So it happened again,,,

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Locoponydirtman

Well-known member
Oct 9, 2018
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Texas
#41
I think that's an unfair indictment that imparts all police do this. There are bad cops just like there are bad people in any job.
Not all are bad. Not all police are good.
These type headlines are not that common, though one headline is bad enough.

There are plenty of stories wherein police are gunned down. Unfortunately, people don't give those that much attention.
I wonder why?
In the last 39 weeks 30 police officers have been killed in the line of duty. If for even just a moment the thoughts, "good! serves them right!", "So what!" or similar sparked in your mind, maybe the problem isn't police.







Preliminary 2019 Fallen Officer Fatalities

Officer Fatalities by State – 2019
View Recently Fallen Heroes

The officer that was charged in the Ft.Worth Texas shooting is entitled to due process. Just like anyone else. If we lose sight of that because he's a cop, we're really barking up the wrong tree claiming to take offense at this Ft. Worth tragedy . When the tragedy is, those who think a cop accused is automatically guilty of what they're accused of. And deserve to die.
That attitude doesn't make us better than the bad guy. It makes us just like the bad guys.

May God's mercies , compassion, and forgiveness, extend to officer Aaron Dean . And may our Lord's strength uphold his family and friends, as it continues to uphold the family and friends and the young nephew of Atatiana Jefferson .
I think the video I posted shows that the indictment is pretty fair.
The general behavior of the police is to bully, harass, and violate people's rights. The minority of police are good and try to enforce the law.

This is not an excuse for criminal thugs to get away with murdering cops.

Our entire criminal justice system needs a severe over haul, and some serious reform done. Which may needs be that a hand full of cops, prosecutors, and judges, be procecuted, and punished, some may be reformable but permanently removed from any public service arena.

The fact in this case an overly aggressive, and under trained, cop murdered someone in cold blood because he could. I hope his trial is speedy and Justice served promptly.
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,000
2,496
113
#42
I think the video I posted shows that the indictment is pretty fair.
The general behavior of the police is to bully, harass, and violate people's rights. The minority of police are good and try to enforce the law.

This is not an excuse for criminal thugs to get away with murdering cops.

Our entire criminal justice system needs a severe over haul, and some serious reform done. Which may needs be that a hand full of cops, prosecutors, and judges, be procecuted, and punished, some may be reformable but permanently removed from any public service arena.

The fact in this case an overly aggressive, and under trained, cop murdered someone in cold blood because he could. I hope his trial is speedy and Justice served promptly.
Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

I have little interaction with the police. I have a couple that attend church with me and they are solid Christians. The police I meet on the street and in the donut shops are real good men and ladies as well. Just don't understand the lack of respect for these folks.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 

Locoponydirtman

Well-known member
Oct 9, 2018
2,872
1,728
113
Texas
#43
I think that's an unfair indictment that imparts all police do this. There are bad cops just like there are bad people in any job.
Not all are bad. Not all police are good.
These type headlines are not that common, though one headline is bad enough.

There are plenty of stories wherein police are gunned down. Unfortunately, people don't give those that much attention.
I wonder why?
In the last 39 weeks 30 police officers have been killed in the line of duty. If for even just a moment the thoughts, "good! serves them right!", "So what!" or similar sparked in your mind, maybe the problem isn't police.







Preliminary 2019 Fallen Officer Fatalities

Officer Fatalities by State – 2019
View Recently Fallen Heroes

The officer that was charged in the Ft.Worth Texas shooting is entitled to due process. Just like anyone else. If we lose sight of that because he's a cop, we're really barking up the wrong tree claiming to take offense at this Ft. Worth tragedy . When the tragedy is, those who think a cop accused is automatically guilty of what they're accused of. And deserve to die.
That attitude doesn't make us better than the bad guy. It makes us just like the bad guys.

May God's mercies , compassion, and forgiveness, extend to officer Aaron Dean . And may our Lord's strength uphold his family and friends, as it continues to uphold the family and friends and the young nephew of Atatiana Jefferson .
Wow there is a lot here to address.
One in the other thread I felt the officer was not justified, but also not guilty of murder. She was exhausted and made a grievous mistake, and she received just punishment. So I am not a cop hater. The problem is more the infrastructure and culture of the police departments, and a very broken criminal justice system.
 

Locoponydirtman

Well-known member
Oct 9, 2018
2,872
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Texas
#44
Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

I have little interaction with the police. I have a couple that attend church with me and they are solid Christians. The police I meet on the street and in the donut shops are real good men and ladies as well. Just don't understand the lack of respect for these folks.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
The guys in the video committed no crime but we're threatened with arrest and trumped up charges.
 

Whispered

Well-known member
Aug 17, 2019
4,553
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www.christiancourier.com
#45
I think the video I posted shows that the indictment is pretty fair.
The general behavior of the police is to bully, harass, and violate people's rights. The minority of police are good and try to enforce the law.

This is not an excuse for criminal thugs to get away with murdering cops.

Our entire criminal justice system needs a severe over haul, and some serious reform done. Which may needs be that a hand full of cops, prosecutors, and judges, be procecuted, and punished, some may be reformable but permanently removed from any public service arena.

The fact in this case an overly aggressive, and under trained, cop murdered someone in cold blood because he could. I hope his trial is speedy and Justice served promptly.
I don't disagree that the video appears to show negligence and very bad form in matters of conducting a welfare check. Now it is up to a jury to see the evidence we're not likely to have access to. Beyond what is on the Net as the cop-cam footage.
I agree that the system needs a serious overhaul. And one that is long overdue at that.

I'd hope background checks are run on potential candidates for the police academy. As well as mental health checks. If those are seemingly deemed necessary for American's seeking to exercise their 2nd amendment rights, it should be mandatory for those who have a right to carry and a badge.
I've been on the receiving end of bad cop behaviors. The few bad one's make the rest suspect just by the impression the few give the rest.
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
8,268
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Anaheim, Cali.
#46
in Texas we do have the castle doctrine and the castle doctrine also extends to your vehicle as long as you are occupying it. in some cases it has extended to neighbors homes if they have we asked you to watch and keep an eye on their home.
The castle doctrine protects your property at night, but only inside your home during the day light hours or your vehicle if you are in it at the time.
I was curious about old use of deadly force laws that were never taken off of the books. In the early 80's I was an armed guard in Houston. I know that deadly force is allowed if it is a vehicle that the owner sleeps in. I just remembered the one about the Cow because it seems excessive. Commonly they are called blue laws.
 

Dude653

Senior Member
Mar 19, 2011
9,047
455
83
#47
Wow there is a lot here to address.
One in the other thread I felt the officer was not justified, but also not guilty of murder. She was exhausted and made a grievous mistake, and she received just punishment. So I am not a cop hater. The problem is more the infrastructure and culture of the police departments, and a very broken criminal justice system.
I'm quite sober and had the roles been reversed that man would have spent the rest of his life in prison.
And remember Texas was the same state where Sandra Bland got pulled from her car gym clothes style for not putting out a cigarette.
So it wouod seem Texas has a problem with overly aggressive police officers
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
8,268
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Anaheim, Cali.
#48
I'm quite sober and had the roles been reversed that man would have spent the rest of his life in prison.
And remember Texas was the same state where Sandra Bland got pulled from her car gym clothes style for not putting out a cigarette.
So it wouod seem Texas has a problem with overly aggressive police officers
Not just Texas. But the problem is complicated. You have police that expect to be treated with honor and respect, without any back talk or resistance vs citizens that have little or no respect and know they have the right to talk back and have some kind of feelings of persecution when stopped or questioned. They both get angry.

There might even be police that never studied police science or psychology befor joining the force and policing agencies that prefer to hire veterans. The Veterans may also see suspects as some kind of enemy if the resist, talk back or try to evade or escape. In the Airforce if a suspect did not stop when ordered or tried to evade or escape apprehension the standing order where I was posted/stationed was, 'shoot to kill'. The LAPD tried to recruit me.

There's also no federally required standard of training except how and when to read the Miranda rights..., after the arrest. Or any federal school or law requirements regarding powers of arrest or use of deadly force. Plus every state is different.
 

Dude653

Senior Member
Mar 19, 2011
9,047
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#50
I get that people tend to get belligerent when they are confronted by police officers
However as a professionally trained police officer, your job is to try to de' escalate the situation instead of doing the exact opposite.
Same reason the fire department doesn't use gasoline to put out a fire
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
8,268
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Anaheim, Cali.
#51
I get that people tend to get belligerent when they are confronted by police officers
However as a professionally trained police officer, your job is to try to de' escalate the situation instead of doing the exact opposite.
Same reason the fire department doesn't use gasoline to put out a fire
There are many here that would argue against federally mandated national training for our law enforcement. That might say it's violation of states rights or a waste of tax money. There localities and/or states that are too poor or stingy to properly train as well.
 

Locoponydirtman

Well-known member
Oct 9, 2018
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Texas
#52
I'm quite sober and had the roles been reversed that man would have spent the rest of his life in prison.
And remember Texas was the same state where Sandra Bland got pulled from her car gym clothes style for not putting out a cigarette.
So it wouod seem Texas has a problem with overly aggressive police officers
Texas is particularly a problem, there is a book called, "terror on the highway," about the corruption and evil of law enforcement on highway 59 through San Jacinto county. It's a true story.
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
8,268
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113
Anaheim, Cali.
#53
Texas is particularly a problem, there is a book called, "terror on the highway," about the corruption and evil of law enforcement on highway 59 through San Jacinto county. It's a true story.
I worked off shore in the gulf in the early 80's but spent my winters around Houston. 2 at the Key Truck stop on I-10 east of Houston in Channel view.
 
S

Susanna

Guest
#56
The fact in this case an overly aggressive, and under trained, cop murdered someone in cold blood because he could. I hope his trial is speedy and Justice served promptly.
I don’t think this is a correct perspective on the subject at hand. Is your position on this that he walked up to outside her window and opened fire in cold blood?

Unfortunately the accurate reason for this incident is not very comforting either. He probably wasn’t up to the situation and opened fire prematurely.

It’s not easy beforehand telling who’s gonna crack under pressure, but it is obvious that this part of the training needs improvement.
 

Mii

Well-known member
Mar 23, 2019
1,648
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#57
The biggest issue I have is how do you know it's not a prowler?

I haven't had the best interactions with police. It's the guilty until proven innocent stuff that bothers me as well as getting arrested for resisting arrest as your only charge, and yes that can happen. As well as obstruction.

Obstructing justice is very much in the eye of the beholder.

It also bothers me that recording of police puts up red flags and anger from them. I get that no one likes to be under a microscope but...? There's also the fact that qualified immunity exists and how it can be abused.



Just a friendly F.Y.I. Yes they can pull you over for no reason, yes they can order you out of the vehicle for no reason. It is jarring and unpleasant to have this potential situation every time you drive but bear it in mind it can happen. Doesn't mean it's legal to pull you over without cause but that is irrelevant when it happens.
 

Locoponydirtman

Well-known member
Oct 9, 2018
2,872
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Texas
#58
I don’t think this is a correct perspective on the subject at hand. Is your position on this that he walked up to outside her window and opened fire in cold blood?

Unfortunately the accurate reason for this incident is not very comforting either. He probably wasn’t up to the situation and opened fire prematurely.

It’s not easy beforehand telling who’s gonna crack under pressure, but it is obvious that this part of the training needs improvement.
All of police training needs to be changed, and all of police culture needs to be changed.
I'm guessing you didn't bother to watch the video that I posted. It's at police stations all over the country.
 

Locoponydirtman

Well-known member
Oct 9, 2018
2,872
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Texas
#59
The biggest issue I have is how do you know it's not a prowler?

I haven't had the best interactions with police. It's the guilty until proven innocent stuff that bothers me as well as getting arrested for resisting arrest as your only charge, and yes that can happen. As well as obstruction.

Obstructing justice is very much in the eye of the beholder.

It also bothers me that recording of police puts up red flags and anger from them. I get that no one likes to be under a microscope but...? There's also the fact that qualified immunity exists and how it can be abused.



Just a friendly F.Y.I. Yes they can pull you over for no reason, yes they can order you out of the vehicle for no reason. It is jarring and unpleasant to have this potential situation every time you drive but bear it in mind it can happen. Doesn't mean it's legal to pull you over without cause but that is irrelevant when it happens.
That's their training everybody is guilty of something, and everybody is the enemy.
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,000
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#60
The guys in the video committed no crime but we're threatened with arrest and trumped up charges.
Yep and all the inmates in prison are innocent.
That's their training everybody is guilty of something, and everybody is the enemy.
So not true. No wonder you have a problem with law enforcement. God put them on the streets to protect you. Do right and you have nothing to fear. If you are persecuted for the cause of Christ be happy and bear it as unto the Lord.

For the cause of Christ
Roger