Will do greater things??

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karuna

New member
Apr 24, 2019
3
3
3
#1
John 14:12
I tell you the truth, anyone who believes in me will do the same works I have done, and even greater works, because I am going to be with the Father (NLT)

Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; (KJV)

Brothers and Sisters, can we have some serious discussion on this verse? Because this verse really beats me.

First of all this verse says "Verily, verily" that means what He is saying is truth.

Next Jesus Christ tells us that we who believe in Him " will do the same works I have done". Alright so let us see the kind of works He has done.

* Healing the sick. [Please note 3 points here : a) Healing all the sick who came to him b) Healing them of any kind of sickness and c) Healing them instantly!]
* Driving out demons [Note: a) instantly b) with just one word]
* Healing infirmities like blind seeing, lame walking, dumb speaking, deaf hearing all this instantly
* Raising people from death
* Command over nature like calming storm, walking on water and drying of tree (again instantly)

Now here are my questions and I really want someone to help me with the answers.

Q1. Jesus Christ says "and greater works than these shall he do". I don't get this! What could be greater than what He has done??
Q2. Forget the "doing greater things" part. I have not known anyone who can do what Jesus Christ has done (they way He did it)!! Why are we unable to do what He did??
Q3. Since I firmly believe that Jesus Christ has told us the truth, and since it is also a fact that today noone is able to do what He did, I can only come to the conclusion that we have gone drastically wrong somewhere. Does anybody has any idea where we have gone wrong? Or is this question itself wrong?

Help!!!
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
28,607
7,021
113
64
Florida
#2
Jesus has mercy and compassion so perhaps these are part of the greater works that He was referring too. Your topic is very interesting. Glad to have you as part of our community. Welcome to CC.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
24,193
5,961
113
#3
What does Christ Jesus consider 'greater'?
Is it the same thing people call 'greater'?
Why does He qualify this statement by 'because He is going to the Father' - - what's the relevance to His definition of 'greater'?
 

Didymous

Senior Member
Feb 22, 2018
4,418
1,632
113
#5
Sharing the gospel, about how Jesus died for our sins, was buried and rose again the third day is a greater work, because Jesus couldn't do that while he lived.
 
K

KnowMe

Guest
#6
Acts 5
12The apostles performed many signs and wonders among the people, and with one accord the believers gathered together in Solomon’s Colonnade. 13Although the people regarded them highly, no one else dared to join them. 14Yet more and more believers were brought to the Lord—large numbers of both men and women.

15As a result, people brought the sick into the streets and laid them on cots and mats, so that at least Peter’s shadow might fall on some of them as he passed by.16Crowds also gathered from the towns around Jerusalem, bringing the sick and those tormented by unclean spirits, and all of them were healed.
 
K

KnowMe

Guest
#7
hmm even a shadow
 

Noose

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2016
4,232
735
113
#8
Jesus was directly addressing the disciples and that promise was for the disciples. The disciples did 'greater' works than Jesus because their scope was not limited to Jerusalem or Israel but also the nations.
 
K

KnowMe

Guest
#9
Acts 19
8Then Paul went into the synagogue and spoke boldly there for three months, arguing persuasively about the kingdom of God. 9But when some of them stubbornly refused to believe and publicly maligned the Way, Paul took his disciples and left the synagogue to conduct daily discussions in the lecture hall of Tyrannus. 10This continued for two years, so that everyone who lived in the province of Asia, Jews and Greeks alike, heard the word of the Lord.

11God did extraordinary miracles through the hands of Paul, 12so that even handkerchiefs and aprons that had touched him were taken to the sick, and the diseases and evil spirits left them.
 

Didymous

Senior Member
Feb 22, 2018
4,418
1,632
113
#10
Jesus was directly addressing the disciples and that promise was for the disciples. The disciples did 'greater' works than Jesus because their scope was not limited to Jerusalem or Israel but also the nations.
I agree that the apostles did things that most of us won't, or can't. But the verse addresses all who believe in Jesus. And since no one-even the apostles-raised themselves from the dead, I think the greater refers to more things done, rather than more miraculous.
 

Noose

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2016
4,232
735
113
#11
I agree that the apostles did things that most of us won't, or can't. But the verse addresses all who believe in Jesus. And since no one-even the apostles-raised themselves from the dead, I think the greater refers to more things done, rather than more miraculous.
1. The apostles raised the dead
2. From the context, we can tell that Jesus was addressing the disciples only:

John 14:12Truly, truly, I tell you, whoever believes in Me will also do the works that I am doing. He will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father. 13And I will do whatever you ask in My name, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14If you ask Mec anything in My name, I will do it.
.......

John 16:23In that day you will no longer ask Me anything. Truly, truly, I tell you, whatever you ask the Father in My name, He will give you. 24Until now you have not asked for anything in My name. Ask and you will receive, so that your joy may be complete.


Jesus was not addressing anyone else apart from the disciples and He told them until that moment, they had not asked anything in His name yet because He had not yet ascended to the Father.
 

FlyingDove

Senior Member
Dec 27, 2017
667
203
43
#12
Matthew 16:26 For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?

Every living soul is worth more to God then ALL the riches this world has to offer

Helping a lost soul find salvation. Is the """Greater Works""" Jesus spoke of. My Opinion Only!
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
1,784
1,365
113
#13
Amen to above. It is so wonderful to realize that there is no greater work than helping someone find Jesus - PTL !
 

MattforJesus

Senior Member
Apr 15, 2017
2,036
315
83
#14
John 14:12
I tell you the truth, anyone who believes in me will do the same works I have done, and even greater works, because I am going to be with the Father (NLT)

Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; (KJV)

Brothers and Sisters, can we have some serious discussion on this verse? Because this verse really beats me.

First of all this verse says "Verily, verily" that means what He is saying is truth.

Next Jesus Christ tells us that we who believe in Him " will do the same works I have done". Alright so let us see the kind of works He has done.

* Healing the sick. [Please note 3 points here : a) Healing all the sick who came to him b) Healing them of any kind of sickness and c) Healing them instantly!]
* Driving out demons [Note: a) instantly b) with just one word]
* Healing infirmities like blind seeing, lame walking, dumb speaking, deaf hearing all this instantly
* Raising people from death
* Command over nature like calming storm, walking on water and drying of tree (again instantly)

Now here are my questions and I really want someone to help me with the answers.

Q1. Jesus Christ says "and greater works than these shall he do". I don't get this! What could be greater than what He has done??
Q2. Forget the "doing greater things" part. I have not known anyone who can do what Jesus Christ has done (they way He did it)!! Why are we unable to do what He did??
Q3. Since I firmly believe that Jesus Christ has told us the truth, and since it is also a fact that today noone is able to do what He did, I can only come to the conclusion that we have gone drastically wrong somewhere. Does anybody has any idea where we have gone wrong? Or is this question itself wrong?

Help!!!
Joh 14:12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.

Joh 21:25 And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.

Who can out do Jesus, with miracles aplenty, and love galore, without wavering, and without faltering, for you cannot, unlike us who can say I do not feel like going to Church, as we bust out the Nintendo for some serious video game action, and say I do not want to reach out to those people, when they need it.

But we can do the same works as Jesus by the Spirit, but how can we do greater works than Him.

It cannot be concerning the works that He actually did, as their purpose, for it can be no greater than that, for He did all the works that can be done by the Spirit, nothing lacking, and love is the fulfilling of the law, which He is perfect love, always led of the Spirit, and dealing with people.

It cannot be greater than the actual works He done in purpose.

Jesus was only sent to the lost sheep of Israel, and that is it, and basically walked everywhere He went, so He was limited on how far His ministry could reach.

Jesus could only reach out to so many people in a small area, which would mean not that many people, although it was still a lot.

Mat 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.

The disciples, as well as all people, are instructed to go out and teach all nations.

Would someone say that Paul reached out to a larger number of people than Jesus did, since Paul was sent to the Gentiles, and could travel to more than only one tiny country, for he was not sent to only one tiny country.

Would someone say that the disciples, as well as the saints, reached out to a larger number of people, since they could branch out more in Israel, and even affect Gentiles.

We cannot do greater works than Jesus compared to the intensity, and importance of the work itself, but we can reach out to a larger number of people, for we are not limited to a small area like Jesus, who was only sent to the lost sheep of Israel, only had three and one half years to work, and could only affect a small amount of people, although it is big in number, but not as big as a person that is not limited in how far they can travel, and have more time in the ministry.

Not only on an individual level concerning some people that have reached out to a larger number than Jesus, but also collectively the saints can reach out to the whole world, where Jesus was only sent to the lost sheep of Israel.

It started with Jesus, for He was the only one, even with the disciples, for He was the only one that was led of the Spirit at the time of His ministry.

And when Jesus ascended, then went to the saints when they received the Spirit, and they could reach a greater number of people than Jesus did.

I tend to believe that Jesus is speaking that the saints collectively will do greater works than Him, for they will impact the world, and all their works together would be far greater than what Jesus did while on earth, but some could on an individual level like Paul who was sent to the Gentiles, bigger area, more ground to cover, not limited by only a tiny nation such as Israel, and not having only three and one half years to preach.

We cannot do greater works than Jesus compared to the intensity, and the importance of the work itself, but we can reach out to more people than He did when He was on earth during His ministry.

Joh 21:25 And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.

Which is why I tend to believe that Jesus meant that we will reach out to more people, possibly as an individual, and definitely as the Church, or works other than miracles.

For I tend to doubt that anybody as an individual could do more than Jesus did in the amount of work He did concerning miracles, even though it was only three and one half years.

But those works Jesus said would be greater also include preaching the Gospel, feeding the poor and needy, and showing love towards people, and whatever pertains to the kingdom of God, which is easily believable that an individual may do greater works than Jesus in those areas, seeing they can cover more ground, and are not limited to only three and one half years, at least a lot of them.

But straight up miracles of healing, and causing a fig tree to wither, those types of miracles, and causing people to come back to life, I doubt that anybody could do greater works than Jesus in that area, not an individual, no way, no how, but the Church all through the years, especially the early Church with all the miracles they did could do it.

But not an individual, for I do not believe that, for sure the disciples did miracles of healing, but did any of them cause a fig tree to wither, cause a coin to appear in a fishes mouth, put mud in someone's eye sockets, and they became eyes, walked on water, calmed the roaring sea, caused a great fish catch for the disciples, turns water in to wine, fed thousands of people with a couple of fish, and a few loaves of bread, cast demons in to a herd of swine, a woman is healed simply by touching his garment, and that as a standard routine.

For we do not hear of all this vastness of miracles being done by the disciples, other than a lot of healing, and a few casting out demons, and a few raising the dead, but Jesus did those miracles in abundance, and did extreme miracles other than them.

But then again Jesus had to prove He was the Savior of the world, the Christ, by doing what no man ever did, and that in extreme miracles, which He told the disciples that if they did not believe Him for the words He speaks, believe Him for the works He does that they testify that He is of God, and of God He would not lie about being the Christ, for like Nicodemus said, no man can do these works unless God is with him.

So in miracles, those type of works other than healing, no person is going to do greater works than Jesus, for we are not out to prove we are the Christ, like He had to do by works that no person ever did, and Elijah healed, so Jesus had to do great works other than healing.

The greater works that we will do include miracles like healing, and casting out demons, raising the dead, miracles that have to do with the welfare of a person, and their health, physically, and spiritually, and to preach the Gospel, feed the poor and hungry(with money not multiplying fish, and bread), and to love people, and help them with whatever they need help.

But Jesus did extreme miracles that is not common place for the saints, and not told they would do other than the miracles that have to do with the welfare of a person.

So rest easy for your Savior could do greater works than us, and He is still the greatest, and we would not want to think of Him any differently, but we will do greater works in other areas that pertain to the welfare of people, for that is what the kingdom of God is about, possibly as an individual, and definitely as the Church, for the Church has fed more people, reached out to more people, preached the Gospel to more people, and healed more people in the early Church than Jesus, for the Church is not limited in time spent to minister, and they are a larger group, and not limited to a certain area, but the world.
 

karuna

New member
Apr 24, 2019
3
3
3
#15
Great to all those responses. One thing I have learnt from all of you is that the word "greater" can also have another meaning i.e "more". As dear MattforJesus put it down for us it is quite possible that Jesus was talking in terms of the number of people He reached out to versus the number of people all His disciples were going to reach out to. And most likely it cannot be speaking about the miracles Jesus did. Because as many have pointed out, out doing Jesus Christ in those areas is... NOT POSSIBLE. Praise the Lord that I now have somethings cleared up. In Jesus' name I thank all of you for your replies.
 

Guojing

Well-known member
Jan 12, 2019
2,178
417
83
#16
John 14:12
I tell you the truth, anyone who believes in me will do the same works I have done, and even greater works, because I am going to be with the Father (NLT)

Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; (KJV)

Brothers and Sisters, can we have some serious discussion on this verse? Because this verse really beats me.

First of all this verse says "Verily, verily" that means what He is saying is truth.

Next Jesus Christ tells us that we who believe in Him " will do the same works I have done". Alright so let us see the kind of works He has done.

* Healing the sick. [Please note 3 points here : a) Healing all the sick who came to him b) Healing them of any kind of sickness and c) Healing them instantly!]
* Driving out demons [Note: a) instantly b) with just one word]
* Healing infirmities like blind seeing, lame walking, dumb speaking, deaf hearing all this instantly
* Raising people from death
* Command over nature like calming storm, walking on water and drying of tree (again instantly)

Now here are my questions and I really want someone to help me with the answers.

Q1. Jesus Christ says "and greater works than these shall he do". I don't get this! What could be greater than what He has done??
Q2. Forget the "doing greater things" part. I have not known anyone who can do what Jesus Christ has done (they way He did it)!! Why are we unable to do what He did??
Q3. Since I firmly believe that Jesus Christ has told us the truth, and since it is also a fact that today noone is able to do what He did, I can only come to the conclusion that we have gone drastically wrong somewhere. Does anybody has any idea where we have gone wrong? Or is this question itself wrong?

Help!!!
Good thread, you may want to refer to this earlier discussion for another perspective.

https://christianchat.com/bible-dis...ists-believe-in-cessation-of-miracles.182378/
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
24,193
5,961
113
#17
it is quite possible that Jesus was talking in terms of the number of people He reached out to versus the number of people all His disciples were going to reach out to.
no, that is not possible fit with the text, even though it is actually a really common explanation.

Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever believes in me will also do the works that I do;
and greater works than these will he do, because I am going to the Father.
(John 14:12)

the word translated as "whoever" is singular
the word translated as "he" is singular


the word translated "greater" is "megas" and it means greater in quality -- there is a different Greek word, "pleistos" which means greater in number

what Matt wrote simply isn't supported by the text.
the text doesn't say that a plural collective of millions will do more works. it says the singular one who believes in Him will do greater things.


we have to find out what God means when He says 'greater' -- does God generally put quantity above quality?
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
1,194
113
#18
12 I tell you the truth, anyone who has faith in me will do what I have been doing.
He will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father.
13 And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Son may bring glory to the Father.
14 You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it.
John 14

14 This is the confidence we have in approaching God: that if we ask anything according to his will, he hears us.
1 John 5

3 When you ask, you do not receive, because you ask with wrong motives, that you may spend
what you get on your pleasures.
James 4

Jesus promises a great deal when He says He is going to the Father, except John and James specify
these great promises are bounded by our understanding of Gods will.

And clearly some men of God have done great miracles and stirred up great revivals that have changed
nations. But it is neither obvious or straightforward, and much is clouded by our view on holiness,
a righteous walk, anointing and Gods will.
 

breno785au

Senior Member
Jul 23, 2013
5,327
318
83
#19
I know a man, a man whom I esteem greatly in the faith, who has been walking with the Lord for longer I have been alive. He shared a story with me from when he was very young in the faith. He read Mark 6:13 about anointing the sick with oil and they were healed. He took that scripture with simple, child like faith and blessed a sick person with whatever oil he found, I believe it was motor oil and the person was healed.

I guess if we don't believe, we will never know.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
24,193
5,961
113
#20
What does Jesus say is the works of God for us?
Isn't it "to believe"?

And didn't He tell Thomas blessed are those who don't see Him, and yet believe?

Here in John we read that He explains exactly why the one believing in Him does 'greater works' - - because He goes to the Father.

I really think y'all should stop focusing on miraculous signs and powers and think about what He Himself calls 'great'