Where do believers go after death?

[Magenta]

1 Corinthians 15:6
Then he appeared to more than five hundred brothers at one time, most of whom are still alive, though some have fallen asleep.

1 Corinthians 15:20-23
But in fact Christ has been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep.

John 11:11-14
After saying these things, he said to them, “Our friend Lazarus has fallen asleep, but I go to awaken him.” The disciples said to him, “Lord, if he has fallen asleep, he will recover.” Now Jesus had spoken of his death, but they thought that he meant taking rest in sleep. Then Jesus told them plainly, “Lazarus has died,

Acts 7:60
And falling to his knees he cried out with a loud voice, “Lord, do not hold this sin against them.” And when he had said this, he fell asleep.

Daniel 12:2
And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

Matthew 27:52
The tombs also were opened. And many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised,

Matthew 9:24
He said, “Go away, for the girl is not dead but sleeping.” And they laughed at him.

They laughed at Jesus and misunderstood His meaning often. Not much has changed.
You say only the body sleeps, but the body rots in the ground and returns to dust, while
the person SLEEPS, awaiting the resurrection of all to either new life, or the second death.

 

[Nehemiah6]

The spirit being received by Jesus, sure. But no mention of it being awake and aware. Sleep is largely unconscious.

There are no sleepers in Heaven.

And I beheld, and I heard the voice of many angels round about the throne and the beasts and the elders: and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands; Saying with a loud voice, Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to receive power, and riches, and wisdom, and strength, and honour, and glory, and blessing. (Rev 5:11,12)

 

[Magenta]

There are no sleepers in Heaven.

And I beheld, and I heard the voice of many angels round about the throne and the beasts and the elders: and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands; Saying with a loud voice, Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to receive power, and riches, and wisdom, and strength, and honour, and glory, and blessing. (Rev 5:11,12)

That speaks of angels in heaven. So? Angels are not men, and men are not angels.

 

[Deuteronomy]

But how do you explain this:

Isa 26:
19But your dead will live, Lord;
their bodies will rise—
let those who dwell in the dust
wake up and shout for joy—
your dew is like the dew of the morning;
the earth will give birth to her dead.
20Go, my people, enter your rooms
and shut the doors behind you;
hide yourselves for a little while
until his wrath has passed by.
21See, the Lord is coming out of his dwelling
to punish the people of the earth for their sins.
The earth will disclose the blood shed on it;
the earth will conceal its slain no longer.

Hi Noose, which part(s) of Psalm 103 are you comparing to this passage from Isaiah, and what problem do you see when you compare them? I can tell you what I believe v19-21 means in general if that's all you want, but that may not get you the answer(s) that you are looking for.

Thanks!

~Deut

 

[Noose]

When my wife was dying II Corinthians 5:1-4 was on my heart the entire time. Shortly after that I picked up "Baptist Bread" - a devotional booklet and the verses used for the day she died was this . . .


God has prepared temporary bodies for his deceased saints.

Sorry for your loss.

 

[Noose]

Hi Noose, which part(s) of Psalm 103 are you comparing to this passage from Isaiah, and what problem do you see when you compare them? I can tell you what I believe v19-21 means in general if that's all you want, but that may not get you the answer(s) that you are looking for.

Thanks!

~Deut

I don't see any problem with Psalms 103 or Isaiah 26, to me they speak of the same thing.

In Psalms 103, David is urging his innermost being (soul) to praise the Lord for His loving kindness but then expounds on what his innermost being means- it means the heavenly joyful assembly of angels/the resurrected righteous/and the Lord Himself. Psalm 103 is like a poem, it starts with the statement "praise the Lord my soul", expounds on it and then closes with the same statement, meaning that everything between the two statements is an explanation of the statement.

Psalms 103 correlates well with Isaiah 26 because in Isaiah, we see the dead in Christ arising and are told to lock themselves in their rooms. These rooms are nothing more than the hearts of living believers- from verse 1, they (living believers) are being described as a strong city/Judah where other believers will find refuge.

 

[Noose]

1 Corinthians 15:6
Then he appeared to more than five hundred brothers at one time, most of whom are still alive, though some have fallen asleep.

1 Corinthians 15:20-23
But in fact Christ has been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep.

John 11:11-14
After saying these things, he said to them, “Our friend Lazarus has fallen asleep, but I go to awaken him.” The disciples said to him, “Lord, if he has fallen asleep, he will recover.” Now Jesus had spoken of his death, but they thought that he meant taking rest in sleep. Then Jesus told them plainly, “Lazarus has died,

Acts 7:60
And falling to his knees he cried out with a loud voice, “Lord, do not hold this sin against them.” And when he had said this, he fell asleep.

Daniel 12:2
And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

Matthew 27:52
The tombs also were opened. And many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised,

Matthew 9:24
He said, “Go away, for the girl is not dead but sleeping.” And they laughed at him.

They laughed at Jesus and misunderstood His meaning often. Not much has changed.
You say only the body sleeps, but the body rots in the ground and returns to dust, while
the person SLEEPS, awaiting the resurrection of all to either new life, or the second death.

'Sleep' is a word used in the scriptures instead of death. It simply means death but it is a carefully chosen word that gives hope to those that are living because apart from just death, it implies that those that pass are actually living and we hope to unite with them sometime in the future. So the word itself is with respect to the living that remain behind but to those that are on the other side of the divide it is business because they are conscious.

This was clearly demonstrated here:

Luke 23:42 Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when You come into Your kingdom!” 43 And Jesus said to him,“Truly I tell you, today you will be with Me in Paradise.”

That thief is not sleep walking in paradise, he is part of the joyful assembly in our hearts.

 

[JaumeJ]

1 Corinthians 15:6 tells us they sleep.
It gets confusing at times doesn't it?

Usually, keeping all of the Word in mind, it is a frequent reference that wwhen we die we sleep with our fathers. Now any who sleep will awaken one day.

 

[JaumeJ]

No, THEY DO NOT SLEEP. Soul sleep is false doctrine. All the saints go immediately to Heaven and are very much awake in the presence of God and Christ.

In my life of reading the Word I have never learned such a doctrine.....soul sleep? I must be missing something, I know I understand very little after my studies over the years.

 

[zeroturbulence]

Luke 23:42-43

Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when You come into Your kingdom!” And Jesus said to him, “Truly I tell you, today you will be with Me in Paradise.”

 

[JaumeJ]

No, you were wrong in misunderstanding Him.

The "sleep" of death applies to the body, NOT the soul and spirit. So please take careful note:

SOUL AND SPIRIT AWAKE AND GO TO BE WITH CHRIST
And they stoned Stephen, calling upon God, and saying, Lord Jesus, receive my spirit. (Acts 7:59)

BODY SAID TO "SLEEP" BUT LAID IN GRAVE
And he kneeled down, and cried with a loud voice, Lord, lay not this sin to their charge. And when he had said this, he fell asleep... And devout men carried Stephen to his burial, and made great lamentation over him. (Acts 7:60, 8:2)

As Paul said, to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.

For me this is a doctrine of hopelessness. Jesus is the Resurrection, the Firstborn of the Dead. We are, naturally, numbered after Him,.

He was resurrected Body and Soul and trnsformed to His Holy and Royal State in Heaven. We are to be made just as He though not He, just as He is a wonderful hope in our eternity given us to yearn for.

We sleep until it is His time to wake us, resurrect us to be transformed to be just like He. Is it not a wonder and amazement? It is to me and all who await this great and glorious event. Praise Jesus, God, amen

 

[Noose]

I'm not an English speaker but let's talk English for a moment. Do these sentences mean the same thing?

1. And I will make every effort to see that after my departure you will always be able to remember these things
2. And I will make every effort to see that you will always be able to remember these things after my departure

If i'm not wrong, then:
The first sentence would mean that the efforts doesn't stop but go beyond his departure in whatever form
The second sentence is very clear that the efforts cease with his departure.

 

[dcontroversal]

To be with Jesus......end of story....Christ could not bring the dead in Christ with him if they were not with him......1+1=2

 

[Noose]

To be with Jesus......end of story....Christ could not bring the dead in Christ with him if they were not with him......1+1=2

And where is Jesus?

 

[Magenta]

Sleep does not denote consciousness. The machinations and twisting of words you guys get up to is astounding.

 

[JaumeJ]

Listen to Magenta, she made me able to read again.....no lie, ask her.

 

[Noose]

Sleep does not denote consciousness. The machinations and twisting of words you guys get up to is astounding.

The thief on the cross, is he unconscious? How can Jesus promise him paradise that day if He knew he would be unconscious that day?

 

[JaumeJ]

Regarding what is reported by Luke, the doctor, about the thief and Jesus, read carefully what is said:

"Luk 23:43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise. "

I believe I know what is being said here, but it is not mine to say, but I can ask this, how can the thief be "today" walking with Jesus in Paradise when Jesus is to pass three days and nights in "sheol," or, in hell?

Again, it is not for me to say what I understand here, but you are free to meditate on this until you feel you know to your own satisfaction. God bless you....j

 

[Noose]

Regarding what is reported by Luke, the doctor, about the thief and Jesus, read carefully what is said:

"Luk 23:43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise. "

I believe I know what is being said here, but it is not mine to say, but I can ask this, how can the thief be "today" walking with Jesus in Paradise when Jesus is to pass three days and nights in "sheol," or, in hell?

Again, it is not for me to say what I understand here, but you are free to meditate on this until you feel you know to your own satisfaction. God bless you....j

You can say whatever you feel is correct and let's discuss, maybe agree or disagree, learn or unlearn.

My area of focus and with regard to this topic is what the thief asked and what was promised him. He simply asked Jesus to remember him when Jesus comes into His kingdom. Jesus's response to that request was that the thief would walk with Jesus in paradise that same day.
Assuming that Jesus did not lie, which i 100% believe that He didn't, then the redeemed thief was in paradise that same day, consciously partaking of the promise of the Lord. If the thief was not conscious that same day after death, then we have turned Jesus into a liar for not keeping a promise.

Everything else is beyond the scope of this topic but i can still say something. That very day when Jesus died, the graves of the OT saints were opened and they were resurrected, where did they go? are we wrong to say the thief and some OT saints were conscious in heaven that same day?

 

[BaptistBibleBeliever]

In my life of reading the Word I have never learned such a doctrine.....soul sleep? I must be missing something, I know I understand very little after my studies over the years.

Soul sleep is a Seventh Day Adventist teaching . . . and from cursory reading here I'm pretty sure that cultists abound.