Works

[OIC1965]

Your comments are so unusual I spoke with several baptists...not so.

If that is your way.......you have wasted 34 years.
Make a change.

https://bfm.sbc.net/bfm2000/

As you can see in article seven, there is nothing in the Baptist Faith and Message ( statement of largest Baptist group) that says Baptism washes away sin.

Perhaps you can give citations of Baptists or Baptist groups that teach that baptism washes away sin.

The blood of Jesus cleanses from sin. (1 John 1:7.

 

[Jocund]

https://bfm.sbc.net/bfm2000/

As you can see in article seven, there is nothing in the Baptist Faith and Message ( statement of largest Baptist group) that says Baptism washes away sin.

Perhaps you can give citations of Baptists or Baptist groups that teach that baptism washes away sin.

The blood of Jesus cleanses from sin. (1 John 1:7.

"Baptism, which corresponds to this, now saves you, not as a removal of dirt from the body but as an appeal to God for a good conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ," - 1 Peter 3:21 ESV

 

[peldom10]

https://bfm.sbc.net/bfm2000/

As you can see in article seven, there is nothing in the Baptist Faith and Message ( statement of largest Baptist group) that says Baptism washes away sin.

Perhaps you can give citations of Baptists or Baptist groups that teach that baptism washes away sin.

The blood of Jesus cleanses from sin. (1 John 1:7.

When did you marry a denomination and divorce the Bible?

I couldn't care less of what any denomination says.
What does the Bible say...KJV 1611 edition;
(may be duplicates quotes)

Baptism is Required


Peter 3: 21.... whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:


John 3:5 .......Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.


Acts 2;38-....Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Acts 22;16... And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

Roman 6;3.... Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

Galations 3:26...... For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Mark16;16.... He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved.....

Eph. 4;5 One lord, one faith, one baptism. Many others

Born Again;

The second death is avoided................. providing our christian life (born again) on earth....... is acceptable by G-d for eternal salvation. If so then we are ,......"Saved".
2 Corinthians 5:10 ESV / 218 helpful votes
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may receive what is due for what he has done in the body, whether good or evil.

I will not do this for you again. I have done it each time you have asked. You have a computer...forget denominations and search/study read the Bible.

 

[TheLearner]

bed time

 

[OIC1965]

When did you marry a denomination and divorce the Bible?

I couldn't care less of what any denomination says.
What does the Bible say...KJV 1611 edition;
(may be duplicates quotes)

Baptism is Required


Peter 3: 21.... whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:


John 3:5 .......Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.


Acts 2;38-....Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Acts 22;16... And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

Roman 6;3.... Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

Galations 3:26...... For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Mark16;16.... He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved.....

Eph. 4;5 One lord, one faith, one baptism. Many others

Born Again;

The second death is avoided................. providing our christian life (born again) on earth....... is acceptable by G-d for eternal salvation. If so then we are ,......"Saved".
2 Corinthians 5:10 ESV / 218 helpful votes
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may receive what is due for what he has done in the body, whether good or evil.

I will not do this for you again. I have done it each time you have asked. You have a computer...forget denominations and search/study read the Bible.

I didn’t marry a denomination. You’re the one who misrepresented Baptists, so I corrected you. Now you’re all defensive. I will address your proof texts later as I am currently busy. But in the meantime, I will ask. How did Cornelius receive the Holy Spirit before baptism if baptism washes away sins?

The blood of Jesus washes away sins of those who CALL on Him, not physical water.

 

[peldom10]

I didn’t marry a denomination. You’re the one who misrepresented Baptists, so I corrected you. Now you’re all defensive. I will address your proof texts later as I am currently busy. But in the meantime, I will ask. How did Cornelius receive the Holy Spirit before baptism if baptism washes away sins?

The blood of Jesus washes away sins of those who CALL on Him, not physical water.

You don't want to abide by scriptures but, abide by denomination..... babal...be it baptist Methodist, etc.

The Bible defeated you on that issue now lets try another.

Since you choose following a denomination instead of God's word.................please show us one scripture of any support for a denomination in the Bible?.

 

[OIC1965]

You don't want to abide by scriptures but, abide by denomination..... babal...be it baptist Methodist, etc.

The Bible defeated you on that issue now lets try another.

Since you choose following a denomination instead of God's word.................please show us one scripture of any support for a denomination in the Bible?.

Again, you’re the one who brought up Baptists and completely misrepresented their position on baptism. I merely corrected you on it.

And you didn’t show me any verses that show that baptismal waters wash away sin, which is what we disagreed on. I showed you several passages that show that the blood of Jesus washes away sin.

Even the Acts passage that says “wash away your sins” doesn’t say that baptism washes away sins, seeing that the phrase “ calling upon the name of the Lord” is also present in that verse, and the view that that is what is connected with sin cleansing is more in line with Romans 10:13-14 and the rest of Paul.

In addition, regarding born of water in John 3, Nicodemus would probably have interpreted that from the Old Testament. I suggest reading Ezekiel 36:25-27. In addition, there is also the argument that born of water could represent physical birth, as it is stated in the same breath as “that which is born of flesh is flesh, and that which is born of Spirit is spirit.” Two births in John 3. A physical birth and a spiritual birth.

As to the rest of the verses, the Bible clearly teaches that water baptism corresponds to Spirit Baptism. As John the Baptist said “ I have baptized you with water, one is coming after me who will baptize you in the Holy Spirit.” So we rightly believe that water baptism is an outward sign of an inward reality. Ie- water baptism is representative and aptly symbolizes Spirit Baptism.

 

[OIC1965]

You don't want to abide by scriptures but, abide by denomination..... babal...be it baptist Methodist, etc.

The Bible defeated you on that issue now lets try another.

Since you choose following a denomination instead of God's word.................please show us one scripture of any support for a denomination in the Bible?.

Continuation of post 307

1 Peter 3:21. Doesn’t teach that baptism washes away sin. In fact, it refutes such a notion. Notice, baptism is referred to as “ the answer of a good conscience towards God.” Baptism is an answer of a good conscience, meaning that those who are baptized have been justified.

John 3:5. See John 3:6 and following.

Acts 2:38. The same participle, translated “for” here is used in Matthew 3:11. “ I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance.” Now did John baptize people so that they could repent or did he baptize repentant people? For he said to those coming to his baptism, bring forth fruit meet for repentance. So he was baptizing already repentant people, just as Peter was baptizing already forgiven people (baptized for the remission of sins, baptized into repentance, same participle).

Acts 22:16. Does not say baptism washes away sin. The view that wash away sins is connected to the calling on the name of the Lord is more in line with Romans 10:13-14 and other scriptures.

Romans 6:3. Water baptism represents and typifies another baptism, baptized into union with Christ by the Spirit. (1 Cor. 12:13.) Which happens by faith.

Galatians 3:27. We are baptized by one Spirit into Christ. 1 Cor. 12:13. Water baptism represents and typifies this spiritual union wrought by the Spirit, (not physical water).

Mark 16:16. He that believes and is baptized shall be saved, he that believe that not shall be damned. Baptism is omitted from the second clause, because God will not damn a person who believes but then dies before they can get to baptismal waters. For example, I was saved in the middle of the night. Did I have to wake up a preacher and have him baptize me in the middle of the night in order to have my sins washed away.

Ephesians 4:5 does not say that baptism washes away sins.

In addition, Jesus said whoever confesses me before men, him will I confess before the Father. Confession before Father is speaking of His Priestly Intercession. Are we adding the condition of confession before men as a PREREQUISITE for justification and washing away sins, or is this something that FOLLOWS justification and sin cleansing.

 

[OIC1965]

Continuation of post 307

1 Peter 3:21. Doesn’t teach that baptism washes away sin. In fact, it refutes such a notion. Notice, baptism is referred to as “ the answer of a good conscience towards God.” Baptism is an answer of a good conscience, meaning that those who are baptized have been justified.

John 3:5. See John 3:6 and following.

Acts 2:38. The same participle, translated “for” here is used in Matthew 3:11. “ I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance.” Now did John baptize people so that they could repent or did he baptize repentant people? For he said to those coming to his baptism, bring forth fruit meet for repentance. So he was baptizing already repentant people, just as Peter was baptizing already forgiven people (baptized for the remission of sins, baptized into repentance, same participle).

Acts 22:16. Does not say baptism washes away sin. The view that wash away sins is connected to the calling on the name of the Lord is more in line with Romans 10:13-14 and other scriptures.

Romans 6:3. Water baptism represents and typifies another baptism, baptized into union with Christ by the Spirit. (1 Cor. 12:13.) Which happens by faith.

Galatians 3:27. We are baptized by one Spirit into Christ. 1 Cor. 12:13. Water baptism represents and typifies this spiritual union wrought by the Spirit, (not physical water).

Mark 16:16. He that believes and is baptized shall be saved, he that believe that not shall be damned. Baptism is omitted from the second clause, because God will not damn a person who believes but then dies before they can get to baptismal waters. For example, I was saved in the middle of the night. Did I have to wake up a preacher and have him baptize me in the middle of the night in order to have my sins washed away.

Ephesians 4:5 does not say that baptism washes away sins.

In addition, Jesus said whoever confesses me before men, him will I confess before the Father. Confession before Father is speaking of His Priestly Intercession. Are we adding the condition of confession before men as a PREREQUISITE for justification and washing away sins, or is this something that FOLLOWS justification and sin cleansing.

In my response to Acts 2:38, I meant to say same PREPOSITION, not participle. Eis with the accusative.

 

[TheLearner]

In my response to Acts 2:38, I meant to say same PREPOSITION, not participle. Eis with the accusative.

"in the name of" simply means by whose authority.

 

[Blik]

I see repentance as more of an effect of the Grace of God than a work. I do not categorize repentance as a work, especially not in the sense that Paul and others use the word “works”

In our thought process, we either think of ourselves as belonging to Christ or not belonging to Christ. If we have simply given our will over to Christ.

 

[OIC1965]

"in the name of" simply means by whose authority.

I was referring to the phrase "for (eis with the accusative)the remission of sins"

Acts 2:38. The same preposition, translated “for” here is used in Matthew 3:11.

“I indeed baptize you with water UNTO (eis with accusative) repentance.”

Now did John baptize people so that they could repent or did he baptize repentant people? For he said to those coming to his baptism, bring forth fruit meet for repentance. Therefore, he was baptizing already repentant people. The same preposition in the same case is used in Acts 2:38.

The same preposition in the same case Matthew 12:41-

The men of Nineveh shall rise in judgment with this generation and shall condemn it: because they repented AT (eis with the accusative) the preaching of Jonas; and, behold, a greater than Jonas is here.

Does not mean that their repentance led to Jonah's preaching. It means that Jonah's preaching led to their repentance.

So the preposition eis with the accusative does not always mean something done to accomplish something else. Sometimes it means because of or in reference to.

 

[OIC1965]

In our thought process, we either think of ourselves as belonging to Christ or not belonging to Christ. If we have simply given our will over to Christ.

Who initiated your conversion? You or God?

And thought processes do not save. God saves.

 

[pottersclay]

I

I wonder if there are any Christians who give a rip about the way the Lord looks at our works? According to polls, the Jews are rewarded by their works, although they also, at the same time, earn death through their denial of Christ.

There is a book (I lost it) written by a Jewish lady who converted to Christianity, telling of the difference. The major difference was that as a Jew everything she did related to God from washing hands, eating, to going to bed at night. As a Christian, there was no tie between living her life and worshipping God, it was something she added.

Those Jews who are working to obey the Lord even though they do not obey that they are to accept Christ are, according to polls, reaping great rewards in all ways except eternal life from friends and family, to wealth, to honors they are given. Christians could have these same rewards on top of the major reward of eternal life if we would open our eyes to the advantages of works.

Christians pat themselves on the back for knowing that God looks at faith, not works, when God decides about forgiving us for our sins. No Christian has works as a goal for their life. Eternal life is more important than this life, checking our faith first is most reasonable. However, it is in scripture that we are told there is a reward here on earth for our works. Scripture telling us of the fruits of the spirit is one.

Scripture telling us this is most plainly put in the old testament and it is part of the covenant we call the old covenant. That covenant has been improved by the Lord and some say God took it back, claiming the Lord tells us it is no more. I don’t think that is true at all, God improved it. I think God is eternal and never takes back something he gave us in eternity. Some say God promised salvation through works, but there is no scripture anywhere to back this up but there is scripture saying it is an eternal principle that works never has or will result in salvation as part of the rewards.

Are there any Christians who would consider taking a new way of looking at works?

I like your post here but your thinking of what works are needs a bit of adjustment.
My reply is to you and every christian that believe keeping the appointed times feast, sabbaths, and customs, that the Jewish people practice are works is simply wrong.
Jesus was not opposed to these practices. What he sharply rebuked is the Pharisees teaching that this is the way to eternal life. By not keeping these practices you were breaking the law and in danger of hell fire.
The Pharisees would send spies out to Lord over the people pointing out publicly one who broke the law according to their teaching. This is found throughout all the gospels.
Jesus and the apostles were in their cross hairs sorta speak.

There are many scriptures to make a point here but let me just share one.

Trust in the Lord with all your heart lean not to your own understanding.
Acknowledge him in all your ways, and he shall direct your path.

 

[peldom10]

Continuation of post 307

1 Peter 3:21. Doesn’t teach that baptism washes away sin. In fact, it refutes such a notion. Notice, baptism is referred to as “ the answer of a good conscience towards God.” Baptism is an answer of a good conscience, meaning that those who are baptized have been justified.

John 3:5. See John 3:6 and following.

Acts 2:38. The same participle, translated “for” here is used in Matthew 3:11. “ I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance.” Now did John baptize people so that they could repent or did he baptize repentant people? For he said to those coming to his baptism, bring forth fruit meet for repentance. So he was baptizing already repentant people, just as Peter was baptizing already forgiven people (baptized for the remission of sins, baptized into repentance, same participle).

Acts 22:16. Does not say baptism washes away sin. The view that wash away sins is connected to the calling on the name of the Lord is more in line with Romans 10:13-14 and other scriptures.

Romans 6:3. Water baptism represents and typifies another baptism, baptized into union with Christ by the Spirit. (1 Cor. 12:13.) Which happens by faith.

Galatians 3:27. We are baptized by one Spirit into Christ. 1 Cor. 12:13. Water baptism represents and typifies this spiritual union wrought by the Spirit, (not physical water).

Mark 16:16. He that believes and is baptized shall be saved, he that believe that not shall be damned. Baptism is omitted from the second clause, because God will not damn a person who believes but then dies before they can get to baptismal waters. For example, I was saved in the middle of the night. Did I have to wake up a preacher and have him baptize me in the middle of the night in order to have my sins washed away.

Ephesians 4:5 does not say that baptism washes away sins.

In addition, Jesus said whoever confesses me before men, him will I confess before the Father. Confession before Father is speaking of His Priestly Intercession. Are we adding the condition of confession before men as a PREREQUISITE for justification and washing away sins, or is this something that FOLLOWS justification and sin cleansing.

You are playing games.
God's blessing upon your proper scriptural understanding.
We are done here.

 

[BillG]

You are playing games.
God's blessing upon your proper scriptural understanding.
We are done here.

It's funny how you do this when you have been proven wrong and in error.
You do it every time.

In fact it's not funny but very very sad indeed.

You have no desire to discuss but impose and dare anyone disagree with you then they are of a new age religion and not saved.

You will answer for the judgment you make against others.

You will be judged just as you have judged.

And you call yourself a Christian???????????????

 

[Blik]

Who initiated your conversion? You or God?

And thought processes do not save. God saves.

So God saves, but only saves a vacuum? Who, what, and why does God save? I think you are just arguing for the fun of it.

 

[BillG]

So God saves, but only saves a vacuum? Who, what, and why does God save? I think you are just arguing for the fun of it.

He is not really.
You just don't like the challenges presented to you.

 

[TheLearner]

read to here

 

[peldom10]

So God saves, but only saves a vacuum? Who, what, and why does God save? I think you are just arguing for the fun of it.

Your interloper comments are hardly persuasive.