Which is greater?

[Gadget]

First of all. I do want to thank everyone for the answers thus far. It has given me a better understanding of some aspect. But now we start to dig a bit more into the meat and potatoes.

I have heard both sides of the story on this one. God loves you soo much. He even sent his son to die for your transgressions. Because he is a perfect god and cannot stand sin.

This raises the question then, is Gods's hatred for sin greater than his love for us? If so, tgen why did he create a creature ( in his own image) that could not possibly stand up to such an expectation?

 

[Ugly]

When we were created (Adam and Eve) we were already perfect. We were sinless. But also had free will. Adam and Eve chose to sin, and that sin is then passed down to the rest of us.

 

[Dan58]

God's hatred of sin is not greater than his love for us.. Its our love of sin that's greater than our love for God.

God sacrificed His Only Begotten for our sins, which proves to me that His love for us supersedes His displeasure with our sin.

We live-up to God's expectations when we believe and love him, He's promised to redeem us despite our short-comings.

 

[ChristIsGod]

Some people get angry when they hear that Adam & Eve's sin was passed down to us -- but that is only because they were representatives of ALL of us. In other words - God knew that no matter who He put in the Garden, it would have happened the same way with any of us.

1 cor 10:13 had helped me for many years. May it serve you as well. 13 There hath no temptation taken hold of you but such as is common to man. But God is faithful; He will not suffer you to be tempted beyond that which ye are able to bear, but with the temptation will also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.

I put this in this thread because your last question/sentence may not be answered in a way that silences that question in your or some other's mind.
A Good & very true verse that you chose.

Reading Romans 1 may help. No one is without excuse -- He makes Himself known to all of His creation, but they choose to not acknowledge Him as God and like Satan, would rather be their own god -- autonomous -- loving darkness rather than Light -- or they call out to God and He will answer and lead them into the way.

No one that has ever lived or will live, will be able to stand before Him and say, "I didn't know about You."

God created us to love us & be loved and have an eternal relationship & life with Him.
The most beautiful love story ever written. Only if humans love and choose the Light rather than darkness.
Satan still tempts with questions, as he did in the Garden. "Hath God said?", "You shall not surely die", etc.

 

[Gadget]

When we were created (Adam and Eve) we were already perfect. We were sinless. But also had free will. Adam and Eve chose to sin, and that sin is then passed down to the rest of us.

Then may i ask how i personal made a choice in the decision that adam or eve made? How could i have stopped them? What could i possibly have done to keep them on the streight and norrow?

 

[ChristIsGod]

If you've read the book of Job, you will understand why that was the first of the books written, chronologically - and for a very good reason.

God was showing us through that book, what the warfare is with Satan - who wanted to be god and Satan came to God and the man Job came into the conversation. Satan accused both Job and God by saying, 'Sure, of course the man's righteous - you've put a hedge of protection around him and blessed the man' [paraphrased] but God knew that it was Job's 'choice' to love & serve God - No Matter What.

If this wasn't played out and written - Satan could say that we just love God because He makes us love Him.

Adam & Eve and we 'have to' have freewill to prove that God doesn't force anybody to love Him.
What good would it be to have a wife that you forced to marry you? Or could you force children to sincerely love you?

 

[Gadget]

Some people get angry when they hear that Adam & Eve's sin was passed down to us -- but that is only because they were representatives of ALL of us. In other words - God knew that no matter who He put in the Garden, it would have happened the same way with any of us.



I put this in this thread because your last question/sentence may not be answered in a way that silences that question in your or some other's mind.
A Good & very true verse that you chose.

Reading Romans 1 may help. No one is without excuse -- He makes Himself known to all of His creation, but they choose to not acknowledge Him as God and like Satan, would rather be their own god -- autonomous -- loving darkness rather than Light -- or they call out to God and He will answer and lead them into the way.

No one that has ever lived or will live, will be able to stand before Him and say, "I didn't know about You."

God created us to love us & be loved and have an eternal relationship & life with Him.
The most beautiful love story ever written. Only if humans love and choose the Light rather than darkness.
Satan still tempts with questions, as he did in the Garden. "Hath God said?", "You shall not surely die", etc.

Okay as i understand, and please tell me if i am missing anything, so god created a species that would naturally fall, this represents me in the idea that i would have made the same choice. So yiu say i am guilty of a crime before i was even born in which to make that choice or not. Am i missing anything?

 

[Gadget]

If you've read the book of Job, you will understand why that was the first of the books written, chronologically - and for a very good reason.

God was showing us through that book, what the warfare is with Satan - who wanted to be god and Satan came to God and the man Job came into the conversation. Satan accused both Job and God by saying, 'Sure, of course the man's righteous - you've put a hedge of protection around him and blessed the man' [paraphrased] but God knew that it was Job's 'choice' to love & serve God - No Matter What.

If this wasn't played out and written - Satan could say that we just love God because He makes us love Him.

Adam & Eve and we 'have to' have freewill to prove that God doesn't force anybody to love Him.
What good would it be to have a wife that you forced to marry you? Or could you force children to sincerely love you?

unfirtunately the book of job does nothing for me anymore. I hung onto it to keep encourage me that things would eventually get better. But they never did. That verse brought me comfort that i could get tgrough it all with gods help. But i couldnt. I am sorry but im not following your answer much.

 

[Flamingspirit]

Without evil, how would we learn to know and choose what is good? We are all children who will inherent eternity. We must know how to act accordingly.

 

[ChristIsGod]

Gadget, all I know is that He loves you and there isn't much that I myself could say but I'd be glad to pray that you'll see that something is trying to rob you of the joy of knowing how much you are loved and what He has planned for us in Eternity.
1Cor 2:9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.

If I can help at all - please feel free to PM me or whoever else that you do trust.
It's always good to have re-enforcement in battle.
He loves you.

 

[Gadget]

Without evil, how would we learn to know and choose what is good? We are all children who will inherent eternity. We must know how to act accordingly.

Wait. So in order to know good, we must know evil, in which we are to be found guilty for knowing?

 

[ChristIsGod]

I just saw your question on the Adam & Eve post.

The Lamb was slain from the foundation of the world. In the mind of God - He knew making man with a freewill would involve a way to cover us out of necessity because we're bent on having things our own way which is not what He knows is the Best for us -- that we'd need a Savior -- otherwise it's that forced love thing again.
He could have created you a robot that had no choice of whether you loved Him or not. There was only two ways to create mankind. Either as robots or freewill agents. What else could He do or how else could He have created us in Eden?

God 'is' love.

 

[Flamingspirit]

Wait. So in order to know good, we must know evil, in which we are to be found guilty for knowing?

Knowing and doing evil are two different things. Many "think" they know what "good" is but if that were so, we would not be dying today. This is one big lesson by our great teacher to prepare us to live with one another forever.

 

[Gadget]

I just saw your question on the Adam & Eve post.

The Lamb was slain from the foundation of the world. In the mind of God - He knew making man with a freewill would involve a way to cover us out of necessity because we're bent on having things our own way which is not what He knows is the Best for us -- that we'd need a Savior -- otherwise it's that forced love thing again.
He could have created you a robot that had no choice of whether you loved Him or not. There was only two ways to create mankind. Either as robots or freewill agents. What else could He do or how else could He have created us in Eden?

God 'is' love.

Okay, then something doesnt add up. He wanted us to have freewill but were to be punished for having it? Isnt that like give a child a ball and the punishing them fir having it?

 

[Mem]

If God knew we would sin and created us anyway, then I should thing that proves He loves us more than He hates sin especially knowing that sin's atonement would require nothing less than the death of His Son. Do you ever wonder why He hates sin though? I suspect it is because it brings death to us.

 

[Gadget]

So then why the fall of man and pass it along to their children? Each generation could "learn" of good and evil individualy. At least then we are responsible for our own decisions and not the actions of those weve never even met.

 

[ChristIsGod]

Okay, then something doesnt add up. He wanted us to have freewill but were to be punished for having it? Isnt that like give a child a ball and the punishing them fir having it?

I understand where you're coming from. I'd feel better if I knew more about you. Like, has this life really been rough on you? It sort of sounds like it. If God created you to love you, but you see that as being punished -- then it would seem that you're mad at the life that you've had ... or the life that you can't have. Is that anywhere near what your life has been like? From my heart, I'm asking. I know what a rough life is and these type questions come from those & the enemy of our souls that hit us when we're down with these type questions about the One Who Loves us more than anyone could ever love another human being. Been there - done that.

 

[Mem]

So then why the fall of man and pass it along to their children? Each generation could "learn" of good and evil individualy. At least then we are responsible for our own decisions and not the actions of those weve never even met.

Unfortunately, its in the blood, that's the nature of inheritance. If I shed my blood for my own sin, that's only justice, no reward in it. But since Jesus' blood was shed for my sin, I continue to live as He should have if it were not that He willingly gave life up so that I could have it. The only decision we have left for us is to choose Christ's atonement or reject it.

 

[Gadget]

I understand where you're coming from. I'd feel better if I knew more about you. Like, has this life really been rough on you? It sort of sounds like it. If God created you to love you, but you see that as being punished -- then it would seem that you're mad at the life that you've had ... or the life that you can't have. Is that anywhere near what your life has been like? From my heart, I'm asking. I know what a rough life is and these type questions come from those & the enemy of our souls that hit us when we're down with these type questions about the One Who Loves us more than anyone could ever love another human being. Been there - done that.

Oh my. That is a can if worms. But i will give my testimonie. Itll just take some time to type out. But be mindful. I cant even get psychatric help xause they say it couldnt have happen.

 

[ChristIsGod]

I was in my 4th home by time I was 3 - it was heart breaking to leave home #3 because I loved my Uncle like "Daddy".
He was the only one that I felt loved me until I was almost 26 - as far as the families I lived with.
Home #4 & #5 were h___ on earth and my self-worth was totally destroyed by time I was 7.
I looked for love in all the wrong places outside of my 'home' #5.
Married in the military to Prince Charming that got himself booted out of the Military and made me his bread ticket and near killed me for more money while he partied all day and was out with women while I worked and he didn't.
Got an Annulment after 3.4 yrs and got out of the military and went to Bible College cuz I got saved while married to him.
Went to Bible college and as a Freshmen, met The Bible Answer Man that was about to graduate and he charmed me off my feet. The Denomination told me that I could marry again - because Biblically, I didn't think that it was the right thing - so I did marry him. The rest I can't post but it turned out that he wasn't saved at all. I wasted my GI Bill by dropping out of school for him and after 30 yrs of anything that anyone's mind could imagine and him doing everything possible to get me to leave - because he wanted to keep up his 'christian front' - he wouldn't leave - so he tried to set our place on fire ... just for one tactic to get free so he could live his 'life-style'. I got bit several times by Lyme ticks and no one tested me until after the damage was done - so I was home-bound while living with this wolf in sheep's clothing - literally.
I only got free when my Dad asked me to move to take care of him. So on 12/1 it'll be 5 yrs that I've been away from my 'husband'. I won't get a divorce - but I know I'll never go back to him. I will always wear a wedding band because I'm married to Him.

It's been very-very hard living here near family ... so - I'll be looking forward to hearing your testimony so that we can figure out when you lost your faith.

God Bless you & help you, dear Sister!