Who is the beast that was and is not?

[Rondonmon]

The 7th Vial & 7th Trump are the same event in parallel teachings, same voices, lightning, thunder, earthquake

Revelation 11:15-19KJV
15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.
19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

Revelation 16:15-17KJV
15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.
16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.
17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.
18 And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great.

Look IMHO, you are wrong on the Rapture, but I don't have to discuss our differences in every post, which makes it seem like we disagree on everything, which is why if I know I disagree on something with someone, I leave it be as far as making it an issue in every post, that is why its a waste of time, we both know we differ so I will allow you to be wrong on that issue and not mention it per se in every post between us(and likewise you can think I am wrong, even though I am correct). Therefore we can have meaningful conversations on other issues. That was my whole point, people can drive wedges by continuing to disagree on one issue. It is what it is, we can let it be.

As per the above, I don't think they are parallel per se, I see them as one and the same like this, the 7th Trump is the Whistle that STARTS THE FOOTBALL GAME, then you have ONE-QUARTER(Vial) of a WHOLE GAME(3rd Woe). The 7th Trump sounds and thus ANNOUNCES the coming 3rd Woe is here, the 3rd Woe is the WHOLE GAME, the 7th Vial is as unto the ONE QUARTER, and the 7th Trump is as unto a Whistle that starts the game. The 3rd Woe is as unto the whole game.

Basically, the Judgments are all in one form, the 7 Trumps. This is why Rev. 10 states that when the 7 THUNDER'S SOUND time will be no more. The Seals are the 7 Judgments BOUND UP, when the Seals are opened, the 7 Judgments can be read from the scroll, which was bitter in Johns's mouth but also sweet in his belly or vice versa. You have the first four Trumps that are one asteroid, and the last three Trumps that are the three woes. The 7 Vials are the 3rd Woe collectively speaking.

The Book of Revelation (BoR) is like an ENCODED PARABLE of the End Times.

1. ) Jesus is seen in Rev. 1 as the THINGS WHICH YOU HAVE SEEN. (John and the Disciples saw Jesus in all His Glory)
2.) In Rev. 2 and 3, we see the Church Age (The THINGS WHICH ARE)
3.) In Rev. 4-19 we see the things which will be HEREAFTER.........

The CODE begins now(Rev. 4:1), we see Jesus sounds the Trumpet in verse 1 ending the Church Age Harvest with the Last Trump.

In Rev. 4 we see the Church in the 24 Elders via CODED HINTS. Go look at Rev. 2:10, 3:5, and 3:21, in each verse, you can see the PROMISES to those that OVERCOME as seen in Rev. 4:4 in the 24 Elders gifts. I will tell you what they are. Rev. 2:10 (Crown of Life) Then in Rev. 3:5 (White Raiment) and finally in Rev. 3:21 (we are promised to SIT amidst God's Throne. Then in Rev. 4;4 we see the 24 Elders sitting at God's throne in the throne room, we have on White Raiment, and Crowns. It's a HUGE CODE, telling us this is the Church in Heaven before the Seals are ever broken. In Rev. 5:9-10 it is clearly stated that those are REDEEMED by the blood, Angels don't need redeeming, and they are said to be Kings and Priests, which is what we are said to be unto God kings and priests. The 24 Elders moniker comes from Leviticus 24, where there are 24 Orders of the Priesthood. It's all a HIGE CODE YELLING, we are the Church in heaven BEFORE the Seals are ever broken.

Rev. 6 is then the Seals being Opened, and Jesus Prophesies with each Seal what is coming over the coming 42 months of the DOTL God's Judgment, AND that the Anti-Christ will use the exact same timeline as when God's Judgment starts to GO FORTH Conquering, the Anti-Christ, understanding Dark Sentences (Satanic influence) will understand that waiting on this Judgment which will wipe out 1/3 of the world is a benefit unto his tactical goals. So he bids his time unto God's Wrath starts, then while the rest of the world is trying to help out what I see as an Asteroid just off the California Coastline, he ATTACKS Israel and THE MANY [Nations] in the Region, including all of North Africa. Thus, we can look at an old Roman Empire map, and we will see what the E.U. and the Nations he conquers will look like, just as it did 2000 some odd years ago on a map. At this time the Jews who repent Flee Judea (Rev. 7) just before the Rev. 8 Judgments hit, and thus just before the Anti-Christ goes forth Conquering.

Rev. 7 is basically this, the Jews Fleeing Judea and the Church as seen in Heaven in verses 9-16. Rev. 8 is the Trumpet Judgments or an Asteroid strike via the first four verses. Rev. 9 is the first two Woes. Rev. 16 we can say 15&16 is the 3rd Woe. Everything else in the Book of Revelation is not a part of the Chronological Order of the BoR, they are all Parenthetical Citation Chapterstat happen during chapters 8, 9, and 16, the Judgment Chapters which last 42 months. So, Rev. 10 is a flash-forward to the end, Rev. 11 overlaps all 42 months save it starts 75 days before the 1260 Rev. 8 Asteroid Strike (DOTL). Rev. 12, 13, 17, and 18 all start with the Rev. 8 Asteroid Strike or DOTL Event. Rev. 14 and 19 both cover the full 7 years because 14 is the Harvest Chapter, and in verse 14 we see the Church Harvested by Jesus from upon a cloud pre-trib. Rev. 19 covers 7 years because we see the Church in Heaven Marrying the Lamb, then returning with him on White Horses.

EWQ said I didn't know about Revelation so I just had to....................put it out there. I think I just confused him even more.

 

[Truth7t7]

Look IMHO, you are wrong on the Rapture, but I don't have to discuss our differences in every post, which makes it seem like we disagree on everything, which is why if I know I disagree on something with someone, I leave it be as far as making it an issue in every post, that is why its a waste of time, we both know we differ so I will allow you to be wrong on that issue and not mention it per se in every post between us(and likewise you can think I am wrong, even though I am correct). Therefore we can have meaningful conversations on other issues. That was my whole point, people can drive wedges by continuing to disagree on one issue. It is what it is, we can let it be.

As per the above, I don't think they are parallel per se, I see them as one and the same like this, the 7th Trump is the Whistle that STARTS THE FOOTBALL GAME, then you have ONE-QUARTER(Vial) of a WHOLE GAME(3rd Woe). The 7th Trump sounds and thus ANNOUNCES the coming 3rd Woe is here, the 3rd Woe is the WHOLE GAME, the 7th Vial is as unto the ONE QUARTER, and the 7th Trump is as unto a Whistle that starts the game. The 3rd Woe is as unto the whole game.

Basically, the Judgments are all in one form, the 7 Trumps. This is why Rev. 10 states that when the 7 THUNDER'S SOUND time will be no more. The Seals are the 7 Judgments BOUND UP, when the Seals are opened, the 7 Judgments can be read from the scroll, which was bitter in Johns's mouth but also sweet in his belly or vice versa. You have the first four Trumps that are one asteroid, and the last three Trumps that are the three woes. The 7 Vials are the 3rd Woe collectively speaking.

The Book of Revelation (BoR) is like an ENCODED PARABLE of the End Times.

1. ) Jesus is seen in Rev. 1 as the THINGS WHICH YOU HAVE SEEN. (John and the Disciples saw Jesus in all His Glory)
2.) In Rev. 2 and 3, we see the Church Age (The THINGS WHICH ARE)
3.) In Rev. 4-19 we see the things which will be HEREAFTER.........

The CODE begins now(Rev. 4:1), we see Jesus sounds the Trumpet in verse 1 ending the Church Age Harvest with the Last Trump.

In Rev. 4 we see the Church in the 24 Elders via CODED HINTS. Go look at Rev. 2:10, 3:5, and 3:21, in each verse, you can see the PROMISES to those that OVERCOME as seen in Rev. 4:4 in the 24 Elders gifts. I will tell you what they are. Rev. 2:10 (Crown of Life) Then in Rev. 3:5 (White Raiment) and finally in Rev. 3:21 (we are promised to SIT amidst God's Throne. Then in Rev. 4;4 we see the 24 Elders sitting at God's throne in the throne room, we have on White Raiment, and Crowns. It's a HUGE CODE, telling us this is the Church in Heaven before the Seals are ever broken. In Rev. 5:9-10 it is clearly stated that those are REDEEMED by the blood, Angels don't need redeeming, and they are said to be Kings and Priests, which is what we are said to be unto God kings and priests. The 24 Elders moniker comes from Leviticus 24, where there are 24 Orders of the Priesthood. It's all a HIGE CODE YELLING, we are the Church in heaven BEFORE the Seals are ever broken.

Rev. 6 is then the Seals being Opened, and Jesus Prophesies with each Seal what is coming over the coming 42 months of the DOTL God's Judgment, AND that the Anti-Christ will use the exact same timeline as when God's Judgment starts to GO FORTH Conquering, the Anti-Christ, understanding Dark Sentences (Satanic influence) will understand that waiting on this Judgment which will wipe out 1/3 of the world is a benefit unto his tactical goals. So he bids his time unto God's Wrath starts, then while the rest of the world is trying to help out what I see as an Asteroid just off the California Coastline, he ATTACKS Israel and THE MANY [Nations] in the Region, including all of North Africa. Thus, we can look at an old Roman Empire map, and we will see what the E.U. and the Nations he conquers will look like, just as it did 2000 some odd years ago on a map. At this time the Jews who repent Flee Judea (Rev. 7) just before the Rev. 8 Judgments hit, and thus just before the Anti-Christ goes forth Conquering.

Rev. 7 is basically this, the Jews Fleeing Judea and the Church as seen in Heaven in verses 9-16. Rev. 8 is the Trumpet Judgments or an Asteroid strike via the first four verses. Rev. 9 is the first two Woes. Rev. 16 we can say 15&16 is the 3rd Woe. Everything else in the Book of Revelation is not a part of the Chronological Order of the BoR, they are all Parenthetical Citation Chapterstat happen during chapters 8, 9, and 16, the Judgment Chapters which last 42 months. So, Rev. 10 is a flash-forward to the end, Rev. 11 overlaps all 42 months save it starts 75 days before the 1260 Rev. 8 Asteroid Strike (DOTL). Rev. 12, 13, 17, and 18 all start with the Rev. 8 Asteroid Strike or DOTL Event. Rev. 14 and 19 both cover the full 7 years because 14 is the Harvest Chapter, and in verse 14 we see the Church Harvested by Jesus from upon a cloud pre-trib. Rev. 19 covers 7 years because we see the Church in Heaven Marrying the Lamb, then returning with him on White Horses.

EWQ said I didn't know about Revelation so I just had to....................put it out there. I think I just confused him even more.

We will disagree, the 7th vial and 7th trump are parallel teachings of the same event (The End) when the second coming, final judgement by the Lords fire, the heavens and earth are dissolved, (Eternity Begins)

(Eternity Begins)

The 7th vial (It Is Done)

The 7th trump (He Shall Reign For Ever And Ever)

Revelation 11:15-19KJV
15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.
19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

Revelation 16:15-17KJV
15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.
16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.
17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.
18 And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great.

 

[lamad]

We will disagree, the 7th vial and 7th trump are parallel teachings of the same event (The End) when the second coming, final judgement by the Lords fire, the heavens and earth are dissolved, (Eternity Begins)

(Eternity Begins)

The 7th vial (It Is Done)

The 7th trump (He Shall Reign For Ever And Ever)

Revelation 11:15-19KJV
15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.
19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

Revelation 16:15-17KJV
15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.
16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.
17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.
18 And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great.

You both amaze me. I have an axiom on Revelation:

ANY theory that must rearrange Revelation to fit, is immediately suspect and will be proven wrong.

The truth is, TIME passes as people read through Revelation. God "marked" (His word not mine) the 70th week so we could easily know where it is: He marked it with 7's: the 7th seal starts the week, the 7th trumpet marks the midpoint, and the 7th trumpet ends it.

The first 6 trumpets come in the first half of the week. Notice that those that will flee when they see the abomination (as Jesus instructed) begin to flee in 12:6. Therefore, that verse is only seconds after the abomination. God will cause the 7th trumpet to sound in heaven marking the very moment the man of sin will enter the Holy of Holies and declare he is GOD. Then a few seconds later (reaction time) they will begin to flee.

There is no "coming" at the 7th trumpet. The mystery there is no longer a mystery because John solved it: it is when Satan is kicked off his throne as God of this world, and the world is given back to Jesus Christ. It is like a "closing" where property LEGALLY changes hands. Jesus begins to reign over the world at that moment, but His first thing will be to delegate 42 months of Authority to the Beast.

The week ends at the 7th vial: "It is done." Yet, there is no coming at the 7th vial. His coming is after the marriage and supper that will take place in heaven. As He said, no one will know the day or the hour.

15 Behold, I come as a thief. This is a prophecy / warning that He will come soon after this.

Note that the seals are NOT IN the 70th week. Chapters 4 & 5 set the context for the first seal opening as soon as Jesus ascended and took the Book from the Father.
Seal 1 is the CHURCH Sent out with the GOSPEL
Seals 2-4 are to represent the devil's attempts to stop the Gospel. These three ride together but are limited to 1/4 the earth.
Seal 5 is for the martyrs of the church age
Seal 6 in the announcement of the imminent start of the Day of the Lord and His wrath. The rapture must come between the 5th and 6th seal. The martyrs are told that judgment will not come until the full count of martys has happened - in other words, until the last martyr of the church age has been murdered. How will that happen? The rapture will end the church age. The next martyr will be a Day of the Lord martyr.
Seal 7 allows the book to be opened - to reveal the trumpet judgments.

 

[lamad]

The 7th Vial & 7th Trump are the same event in parallel teachings, same voices, lightning, thunder, earthquake
.

Solomon said there is nothing new under the sun.
There will be "voices" over and over.
There will be lightning again and again.
There will be thunder over and over.
Earthquakes are happening around the globe.

Question: do you really think there will be great hail in the throne room of heaven? Or perhaps that was just prophecy of what will happen soon on earth?

 

[lamad]

You are wrong twice here. Everyone knows Christ comes at the 7th trump not the 7th vial. Literally 99 percent of Christians understand that correctly.

This reminds of Jesus' saying: a beam versus a mote. There is no coming at the 7th trump. There is not one word that remotely looks like His coming in chapter 19. He comes in chapter 19, after the entire week has finished. Most of the church world knows His coming is in chapter 16.

He will come FOR His saints before the week, then will come WITH His saints after the week.

 

[lamad]

I agree, the 7th vial and 7th Trump take place at the same time, and are parallel teachings of the same event

ANY theory that must rearrange Revelation to fit is immediately suspect and WILL BE proven wrong. The truth is, the 7th trumpet marks the midpoint of the week, while the 7th vial ENDS the week. ("It is done.")

 

[lamad]

Who said it is? The Day of the Lord AND the Anti-Christs rule is42 mo this, the Second Coming happens at the 7th Vial, wich ends the 3rd Woe, which is......."STARTED"........by the 7th Trump.

Rev. 8:13 And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!

So, the LAST THREE TRUMPS are the last three Woes !!

Trump #1 lasts for 5 months, it says so. The First four Trumps are ONE EVENT, the Asteroid Impact brings in fire (Trump #1) ahead of the Impact, then we get the IMPACT (Trump #2) and the Nuclear Fallout (Trump #3) or Wormwood, then we get the skies bei ng Darkened by all te smoke and debris (Trump #4).

So, we have ONE Asteroid Impact, followed by ONE Woe that lasts 5 months, followed by the 2nd Woe where an Angelic Army slays 1/3 of all the wicked men who have taken the Mark of the Beast, followed by the 3rd Woe where Seven Vials of Judgment are brought forth, with te Last Vial being Jesus Christ returning to earth to take control and to bind Satan's power.

Those four things happen over a 3.5 year period of time. NONE of those things happen in one day.

Rev. 9:5 And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man.

The First Woe lasts for 5 months. The 2nd Woe is where Angels slay about 2 billion wicked men, that will take some time, and the last or3rd Woe has 7 phases unto it, you don't seem to get that at all.

Just keep in mind that the first 6 trumpets take up the entire first half of the week: as you said, 3.5 years. I don't think the first four trumpets sound together. There will probably be a short time between. A nuclear exchange will not take long, but radiated water may not be discovered for some time.

 

[Rondonmon]

We will disagree, the 7th vial and 7th trump are parallel teachings of the same event (The End) when the second coming, final judgement by the Lords fire, the heavens and earth are dissolved, (Eternity Begins)

(Eternity Begins)

The 7th vial (It Is Done)

The 7th trump (He Shall Reign For Ever And Ever)

Revelation 11:15-19KJV
15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.
19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

Revelation 16:15-17KJV
15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.
16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.
17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.
18 And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great.

Here is where you get tripped up on the timing. They are the SAME EVENT, in that the 7th Trump is THE 3RD Woe Judgment but the 7th Vial is not all of the 3rd Woe Judgment, it is just one out of 7 parts. It's like saying a gallon that has 8 pints and all 8 pints are different juices, but somehow the LAST PINT of Orange Juice is the WHOLE GALLON, when the whole gallon has 1 pint of Milk, One pint of Water, one pint of Coke, etc., etc. thus the Gallon and the [not cant be the samee\, likewise, the Trump and the Vial can't be the same, the Trump is a;; 7 Vials thus it's the 3rd Woe, so how can the Trump be Parallel with the Vial when it is ALSO the 1st Via, 2n d Vial, 3rd Vial, etc. all the Vials?

I know why you go there, I see it time and again, Rev. 11 is the Two-witnesses chapter, it's a set-a-side chapter or Parenthetical Citation chapter about the Two-witnesses ministry on earth, it isn't about the Judgments per se, it's only telling us a few things. That the Two-witnesses are called unto Israel only in Revelation 11:1-3 and that their prayers bring forth the Judgments on mankind, kinda like Moses brought the 10 Plagues (even though it was of God/Holy Spirit). So, when we get to the 7th Trump a lot of people say, Ohhh, that sit, it a parallel event, no it's the SAME EVENT. Rev. 11s 7th Trump will END WITH VICTORY at the 7th Vial. So the 7th Trump incorporates the 7th Via but the 7th Vial isn't parallel with the 7th Trump because it's only 1/7 of the Woe, now if you want to say all 7 Vials are Parallel with the 7th Trump, it would be kinda true, but not really, because the 7 Vials ARE the 7th Trump s Judgments via the 3rd Woe. In other words, the Gallon would be the 8 PINTS ALSO !! But the Orange Juice can't be the Whole Gallon.

People take the Two-witnesses ministry and make it a part of the BoR's timeline, it's not. We also see the 2nd Woe spoken of in Rev. 11 right? But we are given NO DETAILS about the 2nd Woe because we are given the DETAILS in Rv. 9 because Rev. 9 is the Chronological Order of the BoR, not Rev. 11. Likewise, the 3rd Woe is mentioned as coming quickly, thus when the 7th Trump is blown, we are merely told it will BRING VICTORY and thus given an overall account as per to what the last prayer of the Two-witnesses brings forth, the 7th Trump will QUICKLY bring the 3rd Woe which will bring VICTORY. But, just like via the 2nd Woe, we get NO DETAILSin Rev. 7 because this is not a part of the Chronological Order of the BoR, we get THE DETAILS of the 3rd Woe via the 7 Vials in Rev. 16 which ENDS IT ALL via the Angel saying IT IS DONE. That's is why it's not really parallel, one is the WHOLE GALLON and one is the PINT. Thus they two can't be parallel, even though the pint will eventually be a part of the Gallon, the Gallon is not JUST ORANGE JUICE.

The 7th Trump is the LAST JUDGMENT (3rd Woe) and will indeed bring victory when the 7th Vial finishes off the 3rd Woe. Som in short the reason they can't be parallel is they don't cover the exact same timeline IN FULL. One is a PINT and one is a GALLON. One has ONE LIQUID the other has 8 liquids (7 Vials........LOL).

Instead of Parallel think these are all the SAME EVENT. Rev. 11s 7th Trumps END IT ALL........Rev. 14s Winepress which ENDS IT ALL........ Rev. 16s 7th Vial ENDS IT ALL............ And lastly the Rev. 19 Marriage Supper = Armageddon and ENDS IT ALL !!

The above are all the EXACT SAME EVENT, just like Daniel 2s Rock (Jesus) that is cut out of the Mountain and SMASHES the Satue to smithereens is the exact same event as the four above.

 

[Rondonmon]

Just keep in mind that the first 6 trumpets take up the entire first half of the week: as you said, 3.5 years. I don't think the first four trumpets sound together. There will probably be a short time between. A nuclear exchange will not take long, but radiated water may not be discovered for some time.

You are lost brother man in world of gyroscopes and you can't tell up from down.

 

[lamad]

Here is where you get tripped up on the timing. They are the SAME EVENT, in that the 7th Trump is THE 3RD Woe Judgment but the 7th Vial is not all of the 3rd Woe Judgment, it is just one out of 7 parts. It's like saying a gallon that has 8 pints and all 8 pints are different juices, but somehow the LAST PINT of Orange Juice is the WHOLE GALLON, when the whole gallon has 1 pint of Milk, One pint of Water, one pint of Coke, etc., etc. thus the Gallon and the [not cant be the samee\, likewise, the Trump and the Vial can't be the same, the Trump is a;; 7 Vials thus it's the 3rd Woe, so how can the Trump be Parallel with the Vial when it is ALSO the 1st Via, 2n d Vial, 3rd Vial, etc. all the Vials?

I know why you go there, I see it time and again, Rev. 11 is the Two-witnesses chapter, it's a set-a-side chapter or Parenthetical Citation chapter about the Two-witnesses ministry on earth, it isn't about the Judgments per se, it's only telling us a few things. That the Two-witnesses are called unto Israel only in Revelation 11:1-3 and that their prayers bring forth the Judgments on mankind, kinda like Moses brought the 10 Plagues (even though it was of God/Holy Spirit). So, when we get to the 7th Trump a lot of people say, Ohhh, that sit, it a parallel event, no it's the SAME EVENT. Rev. 11s 7th Trump will END WITH VICTORY at the 7th Vial. So the 7th Trump incorporates the 7th Via but the 7th Vial isn't parallel with the 7th Trump because it's only 1/7 of the Woe, now if you want to say all 7 Vials are Parallel with the 7th Trump, it would be kinda true, but not really, because the 7 Vials ARE the 7th Trump s Judgments via the 3rd Woe. In other words, the Gallon would be the 8 PINTS ALSO !! But the Orange Juice can't be the Whole Gallon.

People take the Two-witnesses ministry and make it a part of the BoR's timeline, it's not. We also see the 2nd Woe spoken of in Rev. 11 right? But we are given NO DETAILS about the 2nd Woe because we are given the DETAILS in Rv. 9 because Rev. 9 is the Chronological Order of the BoR, not Rev. 11. Likewise, the 3rd Woe is mentioned as coming quickly, thus when the 7th Trump is blown, we are merely told it will BRING VICTORY and thus given an overall account as per to what the last prayer of the Two-witnesses brings forth, the 7th Trump will QUICKLY bring the 3rd Woe which will bring VICTORY. But, just like via the 2nd Woe, we get NO DETAILSin Rev. 7 because this is not a part of the Chronological Order of the BoR, we get THE DETAILS of the 3rd Woe via the 7 Vials in Rev. 16 which ENDS IT ALL via the Angel saying IT IS DONE. That's is why it's not really parallel, one is the WHOLE GALLON and one is the PINT. Thus they two can't be parallel, even though the pint will eventually be a part of the Gallon, the Gallon is not JUST ORANGE JUICE.

The 7th Trump is the LAST JUDGMENT (3rd Woe) and will indeed bring victory when the 7th Vial finishes off the 3rd Woe. Som in short the reason they can't be parallel is they don't cover the exact same timeline IN FULL. One is a PINT and one is a GALLON. One has ONE LIQUID the other has 8 liquids (7 Vials........LOL).

Instead of Parallel think these are all the SAME EVENT. Rev. 11s 7th Trumps END IT ALL........Rev. 14s Winepress which ENDS IT ALL........ Rev. 16s 7th Vial ENDS IT ALL............ And lastly the Rev. 19 Marriage Supper = Armageddon and ENDS IT ALL !!

The above are all the EXACT SAME EVENT, just like Daniel 2s Rock (Jesus) that is cut out of the Mountain and SMASHES the Satue to smithereens is the exact same event as the four above.

It is written that the last three trumpet judgments are the three woes. But John gets more specific with the 3rd woe:


Revelation 12:12
Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

The 3rd woe will be what Satan does "having great wrath." What will he do? He will work with the Beast and False Prophet to cause the days of great tribulation.

Then the earth will also experience the vials and associated plagues that God will cause to be poured out to shorten those days of GT.

Just the fact that the 7th trumpet is in chapter 11 and the 7th vial is in chapter 16 should be enough to show anyone they are not the same thing nor will happen at the same time. The truth is, the 7th trumpet will mark the MIDPOINT while the 7th vial ends the week.

 

[lamad]

You are lost brother man in world of gyroscopes and you can't tell up from down.

You can be wrong if you choose to be. You don't seem to know that God marked the 70th week with the sevens. You seem to ignore the fact that in general, when you flip a page in Revelation, TIME PASSES.
In chapters 4 & 5, John is showing us Jesus on earth, (Jesus not found worthy) Jesus resurrected (found worthy), then Jesus ascended and the Holy Spirit sent down.
Then chapter 6 covers the entire church age.
Then chapter 8 through 16 cover the 70th week.

ANY theory that must rearrange John's God given chronology to fit, will be proven wrong.

 

[Rondonmon]

It is written that the last three trumpet judgments are the three woes. But John gets more specific with the 3rd woe:


Revelation 12:12
Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

The 3rd woe will be what Satan does "having great wrath." What will he do? He will work with the Beast and False Prophet to cause the days of great tribulation.

Then the earth will also experience the vials and associated plagues that God will cause to be poured out to shorten those days of GT.

Just the fact that the 7th trumpet is in chapter 11 and the 7th vial is in chapter 16 should be enough to show anyone they are not the same thing nor will happen at the same time. The truth is, the 7th trumpet will mark the MIDPOINT while the 7th vial ends the week.

No, he doesn't, Satans Wrath is not a Woe. It never ceases to amaze me when you guys conflate issues because of words like Woe is come to earth well, that is not God's Wrath, the three Wos are God's Wrath. Can't Stan bring WOE without it being God's Wrath which is designated as the three woes? Yes, and he does.

The 1st Woe is God allowing the Demons out of the bottomless pit. The 2nd Woe is 200 Million Angelic Beings slaying 1/3 of those who have taken the Mark of the Beast. The 3rd Woe is the 7 Vials. None are the Dragon, his Woes last 42 months via the Anti-Cheists killings, buts it is not God's Wrath.

You can be wrong if you choose to be. You don't seem to know that God marked the 70th week with the sevens. You seem to ignore the fact that in general, when you flip a page in Revelation, TIME PASSES.
In chapters 4 & 5, John is showing us Jesus on earth, (Jesus not found worthy) Jesus resurrected (found worthy), then Jesus ascended and the Holy Spirit sent down.
Then chapter 6 covers the entire church age.
Then chapter 8 through 16 cover the 70th week.

ANY theory that must rearrange John's God given chronology to fit, will be proven wrong.

You are confused via the book of Revelation. You not understanding it is not me rearranging it, it's just you not understanding it.

I know who you are I think and you believe in that ole THE SEALS have mostly been broken stuff, which I have proved wrong, and I pretty much refuse to keep on replying to you on another site because it's waste of time, I don't debate over and over with people who I think are way out there on things, I just leave it be and let you go where you want to go, but you will never convince me on anything about Revelation or Eschatology brother. So don't waste your time.

 

[lamad]

No, he doesn't, Satans Wrath is not a Woe. It never ceases to amaze me when you guys conflate issues because of words like Woe is come to earth well, that is not God's Wrath, the three Wos are God's Wrath. Can't Stan bring WOE without it being God's Wrath which is designated as the three woes? Yes, and he does.

The 1st Woe is God allowing the Demons out of the bottomless pit. The 2nd Woe is 200 Million Angelic Beings slaying 1/3 of those who have taken the Mark of the Beast. The 3rd Woe is the 7 Vials. None are the Dragon, his Woes last 42 months via the Anti-Cheists killings, buts it is not God's Wrath.


You are confused via the book of Revelation. You not understanding it is not me rearranging it, it's just you not understanding it.

I know who you are I think and you believe in that ole THE SEALS have mostly been broken stuff, which I have proved wrong, and I pretty much refuse to keep on replying to you on another site because it's waste of time, I don't debate over and over with people who I think are way out there on things, I just leave it be and let you go where you want to go, but you will never convince me on anything about Revelation or Eschatology brother. So don't waste your time.

Sorry, but anyone saying the 7th trumpet is the end is rearranging. The "end" (of the 70th week and of the Jewish age) is at the 7th vial where it is written "it is done." Some translations say "it is finished." Just to make it very plain, the 7th trumpet is in chapter 11. All the events of chapters 12, 13, 14, 15 happen BEFORE the events of chapter 16.

Satans Wrath is not a Woe. Searching for the word "woe after " The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.," we find:

Revelation 12:12
Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

If God Himself, causing John to write, called it a woe when the devil comes down, who am I to disagree with God? You can disagree if you choose.

It is so amazing that people that follow very close to what is actually written are accused of not understanding, and those that accuse don't follow what is written but use imagination. Case in point: It is God and John calling Satan coming down as a woe, not me.

Just so you know, it was God causing John to write that shows us that Jesus got the book and began opening the seals as soon as He ascended. All I do is tell what John told. Case in point:

Rev. 5:6 And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.

I did not write this, JOHN did. Jesus got the book into HIS hands as soon as He ascended. You imagine 2000 years before He opened a seal. I read what John wrote: He opened the first seal as soon as He got the book into His hands.

By the way, if you are on anther site, you will be wrong there too.

 

[Nebuchadnezzer]

The Bible never contradicts itself, it is us who misconstrue what God is saying, other by bad translations, or bad assumptions.

Dan. 7:11 11 I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the horn spake: I beheld even till the beast was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the burning flame.

The beast in Dan 7:11 being slain and the beast in Rev 19:20 being thrown alive in the lake of fire are not the same events. They are different events.

 

[Nebuchadnezzer]

Hence

Your claim that (The Beast) in Revelation 13 is a demon spirit is false, Daniel clearly explains that (The Beast/Little Horn) has a human body that will be given to the burning flame, in perfect agreement with Revelation 19:20
.

Its called anthropomorphism, and is found throughout the bible. The idea behind anthropomorphism is that of attributing human characteristics to nonhumans — gods, animals, or inanimate objects. If you believe that your cat wants to celebrate his birthday, you are participating in anthropomorphism.

The little horn is attached to a beast by the way.

 

[Nebuchadnezzer]

It's a crown. A crown symbolizes power and authority. There is no other meaning. Same meaning here:


Rev_14:14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.


Rev 17:12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.

This is when they are given their crowns to symbolize this new power given to them as kings within the beast empire.




No, there is not more significance.

They why are there not diadems on the horns in Daniel? Hmmmm?

 

[Nebuchadnezzer]

Our Spirits NEVER DIE, so our Spirits must be alive while we are judged, we must face God and understand the consequences of our sins, and of Jesus SAcrifice for our sins. So, they will never be allowed to rest, thus Spiritually, they are cast ALIVE into hell, but only after they have been killed, see Dan. 7:11.

Actually, we are spiritually dead because of sin.

Genesis 2:17
New King James Version
but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die.”

This is spiritual death in the day or moment transgression occurs.

Thus is why Jesus is the bread of life and the living waters. He gives our spirit life.

Ephesians 2:1
New King James Version
And you He made alive, who were dead in trespasses and sins,

Againt this is spiritually dead.

------------------

Therefore, the beast and false prophet being cast "alive" into the lake of fire is a clear indication that they are demons or demonic entities. For if they are mere humans they are spiritually dead before being cast into the Lake of Fire.

 

[lamad]

The beast in Dan 7:11 being slain and the beast in Rev 19:20 being thrown alive in the lake of fire are not the same events. They are different events.

Is our human spirit "alive" after our body is destroyed?

 

[Nebuchadnezzer]

Is our human spirit "alive" after our body is destroyed?

Our human spirit is alive in Christ. It undergoes eternal destruction apart from Christ.

 

[Truth7t7]

Solomon said there is nothing new under the sun.
There will be "voices" over and over.
There will be lightning again and again.
There will be thunder over and over.
Earthquakes are happening around the globe.

Question: do you really think there will be great hail in the throne room of heaven? Or perhaps that was just prophecy of what will happen soon on earth?

Your In Complete denial of presented truth before your eyes

The 7th Vial & 7th Trump are the same event in parallel teachings, same voices, lightning, thunder, earthquake

(Eternity Begins)

"He Shall Reign For Ever And Ever"

"It Is Done"

Revelation 11:15-19KJV
15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.
19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

Revelation 16:15-17KJV
15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.
16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.
17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.
18 And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great.