Your salvation could be at risk

[mcubed]

I was an atheist until I got married and then I began going to a Pentecostal church. After a few years of studying the Bible, I ask the pastor for a private meeting. I opened a paper and quoted the verses that I had written down and said I don't believe tithing is for today's church. He said "Mike you're right but if I don't ask for tithes people won't give enough money". The following Sunday the entire sermon was on tithing and I was so mad that he was lying I never went back. I tried two more churches but they were just as bad. So, for the last 20 years I have not believed in giving a tithe.
Here are a few things you must know to understand the facts.
1. The New Testament doesn't begin in the Gospels until Jesus's death and resurrection.

　

Just so I understand, are you saying the New Testament Gospels are not true except for the death and resurrection, usually around vs 20 or so? Do you give to netflix, cable, your cell phone provider, electric company, gas company, water, sewage?

Why them and not God? How do you think electric, gas gets paid in a church? Would you like to wipe your butt if you pop at church? If you do not want to bring your own toilet paper where do you think the money comes from to buy it? THE TITH!!!! Bring your own tp if you think you might pop and do not want to tith!!!!

 

[miker]

Just so I understand, are you saying the New Testament Gospels are not true except for the death and resurrection, usually around vs 20 or so? Do you give to netflix, cable, your cell phone provider, electric company, gas company, water, sewage?

Why them and not God? How do you think electric, gas gets paid in a church? Would you like to wipe your butt if you pop at church? If you do not want to bring your own toilet paper where do you think the money comes from to buy it? THE TITH!!!! Bring your own tp if you think you might pop and do not want to tith!!!!

You completely misunderstood what I was saying. I said "1. The New Testament doesn't begin in the Gospels until Jesus's death and resurrection."
That doesn't mean that the new Testaments are not true anywhere. In the four Gospels, they all begin under the Old Testament with tithing. After the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ, all four Gospels at that point become the New Testament and not under the Old Testament law of tithing but of the New Testament principle of giving.

 

[Hizikyah]

John/Yahanan 8:31, "...If you continue in My doctrine, then you are truly My disciples."

Luke 6:46, "And why call Me; Ruler! Ruler! and do not the things which I say?"

John/Yahanan 14:15, "If you love Me, keep My commandments."

Mat 28:20, “Teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you. And lo, I am with you always, to the end of the age."

Mat 24:35, “Heaven and earth may pass away, but My teachings will not pass away.”

John/Yahanan 14:26, "But the Comforter; the Holy Spirit which YHWH will send in My Name will teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatever I (Yahshua/Jesus) have said to you."

John/Yahanan 6:63, "It is the Spirit that gives life; the flesh is useless. The words (Instructions) that I (Yahshua/Jesus) speak to you, they are Spirit, and they are life everlasting."

John/Yahanan 6:27, John 6:27, “Do not labor for the food that is perishing, but for the food that is remaining to everlasting life, which the Son of Aḏam shall give you, for the Father, Yah, has set His seal on Him.”

John/Yahanan 14:26, "But the Advocate, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you."

Mat 7:21-27, “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Master, Master,’ shall enter into the Kingdom of the heavens, but he who is doing the desire of My Father in the heavens. Many shall say to Me in that day, ‘Master, Master, have we not prophesied in Your Name, and cast out demons in Your Name, and done many mighty works in Your Name?’ And then I shall declare to them, ‘I never knew you, depart from Me, you who work lawlessness!’” Therefore everyone who hears these words of Mine, and does them, shall be like a wise man who built his house on the rock, and the rain came down, and the floods came, and the winds blew and beat on that house, and it did not fall, for it was founded on the rock. And everyone who hears these words of Mine, and does not do them, shall be like a foolish man who built his house on the sand, and the rain came down, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and they beat on that house, and it fell, and great was its fall.”

John/Yahanan 15:5-16, "I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, produces much fruit; but without Me, you can do nothing. If anyone does not abide in Me, he is thrown away like a branch, and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned. If you abide in Me, and letting My words; abide in you, you will ask what you will, and it will be done for you. In this is My Father glorified: when you produce much fruit; and in this way you become My disciples. Just as the Father has loved Me, so have I loved you; continue in My love. If you keep My Commands, you will abide in My love; just as I have kept My Father's Commands, and abide in His love. These things I have spoken to you, that My joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be complete. This is My Command: Love one another as I have loved you. Greater love has no one than this: that one would lay down his life on behalf of his brothers. You are My brothers, ifyou do whatever I command you."

 

[Dino246]

Just so I understand, are you saying the New Testament Gospels are not true except for the death and resurrection, usually around vs 20 or so? Do you give to netflix, cable, your cell phone provider, electric company, gas company, water, sewage?

Why them and not God? How do you think electric, gas gets paid in a church? Would you like to wipe your butt if you pop at church? If you do not want to bring your own toilet paper where do you think the money comes from to buy it? THE TITH!!!! Bring your own tp if you think you might pop and do not want to tith!!!!

Two things: the new covenant is in Christ's blood, so in a sense it is legitimate to say that the New Testament (another word for covenant) doesn't begin until Jesus' death.

Also, you are confusing "tithing" with "giving". They aren't the same thing. Read my post on page one for more info.

 

[JesusLives]

I was an atheist until I got married and then I began going to a Pentecostal church. After a few years of studying the Bible, I ask the pastor for a private meeting. I opened a paper and quoted the verses that I had written down and said I don't believe tithing is for today's church. He said "Mike you're right but if I don't ask for tithes people won't give enough money". The following Sunday the entire sermon was on tithing and I was so mad that he was lying I never went back. I tried two more churches but they were just as bad. So, for the last 20 years I have not believed in giving a tithe.
Here are a few things you must know to understand the facts.
1. The New Testament doesn't begin in the Gospels until Jesus's death and resurrection.
2. We are not under the law - Romans 10 : 4.
3. Tithing is one of 613 laws in the Old Testament and they weren’t righteous if they skipped just one of them, and then they had to offer a blood sacrifice.
4.Tithing and giving are two different things. If you give 10% because the pastor is teaching on
tithing out of the old testament-that IS tithing. If you give freely as your heart desires- that is New Testament giving and they are 2 completely different things.
5. The Temple (where Jews payed their tithes) was destroyed in 70 A.D.so they can’t tithe according to the original law.
6. Romans 6v.14
Sin will have no power over you, because you aren't under Law but under grace.
I recently accidentally found a video by Sharon Johnson on tithing on YouTube. Her website is www .motivatingu2win.com The one I watched was "tithing part 1." Although I knew that tithing wasn't scriptural, I didn't know that it COULD be a matter of salvation until I watched her video.
Common English Bible
In it was some of the following verses:
Galations Ch 2 v. 16 However, we know that a person isn't made righteous by the works of the Law but rather through the faithfulness of Jesus Christ. We ourselves believed in Christ Jesus so that we could be made righteous by the faithfulness of Christ and not by the works of the Law—because no one will be made righteous by the works of the Law.
　
　
Galatians Ch.2 v. 21. I don't ignore the grace of God, because if we become righteous through the Law, then Christ died for no purpose.
Galatians Ch3,v.1-5 you irrational Galatians! Who put a spell on you? Jesus Christ was put on display as crucified before your eyes!
2
I just want to know this from you: Did you receive the Spirit by doing the works of the Law or by believing what you heard?
3
Are you so irrational? After you started with the Spirit, are you now finishing up with your own human effort?
4
Did you experience so much for nothing? I wonder if it really was for nothing.
5
So does the one providing you with the Spirit and working miracles among you do this by you doing the works of the Law or by you believing what you heard?
Galations ch.3 v.10 All those who rely on the works of the Law are under a curse, because it is written, Everyone is cursed who does not keep on doing all the things that have been written in the Law scroll.javascript:void(0);
Galations Ch.5 v.4 You people who are trying to be made righteous by the Law have been estranged from Christ. You have fallen away from grace!
　
　
　

From Hebrews 7:
1This Melchizedek was king of Salem and priest of God Most High. He met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings and blessed him, 2and Abraham apportioned to him a tenth of everything. First, his name means “king of righteousness.” Then also, “king of Salem” means “king of peace.” 3Without father or mother or genealogy, without beginning of days or end of life, like the Son of God, he remains a priest for all time.…

This was before Mosaic laws given....Why would Abraham give Melchizedek a tenth of everything?

 

[ColoradoGal]

Salvation is not dependent on works, but on faith.

Now if you were Catholic or Eastern Orthodox, that would be another matter.

I recently rejected Roman Catholicism because I realized that I am not able to be sinless by their definition, that am I an inherently imperfect and broken person and can only do so much. In other words, I found myself in the same dilemma suffered by Martin Luther.

Catholic teaching is that even if you die with one unconfessed, unrepented "mortal sin," you will spend eternity in hell.

That is absolutely ridiculous. That would mean that nearly everyone on earth would be damned as we fallible creatures lack the ability to be sinless.

 

[miker]

I'm really curious about this:
If you would do me a favor and respond to this and answer 2 questions I think a lot of people would be interested also.
Tithing and giving are two different things, I'm not talking about about giving, this is just about tithing.
1. Do you tithe to a church?
2. What percentage of churchgoers do you think tithe today?
Thank you for your time and response to this.

 

[Endoscopy]

Many churches teach that Christians, under the New Covenant, are commanded to give a minimum of 10% of our income to our church. Others teach that preachers of these churches are turning the 10% tithe from the Old Testament for Israel into a monetary, legalistic prescription for Christians under the New Covenant. I even once heard a Pastor make a challenge to his congregation to give 10% of their income for 90 days and if God does not bless them then he will give them their money back.

In 2 Corinthians 9:5-7 we read: Therefore I thought it necessary to exhort the brethren to go to you ahead of time, and prepare your generous gift beforehand, which you had previously promised, that it may be ready as a matter of generosity and not as a grudging obligation. But this I say: He who sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and he who sows bountifully will also reap bountifully. So let each one give as he purposes in his heart, not grudgingly or of necessity; for God loves a cheerful giver.

I don't see a "specific percentage" given anywhere for Christians to give "under the New Covenant," but I certainly believe in giving and not just to our church. I also believe that everything we own belongs to God and we cannot out give God.

Where does it say that the Old Testament laws were done away with. On the contrary Jesus stated not one jot or tittle would be done away since he came not to break but to fulfill the LAW and the prophets. What was stated is the law let's us know what is sin and Christ's blood removes the penalty of the sin.

 

[Endoscopy]

Salvation is not dependent on works, but on faith.

Now if you were Catholic or Eastern Orthodox, that would be another matter.

I recently rejected Roman Catholicism because I realized that I am not able to be sinless by their definition, that am I an inherently imperfect and broken person and can only do so much. In other words, I found myself in the same dilemma suffered by Martin Luther.

Catholic teaching is that even if you die with one unconfessed, unrepented "mortal sin," you will spend eternity in hell.

That is absolutely ridiculous. That would mean that nearly everyone on earth would be damned as we fallible creatures lack the ability to be sinless.

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but there are protestant denominations that adhere to this view of that Catholicism holds about sin. I have a friend that goes to one of those churches. They have great concern for those who have been killed in an accident without having a chance to repent of their recent sin, two competing issues between many denominations.
1. Once saved always saved.
2. You can lose your salvation.
Each stance has verses to back it up. To get to the truth all verses on this subject must be looked at in context with both all of the verses and the section of the scripture where the verses are.

 

[PennEd]

Where does it say that the Old Testament laws were done away with. On the contrary Jesus stated not one jot or tittle would be done away since he came not to break but to fulfill the LAW and the prophets. What was stated is the law let's us know what is sin and Christ's blood removes the penalty of the sin.

It hasn't been done away with. It has been fulfilled by Jesus Christ. And by becoming born again to abide in Him it has been fulfilled by us as well.

For those that reject Jesus, either outright, or by attempting to attain salvation through their OWN works (ie.keeping the Law), not one jot or tittle will be done away with on their debt account.

 

[Endoscopy]

Salvation is not dependent on works, but on faith.

Now if you were Catholic or Eastern Orthodox, that would be another matter.

I recently rejected Roman Catholicism because I realized that I am not able to be sinless by their definition, that am I an inherently imperfect and broken person and can only do so much. In other words, I found myself in the same dilemma suffered by Martin Luther.

Catholic teaching is that even if you die with one unconfessed, unrepented "mortal sin," you will spend eternity in hell.

That is absolutely ridiculous. That would mean that nearly everyone on earth would be damned as we fallible creatures lack the ability to be sinless.

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but there are protestant denominations that adhere to this view of that Catholicism holds about sin. I have a friend that goes to one of those churches. They have great concern for those who have been killed in an accident without having a chance to repent of their recent sin, two competing issues between many denominations.
1. Once saved always saved.
2. You can lose your salvation.
Each stance has verses to back it up. To get to the truth all verses on this subject must be looked at in context with both all of the verses and the section of the scripture where the verses are.

Without Christ's blood the penalty for sin remains. Atheists will learn this at judgment.