dead loved ones are alive. Satan has an accurate record of all who have ever lived. He knows their voices, their mannerisms and secret things that only his victim and the deceased know about.
Demons shall ape the dead in the last days. Satan has been readying the world to accept his lies. When dead loved ones appear to those who are still alive and talk with them, the living will believe what the demons say.

The demons will demand that Sunday be observed! That Sunday is the Sabbath and the Day we are to Observe! The Only Safeguard to satan and his last day deceptions is the Scripture!

If you have any questions. I will respond. It might take me a couple days.


I realize that most, if not all, will think I'm completely off my rocker.

While hell was originally prepared for Satan and his angels, those who reject God's gift of eternal life will spend eternity there too because, though God is a loving God, He is also just and righteous thus He cannot leave sin unpunished: Romans 6:23 - For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. Only those that are covered with the blood of Jesus will escape eternal punishment.

Scripture shows that hell is a place of unending torment for the wicked:
Mark 9:43 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched.

Rev 14:10-11
10- The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:
11- And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

Rev 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

 

[Michael50]

Your first premise was false: Luke 8:55

"Then her spirit returned and she arose immedietly. And He commanded that she be given somthing to eat."

What was the "spirit" that came back? It was nothing more than the breath of life.

What happens when a person dies?
Answer- "Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it." Eccleasties 12:7

The body turns to dust again and the spirit goes back to God who gave it. The spirit of every person who dies- whether rightous or wicked returns to God at death.

What is the "spirit" that returns to god at death?

Answer-

"The body without the spirit is dead." James 2:26 Does that accurately depict the seen of Luke 8:55? yep!

"The spirit of God is in my nostrils." Job 27:3

The spirit that returns to God at death is the breath of life. Nowhere in all of Gods Bible does the "spirit" have any life, wisdom or feeling after a person dies. It is the "breath of Life" and nothing more.

Even Jesus gave up His spirit when he died. Matthew 27;50,, That is he breathed His last Luke 23:46

 

[jerusalem]

and the lake of fire is second death.....a place where death and hell will be destroyed

 

[Michael50]

While hell was originally prepared for Satan and his angels, those who reject God's gift of eternal life will spend eternity there too because, though God is a loving God, He is also just and righteous thus He cannot leave sin unpunished: Romans 6:23 - For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. Only those that are covered with the blood of Jesus will escape eternal punishment.

Scripture shows that hell is a place of unending torment for the wicked:
Mark 9:43 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched.

Rev 14:10-11
10- The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:
11- And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

Rev 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Satan will be destroyed. The Bible says Satan will become ashes. The Bible says that the Wicked will become ashes as well. The bible also says Hell is reserved for the wicked at the end of the age! Nobody is in the lake of fire yet. The lake of fire is the earth on fire!

Let me address the fire not being quenched:

The fire that falls on the wicked will not go out until it consumes all there is to consume. In other words, it won't be quenched! And the smoke of all this,, will rise into the atmosphere and dissipate, into nothingness, forever.

The Bible says that Satan will be no more! God says He will turn Him to ashes. God also says He will turn the wicked into ashes! How do you suppose that they will remain alive forever and ever? Is the wages of sin ETERNAL LIFE in a torture chamber or death? What saith the scripture?

The gift of God is eternal Life. The wages of sin are death. How is you believe the wages of sin are eternal life in the lake of fire?

 

[Michael50]

and the lake of fire is second death.....a place where death and hell will be destroyed

Correct. If death and hell remained, then the "former things" would not pass away.

 

[jerusalem]

tartaros gehenna hell hades they are not all the same place and they do not all serve the same pupose. only immortal beings can be tormented eternally mortal beings cannot. mortal beings can be destroyed and die. faced with the prospect of being thrown into a fire to die would certainly cause wailing and gnashing of teeth. too many words in the greek are translated narrowly into a single word as the 5 greek words for love all simply being translated love. shortcuts like that block people from seeing the whole truth. tartaros is the lake of fire. gehenna a landfill like garbage dump. hell is simply the grave. andhades is the mythological place of the dead in greek mythology used as a comparative as is gehenna.

 

[Michael50]

tartaros gehenna hell hades they are not all the same place and they do not all serve the same pupose. only immortal beings can be tormented eternally mortal beings cannot. mortal beings can be destroyed and die. faced with the prospect of being thrown into a fire to die would certainly cause wailing and gnashing of teeth. too many words in the greek are translated narrowly into a single word as the 5 greek words for love all simply being translated love. shortcuts like that block people from seeing the whole truth. tartaros is the lake of fire. gehenna a landfill like garbage dump. hell is simply the grave. andhades is the mythological place of the dead in greek mythology used as a comparative as is gehenna.

My understanding is "hell" can be two-fold. In one respect is in the grave. In another respect some may consider "hell' to be the place of punishment for the wicked. I consider that place to be called the "lake of fire". Which is nothing more than the earth set ablaze. That fire will accomplish two things: It will destroy the wicked and cleanse the earth. Then god will make things anew.

BTW,, Only God is immortal (1 Timothy 6:15-16)

 

[Anonimous]

]My understanding [/B]is "hell" can be two-fold. In one respect is in the grave. In another respect some may consider "hell' to be the place of punishment for the wicked. I consider that place to be called the "lake of fire". Which is nothing more than the earth set ablaze. That fire will accomplish two things: It will destroy the wicked and cleanse the earth. Then god will make things anew.

BTW,, Only God is immortal (1 Timothy 6:15-16)

Perhaps the mistake is "YOUR understanding???

 

[Andrew1]

First of all the Scriptures make it clear that it is possible for one to exist apart from their body:

2Co 12:2 'I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth such an one caught up to the third heaven.'

Also eternal Judgment is a doctrine of the Scriptures:
Hebrews 6:2 'Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.'

Further concerning the doctrine of eternal judgment here is the clearest passage I think you'll find on it.

Mat 25:46 'And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.'

I'm pretty sure everlasting punishment lasts forever. You see God is bound to his own perfect nature. God is an infinitely holy God, thus to sin against such an infinitely holy God warrants an infinite punishment. Thank God he sent his one and only Son that whosoever believes in him shall not perish into eternal punishment but their spirit will go to heaven when they die and be resurrected in there body at the last day. PRAISE GOD.

 

[notconformed2theworld]

Satan will be destroyed. The Bible says Satan will become ashes. The Bible says that the Wicked will become ashes as well. The bible also says Hell is reserved for the wicked at the end of the age! Nobody is in the lake of fire yet. The lake of fire is the earth on fire!

Let me address the fire not being quenched:

The fire that falls on the wicked will not go out until it consumes all there is to consume. In other words, it won't be quenched! And the smoke of all this,, will rise into the atmosphere and dissipate, into nothingness, forever.

The Bible says that Satan will be no more! God says He will turn Him to ashes. God also says He will turn the wicked into ashes! How do you suppose that they will remain alive forever and ever? Is the wages of sin ETERNAL LIFE in a torture chamber or death? What saith the scripture?

The gift of God is eternal Life. The wages of sin are death. How is you believe the wages of sin are eternal life in the lake of fire?

Let's begin with a little background...In revelations chapter 20 it talks about the millennium and how christ reigns and how Satan is bound. Then he is let loose to deceive the nations and to bring war to Jerusalem.

Revelation 20:7-10 KJV

And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea. And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them. And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Then revelation 20:11 talks about the judgement of all wicked dead. Death and hell delivered up the dead that was in them and everyman is judged according to works.
Verse 15 says and whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire...

The lake of fire is not earth on fire...the earth on fire is the renovation of earth to rid sin and cast into the lake of fire. If the earth was to be a lake of fire it would be on fire forever and God would have setup new Jerusalem in a world of fire.

Chapter 21 begins to talk about new jerusalem coming out of heaven and God himself reigns with men.

The death that is illustrated in the bible is an eternal punishment and eternally being cut off from God. God is life and Satan is death. If your not with God you are dead.
Once again God is God of life and Satan is god of death.
Eternal life is being with God because he is eternal and he is life. Eternal death is with Satan. And yes both are forever.

 

[WomanLovesTX]

Jesus Christ emphatically and clearly stated, “And no man has ascended up to heaven, but He that came down from heaven, even the Son of Man [Christ]” (John 3:13). Billions of professing Christians believe that when one dies, he or she goes to heaven—but this contradicts what Jesus said! And keep in mind that when Christ said, “no man has ascended up to heaven,” scores of God’s servants from the Old Testament had already died. Take King David, for example, described as a man after God’s own heart (Acts 13:22). The Bible explains that he will rule in God’s kingdom. Certainly, he would be in heaven, right?

But notice: “Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulcher is with us unto this day…For David is not ascended into the heavens” (Acts 2:29, 34). If we believe Christ’s words, then these faithful servants of God did not ascend to heaven.

God’s Word is very clear—heaven is not the reward of the saved. The earth is. We are to be rulers and priests reigning with Christ on earth.

Psa 146:4 His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; in that very day his thoughts perish.

Ecc 9:4 For to him that is joined to all the living there is hope: for a living dog is better than a dead lion.
Ecc 9:5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.

Job 14:14 If a man die, shall he live again? all the days of my appointed time will I wait, till my change come.

“In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality” (I Cor. 15:52-53). This is the “change” of which Job spoke—a change from this temporary, physical existence to eternal life. This is God’s ultimate goal for humanity. Those who are being called by God now—who are being judged (I Pet. 4:17) and are building holy, righteous character—will be a part of the First Resurrection upon the Return of Jesus Christ (I Thes. 4:16-17; Rev. 20:6).

So does God's Word contradict? No it doesn't. Why so many different beliefs? The heaven and hell doctrines have pagan origins and was propagated as "religion" to keep the masses "orderly".

As Ernest L. Martin, notes in his article “Pagan Doctrine of the Soul” in The Good News, vol. 12, no. 3, March 1963 (Pasadena), pp. 5–6, 12, at godstruthfortoday.org
“One of the most important observations to be made regarding the teachings of the pagan philosophers and/or theologians is that they ALL adhered to the ‘double doctrine’ method teaching. Pythagoras in the sixth century B.C., [later] Plato, Aristotle, and even those of the first century always had two doctrines! Invariably, their disciples were told the truth (as much as the philosophers understood), and the common people were told as many bold-faced LIES as was necessary to control them and render them governable.”

 

[Elin]

Well, Michael, it matters not what we think.
It matters only what the Scriptures think.
And you've got some reckoning to do with the Scriptures.

1) First, we see an immortal spirit returning to its body in Lk 8:55.

2) Then there is what Jesus said:

Mt 22:31-32 - "In the account of the bush (Lk 20:37-38), have you not read what God said to you, 'I am (present tense) the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob. He is not the God of the dead but of the living."

Two hundred years after the death of the patriarchs, God declared he is (present tense) the God of the patriarchs, Abraham, Isaac and Jacob (Ex 3:6). Since he is (present tense) the God only of the living, and not the God of the dead, what part of the patriarchs are still living?

Lk 16:22-26 - "The time came when the beggar man died and the angels carried him to Abraham's side. . .he called to him, 'Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to. . .cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.'
But Abraham replied. . .'If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.' "

Jesus presented the rich man in hell, with he and Abraham conversing with one another after their deaths.
If their bodies are dead, then what part of them are conversing with each other?

Lk 8:51 - "If anyone keeps my word,he will never see death."

Well, all those to whom Jesus spoke those words are now dead.
And God told Adam that the day he ate of the fruit he would die, but he lived for centuries.

So what died, and what did not die?

Jn 5:24 - "Whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal llife. . .he has crossed over from death to life."

So what was dead? . . .it wasn't their bodies.
From what death did they cross over?

3) We find the same thing in the epistles:

1Jn 3:14 - "We know we have passed from death to life, because we love our brothers. Anyone who does not love remains in death. . .no murderer has eternal life in him."

Again, what was dead? . . .it wasn't their bodies.
From what death did they pass?

Col 2:13 - "When you were dead in your sins. . .God made you alive with Christ."

Eph 2:1,3 - "You were dead in your transgressions and sins. . .by nature objects of wrath."

Again, what was dead? It wasn't their bodies.

Php 1:23 - "I am torn between the two: I desire to depart and be with Christ which is better by far, but it is more necessary for you that I remain in the body."

The NT plainly states that when believers die, they are with Christ, apart from their body.

So what part of them is with Christ, apart from their body?

Heb 12:18, 22-24 - "You have not come to a mountain that is burning with fire. . .You have come to Mount Zion. . .You have come to God, the judge of all men, to the spirits of righteous men made perfect, to Jesus the mediator of a new covenant. . ."

The NT reveals that the spirits of former righteous believers (e.g., Abel and Noah, vv.4, 7) are immortal
and are waiting for the resurrection.

Did Jesus' human spirit die before he rose from the dead?

So do you think the Scriptures agree with you?

Your first premise was false: Luke 8:55

"Then her spirit returned and she arose immedietly. And He commanded that she be given somthing to eat."

What was the "spirit" that came back? It was nothing more than the breath of life.

What happens when a person dies?
Answer- "Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it." Eccleasties 12:7

The body turns to dust again and the spirit goes back to God who gave it. The spirit of every person who dies- whether rightous or wicked returns to God at death.

What is the "spirit" that returns to god at death?

Answer-

"The body without the spirit is dead." James 2:26 Does that accurately depict the seen of Luke 8:55? yep!

"The spirit of God is in my nostrils." Job 27:3

The spirit that returns to God at death is the breath of life. Nowhere in all of Gods Bible does the "spirit" have any life, wisdom or feeling after a person dies. It is the "breath of Life" and nothing more.

Even Jesus gave up His spirit when he died. Matthew 27;50,, That is he breathed His last Luke 23:46

Now all you have to do is make your "the spirit is the breath of life and nothing more" agree with the nine other Scriptures presented above which you left on the table unaddressed.

Then we'll revisit Lk 8:55.

 

[Nancyer]

I was given an explanation of hell some time ago, that didn't go into the physical or visual of it but stated that it would be a complete, utter, absence of God, which no one has here on earth. Even non believers have God around them, whether they know it or acknowledge it or not. The absolute absence of God is unimaginable and therefore will only be experienced once a person dies, having unequivocally denied God and Jesus Christ.

Again, I don't know what it will be like physically or visually but I'm guessing that won't matter much as all inhabitants will be in such utter lonely, empty, aching torment.

 

[Michael50]

Now all you have to do is make your "the spirit is the breath of life and nothing more" agree with the nine other Scriptures presented above which you left on the table unaddressed.

Then we'll revisit Lk 8:55.

I don't have to do anything. Your premise is wrong. That is why I didn't address anything else. There is no need to. Once you headed down the wrong path, everything else you mentioned is moot.

Do you disagree with the following scriptures?

"The living know that they shall die, but the dead know not anything: neither have they anymore a reward; for the memory of them is forgotton. Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion in anything that is done under the sun."
"There is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the grave, whither thou goest." Eccleastes 9:5,6,10

Or

"So man lieth down, and riseth not: til the heavens be no more, they shall not awake nor be raised from their sleep." "His sons come to honor him and he know it not." Job 14;12,21

Surely you don't think the Bible is contradicting itself?

Jesus said,, "Behold I come quickly, My reward is with Me."

Nowhere does the scripture say we recieve our rewards when we die. Jesus says He will raise us at the "last day" and that is when the rightous recieve the reward of eternal Life. It is then that we put on immortality,, notice the scripture wording-

"So when this corruptable has put on incorruption and this mortal has put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written: "Death is swallowed up in victory."

 

[Michael50]

First of all the Scriptures make it clear that it is possible for one to exist apart from their body:

2Co 12:2 'I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth such an one caught up to the third heaven.'

Also eternal Judgment is a doctrine of the Scriptures:
Hebrews 6:2 'Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.'

Further concerning the doctrine of eternal judgment here is the clearest passage I think you'll find on it.

Mat 25:46 'And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.'

I'm pretty sure everlasting punishment lasts forever. You see God is bound to his own perfect nature. God is an infinitely holy God, thus to sin against such an infinitely holy God warrants an infinite punishment. Thank God he sent his one and only Son that whosoever believes in him shall not perish into eternal punishment but their spirit will go to heaven when they die and be resurrected in there body at the last day. PRAISE GOD.

The everlasting punishment is death. The bible refers to it as the 2nd death. Of which there is no ressurection.

Would God really be fair and just if he kept the wicked alive and tortured them for all eternity because of 70 years of sin? It's no wonder some very intelligent people turn away from god when they hear these falsehoods. The bible is clear, the wages of sin is death! "Sin when it is finished bringhth forth death".!!

Nowhere does the scripture teach that the wages of sin are eternal life in a torture chamber. Nowhere!

 

[Elin]

Only God is immortal (1 Timothy 6:15-16)

That bears a little textual examination.
You set the Scriptures against themselves, sure indication you do not correctly understand them.

Let's begin with the first use of "immortal God" in 1Timothy.

It occurs in 1Ti 1:17: "Now to the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only God."

The Greek word translated "immortal" here is aphthartos, which means "incorruptible."
The text states that God is "incorruptible."
So what does that mean? How does it mean "immortal"?

Well, God is physically "incorruptible" (because he has no body) which, therefore, makes him immortal, does not die.
God is also a morally "incorruptible" spirit, because he is God.
The text is stating that God is both a morally and physically incorruptible (aphthartos) spirit, and all spirits are immortal.

Now let's look at its use in 1Ti 6:16:

"God. . .who alone is immortal."

The text is stating that God alone is the incorruptible (1Ti 1:17) immortal being.

How do we know that?

Because God is the author of Scripture (2Ti 3:16,) and God does not contradict himself.

And God is not the only immortal being, because angels are immortal, and demons are immortal.

So the text means something else.

In light of 1Ti 1:17, where incorruptible has been translated immortal, we see what is meant in 6:16.
God is the only morally incorruptible/immortal being.

So 1Ti 6:16 does not disagree with other Scripture which reveals angels and demons are immortal.
But even though the angels are immortal, they could be, and were, corrupted in the heavenly rebellion.

So the NT reveals that all spirits are immortal. . .God, angels, demons and human spirits
(Php 1:23; Heb 12:18, 22-24; Mt 22:31-32; Lk 16:22-26).
But God is the only incorruptible/immortal spirit.

And then these nine Scriptures are still on the table unaddressed.

2) Then there is what Jesus said:

Mt 22:31-32 - "In the account of the bush (Lk 20:37-38), have you not read what God said to you, 'I am (present tense) the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob. He is not the God of the dead but of the living."

Two hundred years after the death of the patriarchs, God declared he is (present tense) the God of the patriarchs, Abraham, Isaac and Jacob (Ex 3:6). Since he is (present tense) the God only of the living, and not the God of the dead, what part of the patriarchs are still living?

Lk 16:22-26 - "The time came when the beggar man died and the angels carried him to Abraham's side. . .he called to him, 'Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to. . .cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.'
But Abraham replied. . .'If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.' "

Jesus presented the rich man in hell, with he and Abraham conversing with one another after their deaths.
He presented their spirits as conversing with one another because their spirits are immortal.

Lk 8:51 - "If anyone keeps my word,he will never see death."

Well, all those to whom Jesus spoke those words are now dead.
And God told Adam that the day he ate of the fruit he would die, but he lived for centuries.

So what died, and what did not die?

Jn 5:24 - "Whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal llife. . .he has crossed over from death to life."

So what was dead? . . .it wasn't their bodies.
From what death did they cross over?

3) We find the same thing in the epistles:

1Jn 3:14 - "We know we have passed from death to life, because we love our brothers. Anyone who does not love remains in death. . .no murderer has eternal life in him."

Again, what was dead? . . .it wasn't their bodies.
From what death did they pass?

Col 2:13 - "When you were dead in your sins. . .God made you alive with Christ."

Eph 2:1,3 - "You were dead in your transgressions and sins. . .by nature objects of wrath."

Again, what was dead? It wasn't their bodies.

Php 1:23 - "I am torn between the two: I desire to depart and be with Christ which is better by far, but it is more necessary for you that I remain in the body."

The NT plainly states that when believers die, they are with Christ, apart from their body.

So what part of them is with Christ, apart from their body?

Heb 12:18, 22-24 - "You have not come to a mountain that is burning with fire. . .You have come to Mount Zion. . .You have come to God, the judge of all men, to the spirits of righteous men made perfect, to Jesus the mediator of a new covenant. . ."

The NT reveals that the spirits of former righteous believers (e.g., Abel and Noah, vv.4, 7) are immortal
and are waiting for the resurrection.

When you have addressed the above Scriptures, we will revisit Lk 8:55.

 

[Elin]

I don't have to do anything. Your premise is wrong. That is why I didn't address anything else. There is no need to. Once you headed down the wrong path, everything else you mentioned is moot.

So that's what you're about. . .

Q.E.D.

 

[Michael50]

So that's what you're about. . .

Q.E.D.

What I find amazing is that Satan is a liar and you sit here and uphold him.. "Ye shall not surely die".