Why dealing with an atheist is futile.
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I think you might find that "dealing" with a Deist who takes a position on the Bible that is neither typically atheistic or fundamentalist, and who has some 30+ years under their belt steeped in Christian experience and Christian apologetics more difficult than "dealing" with an atheist. We aren't as easy to dismiss, categorize or generalize.
why would i be wasting time, turning water into wine, all so that i could change your mind. i know its not really fair, but i just want to help you prepare. cause no matter what you believe, one day you will receive, all that has been made ready for you, and you will experience what is true. the word prepares you and the Spirit repairs you and Jesus will carry you. before we even have to bury you.
ask any atheist if they want to EXPERIENCE Christianity. tell them the bible teaches us how to have that experience. if a non believer say they don't want to have the christian experience. tell them the bible teaches us how to have the experience. the only people who want to argue over the word of God are those who have not yet experienced it.
duewell
mark 4 v11-13
ask any atheist if they want to EXPERIENCE Christianity. tell them the bible teaches us how to have that experience. if a non believer say they don't want to have the christian experience. tell them the bible teaches us how to have the experience. the only people who want to argue over the word of God are those who have not yet experienced it.
duewell
mark 4 v11-13
My apologies, I may have been to vague.
Atheist put all their trust in the five senses if they cant rationalize it through their 5 senses then they will not accept it
What of emotion and abstract concepts? I can accept a notion like 'sympathy' as existing even though I can't put it under a microscope.
I then asked a follow up question - "do you believe the multiverse is real?" I asked this because it's an abstract concept for us until we are able to prove/detect it's existence. It's very difficult to believe in something outside our current reality. It's nearly impossible to prove the existence of the supernatural because by definition it exists outside our own plain of existence.
Atheist put all their trust in the five senses if they cant rationalize it through their 5 senses then they will not accept it
What of emotion and abstract concepts? I can accept a notion like 'sympathy' as existing even though I can't put it under a microscope.
I then asked a follow up question - "do you believe the multiverse is real?" I asked this because it's an abstract concept for us until we are able to prove/detect it's existence. It's very difficult to believe in something outside our current reality. It's nearly impossible to prove the existence of the supernatural because by definition it exists outside our own plain of existence.
What about someone raised Christian, one who bought into the indoctrination, and the teachings? What if this person learned of other religions as well and began to question all of them on the same ground? I have experience Christianity as a religious body. It's pleasant, people have a common belief and there is a real sense of community. I know many Christians who are amazing people to be around. People do good works in the name of Christianity. However, you can find these same characteristics in a humanist community, a Muslim community, or any other community that shares a common goal of having a decent society. I'm not a Christian because I don't accept the bible as divine writing. Frankly, I haven't seen the evidence for a god/gods either. Keep in mind yours is not the only god being submitted as true/real.
I've read lots of Science Fiction books which have a multiverses. One episode of STNG has an awesome multiverse plot. The one where reality is ripping apart and Enterprises appear all over the front screen, with so many possible outcomes shown as different from the current reality, portrayed in the show.
As to reality, I know a lot of scientists are trying to prove it, but so far more math than something the 5 senses can experience. But, there is the Hadron Collider, so who knows what will happen?
As for as experiences leading to being a Christian, I would rather call it "the Revelation of God." When God revealed himself to me, it was with the eyes and hearing. I saw and heard, and I believed. That was 35 years ago, and my walk with Christ goes stronger every day!
(And yes, I came out of 10 years of atheism and then agnosticism. God led me and guided me back to him!))
I'm thinking when you say"what about emotion"you are talking about feelings on the inside.
Feel is one of the five senses also All of what you are talking of(emotions,personality,thoughts.etc.....)that are coming from inside originate from your brain and operate by the sense of feeling.
But the spirit which is where GOD changes a person operates by Faith.
What is spirit is spirit and what is flesh is flesh.
We are housed in flesh but the rebirth takes place in the spirit and Faith pleases GOD and the flesh doesn't operate by Faith.
GOD is a Spirit and must be worshiped in spirit and in TRUTH.
My source is the book Spirit Soul And Body by Andrew Wommack.
Feel is one of the five senses also All of what you are talking of(emotions,personality,thoughts.etc.....)that are coming from inside originate from your brain and operate by the sense of feeling.
But the spirit which is where GOD changes a person operates by Faith.
What is spirit is spirit and what is flesh is flesh.
We are housed in flesh but the rebirth takes place in the spirit and Faith pleases GOD and the flesh doesn't operate by Faith.
GOD is a Spirit and must be worshiped in spirit and in TRUTH.
My source is the book Spirit Soul And Body by Andrew Wommack.
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what strikes me as difficult to comprehend is what happens when a Muslim says they truly have a religious experience that leads them to Allah through Islam? or a Mormon says they are visited spiritually by Joseph Smith which tells them that their beliefs are in fact the correct beliefs? It's pretty bold to say, "no, those weren't real experiences they had, but mine are!". I'd pretty much just wonder... maybe all of these are personal experiences that people had and have assigned their own meaning to in a way that convinces them that they can't possibly be wrong. In a way, maybe you're all telling the truth, maybe your all lying, how would we ever even know?
On emotion - emotion is certainly one of the senses, but not the 5 senses commonly referred to. touch - physical feeling is one of those commonly mentioned 5. I don't disagree though. I think it's inaccurate to say we only have 5 senses, we leave out so much of how our bodies detect the world around us.
As for spirit and soul. Those are tricky to define, what are the spirit or soul, is it possible to function without these? What would a person with them look like versus a person without? We know consciousness to be it's own separate thing, after all, the soul/spirit is suggested to live on after your physical body dies. What testable evidence do we have that can help us demonstrate why we should believe such things exist?
As for spirit and soul. Those are tricky to define, what are the spirit or soul, is it possible to function without these? What would a person with them look like versus a person without? We know consciousness to be it's own separate thing, after all, the soul/spirit is suggested to live on after your physical body dies. What testable evidence do we have that can help us demonstrate why we should believe such things exist?
i didn't accept the bible as divine writing either. i didn't care much for the religious community and their beliefs. i wasn't looking to become a religious person. then i had a Christian experience. i tried talking about the experience to a guy i worked with and he said, "hey what you are talking about is found in the bible." i replied "oh i don't have a bible." so he gave me one. and there is all was in black in white. the things i had experienced were right there in the bible. the bible confirms the experience.
when i talk about being able to experience Christianity. i am not taking about going to a specific church and singing and praying with people. i'm talking about actually experiencing the word of God at work in you and at work in those around you. actual enlightenment and experience of the Holy Spirit. a renewing of the mind. born again of imperishable seed. physical desires removed.
if you want to know the real true God, confess your sins, repent of them and ask Jesus to prepare you for his father.
you talk of evidence. it is one i used to talk about with my other non believer friends back in the day and what i have learned since then. its not that there is a lack of evidence, its that we are too blinded by our own sins to see that evidence. imagine you don't believe in water, only to one day find you are in the ocean and you had been swimming in the ocean waters your whole life and never even knew you were wet. we are literally drowning in evidence. i cant show it to you. you have to go through what Jesus teaches to see it. with luck you will get a bible after its done and see it even clearer. if a bible isn't available or acceptable, you might end up writing the experience down. maybe thats what mohamed/buddha/joseph smith did. i got to tell you though when i read about saint francis of assisi had to say, there was a guy who clearly understood it as the Christian experience.
finally thanks for reading this far. one last thing. many non believers claim to want evidence and proof so that they can believe. you need to make the choice to believe before you see the evidence and proof, or are non believers asking God to take away their free will to believe in God? they want proof and evidence that leaves them no choice but to believe before deciding if they even want to believe. you cant force anyone to love you or it isn't actually love. you cant force someone to believe you or it isn't actual belief. could God do those things? of course, but God respects us enough to leave the decision in our hands.
ok thank for reading everything if you want to talk about anything feel free to let me know. im not a lawyer here to debate the bibles meaning in greek. i'm here to try and help those who wish to experience what the bible teaches in the only way i can, as a witness.
duewell
mark 4 v 11-13
I am atheist. I used to be born again. but my experience is the christens I knew were selfish.they did nothing because it was a right thing to do, because they had too. christens ask, where do atheist get there morality? for me. I believe in the rule of law. also I respect my fellow man. and would never say or do something I didn't want done to me. some will say I got that from the bible.but I'm different I care about people because I want to live on a good plannet where people do for others, simply to make this a better place.i was at church awhile back. and there was a women who was a member. but her husband was in the hospital with cancer. and our church had sixty thousand dollars. I thought the church should help. but this is what the pastor said. I wont give money from the collections. that is the churches money. and I wont ask for a special collection either. my jaw was already on the floor. and then if u people want to give that's up too you.jesus said follow me and god will provide. I thought it was the churches job to help this women. then I realized christens are very selfish. they do nothing wiyhout something in return. whatever that may be. that was the moment I knew I was better then that and that I was atheist
Does anyone have covering for sins? I try my best to do good and be patient, not to win anyone's favor, because I believe it makes for the best society. I just want to be a good person. If I go before any god and they decide I deserve punishment for this, then that is an unjust god and was never deserving of worship to begin with.