Who is voting for Trump again?

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posthuman

posthuman

Senior Member
#141
Jul 31, 2013
37,831
13,558
113
#141
7seasrekeyed said:
this would have been more believable if you had asked it before you ventured to trash Trump

as it stands, it sounds more like a last ditch attempt to have an 'aha gotcha' moment

the way I understand it, Jesus would do different things depending on which person you might vote for

I actually do not like the way Americans seem to think they own Jesus

finally said it
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if you could take Trump out of your mind for a second, maybe you'll believe it.
believe it or not, the world does not revolve around him, and my opinions are not formed in response to him.
before i had ever even heard of him, i already knew a vain man or a liar is a bad choice for a leader.

would Jesus even vote?
this has nothing to do with Trump.

would Jesus even vote?

how active was He in the politics of His day? did His apostles involve themselves in politics?

for sure, America's political system is not like Israel's was in the 1st century, so there isn't a direct correlation to be made from the evidence in the gospels.
for sure, you can quote for us, 'all that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing' and suppose it applies to Christ. but did Christ oppose Rome? well, no. did the apostles oppose Rome? well, no. so is that 'good men doing nothing' ?

it's a very interesting question, to me. would Jesus even vote?

probably the reader is thinking, what if no Christians voted? wouldn't we get liberals running the country and the whole world go to the birds? like FOCHS tells us?
my friend, you have read the Bible. is there any hope that the world will not go to hell in a handbasket? 'saving the world by voting conservative' is a ruse.
 
posthuman

posthuman

Senior Member
#142
Jul 31, 2013
37,831
13,558
113
#142
all the political threads need to become Jesus threads, IMO.

not R vs D threads. that's carnal.
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#143
#143
posthuman said:
if you could take Trump out of your mind for a second, maybe you'll believe it.
believe it or not, the world does not revolve around him, and my opinions are not formed in response to him.
before i had ever even heard of him, i already knew a vain man or a liar is a bad choice for a leader.

would Jesus even vote?
this has nothing to do with Trump.

would Jesus even vote?

how active was He in the politics of His day? did His apostles involve themselves in politics?

for sure, America's political system is not like Israel's was in the 1st century, so there isn't a direct correlation to be made from the evidence in the gospels.
for sure, you can quote for us, 'all that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing' and suppose it applies to Christ. but did Christ oppose Rome? well, no. did the apostles oppose Rome? well, no. so is that 'good men doing nothing' ?

it's a very interesting question, to me. would Jesus even vote?

probably the reader is thinking, what if no Christians voted? wouldn't we get liberals running the country and the whole world go to the birds? like FOCHS tells us?
my friend, you have read the Bible. is there any hope that the world will not go to hell in a handbasket? 'saving the world by voting conservative' is a ruse.
Click to expand...
yet, Jesus paid taxes and obeyed the law

Paul said to pray for our leaders

since Israel was under Roman occupation, and Jesus did not try to overthrow that foreign government, I think we can take the view that Jesus was not into creating a diversion from facts to manufacture a reason for doing so

this particular reader is wondering just how far out on a limb you are going to go to try to support conjecture with no facts

that is the interesting question since the rest is moot

I don't have a rubber Bible ;)

all the political threads need to become Jesus threads, IMO.
Click to expand...
right

since calling Trump the beastie man is not working and no one has run out the front door screaming Trump is a demon

got it :eek: :sneaky:
 
posthuman

posthuman

Senior Member
#144
Jul 31, 2013
37,831
13,558
113
#144
Jimbone said:
Fair enough. Who's the nerd?
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IIRC that's what they called Al Gore?
possibly not accurately. *shrug*


7seasrekeyed said:
maybe you would like to talk about cats instead?

there are quite a few varieties
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i don't want to talk about varieties of cats. i want to talk about my specific, individual cats.

one is name Ekko -- he's about 20lbs in the winter, and the size of an Ewok. a Maine Coon. i call him a fluffalupagus ((re: Sesame Street)). one of his favourite things is to share dinner with me; he makes an awful face when he sees broccoli on the plate. not a fan of vegetables - tho he thinks beans from our garden make fun toys.

i kind of don't want to be alive to see him go. is that morbid? but a cat that lives even 20 years is an anomaly. he's 9 this year. the thought, tho, by which i mean, knowing that his life in this shell, on this earth, is temporary - the thought makes me cherish every moment with him, and be thankful for every little moment.

princes and presidents are temporary too. is there such a thing as a candidate whose presidency you would cherish every moment of? who you would not be ashamed of in any fashion, but have joy and gratitude at every remembrance?
i'd vote for that.
political party means nothing to me.
 
posthuman

posthuman

Senior Member
#146
Jul 31, 2013
37,831
13,558
113
#146
7seasrekeyed said:
yet, Jesus paid taxes and obeyed the law

Paul said to pray for our leaders

since Israel was under Roman occupation, and Jesus did not try to overthrow that foreign government, I think we can take the view that Jesus was not into creating a diversion from facts to manufacture a reason for doing so

this particular reader is wondering just how far out on a limb you are going to go to try to support conjecture with no facts

that is the interesting question since the rest is moot

I don't have a rubber Bible ;)
Click to expand...
when they tried to make Him king, He went away from them, to a mountain, by Himself.
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#147
#147
posthuman said:
when they tried to make Him king, He went away from them, to a mountain, by Himself.
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because he knew what was in the hearts of mankind

you could change your entire outlook tomorrow and never blink

oh yes you could

but I won't

there now. apart from what we know of Jesus

the rest is at least as good as your logic
 
posthuman

posthuman

Senior Member
#148
Jul 31, 2013
37,831
13,558
113
#148
7seasrekeyed said:
yet, Jesus paid taxes and obeyed the law
Click to expand...
the 'tax' in Matthew 17:24-27 was not a Roman tax. it was a temple tribute 'for sanctification' -- and Jesus didn't pay it: He taught Peter that the children of kings are exempt from taxes, and instructed Peter to go catch a fish, in which he found a coin that covered both Peter's & Christ's 'temple tax' -- 'so that they would not give offense'

if you look at the Torah where this tribute originated from, Exodus 30, it is not at all clear that this was supposed to be a recurring fee for Jews -- it was to be collected "for atonement" when a census was taken. remember David taking a census? and getting in trouble over it? think about it.

so this isn't an example of Christ paying taxes.

the other place you may be referring to, 'render to Caesar what is Caesars' -- Jesus didn't have a coin. He asked that someone show Him one.


now, am not saying He taught against paying taxes. but to say, the message of these two things is not about paying taxes and honoring governments. it is something much deeper.

besides that -- 'voting' is not a requirement of the law. so you do not break a law by not voting. which is to say -- i don't see that you have a point at all by saying this? it doesn't answer the question. Jesus did not involve Himself in worldly politics. His apostles did not either. they did not advocate nor work toward political change nor did they seek political power. Jesus shirked political power. the apostles, well they didn't really have that opportunity lol -- although one could point out, Paul was on his way to a seat in the Sanhedrin, and he gave it up to pursue evangelism.

our citizenship is not of this world.
i believe, we ought to act like it is true.
so i am not a democrat, and i am utterly disgusted by Christians thinking the Republican party is the party of Christianity.

here is my view: Trump is a vain liar. the GOP manipulates the Christian church in America to equate itself as 'their party' and Trump pandered to them in order to gain votes in the SE states. every GOP candidate since Jerry Falwell has done exactly the same thing. the group of evangelical influencers who met with Trump either lied or were deceived when they said they thought Trump was a 'baby Christian' born again but showing no fruit and having no confession of faith and openly denying repentance. they were either somehow coerced or they were convinced that 'the greater good' of having a GOP-affiliated president who would probably nominate at least one conservative-leaning supreme court justice outwieghed the evil of lying to the church / misleading the church about Trump. their influence and the corresponding influence of thousands of pastors across the Bible belt who parroted their urging that all Christians 'must vote for Trump or else our country goes to hell' had a considerable influence on the vote. i think this is despicable, and it makes me sad to see people still under this spell.

my only advice is don't lie with your vote.
your vote means this is the person you respect and wish to be your nations leader and primary representative to the rest of the world.
if you don't truly respect him, and you are only voting 'against' someone else or 'against' some other perceived ideology - not literally 'for' a candidate -- in my view you should not vote at all; you are casting a lie.
this is the same advice i have given for 30 years. it has nothing to do with party or individuals.

i do not respect Trump, though i respect the office he currently holds. i do not trust him, i am ashamed that he leads our country. i will not vote for him. i will vote for whomever i think is honest, and who puts others before themselves. if i find no such person, i will not vote.
that's just me. make up your own minds. :)

"openness"
 
TabinRivCA

TabinRivCA

Well-known member
#149
Oct 23, 2018
13,093
10,654
113
#149
posthuman said:
the 'tax' in Matthew 17:24-27 was not a Roman tax. it was a temple tribute 'for sanctification' -- and Jesus didn't pay it: He taught Peter that the children of kings are exempt from taxes, and instructed Peter to go catch a fish, in which he found a coin that covered both Peter's & Christ's 'temple tax' -- 'so that they would not give offense'

if you look at the Torah where this tribute originated from, Exodus 30, it is not at all clear that this was supposed to be a recurring fee for Jews -- it was to be collected "for atonement" when a census was taken. remember David taking a census? and getting in trouble over it? think about it.

so this isn't an example of Christ paying taxes.

the other place you may be referring to, 'render to Caesar what is Caesars' -- Jesus didn't have a coin. He asked that someone show Him one.


now, am not saying He taught against paying taxes. but to say, the message of these two things is not about paying taxes and honoring governments. it is something much deeper.

besides that -- 'voting' is not a requirement of the law. so you do not break a law by not voting. which is to say -- i don't see that you have a point at all by saying this? it doesn't answer the question. Jesus did not involve Himself in worldly politics. His apostles did not either. they did not advocate nor work toward political change nor did they seek political power. Jesus shirked political power. the apostles, well they didn't really have that opportunity lol -- although one could point out, Paul was on his way to a seat in the Sanhedrin, and he gave it up to pursue evangelism.

our citizenship is not of this world.
i believe, we ought to act like it is true.
so i am not a democrat, and i am utterly disgusted by Christians thinking the Republican party is the party of Christianity.

here is my view: Trump is a vain liar. the GOP manipulates the Christian church in America to equate itself as 'their party' and Trump pandered to them in order to gain votes in the SE states. every GOP candidate since Jerry Falwell has done exactly the same thing. the group of evangelical influencers who met with Trump either lied or were deceived when they said they thought Trump was a 'baby Christian' born again but showing no fruit and having no confession of faith and openly denying repentance. they were either somehow coerced or they were convinced that 'the greater good' of having a GOP-affiliated president who would probably nominate at least one conservative-leaning supreme court justice outwieghed the evil of lying to the church / misleading the church about Trump. their influence and the corresponding influence of thousands of pastors across the Bible belt who parroted their urging that all Christians 'must vote for Trump or else our country goes to hell' had a considerable influence on the vote. i think this is despicable, and it makes me sad to see people still under this spell.

my only advice is don't lie with your vote.
your vote means this is the person you respect and wish to be your nations leader and primary representative to the rest of the world.
if you don't truly respect him, and you are only voting 'against' someone else or 'against' some other perceived ideology - not literally 'for' a candidate -- in my view you should not vote at all; you are casting a lie.
this is the same advice i have given for 30 years. it has nothing to do with party or individuals.

i do not respect Trump, though i respect the office he currently holds. i do not trust him, i am ashamed that he leads our country. i will not vote for him. i will vote for whomever i think is honest, and who puts others before themselves. if i find no such person, i will not vote.
that's just me. make up your own minds. :)

"openness"
Click to expand...
We must face the fact Trump will win. The best thing to do is stay close to God, always.
 
posthuman

posthuman

Senior Member
#150
Jul 31, 2013
37,831
13,558
113
#150
TabinRivCA said:
We must face the fact Trump will win. The best thing to do is stay close to God, always.
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i think he would lose to Sanders, be close vs Warren, and beat Biden handily. i think the DNC are fools and are more likely to nominate Biden than anyone else.

the best thing to do is always to keep our hearts and minds on where our true citizenship lies -- all these princes are for but a moment, and then pass away, even as the world itself does.
 
RickyZ

RickyZ

Senior Member
#153
Sep 20, 2012
9,635
787
113
#153
posthuman said:
By the way

Isn't this exactly the behavior you accuse only "liberals" of engaging in?

You ignored the substance of my argument, and attacked my character instead, with what turns out to be false accusations altogether.

But isn't this what our president does too? Every day lying and slandering and name calling and threatening every political opponent he has? So let's re elect him? Maybe he'll be mature by his third term? After all, he's on the republican ticket, so it's a no brainer decision to support him?

Lol.
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"No brainer" being the operative word lol
 
stonesoffire

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
#154
Nov 24, 2013
10,665
1,829
113
#154
posthuman said:
Is that why he tells so many obvious lies, and so often repeats them, and so often exaggerates?

Because he really is that incorrigibly ignorant?

I would rather have a man who tells the truth, and who is not vain, and who puts others before himself, no matter what their political views are.
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So who is your choice?
 
stonesoffire

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
#155
Nov 24, 2013
10,665
1,829
113
#155
stonesoffire said:
So who is your choice?
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Never mind the question. You answered already.

Another question though...do you not see what would of happened if Hillary had become President?

This isn’t just about a political matter. It is about freedom to worship YHWH/Yeshua. We have enemies that want to destroy not only Jews but Christianity too. And pure evil reign.

We must differ on our view of on earth as it is in heaven. There’s a harvest begun and freedom yet for it.

I would not ever want to live under sharia law.
 
Dude653

Dude653

Senior Member
#157
Mar 19, 2011
12,680
1,101
113
#157
stonesoffire said:
Never mind the question. You answered already.

Another question though...do you not see what would of happened if Hillary had become President?

This isn’t just about a political matter. It is about freedom to worship YHWH/Yeshua. We have enemies that want to destroy not only Jews but Christianity too. And pure evil reign.

We must differ on our view of on earth as it is in heaven. There’s a harvest begun and freedom yet for it.

I would not ever want to live under sharia law.
Click to expand...
I see you drank all the kool ade
 
stonesoffire

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
#158
Nov 24, 2013
10,665
1,829
113
#158
Dude653 said:
I see you drank all the kool ade
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If I did the side effects woke me up to reality rather than lulled me to sleep.

Plus I like kool aide. Especially when things get heated up.
 
Dude653

Dude653

Senior Member
#159
Mar 19, 2011
12,680
1,101
113
#159
You have freedom of religion as per the Constitution. Trump has nothing to do with that
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#160
#160
Dude653 said:
You have freedom of religion as per the Constitution. Trump has nothing to do with that
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spoken by someone who does not understand how close we came to having an antiChrist type in power

Trump is not an anti Christ type.

please note I am not saying he is the moral example we should all follow either

but I don't know one single person that I would follow. including myself. thank God we have Jesus. I try to follow Him...plus He is always there for me. that's another thing most people are not good at...being there

the Constitution is only a piece of paper

it takes people to uphold it
 
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