Zionism?

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Kojikun

Well-known member
Oct 5, 2018
4,250
2,566
113
#1
So a friend of mine posted a Jewish group that is against Zionism. It argued that the Palestinian displacement is still felt today. I did a little bit of research on the term but I'm still a touch confused. I'm assuming theres far more this and it's a difficult situation, what should our view as Christian's be on Zionism? Is it good or bad or complicated?
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
6,249
5,248
113
#2
For me, Zion represents that future place from which Christ will rule and reign. We have always sang of "marching onward to Zion, that beautiful City of God." I consider my citizenship to be of Zion even now.

But you speak of Zionism. Someone please tell me what the "ism" ism.:unsure:
 

Gideon300

Well-known member
Mar 18, 2021
1,087
731
113
#3
So a friend of mine posted a Jewish group that is against Zionism. It argued that the Palestinian displacement is still felt today. I did a little bit of research on the term but I'm still a touch confused. I'm assuming theres far more this and it's a difficult situation, what should our view as Christian's be on Zionism? Is it good or bad or complicated?
Zionism led to the creation of the state of Israel. It is in many ways against Christianity, but God used it to bring Israel back to life, so to speak.

The real reasons for the present conflict are many. For a start, the nation of Israel is much smaller than it was intended to be originally. This is due to the evil machinations of the British during WW1. The borders were revised to make dirty deals with Arab nations that helped the UK war effort, especially to secure oil supplies.

It's noteworthy that the British are no longer "Great" and they no longer have an empire. God is not mocked. I am English, and not biased against the land of my birth. I'm saddened about the state of the nation that gave birth to the Wesley brothers, Spurgeon , Bunyan and Hudson Taylor.

Arabs were not evicted from Israel. There are no Palestinians. It's a name concocted to provide a false excuse for conflict. It was obvious that Israel would be attacked as soon as it declared independence. Arabs settled in the area that became Israel were encouraged to leave by the attacking nations (Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon, Iraq and a small contingent from Saudi Arabia.). Those nations were supremely confident that Israel would be destroyed and the previous settlers able to return. God had other ideas and Israel did the impossible. For obvious reasons, the people who left were not allowed to return. This permitted Israel to become a democracy.

For a Christian perspective on the Arab-Israel war, look up Derek Prince. He was living in Jerusalem when statehood was declared. His home was used as a command post by the Israeli army. I don't recall the book title, but it's fascinating reading.
 

Kojikun

Well-known member
Oct 5, 2018
4,250
2,566
113
#4
Zionism led to the creation of the state of Israel. It is in many ways against Christianity, but God used it to bring Israel back to life, so to speak.

The real reasons for the present conflict are many. For a start, the nation of Israel is much smaller than it was intended to be originally. This is due to the evil machinations of the British during WW1. The borders were revised to make dirty deals with Arab nations that helped the UK war effort, especially to secure oil supplies.

It's noteworthy that the British are no longer "Great" and they no longer have an empire. God is not mocked. I am English, and not biased against the land of my birth. I'm saddened about the state of the nation that gave birth to the Wesley brothers, Spurgeon , Bunyan and Hudson Taylor.

Arabs were not evicted from Israel. There are no Palestinians. It's a name concocted to provide a false excuse for conflict. It was obvious that Israel would be attacked as soon as it declared independence. Arabs settled in the area that became Israel were encouraged to leave by the attacking nations (Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon, Iraq and a small contingent from Saudi Arabia.). Those nations were supremely confident that Israel would be destroyed and the previous settlers able to return. God had other ideas and Israel did the impossible. For obvious reasons, the people who left were not allowed to return. This permitted Israel to become a democracy.

For a Christian perspective on the Arab-Israel war, look up Derek Prince. He was living in Jerusalem when statehood was declared. His home was used as a command post by the Israeli army. I don't recall the book title, but it's fascinating reading.
Thanks for the info 😁
 

Kojikun

Well-known member
Oct 5, 2018
4,250
2,566
113
#5
For me, Zion represents that future place from which Christ will rule and reign. We have always sang of "marching onward to Zion, that beautiful City of God." I consider my citizenship to be of Zion even now.

But you speak of Zionism. Someone please tell me what the "ism" ism.:unsure:
It seems to be ideological more than anything. I still need some more info
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
6,249
5,248
113
#7
So 'Zionism' could described as a political movement whose agenda is to enlarge the Physical/Geographical size of Israeli Land? More political than religious then?
 

Kojikun

Well-known member
Oct 5, 2018
4,250
2,566
113
#9
So 'Zionism' could described as a political movement whose agenda is to enlarge the Physical/Geographical size of Israeli Land? More political than religious then?
From what I heard there are religious groups in it but I dont think they all are.
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
6,249
5,248
113
#10
Does anyone out there own a Webster's Dictionary?:confused: It says modern Zionism is simply the support of Israel.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,708
2,495
113
#12
For me, Zion represents that future place from which Christ will rule and reign. We have always sang of "marching onward to Zion, that beautiful City of God." I consider my citizenship to be of Zion even now.

But you speak of Zionism. Someone please tell me what the "ism" ism.:unsure:
Wikipedia: Zionism (Hebrew: צִיּוֹנוּת‎ Tsiyyonut [tsijoˈnut] after Zion) is both an ideology[1][2][3] and nationalist[fn 1] movement among the Jewish people that espouses the re-establishment of and support for[6] a Jewish state centered in the area roughly corresponding to Canaan, the Holy Land, or the region of Palestine.[7][8][9][10][11] Modern Zionism emerged in the late 19th century in Central and Eastern Europe as a national revival movement, both in reaction to newer waves of antisemitism and as a response to Haskalah, or Jewish Enlightenment.[12][13][14] Soon after this, most leaders of the movement associated the main goal with creating the desired state in Palestine, then an area controlled by the Ottoman Empire.[15][16][17]

Front page of The Jewish Chronicle, 17 January 1896, showing an article by Theodor Herzl (the father of political Zionism) a month prior to the publication of his pamphlet Der Judenstaat

Theodor Herzl was the founder of the Modern Zionist movement. In his 1896 pamphlet Der Judenstaat, he envisioned the founding of a future independent Jewish state during the 20th century.
Zionism posited a negation of Jewish life in the diaspora and, until 1948 perceived its primary goal as an ideal ingathering of exiles (kibbutz galuyot) in the ancient heartland of the Jewish people,[18] and, through the establishment of a state, the liberation of Jews from the persecutions, humiliations, discrimination and antisemitism they had been subject to. Since the establishment of the State of Israel in 1948, Zionism has continued primarily to advocate on behalf of Israel and to address threats to its continued existence and security.[citation needed]
A religious variety of Zionism supports Jews upholding their Jewish identity defined as adherence to religious Judaism, opposes the assimilation of Jews into other societies, and has advocated the return of Jews to Israel as a means for Jews to be a majority nation in their own state.[8] A variety of Zionism, called cultural Zionism, founded and represented most prominently by Ahad Ha'am, fostered a secular vision of a Jewish "spiritual center" in Israel. Unlike Herzl, the founder of political Zionism, Ahad Ha'am strived for Israel to be "a Jewish state and not merely a state of Jews".[19]
Advocates of Zionism view it as a national liberation movement for the repatriation of a persecuted people residing as minorities in a variety of nations to their ancestral homeland.[20][21][22] Critics of Zionism view it as a colonialist,[23] racist[24] and exceptionalist[25] ideology that led advocates to violence during Mandatory Palestine, followed by the exodus of Palestinians, and the subsequent denial of their right to return to lands and property lost during the 1948 and 1967 wars.[26][27][28][29]
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
6,249
5,248
113
#13
Wikipedia: Zionism (Hebrew: צִיּוֹנוּת‎ Tsiyyonut [tsijoˈnut] after Zion) is both an ideology[1][2][3] and nationalist[fn 1] movement among the Jewish people that espouses the re-establishment of and support for[6] a Jewish state centered in the area roughly corresponding to Canaan, the Holy Land, or the region of Palestine.[7][8][9][10][11] Modern Zionism emerged in the late 19th century in Central and Eastern Europe as a national revival movement, both in reaction to newer waves of antisemitism and as a response to Haskalah, or Jewish Enlightenment.[12][13][14] Soon after this, most leaders of the movement associated the main goal with creating the desired state in Palestine, then an area controlled by the Ottoman Empire.[15][16][17]

Front page of The Jewish Chronicle, 17 January 1896, showing an article by Theodor Herzl (the father of political Zionism) a month prior to the publication of his pamphlet Der Judenstaat

Theodor Herzl was the founder of the Modern Zionist movement. In his 1896 pamphlet Der Judenstaat, he envisioned the founding of a future independent Jewish state during the 20th century.
Zionism posited a negation of Jewish life in the diaspora and, until 1948 perceived its primary goal as an ideal ingathering of exiles (kibbutz galuyot) in the ancient heartland of the Jewish people,[18] and, through the establishment of a state, the liberation of Jews from the persecutions, humiliations, discrimination and antisemitism they had been subject to. Since the establishment of the State of Israel in 1948, Zionism has continued primarily to advocate on behalf of Israel and to address threats to its continued existence and security.[citation needed]
A religious variety of Zionism supports Jews upholding their Jewish identity defined as adherence to religious Judaism, opposes the assimilation of Jews into other societies, and has advocated the return of Jews to Israel as a means for Jews to be a majority nation in their own state.[8] A variety of Zionism, called cultural Zionism, founded and represented most prominently by Ahad Ha'am, fostered a secular vision of a Jewish "spiritual center" in Israel. Unlike Herzl, the founder of political Zionism, Ahad Ha'am strived for Israel to be "a Jewish state and not merely a state of Jews".[19]
Advocates of Zionism view it as a national liberation movement for the repatriation of a persecuted people residing as minorities in a variety of nations to their ancestral homeland.[20][21][22] Critics of Zionism view it as a colonialist,[23] racist[24] and exceptionalist[25] ideology that led advocates to violence during Mandatory Palestine, followed by the exodus of Palestinians, and the subsequent denial of their right to return to lands and property lost during the 1948 and 1967 wars.[26][27][28][29]
Sooooooooooo... Zionism is the support of Israel.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
15,366
7,549
113
#14
...what should our view as Christian's be on Zionism? Is it good or bad or complicated?
Zionism is purely secular and was meant to give persecuted Jews in Europe and Russia a homeland in Palestine (since that is promised in Scripture). The British and the American government at the time made this possible by 1948. But there was conflict with the Arabs, who were occupying Palestine at that time. There were atrocities on both sides, and that conflict has never disappeared.

But instead of trying to arrive at a peaceful solution, the political leaders in Palestine have opted for warfare each and every time, and kept the pot boiling with the help of Iran. Politically, Christians should stand with Israel, since the Muslim world is against both Jews and Christians. At the same time, it should be noted that a large majority of Jews in Israel are not from the twelve tribes, but Khazarian (from Central Asia).
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
8,626
2,604
113
#16
For me, Zion represents that future place from which Christ will rule and reign. We have always sang of "marching onward to Zion, that beautiful City of God." I consider my citizenship to be of Zion even now.

But you speak of Zionism. Someone please tell me what the "ism" ism.:unsure:
they are promoting Jews that is the PC woke term. just those who coined a term to hate Jews. Zionist, Zionism, etc...
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
8,626
2,604
113
#18
Is this fact or opinion?
If you like Baseball brother you are gamist they have to give you a title to draw attention to your position so they can hate you. Like all those phobias they created and say we have when you disagree with snowflakes.
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
18,986
5,006
113
#19
So a friend of mine posted a Jewish group that is against Zionism. It argued that the Palestinian displacement is still felt today. I did a little bit of research on the term but I'm still a touch confused. I'm assuming theres far more this and it's a difficult situation, what should our view as Christian's be on Zionism? Is it good or bad or complicated?
It is spiritual and not according to this age.