Beware of the latest, greatest dangerous drugs in your neighborhood

[Viligant_Warrior]

This isn't really a single news story, but a warning for board members here. As a result of my being a licensed drug/alcohol counselor and treatment provider in Missouri and Kansas, I've gotten a couple notices from the Kansas City (Mo.) Police Department and from the Kansas Bureau of Investigation regarding some dangerous new designer drugs out there on the streets. I don't really expect any of you to come in contact with them, but you might want to warn your kids and grandkids to beware of them. Then again, in some cases, perhaps it is you, the reader, who ought to be aware of them.

On is a marijuana extract that goes by several names: Shatter, Dabs, Buds, to name a few. It is cooked down from marijuana extracts and comes out of the oven looking like a thin sheet of toffee. The only info readily available on it online comes from the idiots making and/or promoting this stuff, such as this:

Dabs: The World’s Most Powerful and Sought After Weed Product

Most commonly created by a technique in which high quality pot is blasted with butane that is then extracted, these cannabis concentrates approach 70%-to-90% THC.

These fools haven't a clue what they've created -- or more frighteningly, they most assured do know, and don't care. The "weed" of the 70s was benign compared to today's readily available marijuana. Then, THC levels were about 8% -- today they approach 40%. 70-90% THC concentrate in this new drug puts marijuana on the psychedelic level of LSD. No one can be sure of what they will do, what risks they might take, or what kind of a "bad trip" they may go on using this stuff.

Another is Fentanyl. It is a legal medical anesthetic that is being reproduced in basements, garages, and worse -- in Mexican labs just across the border and smuggled into the U.S. It is fifty times more powerful than heroin, and in some cases is being used to "cut" heroin. University of North Carolina drug research John Stogner wrotes of the drug in a recent edition of the international medical journal Annals of Emergency Medicine.

The Potential Threat of Acetyl Fentanyl: Legal Issues, Contaminated Heroin, and Acetyl Fentanyl “Disguised” as Other Opioidsl

"Most frightening about this emerging street drug is not only the potency level, but that users themselves may not be aware that they are ingesting it ... Drug users who overdose on the spiked heroin or pure acetyl fentanyl marketed as heroin appear as if they have overdosed on heroin they look lethargic and disoriented, and have shallow breathing, a slow heart rate and low blood pressure, he said. But if an overdose victim doesn't respond to the standard treatment for opioid overdose, which is a medicine called naloxone, doctors should consider that acetyl fentanyl might be the culprit."

Finally, there is a new designer drug -- a "bath salt" -- called Flakka. This stuff is just plain, outright deadly:

Meet Flakka, The Dangerous New Drug Sweeping the Nation

Its effects can be as potent as crystal meth, bath salts or cocaine. It causes people to act erratically, uncontrollably and dangerously. It’s called flakka, and it’s the new designer drug hitting the streets.

Jim Hall, an epidemiologist at the Center for Applied Research on Substance Use and Health Disparities at Nova Southeastern University, told CBS News: “This is where the body goes into hyperthermia, generally a temperature of 105 degrees. The individual becomes psychotic, they often rip off their clothes and run out into the street violently and have an adrenaline-like strength and police are called and it takes four or five officers to restrain them. Then once they are restrained, if they don’t receive immediate medical attention they can die.”

It isn't enough we've got ISIS, al-Qaeda, Boko Haram, etc. in the world wanting to kill Christians in particular and Americans in general. We've always had people amongst us gladly to provide the same services, and make money off their victims at the same time.

Forewarned is forearmed.

 

[GodIsSalvation]

I try to stay away from these scenes, but now and then you hear of them. Not to downplay bath salts, for they are indeed a big problem, but for my area and age group it seems to me heroin is the most major problem. Just recently even a guy I went to highschool with died from heroin. I didn't know him that well, just a little bit from highschool days, but from what I do know he was a nice guy, never did me no wrong. Very sad news, and kind of a shock for the whole local community.

 

[dcontroversal]

Crazy for sure.....wasn't it bath salts that the one dude had injested that got shot by a cop because he had attacked a man and was eating his face off...literally....

 

[DesiredHaven]

Crazy for sure.....wasn't it bath salts that the one dude had injested that got shot by a cop because he had attacked a man and was eating his face off...literally....

Thats is what I keep hearing again and again and seeing on videos is people start eating other peoples faces off... and eating their children... oh my goodness who created this stuff?

What has this world become, I am really troubled by this bath salts thing, nothing has gotten to me more when it shows their behavior, to me thats its some highly demonically inspired stuff.

 

[dcontroversal]

Thats is what I keep hearing again and again and seeing on videos is people start eating other peoples faces off... and eating their children... oh my goodness who created this stuff?

What has this world become, I am really troubled by this bath salts thing, nothing has gotten to me more when it shows their behavior, to me thats its some highly demonically inspired stuff.

I agree for sure.....people are full out whack jobs on the stuff.....I mean what could possibly provoke a human being to attack and eat the face off of another human being......Devilish for sure!

 

[Bushido8000]

While most anti-marijuana propaganda is laughable at best, dabs are a terrible idea and you really need to let your kids know about it. It's actually a good thing that THC levels have risen to 40%, as this lets the user smoke less carbon monoxide (the only real physically harmful part of marijuana) and instead of smoking a full joint, they only need to take a couple of draws. While it is INCREDIBLY unlikely that dabs could kill you, there is a possibility of ingesting harmful chemicals (who puts butane in their body?) and you could become sick and/or pass out.

 

[jahsoul]

While most anti-marijuana propaganda is laughable at best, dabs are a terrible idea and you really need to let your kids know about it. It's actually a good thing that THC levels have risen to 40%, as this lets the user smoke less carbon monoxide (the only real physically harmful part of marijuana) and instead of smoking a full joint, they only need to take a couple of draws. While it is INCREDIBLY unlikely that dabs could kill you, there is a possibility of ingesting harmful chemicals (who puts butane in their body?) and you could become sick and/or pass out.

You read my mind. I don't have any issue with marijuana (crap, look at the medicine that doctors prescribe that people gladly take) but I can't sign on with dabs. It's really nothing but THC concentrate and from the videos that I've seen, that first hit is NO JOKE. Like Bushido8000, since marijuana has a recorded death count of zero, I doubt dabs will kill anyone but I believe that it would put you to sleep....quick.

 

[Viligant_Warrior]

WIt's actually a good thing that THC levels have risen to 40%, as this lets the user smoke less carbon monoxide ...

B/S.

University of Washington, Learn about Marijuana: Science based information for the public

Marijuana smoke smoke contains a similar range of harmful chemicals to that of tobacco smoke (including bronchial irritants, tumor promoters and carcinogens) (Hoffmann et al, 1975). As inhaled smoke comes into contact with airway and lung before being absorbed into the bloodstream, it is likely to affect the respiratory system (Novotny et al, 1982).

Risk of respiratory effects from inhaling marijuana smoke are heightened by the more intensive way in which marijuana is smoked -- when smoking marijuana compared to tobacco, there is a prolonged and deeper inhalation and it is smoked to a shorter butt length and at a higher combustion temperature. This results in approximately 5 times the carbon monoxide concentration, 3 times the tar, and the retention of one-third more tar in the respiratory tract. Higher levels of ammonia and hydrogen cyanide have also been found in marijuana smoke, compared to tobacco (Moir, et al., 2008; Wu et al., 1988; Tashkin et al., 1991; Benson & Bentley, 1995).

... (the only real physically harmful part of marijuana) ...

Again, B/S.

The association between smoking marijuana and lung cancer remains unclear.

Marijuana smoke contains about 50% more benzopyrene and nearly 75% more benzanthracene, both known carcinogens, than a comparable quantity of unfiltered tobacco smoke (Tashkin, 2013). Moreover, the deeper inhalations and longer breath-holding of marijuana smokers result in greater exposure of the lung to the tar and carcinogens in the smoke. Lung biopsies from habitual marijuana-only users have revealed widespread alterations to the tissue, some of which are recognized as precursors to the subsequent development of cancer (Tashkin, 2013).

Two other conditions of concern, bullous lung disease (abnormal airspaces in the lungs caused by damage to the lung walls) and pneumothorax (“collapsed lung”), have not been definitively linked to marijuana smoke either (Tam et al, 2006). Several studies have found evidence of a possible association (Beshay et al, 2007; Hii et al, 2008; Reece, 2008), however, many of these studies featured 10 or fewer study subjects, some of whom also smoked tobacco. The research remains unclear.

Even though the studies remain unclear, the fact that so many subjects even in a small group developed health issues makes it imperative further, lengthier, and more in-depth studies be done. No one can pronounce marijuana safe. That's the height of willful deception.

... and instead of smoking a full joint, they only need to take a couple of draws.

Which would be a limitedly good thing if tghe average smoker actually only took two tokes a day. However, most smoke an average of two to five joints a week.

While it is INCREDIBLY unlikely that dabs could kill you, there is a possibility of ingesting harmful chemicals (who puts butane in their body?) and you could become sick and/or pass out.

Agreed. Dabs/shutter, etc. also, as stated in my OP, places the marijuana extract on an even keel with LSD as a dangerous hallucinogenic.

 

[RachelBibleStudent]

since no one has said it yet...it is worth pointing out that 'dabs' is just a more concentrated form of the exact same substance that is the active ingredient in marijuana... and also the 'spice' drug that has produced the widely reported cases of cannibalistic behaviors...'spice' being frequently confused with another drug called 'bath salts'...this drug is an artificial form of THC that just happens to be more potent...

due to the bizarre behaviors involved christians have been quick to label 'spice' as demonic...yet what many people fail to realize is that marijuana is really just 'spice light' or 'dabs light'...they are either exactly the same chemical or a close molecular analog as the THC in marijuana...just with more obvious effects...

 

[Bushido8000]

B/S.

Oh, my bad, I guess you're right again

Again, B/S.

and again

Agreed. Dabs/shutter, etc. also, as stated in my OP, places the marijuana extract on an even keel with LSD as a dangerous hallucinogenic.

Even keel with LSD?! Do you know what happens to someone if they even touch/take just slightly more MICROGRAMS of LSD than what they are supposed to? They can have incredible amounts of brain damage and psychological problems for the rest of their lives.

One of the reasons why kids try drugs is because they are lied to about them. When you say things like marijuana can make you crazy and dabs are even in the same ballpark as LSD, teens will find out that those are media scares/gov propaganda and will try drugs just out of spite, whether or not the drugs truly are harmful or not.

Tell kids the truth about drugs and I believe you'll have kids not taking as many cocky risks to look for the truth themselves.

 

[Bushido8000]

The association between smoking marijuana and lung cancer remains unclear.

Marijuana smoke contains about 50% more benzopyrene and nearly 75% more benzanthracene, both known carcinogens, than a comparable quantity of unfiltered tobacco smoke (Tashkin, 2013). Moreover, the deeper inhalations and longer breath-holding of marijuana smokers result in greater exposure of the lung to the tar and carcinogens in the smoke. Lung biopsies from habitual marijuana-only users have revealed widespread alterations to the tissue, some of which are recognized as precursors to the subsequent development of cancer (Tashkin, 2013).

Two other conditions of concern, bullous lung disease (abnormal airspaces in the lungs caused by damage to the lung walls) and pneumothorax (“collapsed lung”), have not been definitively linked to marijuana smoke either (Tam et al, 2006). Several studies have found evidence of a possible association (Beshay et al, 2007; Hii et al, 2008; Reece, 2008), however, many of these studies featured 10 or fewer study subjects, some of whom also smoked tobacco. The research remains unclear.

Even though the studies remain unclear, the fact that so many subjects even in a small group developed health issues makes it imperative further, lengthier, and more in-depth studies be done. No one can pronounce marijuana safe. That's the height of willful deception.

So you would be in agreement then that someone who vaporized or ingested marijuana would probably be physically safe from any carcinogens? Also, bigger picture, people don't smoke as near as much marijuana per week as tobacco, which contains literally hundreds of carcinogens and tons of tar as well. Id be incredibly interested to see the number of cancer cases in states that have legalized in 20 years as opposed to states that haven't. I would bet there would be no difference.

Also, do you really have to debate every one of my posts? I was in agreement with you that dabs were a bad idea. Why are you such a disagreeable person?

 

[Viligant_Warrior]

Even keel with LSD?! Do you know what happens to someone if they even touch/take just slightly more MICROGRAMS of LSD than what they are supposed to? They can have incredible amounts of brain damage and psychological problems for the rest of their lives.

Allow me to introduce myself: V_W, licensed drug and alcohol addictions treatment provider in Missouri and Kansas. Yes, I do know what happens if an overdose of LSD is taken. I also know from the preliminary study of dabs, shatter, whatever it is called in the various parts of the country, it has thoseexact same effects in concentrated doses.

One of the reasons why kids try drugs is because they are lied to about them.

B/S. The main reason kids try drugs is peer pressure. The second most common reason is peer pressure.

When you say things like marijuana can make you crazy and dabs are even in the same ballpark as LSD, teens will find out that those are media scares/gov propaganda and will try drugs just out of spite, whether or not the drugs truly are harmful or not.

One, few people other than the elderly who grew up when "Reefer Madness" was the only information they had on pot, say that marijuana will "make you mad." Two, it is misinformation like you disseminate regarding how "safe" (not) marijuana is that causes them to take stupid risks.

Tell kids the truth about drugs and I believe you'll have kids not taking as many cocky risks to look for the truth themselves.

The truth is, drugs used recreationally all, universally, have negative medical and psychological impacts. Anyone telling them that isn't true is the bearer of lies.

Bush, the evidence is overwhelming in proving the health and safety hazards of using all drugs, and that includes marijuana. You and those others who promote it willfully blind yourselves to the facts, claiming they are biased, slanted, or just outright lies, and you have absolutely nothing to base those claims on.

Marijuana should probably be temporarily reclassified as a Schedule II drug so the potential legitimate medicinal uses can be subjected to empirical testing, but smoking it is never going to be a legitimate delivery system, given the known risk of exposure to multiple carcinogenic substances in the smoke that are known to be present at higher levels than tobacco smoke, which we know to be deadly.

 

[jahsoul]

So you would be in agreement then that someone who vaporized or ingested marijuana would probably be physically safe from any carcinogens? Also, bigger picture, people don't smoke as near as much marijuana per week as tobacco, which contains literally hundreds of carcinogens and tons of tar as well. Id be incredibly interested to see the number of cancer cases in states that have legalized in 20 years as opposed to states that haven't. I would bet there would be no difference.

Exactly....the only arguments that could be brought up against marijuana (even though, again, it has a death rate of zero) was the effects of combustion. But what can be said about it in edible, liquid, or vaporized form?

 

[jahsoul]

since no one has said it yet...it is worth pointing out that 'dabs' is just a more concentrated form of the exact same substance that is the active ingredient in marijuana... and also the 'spice' drug that has produced the widely reported cases of cannibalistic behaviors...'spice' being frequently confused with another drug called 'bath salts'...this drug is an artificial form of THC that just happens to be more potent...

due to the bizarre behaviors involved christians have been quick to label 'spice' as demonic...yet what many people fail to realize is that marijuana is really just 'spice light' or 'dabs light'...they are either exactly the same chemical or a close molecular analog as the THC in marijuana...just with more obvious effects...

I agree with you that Spice is horrible and is nothing but a byproduct of the criminalization of marijuana. If it was legal (you know, like the more deadly cigarette), Spice would have probably never made it to the surface.

Also, if we should call marijuana spice light, then what name do we have for prescription drugs? It's funny how weed is vilianized but everyday we see commercials of approved drugs that are linked to depression, dangers of the body and mind, suicide, and death. I should make a movie called "Prescription Drug Madness." At least it would be closer to the truth than Reefer Madness.

 

[Viligant_Warrior]

Exactly....the only arguments that could be brought up against marijuana (even though, again, it has a death rate of zero) was the effects of combustion. But what can be said about it in edible, liquid, or vaporized form?

As I already told Bush, none of these are acceptable delivery systems, either.

The vaporizers that people are most familiar with heat up dry pieces of plant. There's also a subtype of devices called "vape pens" that heat up concentrated cannabis oil or wax rather than dry leaf. Cannabis oils are extremely potent, containing up to 80 percent THC compared to 20 to 40 percentTHC in marijuana buds, and because of this, vaporizers that utilize oils deliver higher doses of THC than vaporizers that utilize dry plant. The point of the OP is that these very high concentrations of THC place this type of marijuana delivery at the same level as LSD, which is a dangerous, potent illegal drug. The argument for marijuana has been the low levels of the high. These systems destroy that argument.

Aside from that, different manufacturers of oils have different extraction processes and might use additives, so marijuana oils might also contain chemicals that pollute the vapor more than dry leaf vaporizers do, but no studies have been done yet. They desperately need to be done, because these manufacturers aren't being open about what additives they put into the oils, which means users don't know either.

Liquid forms of marijuana are just another product that can be used for "vaping," and are equally dangerous. Additionally, the false information that liquid vaping is "safer" is reaching younger marijuana users, and as a result, middle- and high-schoolers are being exposed to those dangerous higher THC contents.


Edible marijuana is believed responsible for a death in Colorado. A Denver man is accused of killing his wife after eating now-legal pot candy. A University of Wyoming student jumped off a Denver hotel balcony after eating a marijuana cookie purchased at a pot shop, police said. And at least one Colorado hospital has reported an increase in visits after children ate too many pot-laced treats, according to a study in JAMA Pediatrics. Safer? Hardly.

So while you "high fived" Bush for being "right," he's not, and neither are the people trying to promote these more potent delivery systems. You like to say "no one has died using marijuana." Looks like that's no longer a valid argument. Never was, actually, because we don't know how many people have died doing stupid stuff while high.

 

[lumberjack]

Let's not forget all the new, fashionable desiger drugs that come available online.
Technically speaking they're legal, because legislation can't keep up with the pace.

 

[Viligant_Warrior]

Let's not forget all the new, fashionable desiger drugs that come available online.
Technically speaking they're legal, because legislation can't keep up with the pace.

True, and there's no reliable test for them yet, either. Missouri and Kansas have made K2 and bath salts illegal, but the illegal drug peddlers are getting way too creative for police and treatment providers to keep up with them.

 

[lumberjack]

True, and there's no reliable test for them yet, either. Missouri and Kansas have made K2 and bath salts illegal, but the illegal drug peddlers are getting way too creative for police and treatment providers to keep up with them.

You can just order them by mail, easy.

 

[Viligant_Warrior]

You can just order them by mail, easy.

Or buy them at a convenience store. They're sold as "potpourri" and "bath salts" in most states. They're still deadly drugs. I had a vet client not long ago that had complete loss of touch with reality using K2. Thought he was living in 1996, that it was Christmas (in July), and that he was a lawyer -- he hasn't had a job since he got out of the Army. Those drugs are bad stuff.

 

[lumberjack]

I wouldn't know, I don't do drugs. Not even liquor.