Why didn’t Jonah just jump off the boat?

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posthuman

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Jul 31, 2013
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Jesus said He always does what He sees and hears the Father do and NOT ONCE did Jesus ever say it was God's will for anybody to be sick. Not once!
i seem to remember reading that it's appointed once for man to die.
 
P

PhilCollins

Guest
In fact, Jesus took our sickness and disease upon His Body on the cross so I don't have to have them in my body.
Again, I'm not so sure. You surely are talking about a perfect human, and those Christians claiming that, like the rich young man from the elite class, are focused on avoiding doing bad things, rather than considering whether they are doing all the good things they are called to. Sins of omission are much harder to be free from.

Additionally we can note that the apostle Paul indicated that God allowed a thorn in his side to remain in order to keep him humble, since he had such an important role in the early church. We know illness or accident for a proud person can be used by God to bring humility and sensitivity. And since God is sovereign, and scripture is clear that he chooses to interact with this world, he can ensure perfect health for an individual if he wishes to. But often, in his grace, he uses the bad things that happen to us for our good. Again, the apostle Paul attests to that of course.
 

posthuman

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In fact, Jesus took our sickness and disease upon His Body on the cross so I don't have to have them in my body.

Those that learn how to stand on God's Word can live victoriously in ALL areas of their lives.

Those that allow the devil to talk them out of God's promises get defeat.
do you believe your body will not die?

does it presently not decay?
 
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i seem to remember reading that it's appointed once for man to die.

Yes, we are appointed to die physically once, that does not mean it's God's will that His people live in sickness and disease.

He provided for us to have healing at the Cross but sadly most Christians don't believe that and don't stand on God's promises on this topic and many get sick and needlessly die early



Again, I'm not so sure.

You should be because God's Word teaches us about this.



You surely are talking about a perfect human

No, I'm talking about those that see God's promises and stand on those promises and grow in faith to receive what God promised as a reality in their lives.


we can note that the apostle Paul indicated that God allowed a thorn in his side

That was not sickness and disease, it was the devil opposing him and causing trouble for him every where he went.

He asked God to get the devil off of him in error - Paul apparently had not learned what Jesus said to do about the devil which is cast him out in Jesus Name

Mark 16:17
And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;


Jesus never taught anyone to pray and ask the Lord to get the devil off of them. Paul eventually figured this out as we see in the last part of the Book of Acts where he lived in a rented house no man forbidding him to preach the Gospel.

Paul is not Jesus so Paul made some mistakes and had to learn the error of his ways as he grew spiritually just like the rest of us.

Besides, Jesus is the model we are called to follow and Jesus said the devil had nothing in Him. Until Jesus willingly laid down His life to die on the Cross, the devil thought Jesus was teflon don because all his attacks against Jesus failed.



We know illness or accident for a proud person can be used by God to bring humility and sensitivity.

The devil is so very glad to hear that some folk believe this! This is an open door for him to bring destruction in to people's lives due to believing it is God doing evil things to people.

John 10:10
The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.

God is good and wants good things for His children.
The devil is bad and wants to bring destruction to God's people.

Those that don't understand this are wide open for deception and destruction.



God is sovereign, and scripture is clear that he chooses to interact with this world, he can ensure perfect health for an individual if he wishes to. But often, in his grace, he uses the bad things that happen to us for our good. Again, the apostle Paul attests to that of course.

Sounds like what the calvinists teach, that God and satan are the same guy!

Their false doctrine make God in to a monster!






do you believe your body will not die?

does it presently not decay?

Sure we will all die eventually and age does cause the body to not be as strong as it was when we were young.

That does not mean I have to put up with sickness and disease in my life. I don't, and no Christian should that knows how to obtain God's promises concerning health.
 

posthuman

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Jul 31, 2013
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Sure we will all die eventually and age does cause the body to not be as strong as it was when we were young.

That does not mean I have to put up with sickness and disease in my life. I don't, and no Christian should that knows how to obtain God's promises concerning health.
decay - the process of your body waning with age - is different from sickness and disease how exactly?

it's death. it's the result of the cursing of the dust, from which our bodies are formed.

why is it significant that Moses had not lost his eyesight or strength? why did Satan want to know where his body is?
 

posthuman

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That does not mean I have to put up with sickness and disease in my life. I don't, and no Christian should that knows how to obtain God's promises concerning health.
where did God promise that our earthly bodies would not be subject to disease?

good health is nothing more than dying slightly slower.

perhaps this needs it's own thread.
 

PaulThomson

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Oct 29, 2023
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Hmm. Maybe. Maybe not. Jesus explicitly said that the man born blind had been allowed to remain blind so that God's glory would be revealed. So one could deduce that God ensured the blindness to remain until that day when Jesus would be able to demonstrate his power over disability.
This may be a case where the KJV translators got it wrong. The text could be punctuated differently.

John 9:3-4 Jesus answered, "Neither has this man sinned, nor his parents. But that the works of God should be manifest in him, I must work the works of him who sent me, while it is day. Night comes, when no man can work. As long as I am in the world, I am the light of the world."
 

PaulThomson

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Because scripture never directly says he died and then God raised him from the dead and this is what most scholars think as well for whatever good that does.

Besides, why does it even matter? Who really cares?

If we guess right does this make us a better Christian and it brings us closer to the Lord or something.

There's lots of other things to think about that are far more profitable for spiritual growth


Besides, what ever happened to the question "Why didn’t Jonah just jump off the boat?" View attachment 261403
What makes us a better Christian is the way we choose to treat the views of people who have perspectives on scripture they cannot prove but we cannot disprove. Are we gracious and patient and keeping an open mind? Or are we combative because we have a prideful heart and their idea being true would make my idea wrong?
 
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decay - the process of your body waning with age - is different from sickness and disease how exactly?

it's death. it's the result of the cursing of the dust, from which our bodies are formed.

why is it significant that Moses had not lost his eyesight or strength? why did Satan want to know where his body is?

All these questions produce strife / opposition between you and the Lord's promises that are found in Christ Jesus. A double minded man receives nothing from the Lord (James 1:5-8)

I've been bought with a price, not my own therefore I'm called to glorify God in my body (1 Corinthians 6:20) which is the temple of the Holy Spirit (1 Corinthians 6:19)

There are a lot of people in our world today that are healthy their entire lives before they die at 90 or 100 and this is how a Christian that knows how to rightly divide the Word of God should go as they have learned how to access God's Wisdom to receive His promises.

But hay, it's no problem for me if some folk want to receive sickness and die a long drawn out horrible, painful, expensive death in a nursing home where they let people just lay their and rot. Folks get what they want.



where did God promise that our earthly bodies would not be subject to disease?

Wow, I thought you were a student of God's Word?

Why not pop over to your favorite search engine and do some searching and find scriptures where the Lord promises healing to His people!

Why not go by what God promises rather than unbelief which is making the decision to NOT believe God's promises?




Are we gracious and patient and keeping an open mind?

Jesus upbraided (correction) those that did not believe God's Word.

Since we know ultimately it's the devil that opposes God's Word and continually seeks to get people to agree with his opposition to God's Word - no, I'm not interested in keeping an open mind to opposition to God's Word.

So many that say they are Christians just straight up decide to not believe many of the things God says in His Word because they've been listening to the devil who speak to them thru false teachers, friends and family.

One cannot be a victorious Christian and pay attention to voices that continually speak opposition against God's Word.

This is Christianity 101, let God be true and everyone else a liar unless they are quoting what God said.

God is right, everyone else is wrong. Very simple!
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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All these questions produce strife / opposition between you and the Lord's promises that are found in Christ Jesus. A double minded man receives nothing from the Lord (James 1:5-8)

I've been bought with a price, not my own therefore I'm called to glorify God in my body (1 Corinthians 6:20) which is the temple of the Holy Spirit (1 Corinthians 6:19)

There are a lot of people in our world today that are healthy their entire lives before they die at 90 or 100 and this is how a Christian that knows how to rightly divide the Word of God should go as they have learned how to access God's Wisdom to receive His promises.

But hay, it's no problem for me if some folk want to receive sickness and die a long drawn out horrible, painful, expensive death in a nursing home where they let people just lay their and rot. Folks get what they want.






Wow, I thought you were a student of God's Word?

Why not pop over to your favorite search engine and do some searching and find scriptures where the Lord promises healing to His people!

Why not go by what God promises rather than unbelief which is making the decision to NOT believe God's promises?







Jesus upbraided (correction) those that did not believe God's Word.

Since we know ultimately it's the devil that opposes God's Word and continually seeks to get people to agree with his opposition to God's Word - no, I'm not interested in keeping an open mind to opposition to God's Word.

So many that say they are Christians just straight up decide to not believe many of the things God says in His Word because they've been listening to the devil who speak to them thru false teachers, friends and family.

One cannot be a victorious Christian and pay attention to voices that continually speak opposition against God's Word.

This is Christianity 101, let God be true and everyone else a liar unless they are quoting what God said.

God is right, everyone else is wrong. Very simple!
i, post, posted a new thread. let's post posts to post there; this is off topic.

should show up in an hour or so whenever a mod approves.
 
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i, post, posted a new thread. let's post posts to post there; this is off topic.

should show up in an hour or so whenever a mod approves.

Your signature says

good news gives health to the bones (Proverbs 15:30)

Isn't this a valid promise from the Lord?
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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Your signature says

good news gives health to the bones (Proverbs 15:30)

Isn't this a valid promise from the Lord?
yes!
it's the promise of resurrection.

thanks for getting back on the Jonah topic :geek:
 
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yes!
it's the promise of resurrection.

It says "gives health to the bones" so this is a promise for healthy bones, and has nothing to do with resurrection

Jonah didn't just jump off the boat because he did not want to get his Armani Tunic wet :cool:
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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It says "gives health to the bones" so this is a promise for healthy bones, and has nothing to do with resurrection
the word bones in scripture is associated with dead bodies, not osteoporosis.
and "good news" with the gospel, which is the appearing, death and resurrection of Christ.
 
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hmm plausible, however this does not track with him saying "throw me off the boat"

In other words he is not willing to jump on his own for whatever reason



the word bones in scripture is associated with dead bodies, not osteoporosis.
and "good news" with the gospel, which is the appearing, death and resurrection of Christ.

That's your opinion as you read in to this scripture something it never says.

Proverbs 4:20-23 (see John 8:51, Proverbs 5:1,2, James 1:22… Most Christians don’t do this – BIG MISTAKE!)
Attend to My words; incline your ear unto My sayings....let them not depart from your eyes; keep them in the midst of your heart....for they are life unto those that find them, and health to all their flesh....keep your heart with all diligence; for out of it flow the forces of life.

*Nobody can say this is just spiritual as the Lord specifically says in this passage
His Word is health to all our flesh very clearly speaking about our body.


But, you are welcome to reject the Lord's promises as it sounds like you already have. Enjoy!
 

stilllearning

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Oct 4, 2021
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This may be a case where the KJV translators got it wrong. The text could be punctuated differently.

John 9:3-4 Jesus answered, "Neither has this man sinned, nor his parents. But that the works of God should be manifest in him, I must work the works of him who sent me, while it is day. Night comes, when no man can work. As long as I am in the world, I am the light of the world."
This I find interesting. Some years back when I first heard that the New Testament was written without punctuation it got my mind going. So I dug in and it was in the 3rd century BC that the Greeks started punctuation believe first was the comma.

I theorize that the problem arose because as you conquered new peoples and pushed for assimilation by culture and language. There is gonna be some disconnect in the process. I have never had time to really research if that is the case or not. However, it was noticed that as Greek was being read aloud in forums and public gatherings. Some of the readers did not comprehend where to stop, place emphasis, and etc. So punctuation was born to let the reader know how and when to do so.

Also upon further reading of modern scholars. The majority found no problems with the punctuation. Mainly because Greek was still spoken as a first and primary language as late as I believe 400 AD. So they would have the knowledge and skillset. So I tend to at least at this time go with the majority that it is correct. Mainly because I have not found the time to really dig in further and research out all the history and data.

Which hoping at some point I get the time to because I have to admit that when I read every jot and title will be fulfilled. I take a broader reading for that to include punctuation as well. So interesting topic and since you believe there may be a problem with the punctuation of this verse would actually like to hear more on why you find that so or just your theory if that is what you have at present.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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Proverbs 4:20-23 (see John 8:51, Proverbs 5:1,2, James 1:22… Most Christians don’t do this – BIG MISTAKE!)
Attend to My words; incline your ear unto My sayings....let them not depart from your eyes; keep them in the midst of your heart....for they are life unto those that find them, and health to all their flesh....keep your heart with all diligence; for out of it flow the forces of life.

*Nobody can say this is just spiritual as the Lord specifically says in this passage
His Word is health to all our flesh very clearly speaking about our body.
John 8:51​
Most assuredly, I say to you, if anyone keeps My word he shall never see death
is this speaking about the physical body?
i think you already confessed you don't believe that Christians aren't subject to the death of the flesh.


but please, as i told you yesterday, i made another thread for this topic. no need to go off-topic here.

perhaps you were not able to find it?
that thread is here:

https://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/the-health-gospel.214529/#post-5267520
 
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is this speaking about the physical body?
i think you already confessed you don't believe that Christians aren't subject to the death of the flesh.

Ah yes, the old "hey, what's this over here" tactic to ignore the plain reading of scripture.

I made a better thread at https://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/gods-promises.214536/
called God's promises that is not based on the false pre-conceived premise that God does not watch over His Word to perform it. (Jeremiah 1:12)
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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Ah yes, the old "hey, what's this over here" tactic to ignore the plain reading of scripture.
you posted the reference, so i posted the actual verse.
whose at fault if it doesn't surpport your position?