WHY DO WE HAVE SO MANY BIBLE TRANSLATIONS?

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Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
26,074
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#21
As if they don't believe that God would require that and so they default to one translation like the KJV based on the romanticism of antiquity and call it quits as far as educating themselves.
It is not the romanticism of antiquity by the reliability of a translation which has stood the test of time. Big difference. If a Bible can continue for over 400 years as the Bible of huge numbers of Christians (and the sole bible of English-speaking Christians worldwide for over 300 years), as well as the "go-to" Bible for unbelievers, then you need to wake up and ask yourself "Is God's hand over this translation?" You will not find a single conservative commentator before 1900 who had any reservations about the Authorized Version.

As to the so-called modern scholars and critics, they have all turned out to be hoaxers. They have ignored everything that was written against the most corrupt manuscripts, and steadfastly promoted a lie.
 
May 22, 2020
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#22
What do you do when different translations give verses completely different meanings?
You have a very important decision to make...don't you? Most of those have been written since 1960's and slanted from God's meaning and intent.

The choice is very easy...KJV 1611 edition.
 
J

joecoten

Guest
#23
Pretty good...apart from the fact that they added a word to the book of Revelation...but pretty good!
 

Amanuensis

Well-known member
Jun 12, 2021
1,457
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#24
It is not the romanticism of antiquity by the reliability of a translation which has stood the test of time. Big difference. If a Bible can continue for over 400 years as the Bible of huge numbers of Christians (and the sole bible of English-speaking Christians worldwide for over 300 years), as well as the "go-to" Bible for unbelievers, then you need to wake up and ask yourself "Is God's hand over this translation?" You will not find a single conservative commentator before 1900 who had any reservations about the Authorized Version.

As to the so-called modern scholars and critics, they have all turned out to be hoaxers. They have ignored everything that was written against the most corrupt manuscripts, and steadfastly promoted a lie.
At the risk of opening up a can of worms I have not intention of cleaning up, and only for the sake of answering the previous question...

Translating from the manuscripts in extant into another language is a science not a hoax. Anyone can do it if they take the time to learn the languages. If not, then they rely on others that have.

The questions about the proper translation of a sentence from a manuscript into English, or one of the Chinese languages, or French, or Russian will always be determining which word in the new language communicates the same idea as the Greek or Hebrew that the author intended.

The KJV is a good translation. However, it is agreed by all honest translators that when they used the word candlestick instead of lamps or lampstands in Revelation it was not the best word. It communicated the wax candlesticks familiar to the reader of the medieval times but the wax candlestick was not used in the first century. John saw oil fed lamps and lampstands. Both of which we have in museums from that time and even older. For those of us who are fans of retaining the exact wording of the original including the details like oil fed lamps that might contribute to deeper meanings we are not happy about this use of a wax candlestick in the translation. Passing it off as not important is a bit hypocritical if wanting the most accurate translation is the motive of the KJV advocate.

If that does not matter to the KJV advocate, then he won't care if I use the word Flashlight will he? Of course he would. But he in his attempt to argue for the accuracy of candlestick he would run into a problem. And if honest have to admit that the KJV should have used lamps and lampstands knowing that it was the oil fed lamps of that day and not the wax candlesticks of the KJV scholars day that should have been translated into English.

This is just an example. I am not interested in a long debate on KJV. My point was that answers to the question of why a text is translated can be examined in an intelligent way rather than defaulting to a blind trust in a translation as being the best one without being able to explain why from the perspective of the science of translation concerning that verse?

But that takes work. If you don't want to do the work, then put the issue on the shelf until you can discover all the facts rather than just blindly devote yourself to the KJV or any other out of extremist belligerent zeal for a translation.

Repeating conspiracy theory rhetoric about KJV vs other translations is skipping the real science of examining the Greek of the verse in question and translating it. I have no time for that sort of thing.
 

Roughsoul1991

Senior Member
Sep 17, 2016
8,888
4,539
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#25
What do you do when different translations give verses completely different meanings?
We study the interlinear and compare and contrast the methods used to interpret the verse.

I prepared this for a group that I lead and teach so that they may understand the foundation to translations. To give them the basics to trust their Bible or dig deeper to decide which translation or translations are the best.

This thread was naturally going to attract the KJV only folks but to counter the dogma I wanted to provide anyone with the basics to dig deeper and decide for themselves.
 

Amanuensis

Well-known member
Jun 12, 2021
1,457
460
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#26
We study the interlinear and compare and contrast the methods used to interpret the verse.

I prepared this for a group that I lead and teach so that they may understand the foundation to translations. To give them the basics to trust their Bible or dig deeper to decide which translation or translations are the best.

This thread was naturally going to attract the KJV only folks but to counter the dogma I wanted to provide anyone with the basics to dig deeper and decide for themselves.
Thanks bro. I'm a fan!
 

Amanuensis

Well-known member
Jun 12, 2021
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#27
You will not find a single conservative commentator before 1900 who had any reservations about the Authorized Version.

[/QUOTE]
Before 1900 many scholars wrote. By Scholar I am referring to those who learned the Hebrew and Greek. And they often included their own translation of a text in a commentary explaining the Greek and sometimes presented a better English option than the KJV for a particular word or sentence that they felt could have been done better. Anyone who reads enough of those older commentaries that are in the public domain knows what I am talking about.

Scholars have ALWAYS done the same thing that the KJV scholars did when translating and that is translate from the original. No Scholars have ever accepted the KJV without question. Those are people who don't know the original languages who do that. Scholars translate.
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
25,606
13,863
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#29
If a Bible can continue for over 400 years as the Bible of huge numbers of Christians (and the sole bible of English-speaking Christians worldwide for over 300 years),
The KJV was never the "sole bible of English-speaking Christians worldwide". The Geneva Bible, Tyndale's, Coverdale's, and a handful of others were available before the KJV, and Geneva in particular was preferred by some Christian groups.

as well as the "go-to" Bible for unbelievers
The opinions of ignorant unbelievers are now evidence for a translation's superiority? Whatever you're smoking, you should stop!

then you need to wake up and ask yourself "Is God's hand over this translation?"
Your rhetoric has no evidentiary value and is nothing but wind designed to evoke an emotional response on a subject which absolutely should not be decided by emotions.

As to the so-called modern scholars and critics, they have all turned out to be hoaxers. They have ignored everything that was written against the most corrupt manuscripts, and steadfastly promoted a lie.
Big claims require big evidence. Step up and provide it.
 

JohnDB

Well-known member
Jan 16, 2021
6,280
2,560
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#30
It's all about money.
(Usually is)

Each translation is copyrighted....
Meaning it's not free to use. Fees must be paid to publish using the various translations.

Then you have the various denominations. They like to promote certain theologies and demote the things that the bible says to not do but they perform.

The KJV is the Church of England's Bible.
The ESV is the Calvinists Bible.
The HCSB is the SBC Bible
The ISR is the Messianic Jewish Bible
The RSV is also a COE Bible
Catholics have several these days but I'm thinking that they only promote one.

The original NIV was truly a non-denominational Bible....it's gotten so far off track I'm not sure about the modern versions anymore.

NASB is a more literal word-for-word translation but still nonsensical in its manner of translation and euphemisms.
(There is no possibility for what they claim it to be to actually happen)

Living Bibles....ok...they are now a mishmash of translation and paraphrasing. Depends on age as to what you got.

Amplified....mostly used by AOG to torture the words to death.

Did I miss any major ones?
 
May 22, 2020
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#31
Pretty good...apart from the fact that they added a word to the book of Revelation...but pretty good!
Can you give details..need to know.?
What impact does it have...in your opinion?
 
J

joecoten

Guest
#33
Can you give details..need to know.?
What impact does it have...in your opinion?
Church [Old English cirice, circe; Middle English chereche, chiriche, chirche; whence churche, cherche, etc.: -Greek Kuriakon...] which means "belongs to, or pertaining to, a lord." It may have first been used in relation to pagan gods.
Ecclesia [mediaeval Latin, and Greek - from : SUMMONED] -A regularly convoked assembly, especially the general assembly of Athenians.
The King James bible translators replaced the original word "ecclesia," with the word church.
The two words church and ecclesia have different meanings. I understand that the word of God cannot be broken, therefore the word church was added. My concern is the following...
"I testify to everyone who hears the words of prophecy in this book: If anyone adds to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book." - Revelation 22:18
I know it's just a word...maybe it's nothing. Just don't tell me that the KJV is flawless, because I know better.
(sources: aggresivechristianity.net and others.)
 

Amanuensis

Well-known member
Jun 12, 2021
1,457
460
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#35
Church [Old English cirice, circe; Middle English chereche, chiriche, chirche; whence churche, cherche, etc.: -Greek Kuriakon...] which means "belongs to, or pertaining to, a lord." It may have first been used in relation to pagan gods.
Ecclesia [mediaeval Latin, and Greek - from : SUMMONED] -A regularly convoked assembly, especially the general assembly of Athenians.
The King James bible translators replaced the original word "ecclesia," with the word church.
The two words church and ecclesia have different meanings. I understand that the word of God cannot be broken, therefore the word church was added. My concern is the following...
"I testify to everyone who hears the words of prophecy in this book: If anyone adds to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book." - Revelation 22:18
I know it's just a word...maybe it's nothing. Just don't tell me that the KJV is flawless, because I know better.
(sources: aggresivechristianity.net and others.)
Church = A called out assembly; Called out of the world to assemble together and serve God and Christ together, praying, worshipping, teaching, serving in love, living life together and provoke unto love and good works and being witnesses together of the resurrection of Jesus Christ as we share our testimony, and reach our communities with the Gospel making disciples of all nations, looking for the coming of the Lord Jesus Christ who will rescue us from the coming judgment.

Yeah.. that's what it is. Probably missed some things.
 
J

joecoten

Guest
#36
Church = A called out assembly; Called out of the world to assemble together and serve God and Christ together, praying, worshipping, teaching, serving in love, living life together and provoke unto love and good works and being witnesses together of the resurrection of Jesus Christ as we share our testimony, and reach our communities with the Gospel making disciples of all nations, looking for the coming of the Lord Jesus Christ who will rescue us from the coming judgment.

Yeah.. that's what it is. Probably missed some things.
Church does not mean called-out assemble. That's what ecclesia means. At least if you're honest about it.
 

Amanuensis

Well-known member
Jun 12, 2021
1,457
460
83
#37
Church does not mean called-out assemble. That's what ecclesia means. At least if you're honest about it.
The Greek Ecclesia is translated as both assembly and church in KJV and other translations depending on the verse.

So since we don't actually say Ecclesia in English, (though I did have a friend tattoo it across his chest for some reason) but instead say church what are we talking about? The called out assembly of course.
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
25,606
13,863
113
#38
Church does not mean called-out assemble. That's what ecclesia means. At least if you're honest about it.
What, in your view, is the distinction between "church" and "ecclesia", other than the different language?
 
Nov 26, 2021
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India
#39
What do you do when different translations give verses completely different meanings?
Read the original Hebrew/Greek and/or Strong's Concordance. Simple. Can you give 3 or verses which such "completely different meanings" in different translations?
 
J

joecoten

Guest
#40
The Greek Ecclesia is translated as both assembly and church in KJV and other translations depending on the verse.

So since we don't actually say Ecclesia in English, (though I did have a friend tattoo it across his chest for some reason) but instead say church what are we talking about? The called out assembly of course.
I'm talking about the original meaning of the words and how the KJV translators knowingly inserted a word into scripture, a change that has brought subtle change to the meaning of the original text. No big deal.